Kenevo SL Official 2022 Kenevo SL (KSL) Megathread!

[Hitorogoshi]

You’re really not funny mate.
Why do you feel the need to throw insults at people trying to sort out a problem on a community forum?
It makes you seem so sad and miserable.

it's a forum and there are rules - you really are ruining the Kenevo SL Megathread. To make everyone's life better all these posts should be moved to their own thread called " SL motor 1.1 VS 1.23234" or whatever. It's off topic!!!
and.... cheer up, I didn't mean to hurt your feelings

 

[Moderator]

it's a forum and there are rules - you really are ruining the Kenevo SL Megathread.
and.... cheer up, I didn't mean to hurt your feelings

Not wishing to detract from the main KSL discussion, but the power discussion seems relevant ?

There are clearly anomalies between some 1.2 motors. Using the forum base to discover the differences (6 Amp max draw or nearer 8 Amp max draw) is normal and a good use of forum resources.

Some people will consider a new KSL or LSL if it has more power, but will want to be certain it does have more power.

Zimmerframe started a thread to discuss it in May but no one was interested in talking about it in a separate thread. It seems sometimes the discussion needs to stay in a main thread to gain interest.

Wouldn't "Rich people comparisons" only be interested in numbers, not actual performance. The lay man would want to make sure he's getting what he's supposed to get for his hard earned money ?

OK. Enough of that.. sorry for the interruption folks. Back to anything KSL and possibly uncovering the power anomaly.

 

[Hitorogoshi]

Looks like I hit a nerve with that comment and I apologize - it was a little distasteful from my side but my next sentence might put it into context. I have both bikes, and I can honestly say I am a complete idiot for spending the money just for the new motor. It's pointless, what Spez has given us (aptly named as 1.2 over the 1.1) as an upgrade is a joke. Only reason to buy the new bike is the new frame/geo. But hey - this is only my opinion. If the 1.2 is your first Spez SL bike, awesome you got a bike that's exactly 10% better than the last motor.

IF these comparisons were done on the new KSL with the 1.2 motor I would say it's relevant to this thread. But again... apple with apples right? You can moderate your own way.


"THE 2022 KENEVO SL MEGATHREAD". Once we fit the 1.2 motor into the 2022 model we can consider some relevance


I'll hang my hat

 

[Zimmerframe]

I have both bikes, and I can honestly say I am a complete idiot for spending the money just for the new motor. It's pointless, what Spez has given us (aptly named as 1.2 over the 1.1) as an upgrade is a joke.

Maybe I'm missing something (I've not really been following or involved), but what you're saying is you think your 1.2 performs basically the same as your 1.1 - which is the main point of this discussion and is what several have found.

Have you done the tests the other have tried above to see if your 1.2 is pulling 7.8 amps (400w), or if it's like the others and only pulling 6 Amps (300w) ?

If you only have the 6 amps, you can put up your firmware and we can compare and maybe work out what the difference is ?

IF these comparisons were done on the new KSL with the 1.2 motor I would say it's relevant to this thread. But again... apple with apples right? You can moderate your own way.

Does it make any difference ? If there's something which makes some 1.2 motors only draw 300w max and something which makes others draw 400w max, then surely it doesn't matter what bike it's in. What matters is that people can make sure they're getting a 400w bike if they buy a 1.2 LSL or KSL ? This is the KSL thread and some people will be thinking about upgrading ?

I ran a LSL gen 1 and a KSL with a 1.2 and they performed pretty much exactly the same as they did with the 1.1 (6 Amps peak). Then got no feedback from anyone else with motor/tcu firmwares so gave up with the whole thing.

 

[CjP]

it's a forum and there are rules - you really are ruining the Kenevo SL Megathread. To make everyone's life better all these posts should be moved to their own thread called " SL motor 1.1 VS 1.23234" or whatever. It's off topic!!!
and.... cheer up, I didn't mean to hurt your feelings

You didn’t hurt my feelings man. I just don’t understand why people feel the need to resort to unescasary insults.
I brought up the Gen 2 motor as it was relevant at the time.
As Zimmer said, a thread was made and no one made an effort.
In the end, by bringing it up here we found out some interesting results and that’s the whole point to a forum, for people to help other people out.
You have the right to read what you like but maybe try not purposely insult people. It brings nothing to table and just shows us a little more about the type of person you are.
You may find people less inclined to help you out in the future.

 

[Hitorogoshi]

You didn’t hurt my feelings man. I just don’t understand why people feel the need to resort to unescasary insults.
I brought up the Gen 2 motor as it was relevant at the time.
As Zimmer said, a thread was made and no one made an effort.
In the end, by bringing it up here we found out some interesting results and that’s the whole point to a forum, for people to help other people out.
You have the right to read what you like but maybe try not purposely insult people. It brings nothing to table and just shows us a little more about the type of person you are.
You may find people less inclined to help you out in the future.

Chill guys - the post was honestly made in jest and I do still believe it's all in the wrong forum thread - sorry if I rubbed you the wrong way. My comment really was not an insult, otherwise I would be insulting myself. Look at it from face value - bunch of grown ups worrying about a few watts on a new eeb motor they paid too much money for? If we are looking for such a small difference in something that's supposed to be "new" then there are bigger problems to worry about.

and thanks for your Dr Frasier analysis of me via my post made me laugh

 

[CjP]

Chill guys - the post was honestly made in jest and I do still believe it's all in the wrong forum thread - sorry if I rubbed you the wrong way. My comment really was not an insult, otherwise I would be insulting myself. Look at it from face value - bunch of grown ups worrying about a few watts on a new eeb motor they paid too much money for? If we are looking for such a small difference in something that's supposed to be "new" then there are bigger problems to worry about.

and thanks for your Dr Frasier analysis of me via my post made me laugh

Your welcome.

 

[Pete N]

I’ve just found this thread after being asked by CJP to see what power I was drawing from my Gen 2 LSL. I’m happy to post hardware and firmware numbers if required to help those not getting the full power to get it resolved.
For the record, my Gen 2 felt noticeably more powerful straight away when compared to my Gen 1. In fact , Turbo 100/100 felt the bike was running away from me a bit! Screenshot from recording whilst riding. The battery was charged to 80% and I could probably have given it a bit more effort. Bike was ‘shop plug in’ updated from new as the mastermind said it was required.

 

[KSL]

Maybe I'm missing something (I've not really been following or involved), but what you're saying is you think your 1.2 performs basically the same as your 1.1 - which is the main point of this discussion and is what several have found.

Have you done the tests the other have tried above to see if your 1.2 is pulling 7.8 amps (400w), or if it's like the others and only pulling 6 Amps (300w) ?

If you only have the 6 amps, you can put up your firmware and we can compare and maybe work out what the difference is ?



Does it make any difference ? If there's something which makes some 1.2 motors only draw 300w max and something which makes others draw 400w max, then surely it doesn't matter what bike it's in. What matters is that people can make sure they're getting a 400w bike if they buy a 1.2 LSL or KSL ? This is the KSL thread and some people will be thinking about upgrading ?

I ran a LSL gen 1 and a KSL with a 1.2 and they performed pretty much exactly the same as they did with the 1.1 (6 Amps peak). Then got no feedback from anyone else with motor/tcu firmwares so gave up with the whole thing.

View attachment 122285


View attachment 122284

Just trying to follow some of the recent posts but I'm getting a bit lost when I read there's no difference in the 1.2 motor.
But on a serious note, is this a 1.2 motor above in the KSL?

And I believe I read a many threads ago that it may be possible to just purchase a 1.2 motor when they are available and swap my 1.1 KSL to the 1.2. Is there any more information or speculation on this front since my dealer has nothing. And lastly, are there any more details for when the new KSL/1.2 will be released in the states?

Thanks.

 

[KSL]

On another topic, do other get hard grinding between shifts under load on their KSL? I try to be as gentile as I can when shifting under load, but with some many switch back, combined with rapid elevation changes, I have some trails that simply require a heavy thumb to be in the right gear. I was also wondering if the new Transmission components that were recently introduced have been tested on the KSL by anyone also?

 

[Zimmerframe]

But on a serious note, is this a 1.2 motor above in the KSL?

Yes. Easiest way to tell them apart is the DUB cranks which the 1.2 changed to.

 

[KSL]

Yes. Easiest way to tell them apart is the DUB cranks which the 1.2 changed to.

Thanks.....I'm wondering if this motor or a new KSL will be available in the US soon (?) as I was going to upgrade my cranks to 170mm on my bike, but read that they would not work on the 1.2 motor. It wouldn't make sense to upgrade my cranks at this time if I can retrofit a 1.2 motor in my current bike (hoping).

 

[Pete N]

I understand that you will be able to retrofit but they won’t sell you a Gen 2 motor separately, they only come with complete bikes/new framesets. If you have a very good relationship with a LBS it may be possible I guess.

 

[KSL]

I understand that you will be able to retrofit but they won’t sell you a Gen 2 motor separately, they only come with complete bikes/new framesets. If you have a very good relationship with a LBS it may be possible I guess.

So what my dealer told me, the 1.2 motor won't fit in our existing KSL's and if it fit, he's sell it to me. That said, from what I've been told, only the new KSL that is coming out can support the 1.2 motor. The non-SL motors however can be retrofitted (1.1 to 1.2), but not on the KSL. That said, I'm not sure how the image above is real. It's a physical size issue.

 

[CjP]

So what my dealer told me, the 1.2 motor won't fit in our existing KSL's and if it fit, he's sell it to me. That said, from what I've been told, only the new KSL that is coming out can support the 1.2 motor. The non-SL motors however can be retrofitted (1.1 to 1.2), but not on the KSL. That said, I'm not sure how the image above is real. It's a physical size issue.

As Zimmer frame has shown in the 1.1 vs 1.2 the motor fits perfectly fine and runs perfectly fine using the matching donor mastermind.
The only modification that needs to be made is to the KSL bash plate. It need a bit of the “guts” to be removed with a dremel as the gen 2 motor case is slightly larger. Otherwise it works.

 

[KSL]

As Zimmer frame has shown in the 1.1 vs 1.2 the motor fits perfectly fine and runs perfectly fine using the matching donor mastermind.
The only modification that needs to be made is to the KSL bash plate. It need a bit of the “guts” to be removed with a dremel as the gen 2 motor case is slightly larger. Otherwise it works.

I was getting the impression this was a perfect retrofit upgrade and that not longer seems to be the case. I'm not into hacking something in place and voiding warranties. Simply put, it's not clean by any stretch, cannot be warrantied and simply isn't a match, even if someone was able to muscle it in. No thanks.

Unfortunately this means that anyone looking to retrofit, this isn't realistic. Looks like the only real option is to consider buying the new KSL with the 1.2 motor when it's released. Well that sucks!

 

[CjP]

Your really are over dramatising things. The motor drops straight in, with no “muscling” and the $100 plastic bash guard requires minimal gutting.
If they sold the motor as an upgrade package they would sell a shed load to exsisting SL owners but knowing Specialized they would prefer to force people into buying a whole new bike.
Pity really

Edit, they could even supply you the upcoming gen 2 KSL bash guard and then no “hacking” is required

 

[KSL]

Your really are over dramatising things. The motor drops straight in, with no “muscling” and the $100 plastic bash guard requires minimal gutting.
If they sold the motor as an upgrade package they would sell a shed load to exsisting SL owners but knowing Specialized they would prefer to force people into buying a whole new bike.
Pity really

Edit, they could even supply you the upcoming gen 2 KSL bash guard and then no “hacking” is required

Can you visually document the steps you followed to make this happen - e.g. video, image sequence or other?

 

[KnollyBro]

On another topic, do other get hard grinding between shifts under load on their KSL? I try to be as gentile as I can when shifting under load, but with some many switch back, combined with rapid elevation changes, I have some trails that simply require a heavy thumb to be in the right gear. I was also wondering if the new Transmission components that were recently introduced have been tested on the KSL by anyone also?

Can you visually document the steps you followed to make this happen - e.g. video, image sequence or other?

But where is the HARD GRINDING sound coming from between shifts, under load? Are you saying the motor is the source of this sound? If so, I hope your existing motor is still under warrantee.

 

[CjP]

Can you visually document the steps you followed to make this happen - e.g. video, image sequence or other?

No and I understand your scepticism but I can assure you it is the exact same mounting location. The KSL Gen 2 will be exactly the same bike as it is pretty bang on as it is. The LSL was always going the “Evo” way hence the geo changes. It would make no sense to change the motor mounting points and have to engineer a whole new design. The motor as you can see in the photos have all the same screw mounting locations as the gen 1. The only difference’s are the thicker casing and extra cooling fins hence the need for a modified engine bash plate.
Take what you will from what I say but others have done it. I have no reason to lie about this.

 

[KSL]

No and I understand your scepticism but I can assure you it is the exact same mounting location. The KSL Gen 2 will be exactly the same bike as it is pretty bang on as it is. The LSL was always going the “Evo” way hence the geo changes. It would make no sense to change the motor mounting points and have to engineer a whole new design. The motor as you can see in the photos have all the same screw mounting locations as the gen 1. The only difference’s are the thicker casing and extra cooling fins hence the need for a modified engine bash plate.
Take what you will from what I say but others have done it. I have no reason to lie about this.

Now you are be overly dramatic. Nobody is suggesting you are telling lies, but a Specialized dealer that has done over 200 motors, has a polar opposite view, so hopefully you can appreciate the questions/interest. From what I can see in the images, it looks pretty clean, but my dealer seems to suggest the 1.2 is vastly bigger and while it possible to get it to work, it would require a fair amount of "rigging". The truth lies someone in between these two extremes, hence my ask for a video or pics so I can understand it better. I was surprised that my dealer was willing to sell me a motor, but you can't even order an SL 1.2 motor...it's not it the system.

And trust me, the last thing I want to do is be forced to buy a new KSL if I can swap to a 1.2 motor! That's my ideal situation.

 

[KSL]

But where is the HARD GRINDING sound coming from between shifts, under load? Are you saying the motor is the source of this sound? If so, I hope your existing motor is still under warrantee.

Between shifts...drivetrain, not motor.

 

[KnollyBro]

Between shifts...drivetrain, not motor.

Ah... Why do you want to change your motor? The only drive train I have seen that will allow you to shift under heavy load is the GX Eagle AXS.

 

[soso79]

Now you are be overly dramatic. Nobody is suggesting you are telling lies, but a Specialized dealer that has done over 200 motors, has a polar opposite view, so hopefully you can appreciate the questions/interest. From what I can see in the images, it looks pretty clean, but my dealer seems to suggest the 1.2 is vastly bigger and while it possible to get it to work, it would require a fair amount of "rigging". The truth lies someone in between these two extremes, hence my ask for a video or pics so I can understand it better. I was surprised that my dealer was willing to sell me a motor, but you can't even order an SL 1.2 motor...it's not it the system.

And trust me, the last thing I want to do is be forced to buy a new KSL if I can swap to a 1.2 motor! That's my ideal situation.

Just Open your eyes and Check the thread. It fits…
Bashguard, chainguide is different. And cranks etc.
There are some ksl out there with the 1.2 Motor.
Some of them buy a lsl2, some the child bike and some have a other Solution.

 

[CjP]

Now you are be overly dramatic. Nobody is suggesting you are telling lies, but a Specialized dealer that has done over 200 motors, has a polar opposite view, so hopefully you can appreciate the questions/interest. From what I can see in the images, it looks pretty clean, but my dealer seems to suggest the 1.2 is vastly bigger and while it possible to get it to work, it would require a fair amount of "rigging". The truth lies someone in between these two extremes, hence my ask for a video or pics so I can understand it better. I was surprised that my dealer was willing to sell me a motor, but you can't even order an SL 1.2 motor...it's not it the system.

And trust me, the last thing I want to do is be forced to buy a new KSL if I can swap to a 1.2 motor! That's my ideal situation.

The simple solution is to hire out an SL2 and make the swap yourself. It takes 30min tops.
I don’t have a Gen 2 motor in my KSL as the motor I tested didn’t provide any extra support so I cancelled that idea.
That has changed now that I know there are people out there that have actual quoted power but until we can work out why there is such discrepancies in SL2 motors I will just have to be patient

 

[Zimmerframe]

Now you are be overly dramatic. Nobody is suggesting you are telling lies, but a Specialized dealer that has done over 200 motors, has a polar opposite view, so hopefully you can appreciate the questions/interest. From what I can see in the images, it looks pretty clean, but my dealer seems to suggest the 1.2 is vastly bigger and while it possible to get it to work, it would require a fair amount of "rigging". The truth lies someone in between these two extremes, hence my ask for a video or pics so I can understand it better. I was surprised that my dealer was willing to sell me a motor, but you can't even order an SL 1.2 motor...it's not it the system.

And trust me, the last thing I want to do is be forced to buy a new KSL if I can swap to a 1.2 motor! That's my ideal situation.

There's a separate thread about this which was linked above when the conversation in this thread started discussing the 1.2 option.

Mahle SL 1.1 to SL 1.2 - What's Possible and What's Different ?

The SL 1.2 is out in the wild with the '23 Levo SL. From what we know so far, mountings and connections are all the same. It works with the existing battery and range extender (shorter 145mm instead of 160mm cable). The motor is slightly larger due to the two piece aluminium honeycomb casing...

www.emtbforums.com

The motor fits fine. As @CjP says, the bashguard needs minor modifications if you want it to fit perfectly (or it sticks out slightly as in the pictures), but as he also states, you should be able to just buy the KSL 1.2 bashguard which will already have been factory modified/fabricated with the modifications.

 

[Dax]

Now you are be overly dramatic. Nobody is suggesting you are telling lies, but a Specialized dealer that has done over 200 motors, has a polar opposite view, so hopefully you can appreciate the questions/interest. From what I can see in the images, it looks pretty clean, but my dealer seems to suggest the 1.2 is vastly bigger and while it possible to get it to work, it would require a fair amount of "rigging". The truth lies someone in between these two extremes, hence my ask for a video or pics so I can understand it better. I was surprised that my dealer was willing to sell me a motor, but you can't even order an SL 1.2 motor...it's not it the system.

And trust me, the last thing I want to do is be forced to buy a new KSL if I can swap to a 1.2 motor! That's my ideal situation.

Seems like you're dealer is a bit confused, or like many dealers is giving the party line he has been told by specilized. Maybe he thought you were talking about trying to swap in a motor from a full fat levo?

See this post, where the owner bought a LSL2 and swapped the motor into his KSL: Mahle SL 1.1 to SL 1.2 - What's Possible and What's Different ?

 

[p3eps]

Now you are be overly dramatic. Nobody is suggesting you are telling lies, but a Specialized dealer that has done over 200 motors, has a polar opposite view, so hopefully you can appreciate the questions/interest. From what I can see in the images, it looks pretty clean, but my dealer seems to suggest the 1.2 is vastly bigger and while it possible to get it to work, it would require a fair amount of "rigging". The truth lies someone in between these two extremes, hence my ask for a video or pics so I can understand it better. I was surprised that my dealer was willing to sell me a motor, but you can't even order an SL 1.2 motor...it's not it the system.

And trust me, the last thing I want to do is be forced to buy a new KSL if I can swap to a 1.2 motor! That's my ideal situation.

When the Mastermind TCU came out, everyone wanted to swap their original TCU for one. Specialized wouldn’t sell them, and bike shops were only able to obtain them as warranty replacements if they sent back a Mastermind as an exchange. We’re now over 2 years since the Mastermind came out - and very very few people have managed to get their hands on one.

I imagine the SL1.2 motor will be the same. Bike shops won’t be able to just order one from Specialized to upgrade an SL1.1 motor. If that was the case, everyone would buy an old KSL at 50% off (which most seem to be just now) and order up an SL1.2 motor for them.

Your dealer is maybe overplaying the difficulty of fitting the motor, as they don’t want to do it (or know they can’t get the part)? Several people here have fitted an SL1.2 motor in place of a 1.1. There’s a thread just now from someone who bought a Levo SL1.2 purely to take the motor off it and fit it to his KSL 1.1, then sold off the Levo SL with the 1.1 motor in it.

As others have mentioned, the motor has EXACTLY the same fitment as the original… just a slightly thicker housing due to the honeycomb design. You can modify the bash guard to fit with a dremel… or you could wait until the KSL 1.2 comes out, and probably buy the 1.2 bash guard from your dealer.

That being said… I still think you’ll have difficulty sourcing a 1.2 motor anytime soon.

 

[Endurafrika]

until S has graciously decided to make the 1.2 available to KSL owner you will only be able to make it work by moving an entire unit into the KSL (TCU, battery & motor).
The cheapest right now would be to buy their kids bike (Euro 4K) and move the entire unit over - confirmed by my LBS and apparently some people have done this already (swapping units). Kiddos wont mind a noisy 35Nm 1.1

 

[nicknameless]

until S has graciously decided to make the 1.2 available to KSL owner you will only be able to make it work by moving an entire unit into the KSL (TCU, battery & motor).
The cheapest right now would be to buy their kids bike (Euro 4K) and move the entire unit over - confirmed by my LBS and apparently some people have done this already (swapping units). Kiddos wont mind a noisy 35Nm 1.1

Got to lol at folk doing this. Presume they are keeping the other bike for the inevitable quick swap back prior to warranty claim?