Assembly frame LightCarbon LCE971 bafang M510 (By Denver)

[Denver]

It's time for me to assemble my new bike.

I will gradually provide assembly updates with my various critiques of the equipment I've chosen.
In a few lines, here's what I can tell you.

I rode a "Frey AM1000 EX" and enjoyed using it for 2 years and 2500 km. However, its noisy motor, unnecessary power (1000w), and excessive weight (31kg) led me to decide to sell it.

Today, my criteria for choosing a bike have shifted towards a lighter option with a focus on all-mountain/light enduro. I naturally opted for a carbon frame and carbon wheels. The Bafang M510 motor seems to be an excellent compromise, similar to the performance of a Bosch CX. While the "Bafang M560" also seemed interesting, I found it too noisy.

In the attached PDF, you'll find an Excel sheet listing the parts I've chosen, their weights, and the prices I paid (note that prices are in Swiss francs). Regarding weights, I'll gradually post photos of the different parts. It's quite remarkable to observe that manufacturers never provide the actual weight of their products, except for "Lightcarbon," which displays accurate weights. Other manufacturers usually state a weight lower than reality.
My bike should weigh 23.1kg (fully equipped) on the scale.

Why did I choose "LightCarbon"? It's the carbon frame manufacturer that instilled the most confidence in me. Their website is reliable, providing all frame specifications, and as we say here, "they show their cards." I communicated a lot through WhatsApp, and the person always responded correctly to all my inquiries, remaining very professional. Of all the equipment I've ordered from China, this is the best company I've dealt with. I considered the brand "Dengfu," but "LightCarbon" clearly gave me the impression of being superior. However, I have no doubt that "Dengfu" produces excellent frames; it's just a matter of personal preference as my heart leaned towards "LightCarbon".

 

[Denver]

Let's start with the centerpiece, the frame !

Lightcarbon advertises a weight of 3750g +/- 45g for the "Size M."
This specification is well-respected, and my frame weighs approximately 3669g with the base paint (matte black), including some basic components (see photos).

Here, "Lightcarbon" adopts, in my opinion, a good practice by including certain basic components in the frame weight. Therefore, it's reasonable to assume that with a customized paint job, we would still reach the specified 3750g or even 3800g.
The carbon manufacturing and finishing seem very satisfactory to me. Of course, to judge if a carbon frame is well-built, one needs to test it to see if the manufacturer has established a structure to make the frame adequately rigid yet flexible for comfort. I haven't noted any major defects in the frame; everything seems well-constructed.

Regarding the paint, as seen in the photo below, the frame shows scratches quite easily. Can we say that the paint is of poor quality? Certainly not. What needs to be understood here is that a non-lacquered paint will tend to mark like this anyway (my Frey AM1000 EX behaves exactly the same way). If you want to address this issue (which isn't really a problem), you'll need to lacquer your frame with a matte clear coat. That's the only solution (but it adds weight).

I should note that the scratches were not present during unpacking.
I accidentally caused them myself while handling the frame.
The frame was well-packaged with no apparent scratches.

We'll also take a brief look at the seatpost clamp.

Here, the only minor criticism I could make, and it's a purist's criticism, is that the two notches are not perfectly aligned with the frame. However, there will be no hindrance in use.

Personally, I'm always curious about the technical aspects, and that's why I'm sharing a link where you can explore the rear frame suspension kinematics.


Next, I'll discuss the carbon rims, model: E810-AD938-EN-Race circle.

 

[Slaine]

Is you make your own battery?

 

[Denver]

Is you make your own battery?

Although I have the skills and necessary tools to assemble a battery, I chose not to do so for this bike. The simple reason is that I found a battery with Samsung cells for 311 CHF (including all taxes). That's why I didn't assemble it myself, as the cost would have been almost the same. I'll discuss it more specifically in an article.

Je viens de voir que tu es Français, et si jamais je parle Français XD.
Si tu as des questions, hésite pas

 

[Slaine]

Although I have the skills and necessary tools to assemble a battery, I chose not to do so for this bike. The simple reason is that I found a battery with Samsung cells for 311 CHF (including all taxes). That's why I didn't assemble it myself, as the cost would have been almost the same. I'll discuss it more specifically in an article.

Je viens de voir que tu es Français, et si jamais je parle Français XD.
Si tu as des questions, hésite pas

thanks for the answer

 

[patdam]

About varnish, i think that lightcarbon (alike the other manufacturer) have not performed it because you have not request (some customers don't want to add few grams). For those tested (lightcarbon, dengfu, SZZS) glossy varnish has really great quality and provide efficient protection

 

[Denver]

About varnish, i think that lightcarbon (alike the other manufacturer) have not performed it because you have not request (some customers don't want to add few grams). For those tested (lightcarbon, dengfu, SZZS) glossy varnish has really great quality and provide efficient protection

Yes, that's exactly what I described in my previous post. I might not have fully understood your initial message, but indeed, this is a basic paint, almost like a primer. As you mentioned, applying varnish over the paint will enhance its durability.

 

[TheSnowShark]

Hello,

I will follow your subject with interest because I think I will follow the same path very soon, but perhaps with M560 for me..

And I live just on the other side of the "gouille"

A very nice day

 

[Denver]

Hello,

I will follow your subject with interest because I think I will follow the same path very soon, but perhaps with M560 for me..

And I live just on the other side of the "gouille"

A very nice day

Oui "la petite gouille Leman" ...
ça fait plaisir de voir que les francophones sont présent sur ce Forum .
J'ai beaucoup hésité avec le M560. Cependant, ce qui m'a fait partir sur le M510 est le bruit trop élevé du M560. À en juger par les vidéos sur Internet, je dirais qu'il est un peu moins bruyant que le M620. J'ai fait 2 ans avec un M620 (première génération avec les gros engrenages) et je ne supporte plus ce bruit... maintenant il y a des engrenages plus silencieux pour le M620 et c'est beaucoup mieux (je les ai changé sur mon moteur). Mais mise à part le bruit du M560, il est très intéressant entre son rapport : Poids/puissance (3.3kg). Pour un moteur de 500W nominal et 120Nm, il est très intéressant.

Translate For English :
I hesitated a lot with the M560. However, what led me to choose the M510 is the excessively loud noise of the M560. Judging from videos on the internet, I would say it's somewhat quieter than the M620. I used an M620 for 2 years (first generation with the large gears), and I can't stand that noise anymore. Now, there are quieter gears available for the M620, and it's much better (I changed them on my motor). But aside from the noise of the M560, it is very appealing in terms of its weight-to-power ratio (3.3kg). For a nominal 500W motor with 120Nm, it's quite attractive.

 

[Swannking]

Oui "la petite gouille Leman" ...
ça fait plaisir de voir que les francophones sont présent sur ce Forum .
J'ai beaucoup hésité avec le M560. Cependant, ce qui m'a fait partir sur le M510 est le bruit trop élevé du M560. À en juger par les vidéos sur Internet, je dirais qu'il est un peu moins bruyant que le M620. J'ai fait 2 ans avec un M620 (première génération avec les gros engrenages) et je ne supporte plus ce bruit... maintenant il y a des engrenages plus silencieux pour le M620 et c'est beaucoup mieux (je les ai changé sur mon moteur). Mais mise à part le bruit du M560, il est très intéressant entre son rapport : Poids/puissance (3.3kg). Pour un moteur de 500W nominal et 120Nm, il est très intéressant.

Translate For English :
I hesitated a lot with the M560. However, what led me to choose the M510 is the excessively loud noise of the M560. Judging from videos on the internet, I would say it's somewhat quieter than the M620. I used an M620 for 2 years (first generation with the large gears), and I can't stand that noise anymore. Now, there are quieter gears available for the M620, and it's much better (I changed them on my motor). But aside from the noise of the M560, it is very appealing in terms of its weight-to-power ratio (3.3kg). For a nominal 500W motor with 120Nm, it's quite attractive.

My M560 is louder than my M620. It is louder than any other M620 I came across even without new grease being added. The M560 one way bearing instead of the pawl ratchet and power delivery are superior to the M620.

 

[Denver]

My M560 is louder than my M620. It is louder than any other M620 I came across even without new grease being added. The M560 one way bearing instead of the pawl ratchet and power delivery are superior to the M620.

I'm willing to believe you regarding the M560 being noisier than an M620. However, when it comes to power, that seems implausible. The M620 has a nominal power of 1000W with a boost up to 1500W, while the M560 has a nominal power of 500W with a boost around 850W. It's not possible for the M560 to be more powerful. You might be confusing it with the M600, its predecessor, which is indeed quieter but heavier.

 

[Swannking]

I'm willing to believe you regarding the M560 being noisier than an M620. However, when it comes to power, that seems implausible. The M620 has a nominal power of 1000W with a boost up to 1500W, while the M560 has a nominal power of 500W with a boost around 850W. It's not possible for the M560 to be more powerful. You might be confusing it with the M600, its predecessor, which is indeed quieter but heavier.

I was referring to the power delivery, not the overall power. M560 delivered the power much smoother and less jerk (less on and off) than M620, easier to adjust the assist parameters using either dpc245 display or the bessst tool. M620 has no doubt more watt power than the M560.

 

[Denver]

For the continuation, as I mentioned earlier, we will talk about the wheels from LightCarbon.

In choosing the wheel type, I hesitated between two models for a long time...
The model E810-AD938-EN-Race and the model E810-MC937-EN-Race.


Both models share the same type of spokes (Sapim Race), the same hubs(E810), and an asymmetrical design.
However, one model has deeper rims, while the other has shallower ones (MC937 = 18mm / AD938 = 28mm).

In theory, a deeper rim is more vertically rigid, translating to better pedaling efficiency but sacrificing comfort. Currently, the trend is for depths between 18 mm and 22 mm for enduro or downhill riding. Personally, aiming for all-mountain riding and wanting to prioritize efficiency, I gave the 28mm depth model a chance. It's possible that in the future, I might regret this choice. We'll see if LightCarbon hasn't made the rim too vertically rigid. In the worst case, a too-rigid rim tends not to absorb vibrations, making the ride more tiring. An overly rigid rim also has less tolerance for riding mistakes. So, if you're like me and you're unsure, favor a lower height if you'll be riding on very rough trails. Conversely, if you want a more rolling bike, go for a higher height.


Visually, the rims appear to be of very good quality with solid assembly. Similar to the frame, the rims were chosen with a matte finish. However, (I would have liked to show you in a photo, but I couldn't) the paint layer is much thinner on the rims than on the frame. In reality, the rims have more of a satin effect, and you can very slightly discern the carbon weave. It's a style I wholeheartedly accept; I find it very attractive.

Let's take a moment to also briefly delve into the dimensions of the rim. The advertised width is 32 mm internal and 38 mm external. When taking measurements on the rims, it's observed that the depth (sorry, I can't find the photo) as well as the external width is as specified. However, the internal width falls short by 1mm (the smallest internal measurement I took was 30.4mm).

The hubs are black anodized aluminum, and the freehub body is made of steel to withstand the torque from the rider combined with the motor. This is undeniably more durable, and all brands have embraced it, such as "DT Swiss" with their "Hybrid" or "Hope Tech" with their latest "Pro 5." However, one will have to see their bike gain weight as steel freehub bodies are definitely heavier (about 100g more), but it's worth it to avoid future issues. Overall, everything seems correct. I haven't detected any play in the bearings; the machining is entirely satisfactory. I could easily assemble the cassette, and all the threads for the disc screws are perfect.

And what about the spokes ? Of course !
I believe you've understood that I enjoy pushing the reflection quite far.
Regarding the spokes, I've questioned whether there are counterfeit Sapim spokes.

(

Attention, I'm not suggesting that LightCarbon uses counterfeits !)

I own "HOPE" Fortus 30 Pro 4 wheels with Sapim Race spokes, and the LightCarbon wheels are also equipped with Sapim Race spokes ! Comparing the two, we notice that the letter stamping is very similar, but the spokes from "LightCarbon" display a "T," while the "HOPE" wheels show what seems to be a number "6." But it doesn't end there;

I wanted to push the reflection even further. Currently, I'm developing my own spoke tension meter and calibration bench. Naturally, I have various types of spokes.

Most of my spokes are ordered from Bike24, and I also have some Sapim spokes from an official distributor! Upon comparisons, it seems challenging to determine whether a spoke is official or not. However, there is one spoke from Bike24 that exhibits a significant flaw (see photos). I can hardly imagine "HOPE" using counterfeit spokes, and consequently, I also believe that "LightCarbon" uses genuine ones. To conclude on the spokes, I would have loved to take the tension of each spoke and provide a detailed report on it. However, my tension meter is not yet completed, so I can't check that aspect yet.

However, I took the time to check the "warp" of the rims as well as the "hop."

I'll share a short video with you...
It's excellent craftsmanship !


As for the rim tape, prefer a 32mm width over 30mm, allowing you to cover the entire surface. Regarding tire installation, I managed to mount them without any tools, and I even succeeded in seating the tire sidewalls using a mini pump. For me, it's well-sized, demonstrating that in case of difficulty during a ride, there won't be an issue putting back a sidewall that has come loose. As for air tightness, my tires have been mounted for a week, and I haven't experienced any leaks.

But then, in the end, do I recommend these rims? If we don't consider the fact that I haven't tried them yet and I don't have durability feedback, I would say: Yes!

 

[Sayonara]

I'm considering this frame myself but I have few questions for you.

I was looking at the weird "Straight 1 1/2'' head tube" measurement and someone told me it could be for the headset cable routing and that with a headset it could be turned to 1 1/8" tapered headtube and a normal 1 1/8" tapered fork could be used with it. What's your experience with that?

Did the frame come with the headset?

What made you choose m510 over m560 instead of going with m600?

What's your thoughts and experience with the VPP suspension system? It's totally foreign to me.

Could you prove link to the bolts and the headset for the frame you bought? I live in Finland so I can most likely get hold of the same parts as you did.

Did the frame come with motor covers and battery cover? Also if you are able to provide the links to that battery that would be awesome

 

[Denver]

I'm considering this frame myself but I have few questions for you.

I was looking at the weird "Straight 1 1/2'' head tube" measurement and someone told me it could be for the headset cable routing and that with a headset it could be turned to 1 1/8" tapered headtube and a normal 1 1/8" tapered fork could be used with it. What's your experience with that?

Did the frame come with the headset?

What made you choose m510 over m560 instead of going with m600?

What's your thoughts and experience with the VPP suspension system? It's totally foreign to me.

Could you prove link to the bolts and the headset for the frame you bought? I live in Finland so I can most likely get hold of the same parts as you did.

Did the frame come with motor covers and battery cover? Also if you are able to provide the links to that battery that would be awesome

Regarding the head tube, the frame is designed for a mountain bike fork with a tapered tube (I've attached a photo below for better understanding).

Mountain bike fork tubes are always conical to increase rigidity at the "T." If you want to use a straight tube fork, you'll need an adaptation shim to compensate for the missing cone (although I'm unsure if such shims exist).

For your information, the frame comes with the rear axle, screws for the rear shock, 2 Sram UDH hangers, and indeed, the headset is included. I've also included a photo below of what's included or not.



As for the motor choice, having used a powerful 1000W M620 for 2 years, I found it too overwhelming, giving a mini-motorcycle feel rather than a bike. The excessive weight led to a cumbersome sensation, affecting the playfulness of the ride. Thus, my criteria were weight, noise, and power.

The M600 was dismissed for being too heavy (3.9kg), despite its quiet operation. The M560 seemed a great compromise, but excessive noise (as judged on YouTube) eliminated it from consideration. This left the M510 or potentially the M820, requiring the LCE930 frame. However, it's a matter of compromise, and personally, "Light" electric bikes (like the LCE930 with M820 and a 410Wh battery) seem to be a middle ground between a traditional and an electric mountain bike. This, in my view, is a false good idea as it lacks autonomy and power to save only a few kilos on the bike. Additionally, people often overlook that these bikes are more suited for all-mountain than enduro riding, but that's another debate.

So, I naturally opted for an M510, which, in my opinion, is the best compromise to maintain a good mountain biking experience with assistance for speed and steep climbs, while having good autonomy with the provided 720Wh battery. To revisit my experience with the M620, initially, I used it mostly at 500W, but over time, I even reprogrammed the motor to lower the power to 125W. Hence, an M510 with modulation up to 550W is ample for the majority, as honestly, when the motor provides 500W, pedaling becomes easy, removing the athletic aspect of cycling.

From my research, this frame is midway between a Santa Cruz Heckler and a Scor 4060 Z ST.



"Lightcarbon" displays diagrams on their website concerning the virtual pivot point, and based on my analysis, everything seems coherent and worthy of major manufacturers.

I haven't finished assembling this bike, so I can't provide a usage experience yet. However, analyzing the "Scor 4060 Z ST," tests unanimously describe the bike as playful due to its short rear base (436mm). If we look at the "Santa Cruz Heckler" tests, it's praised for being well-balanced and very stable. Combining all this information, it seems that the "LightCarbon LCE971" frame physically resembles "Scor" with a geometry close to "Santa Cruz." Therefore, one could naturally expect it to have a good stability with a playful spirit.



I personally have a strong inclination towards virtual pivot points. Even though this system is heavier than others, I find it helps overcome potential issues such as a too pronounced "kickback."

From all my analyses before choosing this frame, the geometry appears to be an excellent compromise, especially the "Trail", which is also very coherent with its 128mm. Generally, a "Trail" of 130mm is considered an excellent compromise.

I hope I've answered your questions clearly; feel free to ask again if needed. (I hope my English is understandable as it's not my native language).

If you need titanium screws, I recommend the following stores :
Wanyifa Dear Store

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/906114?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_home.pcShopHead_11209937.0

Not included in the frame:
- Motor cover (Type -A)
- Motor (M510/M560/M600)
- Battery (SYR014 model)
- Mount for the battery



For the battery and support system, I purchased them here :
Shenzhen XiangYang Power Co Ltd St

https://xypowerofficial.aliexpress.com/store/1102144243?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_home.pcShopHead_2002815675092.0

I've conducted a capacity test, and everything seems consistent. I confidently recommend this supplier, given the attractive pricing.

For the motor, I've had positive experiences with this store :
SingYiu E-bike Store

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/912422680?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_home.pcShopHead_6001928646611.0

I know people who've ordered multiple motors without any issues.

 

[Sayonara]

Regarding the head tube, the frame is designed for a mountain bike fork with a tapered tube (I've attached a photo below for better understanding).

View attachment 134521 View attachment 134529

Mountain bike fork tubes are always conical to increase rigidity at the "T." If you want to use a straight tube fork, you'll need an adaptation shim to compensate for the missing cone (although I'm unsure if such shims exist).

For your information, the frame comes with the rear axle, screws for the rear shock, 2 Sram UDH hangers, and indeed, the headset is included. I've also included a photo below of what's included or not.

View attachment 134530

As for the motor choice, having used a powerful 1000W M620 for 2 years, I found it too overwhelming, giving a mini-motorcycle feel rather than a bike. The excessive weight led to a cumbersome sensation, affecting the playfulness of the ride. Thus, my criteria were weight, noise, and power.

The M600 was dismissed for being too heavy (3.9kg), despite its quiet operation. The M560 seemed a great compromise, but excessive noise (as judged on YouTube) eliminated it from consideration. This left the M510 or potentially the M820, requiring the LCE930 frame. However, it's a matter of compromise, and personally, "Light" electric bikes (like the LCE930 with M820 and a 410Wh battery) seem to be a middle ground between a traditional and an electric mountain bike. This, in my view, is a false good idea as it lacks autonomy and power to save only a few kilos on the bike. Additionally, people often overlook that these bikes are more suited for all-mountain than enduro riding, but that's another debate.

So, I naturally opted for an M510, which, in my opinion, is the best compromised to maintain a good mountain biking experience with assistance for speed and steep climbs, while having good autonomy with the provided 720Wh battery. To revisit my experience with the M620, initially, I used it mostly at 500W, but over time, I even reprogrammed the motor to lower the power to 125W. Hence, an M510 with modulation up to 550W is ample for the majority, as honestly, when the motor provides 500W, pedaling becomes easy, removing the athletic aspect of cycling.

From my research, this frame is midway between a Santa Cruz Heckler and a Scor 4060 Z ST.

View attachment 134531 View attachment 134532

"Lightcarbon" displays diagrams on their website concerning the virtual pivot point, and based on my analysis, everything seems coherent and worthy of major manufacturers.

I haven't finished assembling this bike, so I can't provide a usage experience yet. However, analyzing the "Scor 4060 Z ST," tests unanimously describe the bike as playful due to its short rear base (436mm). If we look at the "Santa Cruz Heckler" tests, it's praised for being well-balanced and very stable. Combining all this information, it seems that the "LightCarbon LCE971" frame physically resembles "Scor" with a geometry close to "Santa Cruz." Therefore, one could naturally expect it to have a good stability with a playful spirit.

View attachment 134533 View attachment 134534 View attachment 134535

I personally have a strong inclination towards virtual pivot points. Even though this system is heavier than others, I find it helps overcome potential issues such as a too pronounced "kickback."

From all my analyzes before choosing this frame, the geometry appears to be an excellent compromise, especially the "Trail", which is also very consistent with its 128mm. Generally, a "Trail" of 130mm is considered an excellent compromise.

I hope I've answered your questions clearly; feel free to ask again if needed. (I hope my English is understandable as it's not my native language).

If you need titanium screws, I recommend the following stores:
Wanyifa Dear Store

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/906114?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_home.pcShopHead_11209937.0

Not included in the frame:
- Motor cover (Type -A)
- Engine (M510/M560/M600)
- Battery (SYR014 model)
- Mount for the battery

View attachment 134536 View attachment 134537 View attachment 134538

For the battery and support system, I purchased them here:
Shenzhen XiangYang Power Co Ltd St

https://xypowerofficial.aliexpress.com/store/1102144243?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_home.pcShopHead_2002815675092.0

I've conducted a capacity test, and everything seems consistent. I confidently recommend this supplier, given the attractive pricing.

For the motor, I've had positive experiences with this store:
SingYiu E-bike Store

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/912422680?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_home.pcShopHead_6001928646611.0

I know people who've ordered multiple motors without any issues.

Thank you for extremely informative answer. I'm from Finland so my English isn't the best either haha.

I've been riding my diy full suspension bbs02b 750w for a year now and I'm planning to build my next bike.

Regarding the headtube I was referring to the information straight from the lightcarbon website where it says that the frames headtube is straight 1 1/2". Picture below.

I thought this measurement is what dictates what type and size the forks needs to be. That's why I was so confused about the frame and fork compability when these are the different size forks in bike24.de for example. Picture below.

I've been hearing a lot of good about the rockshock Zeb fork and I was planning to go with that. The easy maintanance compared to fox forks is what made me think this would be good fit for me. Thinking of getting the 160mm travel version.

Any suggestions for rear shock? I'm super new to most of mtb stuff and I'm mostly going based my research and others experience.

What made you choose to upgrade all the bolts to titanium? Durability and to save weight mostly?

In your exel file you list this item. "Convert DC/DC 60w with mount". What is this?

How about "Full system mount lock"?

What made you choose DCP245 display over the others?

How did you get your motor so cheap? The listing for m560 with the dcp245 is €910. And the battery for only 308 but for me the listing shows 390€. Was Swiss franc extremely strong when you ordered? Currently 1 to 1.05€.

Did you get the bafang cranks as 165mm from the seller or did you have to get them elsewhere? I'm thinking of getting 160mm cranks myself.

In the exel file you also listed "support chainring". Does this mean the "spider"? (I think that's what it is called?) Picture example.

Is this the chain guide Ztto iscg-05 you are using? Link to the chain guide

And lastly...

Why haven't you finished your bike build yet?

 

[Denver]

Thank you for extremely informative answer. I'm from Finland so my English isn't the best either haha.

I've been riding my diy full suspension bbs02b 750w for a year now and I'm planning to build my next bike.

Regarding the headtube I was referring to the information straight from the lightcarbon website where it says that the frames headtube is straight 1 1/2". Picture below.
View attachment 134542

I thought this measurement is what dictates what type and size the forks needs to be. That's why I was so confused about the frame and fork compability when these are the different size forks in bike24.de for example. Picture below.
View attachment 134543

I've been hearing a lot of good about the rockshock Zeb fork and I was planning to go with that. The easy maintanance compared to fox forks is what made me think this would be good fit for me. Thinking of getting the 160mm travel version.

Any suggestions for rear shock? I'm super new to most of mtb stuff and I'm mostly going based my research and others experience.

What made you choose to upgrade all the bolts to titanium? Durability and to save weight mostly?

In your exel file you list this item. "Convert DC/DC 60w with mount". What is this?

How about "Full system mount lock"?

What made you choose DCP245 display over the others?

How did you get your motor so cheap? The listing for m560 with the dcp245 is €910. And the battery for only 308 but for me the listing shows 390€. Was Swiss franc extremely strong when you ordered? Currently 1 to 1.05€.

Did you get the bafang cranks as 165mm from the seller or did you have to get them elsewhere? I'm thinking of getting 160mm cranks myself.

In the exel file you also listed "support chainring". Does this mean the "spider"? (I think that's what it is called?) Picture example.
View attachment 134544

Is this the chain guide Ztto iscg-05 you are using? Link to the chain guide

And lastly...

Why haven't you finished your bike build yet?

Thank you very much for your interest in the construction of my bike; it gives me the feeling that I'm not doing this in vain.

Indeed, it can be confusing; "Lightcarbon" should indicate that 1 1/2" is the top part of the head tube, and 1 1/8" is for the bottom part.

So, for this frame, you must choose a fork with a "T": 1 1/8" 1 1/2" Tapered.

Regarding maintenance ease, RockShox is "simpler" in my opinion, with more accessible service manuals, modern colors, and clearer explanations.

I debated between a Lyrik Ultimate (Charger 3 RC2) with "buttercups" and the Fox 36 Factory I already have. Initially, I wanted a Lyrik due to service considerations, but it was only available in green, not matching my bike's spirit. When I found this Fox 36 Factory at the price I paid, I didn't hesitate to buy it, even though I would have preferred 150mm travel over 160mm.

If you're wondering why I preferred 150mm, it's because my practice leans more towards "all mountain" than "enduro," and moving to 160mm increases the trail.

- 160mm = More "Trail" = more stability / less maneuverability
- 150mm = Less "Trail" = less stability / more maneuverability

If the 160mm travel doesn't suit me, for a lower cost (70-100 USD), it's easy to change the air shaft and decrease the travel.

For DIY servicing, I strongly advise getting quality and OEM tools (RockShox or Fox, depending on your choice). Don't overlook oil or the right thread locker (e.g., Loctite 243, 262, 242).

For the rear shock, considering "all mountain" riding, a RockShox Super Deluxe or Fox Float X is suitable. Price, ease of service, and reliability led me to choose the RockShox Super Deluxe Ultimate RCT2. While the Fox Float X doesn't have a significantly more complicated service, it's more expensive and, according to a service center (PMB Suspension YouTube channel), less reliable.

If you want my suggestion on suspension choices, I believe it's important to stay consistent with the suspension type based on your riding style.

To support my points, here's what I consider:

DH:
- RockShox Boxxer
- RockShox Super Deluxe Coil
- Fox 40
- Fox DHX2

Enduro:
- RockShox ZEB
- RockShox Vivid
- Fox 38
- Fox Float X2

All mountain:
- RockShox Lyrik
- RockShox Super Deluxe
- Fox 36
- Fox Float X

Trail:
- RockShox Yari/Pike
- RockShox Deluxe
- Fox 34
- Fox Float

Certainly, I could have also considered "Öhlins" or other brands, but it's just to provide you with a reference.

Of course, there can be variations based on the type of bike, rider weight, and skill level, but in broad strokes, that's the idea.

It's crucial to keep in mind that we're talking about e-bikes, and the bike is inherently heavier (we won't be fitting cross-country components).

If I had to choose components for enduro, I would go for a RockShox Zeb or a Fox 38 with a good cartridge (Charger 3 RC2 or Grip 2 for Fox). However, for the rear shock, you really should avoid the Fox Float X2 due to issues like cavitation and leaks. It's better to prioritize a RockShox Vivid, even though Fox has recently addressed many problems with the Float X2. It's also important to be clear about maintaining these two shocks; it's a bit intricate, especially with the Float X2. (I'll let you check the manuals or watch videos on YouTube for a more precise understanding.)



As for titanium hardware, I've replaced missing parts for aesthetic reasons and weight savings. Be cautious about titanium types (grade 2, 4, 10) as they have different resistances. Moreover, titanium has lower shear strength than stainless steel, especially concerning the screws that hold the rear shock.

In one of my previous posts, I mentioned that my first bike weighed 31 kg, an experience I'll never repeat. With such weight, it clearly deviates from the essence of mountain biking. The bike lacks playfulness, that "Poppy" feel, not to mention its almost non-existent maneuverability. In simple terms, it's a bike suitable for descending in a straight line. However, it's crucial to be honest; the "Frey" has a very peculiar (to put it mildly) geometry, and unfortunately, it's a brand I wouldn't recommend.

As for the converter, it's a voltage converter (48v to 8.4v). I'm installing a Lupine AX light that operates at 7.2v nominal. To avoid an additional battery at the correct voltage, I added this small component to draw power from the main battery. (I'll discuss this in my next post).

When I mention complete locking, it corresponds to the system securing the battery to the frame (not included with the frame).



I'm not sure if it's a typo on your part, but I have a Bafang M510.

When I purchased my motor, I got a complete set (motor, cranks, cables, covers, DCP245). To get the DCP245, I contacted "SingYui E-bike Store" to inquire about replacing it with the DCP240.

I chose the DCP245 for its compact and colorful screen. It's, in my opinion, a good compromise between a small size and maximum available information (especially pedal cadence). Its placement on the handlebar also provides better protection against falls compared to a screen fixed on top of the handlebar near the stem.

Regarding the price, I just checked, and it's currently 614 CHF (including shipping to Switzerland, excluding VAT), so I imagine the Swiss Franc is favorable.

For the battery, I had it delivered to Europe and benefited from free shipping. Adding the favorable exchange rate of the Swiss Franc, I believe that's why the price is relatively low.

As for the cranks, I bought them with the motor. Yes, I opted for 165mm, but if I had to redo it, I would choose 160mm. Shortly after, I came across a YouTube video (Levy Batista's channel / Cranks, Size Matters). I believe 160mm has more advantages, even if the difference compared to 165mm may be marginal.

The "support chainring" is this :



The Ztto chain guide is in my Excel spreadsheet, but don't buy it; it's not compatible.
Edit 06.05.2024 : The chain guide is indeed compatible with Bafang M510, M560, M600 motors; however, you must be careful to select the correct "Spider" because only two models are compatible (CW G522.1A and CW G522.1B) (I'll discuss this more precisely in the next post) so that you can attach a chain guide. The key is that the chain guide is in the "ISCG-05" format. However, be cautious as some "ISCG-05" format chain guides may be too offset to the right or left. Some have compensating shims, while others do not (see my upcoming posts for more details).



You can attach it to the motor (ISCG-05 = ok), but the support plate rubs against it. If you want one, I think you should do what I did and make a custom one because I haven't found a compatible model on the market.
The chain guide I chose is not the same as yours, so I don't know if yours is compatible.

And why haven't I finished this bike ?

I believe it's essential to realize that when you buy a bare frame, you're on the same level as brands like Specialized, Trek, Scott... Even though the frame is excellent, there are many small things that can be improved. On an individual scale, everything resembles prototyping and customization. It might not be very clear now, but you'll see in my next post why I say this.

So, you have two options: either assemble your bike quickly, akin to a "Cheap" manufacturer, or take the time to scrutinize each part and improve what can be improved. All of this takes a lot of time, and to be honest, I have some health issues that don't allow me to dedicate full time to it.

 

[Sayonara]

Thank you very much for your interest in the construction of my bike; it gives me the feeling that I'm not doing this in vain.

Indeed, it can be confusing; "Lightcarbon" should indicate that 1 1/2" is the bottom part of the head tube, and 1 1/8" is for the top part.

So, for this frame, you must choose a fork with a "T": 1 1/8" 1 1/2" Tapered.

Regarding maintenance ease, RockShox is "simpler" in my opinion, with more accessible service manuals, modern colors, and clearer explanations.

I debated between a Lyrik Ultimate (Charger 3 RC2) with "buttercups" and the Fox 36 Factory I already have. Initially, I wanted a Lyrik due to service considerations, but it was only available in green, not matching my bike's spirit. When I found this Fox 36 Factory at the price I paid, I didn't hesitate to buy it, even though I would have preferred 150mm travel over 160mm.

If you're wondering why I preferred 150mm, it's because my practice leans more towards "all mountain" than "enduro," and moving to 160mm increases the trail.
View attachment 134579

- 160mm = More "Trail" = more stability / less maneuverability
- 150mm = Less "Trail" = less stability / more maneuverability

If the 160mm travel doesn't suit me, for a lower cost (70-100 USD), it's easy to change the air shaft and decrease the travel.

For DIY servicing, I strongly advise getting quality and OEM tools (RockShox or Fox, depending on your choice). Don't overlook oil or the right thread locker (e.g., Loctite 243, 262, 242).

For the rear shock, considering "all mountain" riding, a RockShox Super Deluxe or Fox Float X is suitable. Price, ease of service, and reliability led me to choose the RockShox Super Deluxe Ultimate RCT2. While the Fox Float X doesn't have a significantly more complicated service, it's more expensive and, according to a service center (PMB Suspension YouTube channel), less reliable.

If you want my suggestion on suspension choices, I believe it's important to stay consistent with the suspension type based on your riding style.

To support my points, here's what I consider:

DH:
- RockShox Boxxer
- RockShox Super Deluxe Coil
- Fox 40
- Fox DHX2

Enduro:
- RockShox ZEB
- RockShox Vivid
- Fox 38
- Fox Float X2

All mountain:
- RockShox Lyrik
- RockShox Super Deluxe
- Fox 36
- Fox Float X

Trail:
- RockShox Yari/Pike
- RockShox Deluxe
- Fox 34
- Fox Float

Certainly, I could have also considered "Öhlins" or other brands, but it's just to provide you with a reference.

Of course, there can be variations based on the type of bike, rider weight, and skill level, but in broad strokes, that's the idea.

It's crucial to keep in mind that we're talking about e-bikes, and the bike is inherently heavier (we won't be fitting cross-country components).

If I had to choose components for enduro, I would go for a RockShox Zeb or a Fox 38 with a good cartridge (Charger 3 RC2 or Grip 2 for Fox). However, for the rear shock, you really should avoid the Fox Float X2 due to issues like cavitation and leaks. It's better to prioritize a RockShox Vivid, even though Fox has recently addressed many problems with the Float X2. It's also important to be clear about maintaining these two shocks; it's a bit intricate, especially with the Float X2. (I'll let you check the manuals or watch videos on YouTube for a more precise understanding.)



As for titanium hardware, I've replaced missing parts for aesthetic reasons and weight savings. Be cautious about titanium types (grade 2, 4, 10) as they have different resistances. Moreover, titanium has lower shear strength than stainless steel, especially concerning the screws that hold the rear shock.

In one of my previous posts, I mentioned that my first bike weighed 31 kg, an experience I'll never repeat. With such weight, it clearly deviates from the essence of mountain biking. The bike lacks playfulness, that "Poppy" feel, not to mention its almost non-existent maneuverability. In simple terms, it's a bike suitable for descending in a straight line. However, it's crucial to be honest; the "Frey" has a very peculiar (to put it mildly) geometry, and unfortunately, it's a brand I wouldn't recommend.

As for the converter, it's a voltage converter (48v to 8.4v). I'm installing a Lupine AX light that operates at 7.2v nominal. To avoid an additional battery at the correct voltage, I added this small component to draw power from the main battery. (I'll discuss this in my next post).

When I mention complete locking, it corresponds to the system securing the battery to the frame (not included with the frame).
View attachment 134574 View attachment 134576 View attachment 134577


I'm not sure if it's a typo on your part, but I have a Bafang M510.

When I purchased my motor, I got a complete set (motor, cranks, cables, covers, DCP245). To get the DCP245, I contacted "SingYui E-bike Store" to inquire about replacing it with the DCP240.

I chose the DCP245 for its compact and colorful screen. It's, in my opinion, a good compromise between a small size and maximum available information (especially pedal cadence). Its placement on the handlebar also provides better protection against falls compared to a screen fixed on top of the handlebar near the stem.

Regarding the price, I just checked, and it's currently 614 CHF (including shipping to Switzerland, excluding VAT), so I imagine the Swiss Franc is favorable.

For the battery, I had it delivered to Europe and benefited from free shipping. Adding the favorable exchange rate of the Swiss Franc, I believe that's why the price is relatively low.

As for the cranks, I bought them with the motor. Yes, I opted for 165mm, but if I had to redo it, I would choose 160mm. Shortly after, I came across a YouTube video (Levy Batista's channel / Cranks, Size Matters). I believe 160mm has more advantages, even if the difference compared to 165mm may be marginal.

The "support chainring" is this :

View attachment 134578

The Ztto chain guide is in my Excel spreadsheet, but don't buy it; it's not compatible.

View attachment 134580

You can attach it to the motor (ISCG-05 = ok), but the support plate rubs against it. If you want one, I think you should do what I did and make a custom one because I haven't found a compatible model on the market.
The chain guide I chose is not the same as yours, so I don't know if yours is compatible.

And why haven't I finished this bike ?

I believe it's essential to realize that when you buy a bare frame, you're on the same level as brands like Specialized, Trek, Scott... Even though the frame is excellent, there are many small things that can be improved. On an individual scale, everything resembles prototyping and customization. It might not be very clear now, but you'll see in my next post why I say this.

So, you have two options: either assemble your bike quickly, akin to a "Cheap" manufacturer, or take the time to scrutinize each part and improve what can be improved. All of this takes a lot of time, and to be honest, I have some health issues that don't allow me to dedicate full time to it.

Okey thank you so much for the guidance about headtube steering tube lenghts. Seems like the info from lightcarbon got me all confused.

I'm not sure if the lyrik Ultimate charger 3 rc2 is over kill on my part but god damn that fork sounds insane! Sadly it's 800€. I think I will aim for 400-600€ range. If I don't find a good deal I'll have to get slightly used one. Haven't chosen/designed my paint (dyi) yet but that shade of green... not my favorite. So I have to agree with you on that one.

I'm on the lighter side of the normal rider I would guess (70kg/178cm).

Thank you for the tips on the maintanance. I will definitely try to learn and do as much as possible myself. My hobbies and job( even previous jobs) favor me in this department.

Öhlins is also extremely expensive and totally not for me. I'm not even close to skill level to be able to take the advantage of that and be able to fine tune it.

I have to do some research to all those numbers/tags and meaning behind all that. For example the Lyrik Ultimate charger 3 RC2. No clue about that charger or rc and how I can compere it to other forks.

Sadly PMB Suspension isn't English-speaking channel but I have heard and seen alot of nightmares about x2.

Ahh. Yeah that explains alot. I got a ok handlebar lamp and great helmet lamp so I won't need to mess with that, at least not yet

Oh yeah you meant that locking thing. It comes with the battery support system or is it completely separate?

Maybe I miss spoke but yes I understood you have m510 but the price seemed extremely odd to jump about 300€ maybe I need to check out what's going on with Swiss franc and maybe order it via some "middle man" because the price difference seems insane. 1,5 times the price in euros than Swiss franc on the motor and 1,3 times with the battery.

Ah yeah good reasoning behind that screen choise then. I need to check out the options.

Oh the price were without VAT? Mine says 390€ free shipping and VAT included (according to aliexpress) and 910€ for motor kit.

Motor kit link

Battery link

I'll have to message the motor kit seller if 160mm cranks are possible.

Ah yes, thank you. I think that's what they call "spider" as in support chain ring.

The chain guide I showed photo off was just the first one that cam across in aliexpress search. But good to know that it didn't fit. Guess I'll have to follow your steps with the diy.

I totally understand the want to fine tune and perfect every single detail about projects. I'm glad I'm starting to learn to draw the line where I go too far with things Now that I'm over 30 I have become to controll myself better and spread my perfectionism between my job and hobbies. Especially aquariums have been big part of this since I'm dealing with living things.

Can't wait to hear more about you! Thank you for spreading the information!

Edit: isn't This the same lyrik fork you wanted but in black?

 

[JimLee-Lightcarbon]

For the continuation, as I mentioned earlier, we will talk about the wheels from LightCarbon.

View attachment 133430 In choosing the wheel type, I hesitated between two models for a long time...
The model E810-AD938-EN-Race and the model E810-MC937-EN-Race.


Both models share the same type of spokes (Sapim Race), the same hubs(E810), and an asymmetrical design.
However, one model has deeper rims, while the other has shallower ones (MC937 = 18mm / AD938 = 28mm).

In theory, a deeper rim is more vertically rigid, translating to better pedaling efficiency but sacrificing comfort. Currently, the trend is for depths between 18 mm and 22 mm for enduro or downhill riding. Personally, aiming for all-mountain riding and wanting to prioritize efficiency, I gave the 28mm depth model a chance. It's possible that in the future, I might regret this choice. We'll see if LightCarbon hasn't made the rim too vertically rigid. In the worst case, a too-rigid rim tends not to absorb vibrations, making the ride more tiring. An overly rigid rim also has less tolerance for riding mistakes. So, if you're like me and you're unsure, favor a lower height if you'll be riding on very rough trails. Conversely, if you want a more rolling bike, go for a higher height.

View attachment 133431
Visually, the rims appear to be of very good quality with solid assembly. Similar to the frame, the rims were chosen with a matte finish. However, (I would have liked to show you in a photo, but I couldn't) the paint layer is much thinner on the rims than on the frame. In reality, the rims have more of a satin effect, and you can very slightly discern the carbon weave. It's a style I wholeheartedly accept; I find it very attractive.

View attachment 133437 View attachment 133436 View attachment 133438

Let's take a moment to also briefly delve into the dimensions of the rim. The advertised width is 32 mm internal and 38 mm external. When taking measurements on the rims, it's observed that the depth (sorry, I can't find the photo) as well as the external width is as specified. However, the internal width falls short by 1mm (the smallest internal measurement I took was 30.4mm).

View attachment 133439 View attachment 133440 View attachment 133441

The hubs are black anodized aluminum, and the freehub body is made of steel to withstand the torque from the rider combined with the motor. This is undeniably more durable, and all brands have embraced it, such as "DT Swiss" with their "Hybrid" or "Hope Tech" with their latest "Pro 5." However, one will have to see their bike gain weight as steel freehub bodies are definitely heavier (about 100g more), but it's worth it to avoid future issues. Overall, everything seems correct. I haven't detected any play in the bearings; the machining is entirely satisfactory. I could easily assemble the cassette, and all the threads for the disc screws are perfect.

View attachment 133451 View attachment 133450 View attachment 133449



And what about the spokes ? Of course !
I believe you've understood that I enjoy pushing the reflection quite far.
Regarding the spokes, I've questioned whether there are counterfeit Sapim spokes.

(

Attention, I'm not suggesting that LightCarbon uses counterfeits !)

I own "HOPE" Fortus 30 Pro 4 wheels with Sapim Race spokes, and the LightCarbon wheels are also equipped with Sapim Race spokes ! Comparing the two, we notice that the letter stamping is very similar, but the spokes from "LightCarbon" display a "T," while the "HOPE" wheels show what seems to be a number "6." But it doesn't end there;
View attachment 133462 View attachment 133463

I wanted to push the reflection even further. Currently, I'm developing my own spoke tension meter and calibration bench. Naturally, I have various types of spokes.
View attachment 133464

Most of my spokes are ordered from Bike24, and I also have some Sapim spokes from an official distributor! Upon comparisons, it seems challenging to determine whether a spoke is official or not. However, there is one spoke from Bike24 that exhibits a significant flaw (see photos). I can hardly imagine "HOPE" using counterfeit spokes, and consequently, I also believe that "LightCarbon" uses genuine ones. To conclude on the spokes, I would have loved to take the tension of each spoke and provide a detailed report on it. However, my tension meter is not yet completed, so I can't check that aspect yet.

View attachment 133469 View attachment 133471 View attachment 133472 View attachment 133473

However, I took the time to check the "warp" of the rims as well as the "hop."

View attachment 133474

I'll share a short video with you...
It's excellent craftsmanship !


As for the rim tape, prefer a 32mm width over 30mm, allowing you to cover the entire surface. Regarding tire installation, I managed to mount them without any tools, and I even succeeded in seating the tire sidewalls using a mini pump. For me, it's well-sized, demonstrating that in case of difficulty during a ride, there won't be an issue putting back a sidewall that has come loose. As for air tightness, my tires have been mounted for a week, and I haven't experienced any leaks.

View attachment 133488 View attachment 133485

But then, in the end, do I recommend these rims? If we don't consider the fact that I haven't tried them yet and I don't have durability feedback, I would say: Yes!

View attachment 133486 View attachment 133487 View attachment 133478 View attachment 133479 View attachment 133490 View attachment 133491 View attachment 133492 View attachment 133489 View attachment 133476 View attachment 133477 View attachment 133481 View attachment 133482 View attachment 133483 View attachment 133484

the sapim spokes with Letter T means the spokes are produced in sapim's factory in Taiwan, not in Belgium, but the quality is the same,

 

[Denver]

the sapim spokes with Letter T means the spokes are produced in sapim's factory in Taiwan, not in Belgium, but the quality is the same,

I thank you for these details; now it is much clearer.

 

[Denver]

Previously, I was asked why I hadn't finished assembling my bike yet. I replied that the next "post" would be there to answer this more precisely. And that's what I'm going to do, starting with the headset.

As you can see below, the photo shows the headset installed in the frame. Everything fits together correctly, there is no play, it's well designed and well manufactured.

However, I have a few small criticisms to make about this headset kit. Firstly, the guide ring isn't angled enough. If you want to preserve your cables as best as possible, I advise applying a file to break this angle.

Additionally, and this is a poor choice by LightCarbon because unfortunately the cable of the DCP245

doesn't fit through the hole. So you have two solutions ; either cut the plastic to reduce the thickness of the connector (as I did) or cut the cable and resolder the copper wires...

I can also tell you that the rubber grommet won't be very durable because it's too flexible...

But then why do we have this type of headset ?
Simply "Current trends" dictate that this type of headset is found on our mountain bikes because, let's remember, it originated from road bikes. It has the advantage of providing a cable management that is the most streamlined and discreet and moreover, attractive. You can judge for yourself the difference between my LightCarbon LCE971 and My Frey AM1000 EX :

But the downside is that it is known for having two major flaws, one being its difficult and tedious maintenance and the other is that it is an open door to all dirt (dust, sand, dirt...) which results in a more frequent maintenance interval (every 3 months minimum if you want to preserve your bearings as best as possible and depending on how often you ride in bad weather). Furthermore, many people use a "karcher" (high-pressure jet) to clean the bike, which exacerbates this problem as the pressure pushes the dirt inside.

But we have the possibility to counter this problem, and that's where 3D printing comes in handy. I took the trouble to completely model the headset and thus create a TPU seal to act as a barrier against potential dirt that could infiltrate.

TPU has the advantage of being very resistant and flexible. I took care to design the seal with 2 lips that come into contact with the outer cage of the bearing.

The seal only comes into contact with the metal part of the bearing to avoid rubbing against the frame and prematurely wearing the paint.

We can also see in the photo below that there is a small "dirt reservoir".

So, in the best case, it will remain outside the bearing and reach a certain saturation (if you never maintain it). Dirt could pass through the bearing seal.

Its effectiveness in real use will need to be judged, but from what I can visually assess, it seems very effective to me.

And now we move on to the rear end of the bike.

Here we can see the same problem as with the headset. There are openings for cable routing; the derailleur cable, the rear brake hose, and the speed sensor cable.

We can also note that LightCarbon could have aligned the holes.

Here too, it's an open invitation for dirt to embed itself in the rear end and around the motor.

Personally, I can't see myself cleaning the inside of the rear triangle because it's filled with dirt and water or constantly disassembling my motor from the frame to clean it properly. It should be noted that carbon is known to be abrasive, so it's not a good idea for cables to rub against the frame.
To address this problem, TPU grommets were modeled and printed to seal these holes as best as possible and thus limit the accumulation of dirt while minimizing cable friction as much as possible.

The grommets also have a minor advantage in that when you remove the shock from the frame, the rear triangle can no longer hit the frame and damage the paint.

The seals come in several versions; with fins, with holes, or closed if, like me, you use a "wireless" derailleur (AXS).

 

[Denver]

It would have been wise to make a small hole at the bottom of the rear triangle to have a drain in case water entered inside. I don't know if LightCarbon didn't do it for reasons of rigidity and strength or simply because they may not have thought about it.

The best compromise would have been a guided internal cable routing.

Now let's move on to the virtual pivot point.

Personally, I love this kinematic, I find it super aesthetic but like a Santa Cruz or a Scor, these kinematics have a small flaw.

The top part of the photo shows the frame linkage and the bottom part shows exactly what it reminds me of (yes literally a rock crusher).

The amalgam may be a bit exaggerated and I don't know what the odds are of a rock getting lodged in this spot, but one thing is for sure, the day it happens and the rock remains stuck between the frame and the linkage, I don't give much for your frame...
In this video (sorry it's in French) Youtube: "ButterCream Suspension" (Video 4:03min) explains that there is always dirt that gets lodged around the linkage for both Santa Cruz and Scor.
And what can we deduce from all this ?
Well, simply that it's not an isolated issue with LightCarbon, but rather a constraint inherent to this type of geometry.

To draw a parallel with Santa Cruz, we can see that they have made a small plastic tab to limit the projection of foreign bodies through the wheel.

Even though from my point of view this is not enough, I think that for this part, LightCarbon could have defined two small threaded inserts at this point to be able to attach a guard and thus limit this potential problem.

Maybe some of you won't see much use in protecting this part of the frame and even having some, they like to combine botany and mountain biking...

So I racked my brains trying to find a solution and honestly it's not easy. The best would be to drill the aluminum linkage and make threads. However, it requires equipment and skills. Personally, I have the skills but maybe you don't. So I opted for the non-drilling alternative. So there is a part to be glued to the frame to cancel out the friction and not wear the paint while the other part is attached with a quick-release clamp to the aluminum linkage.

Here's a little video that supports my remarks.

For this part, we're talking about protecting the rear shock.

It's somewhat optional and sorry but it won't be compatible with all shocks, I'm thinking especially of shocks designed for "DH" or "Coil". But here, a spring shock, a float X2, or a Vivid, doesn't really have an exposed sensitive part like the Deluxe, Super Deluxe, DPX or the Float X.

There's no doubt that this protection will be compatible for RockShox shocks, but for Fox shocks, I'm not sure because I don't have one and I couldn't check the measurements. However, for owners of a Fox shock, you can without any problem give me certain dimensions and I will adjust them to make this protection compatible. A cable guide will be provided with it to prevent the seat post cable from hitting the protection. This guide is printed in nylon containing 15% carbon fiber (light, strong, rigid) and it is compatible with the original screw (M4 × 7mm). The nylon guide has a second notch if like me you install a rear light (3mm diameter cable).

Make sure to place the seat post cable correctly and check that the protection doesn't hit it. If unfortunately the TPU protection were to hit the cable, you would simply need to straighten the copper rods to restore its original shape.

I also modeled a pump holder in ABS.

Of all the mini pumps I've tried, this model came out with the best compromise (compact, versatile, light, and effective). (MODEL: LEZINE Pocket Drive HV) (this pump would have been magnificent with a built-in mini pressure gauge but alas, in life we can't have everything).

This pump holder bears my "Maker" logo and I know that some people don't want it. If it really bothers you, just tell me that you want a version without a logo. (My logo is present to easily find me on "Thingiverse").

 

[Denver]

And we move on to the integrated voltage converter in the frame.

I imagine I'm not the only one in this situation and with good reason, when it comes to connecting lights to an e-bike it can quickly become a headache. 12 volts, 6 volts, 48 volts, 6W, 30W, well...

I have a Bafang M510 with a headlight power function controllable via the handlebar remote. However, the problem is that the operating voltage is 12 volts and the maximum accepted load is 6 watts. This is acceptable when it comes to connecting a "pilot" light but if you want a proper headlight, it's much more complicated.

For my part, I faced a dilemma. I have a Lupine AX lamp (with wireless remote) operating at 7.2 V nominal with a maximum power of 30 watts (7.2v × 4.16a).

Normally, this lamp is intended to be powered with a "2s" battery (3.6v in series). So I faced two possibilities; either add a voltage converter or add a second battery to my frame. Of course, I chose the voltage converter for weight and integration reasons.

So to give a brief presentation of this unit, it's a DC/DC voltage converter it accepts an input voltage between 6 volts and 60 volts and has an adjustable output voltage from 3.3 volts to 40 volts with a maximum of 5A (theoretical).

Here are some figures for those wondering about the efficiency of the PCB (HW-636B),

Lupine AX lamp (8.2v) WITHOUT HW-636B : - 2.37w (daytime running lights) - 7.8w (eco low beam) -16.38w (low beam) - 33w (high beam)

Lupine AX lamp (48v to 8.2v) WITH HW-636B : - 3.33w (daytime running lights) + 0.96w - 9.47w (eco low beam) + 1.67w -18.84w (low beam) + 2.46w - 37.89w (high beam) + 4.88w

Of course, depending on the output voltage, the efficiency varies (the less difference there is between the input voltage and the output voltage, the better the efficiency).

This gives an average efficiency of 85.6%. It's not exceptional, you might say, and we can do better. There are units with better efficiencies, however, they are heavier and larger... and in the end, as I often say; it's a question of compromise. Moreover, since I mostly use the headlight in "daytime running light" or "low beam" mode, the difference is only 1W to 1.5W per hour which is ridiculous on a 720Wh battery.

I equipped it with a relay (12v) to be able to control the headlight activation via the Bafang motor command. This little trick allows me to have automatic headlight activation either when the motor is turned on (hidden DCP245 light sensor) or when sunlight is lacking (visible DCP245 light sensor). I can also turn off the headlights whenever I want. The only downside is that the screen brightness is reduced when the headlights are on, which can be annoying during the day.

Furthermore, just like the DCP245, the Lupine AX lamp has a light sensor which automatically switches between daytime running lights and low beam. So I practically have automatic control of all my lights and that, that's priceless !

Here's a video that shows the operation :

For my part, I made a support in aluminum however the available model is with a plastic support and an aluminum heat sink. The PCB supports operation without a heat sink but for longevity reasons I preferred to apply an aluminum heat sink to reduce the heat as much as possible.

However, two fixing holes will need to be drilled as shown in the photo below.

And finally, the cable routing system at the battery level.

As shown in the photo below, LightCarbon did not provide cable routing guides and that's a real shame... It should be noted that when you have cable routing through the stem, the additional length of the cables (for when you turn the handlebars) is no longer outside the bike but inside the frame. As shown in the photo below, this has the effect of having cables that are stretched and therefore, it's difficult to keep the cables pressed against the frame.

During my first tests (without guidance), I realized that this was problematic and tedious if you want to often remove and then reinstall the battery. It's tedious to always be careful that the cables are not sandwiched between the battery and the frame. During my tests, I sometimes pinched the brake hose and I can tell you that it came out in a bad state.

So to address this problem I made a modeling in ABS which has two adhesive fasteners and which attaches to the threaded tubes used to attach a bottle cage to the frame.

I took the opportunity to push the reflection a little further and to integrate a compartment to accommodate an air tag.

 

[Denver]

This can be very useful in case of theft of your bike.

Of the four necessary screws 2 are to hold the support and the other two are to fix the airtag. So it will be very easy to change the battery when it is used up.

Of course, my support is purple in color, however with a black support and black screws, the location of the airtag is practically invisible. Moreover, in case of theft it will be difficult to reach because it will first be necessary to break the lock to remove the battery.

I imagine that some people might be interested in purchasing these parts. So for those who want to know the prices :


(No. 1)

The kit therefore includes :
- 1× The TPU joint for the headset.
- 5× TPU seals for the rear triangle.
- 1× TPU protection kit for VPP kinematics
The pack for $30 USD









(No. 2)

TPU protection for Rockshox shock absorber (Deluxe / Super Deluxe) + Nylon cable guide +15% carbon (PA12-CF15) is available for $20 USD







(No. 3)

Support (ABS) for LEZINE pump : $15 USD














(No. 4)

Complete converter is available for : $40 USD













(No. 5)

Internal guidance (ABS) : $20 USD







All these prices include packaging but exclude shipping costs. Shipping

I currently have in stock :
- No. 1 = 10x available
- No. 2 = 6x available
- No. 3 = 3x available soon
- No. 4 = 1x available
- No. 5 = 1x available

As a rule, all parts are black, however it is possible to make them in other colors except TPU. All screws are stainless steel.

The measurements were made on my own frame, if the parts were not suitable for your frame, you just have to return the parts to me for a refund or exchange for a part that fits.

As we have seen, I have "easy criticism" but in return I bring my share of solutions and it's to be taken as an opportunity because few people take the time to provide an objective feedback on the manufacture of a product. I hope that LightCarbon will offer even more refined frames in the future. However, LightCarbon should not be blamed, it's not easy to be on all fronts and to take into account every problem of a frame. Moreover, SantaCruz and Scor have not done better to protect the rocker... Very often, manufacturers face several problems such as development costs or the time they have available to create a new model. Moreover, the perfect frame does not exist. And very honestly, I prefer to have a frame manufacturer who puts all his efforts into the geometry of a frame as well as the kinematics and the quality of manufacture, especially as far as carbon is concerned, rather than into superfluous parts. Even if there are a few points to be made about this frame, I maintain that LightCarbon is a frame manufacturer worthy of the name and that you can trust them. For my part, I clearly do not regret having invested in this frame.

I just hope that in the future LightCarbon will take into account this kind of remarks if they make a version 2. I remain at LightCarbon's disposal to discuss all this or provide the 3D files if they want to produce copies of the various parts presented in this post.

It should be noted that I have already finished assembling my bike. I have already accumulated 150 km with the bike and I will soon give you feedback on its behavior. But before that, we'll talk about the battery (model SYR014) ...

 

[Sayonara]

Damn sick build and good job with the accessories!

Personally I'm still deciding between this frame and Dengfu E82 Currently I'm heavily leaning towards E82 because the frame supports 170/170 travel, better battery and if I understood correctly they can make holes for the cables in the frame so I don't have to wire cables through headset. Though they have not yet released other sizes than M (17") and I'm waiting for the L (19").

As well as that I'm also waiting for Bafang to officially re-release M560 750w.

 

[Denver]

Damn sick build and good job with the accessories!

Personally I'm still deciding between this frame and Dengfu E82 Currently I'm heavily leaning towards E82 because the frame supports 170/170 travel, better battery and if I understood correctly they can make holes for the cables in the frame so I don't have to wire cables through headset. Though they have not yet released other sizes than M (17") and I'm waiting for the L (19").

As well as that I'm also waiting for Bafang to officially re-release M560 750w.

Just because a bike has 170mm of travel doesn't mean it's better. You need to ask yourself, what kind of riding will you be using this bike for? Do you already have an E-bike? Yes? And do you feel limited by the travel you have?

A larger capacity battery isn't necessarily better either. For me, with a 720Wh battery, I have over 80km of range in ECO mode (Assist 340W max) (Bafang M510). Where do you want to go with a battery of over 1000Wh? Even if you get the M560 which is currently available, you'll have decent range with a 720Wh battery. It's true that you won't have 80km of range if you use the M560 in "Boost" mode, but having had an M620 (1000W) and now an M510 (250W), I can tell you that an M510 is sufficient, and if you want more, it might be better to go for an electric motorcycle, right? Like a Sur-ron? :')

The M510 in "Boost" mode removes the effort the rider needs to provide very well, and in this case, where has the spirit of the bike gone?

So why not go for an M600 or the M560 if you want "power comfort" but beyond 500W? = really try it out before buying to realize.

Please don't take offense at what I'm saying... I'm not criticizing you or disparaging your choices. I'm just sharing my perspective and experience, nothing more. Debate is healthy

In my opinion, an E-bike that weighs over 25kg isn't meant for very aggressive "enduro"... It's heavy to handle...

The weight of the Dengfu E82 with "enduro" equipment (for example, Fox 38, Float X2, and big brakes) will be around 28kg if you don't buy weight-optimized products. And from my experience with the 30kg Frey AM1000 EX, it's not a good candidate for enduro at all, even with its 180mm of travel...

Regarding cable routing ;

E82 Dengfu frame now available

Dear Gregor, thank you for the photos. Did you built the pack by yourself? I need to understand better the wiring below that green adhesives and where the zync plates goes before going to the BMS. Therefore I need some more detailed photos which I believe will be hard for you to take it, because...

www.emtbforums.com

I see on this thread :
The headset clearance is worse than mine, it chews up the cables, and it is far from waterproof...
I noticed a slight issue with the speed sensor.
For internal cable routing, no photos show the routing (for me, I didn't find anything). And so far, no one has delivered a verdict on this E82 like I'm doing for my LCE971. So I'm not saying that an LCE971 is better but just to be cautious until we have it in our hands...
I wish you good luck in attaching a bottle cage to this frame as there is hardly any space. The same mistake as the Frey Dopamine V2...
Furthermore, I don't understand brands that advertise enduro frames with a trail shock... It's so contradictory that I find they discredit themselves...
And for your information, frames equipped with a "yoke" prematurely wear out the shocks, so it's not a good solution for enduro.

For the M560 at 750W: I doubt it will see the light of day... An M600 is 500W and heavier. So, making an M560 at 750W while being 600g lighter is, in my opinion, unrealistic. We already see that lightening the M560 makes it noisier than the M600...

 

[Sayonara]

Just because a bike has 170mm of travel doesn't mean it's better. You need to ask yourself, what kind of riding will you be using this bike for? Do you already have an E-bike? Yes? And do you feel limited by the travel you have?

A larger capacity battery isn't necessarily better either. For me, with a 720Wh battery, I have over 80km of range in ECO mode (Assist 340W max) (Bafang M510). Where do you want to go with a battery of over 1000Wh? Even if you get the M560 which is currently available, you'll have decent range with a 720Wh battery. It's true that you won't have 80km of range if you use the M560 in "Boost" mode, but having had an M620 (1000W) and now an M510 (250W), I can tell you that an M510 is sufficient, and if you want more, it might be better to go for an electric motorcycle, right? Like a Sur-ron? :')

The M510 in "Boost" mode removes the effort the rider needs to provide very well, and in this case, where has the spirit of the bike gone?

So why not go for an M600 or the M560 if you want "power comfort" but beyond 500W? = really try it out before buying to realize.

Please don't take offense at what I'm saying... I'm not criticizing you or disparaging your choices. I'm just sharing my perspective and experience, nothing more. Debate is healthy

In my opinion, an E-bike that weighs over 25kg isn't meant for very aggressive "enduro"... It's heavy to handle...

The weight of the Dengfu E82 with "enduro" equipment (for example, Fox 38, Float X2, and big brakes) will be around 28kg if you don't buy weight-optimized products. And from my experience with the 30kg Frey AM1000 EX, it's not a good candidate for enduro at all, even with its 180mm of travel...

Regarding cable routing ;

https://www.emtbforums.com/threads/e82-dengfu-frame-now-available/

I see on this thread :
The headset clearance is worse than mine, it chews up the cables, and it is far from waterproof...
I noticed a slight issue with the speed sensor.
For internal cable routing, no photos show the routing (for me, I didn't find anything). And so far, no one has delivered a verdict on this E82 like I'm doing for my LCE971. So I'm not saying that an LCE971 is better but just to be cautious until we have it in our hands...
I wish you good luck in attaching a bottle cage to this frame as there is hardly any space. The same mistake as the Frey Dopamine V2...
Furthermore, I don't understand brands that advertise enduro frames with a trail shock... It's so contradictory that I find they discredit themselves...
And for your information, frames equipped with a "yoke" prematurely wear out the shocks, so it's not a good solution for enduro.

For the M560 at 750W: I doubt it will see the light of day... An M600 is 500W and heavier. So, making an M560 at 750W while being 600g lighter is, in my opinion, unrealistic. We already see that lightening the M560 makes it noisier than the M600...

I have diy ebike but it's an old Specialized Epic with Bafang BBS02B 750w. Pedaling with that motor sucks but with a throttle it's awesome. However for my riding everything is wrong It was meant to be for commuting to & from work but once I went into the forest with it this hobby sucked me in I also have tested multiple different diy bikes. Mostly with bbs02b and bbshd. I had a rocky mountain powerplay instinct but I need to have throttle as well as good pedaling bike to enjoy both aspects of this hobby. I really love the mixed benefits from pedal riding as well as throttle only riding. That's why I'm going to build my next bike with m560.

Here where I live we have alot of hills all around so typically we ride for 2-4 hours and switch places few times during that. I currently have 17,5Ah (840Wh maybe, can't remember atm) battery and that has been enough but just barely. I have had to change how I use my motor so I can get home after a long riding session. However you could argue that with m560 where the option to pedal actually works properly I could actually survive longer with same size battery.

Currently I don't want E-Enduro but I just like the option to enjoy both aspects of riding, assisted pedaling and throttle only. So many options for rides with that setup.

I understand that for some people E-bikes or throttle option is too far and ruins the spirit of biking but for me, as a new person in the hobby, I have never had that feeling so I can enjoy both aspects without seeing the negative sides. (Since I have not experienced them).

You could be right about the m560 500w being enough but in my eyes if the only negative side for the 750w (+10Nm) is bit louder motor I'm all in. As I said I don't have experience of motorless mtb ride in the forest where I can enjoy hearing my bike and learn from that so the noise is not a big deal to me.

I'm not offended at all! I really enjoy the depate for options and different views. I also really appreciate how informative your answers and posts here are! I'm looking for multiple view points so I can choose between them those that fit me the most.

How did you end up with 28kg with the E82? I think I'm missing something because I can't get to those numbers. Also I don't think the E82 frame is that much heavier than LCE971 even though the bigger battery adds approximately 1kg.

Yeah the headset cableling is terrible on the E82 but apparently they are trying to fix it with better headset. However my plan is to have them drill holes near the headset for the cables and from what I have spoken with Ben from Dengfu they are able to do it in the factory so I will keep the warranty.

Most of the times I run small Camelback backbag so bottle cage is not necessary for me. Maybe if I start to jump more it will become annoying but motocross/enduro riders use similars as well so I guess it's not that bad?

The m560 750w version has had multiple newer versions and from what I have found they have been able to fix the overheating problem and make the noise go down little bit. Most of the info can be found here.

Bafang M560

This is all I found so far.

www.emtbforums.com

Apparently Bafang is planning on reveling the newest version in the summer bike show and currently running few test batches of the motor with some fixes. And l said the noise is not a big problem for me. But then again the 500w version will most likely be enough power for me and then I get to enjoy the quiet motor as well.

Edit: I think my dream option for fork/shock is Lyrik (150mm)/Zeb(170mm) Ultimate charger 3 rc2 and RockShox Super Deluxe Ultimate RCT2. Heard so much great things about those and much easier to self service than Fox suspensions.

 

[Denver]

J'ai un vélo électrique DIY mais c'est un vieux Specialized Epic avec Bafang BBS02B 750w. Pédaler avec ce moteur, c'est nul, mais avec un accélérateur, c'est génial. Cependant, pour ma conduite, tout ne va pas. C'était censé être pour me rendre au travail et en revenir, mais une fois que je suis allé dans la forêt avec, ce passe-temps m'a aspiré. J'ai également testé plusieurs vélos de bricolage différents. Principalement avec bbs02b et bbshd. J'avais un instinct de jeu de puissance dans les montagnes Rocheuses, mais j'ai besoin d'un bon accélérateur ainsi que d'un bon pédalage pour profiter des deux aspects de ce passe-temps. J'aime vraiment les avantages mixtes de la conduite à pédales et de la conduite à accélérateur uniquement. C'est pourquoi je vais construire mon prochain vélo avec le m560.

Ici où je vis, nous avons beaucoup de collines tout autour, donc généralement nous roulons pendant 2 à 4 heures et changeons de place plusieurs fois pendant cela. J'ai actuellement une batterie de 17,5 Ah (840 Wh peut-être, je ne me souviens plus d'ATM) et cela a suffi, mais à peine. J'ai dû changer la façon dont j'utilise mon moteur pour pouvoir rentrer chez moi après une longue séance de conduite. Cependant, vous pourriez affirmer qu'avec le m560, où l'option de pédaler fonctionne correctement, je pourrais survivre plus longtemps avec une batterie de même taille.

Actuellement, je ne veux pas d'E-Enduro, mais j'aime juste la possibilité de profiter des deux aspects de la conduite, du pédalage assisté et de l'accélérateur uniquement. Autant d'options pour les balades avec cette configuration.

Je comprends que pour certaines personnes, les vélos électriques ou l'option d'accélérateur sont trop loin et ruinent l'esprit du vélo, mais pour moi, en tant que nouvelle personne dans le hobby, je n'ai jamais eu ce sentiment, donc je peux profiter des deux aspects sans voir les côtés négatifs. . (Comme je ne les ai pas vécus).

Vous pourriez avoir raison sur le fait que le m560 500w est suffisant, mais à mes yeux, si le seul côté négatif du 750w (+10Nm) est un moteur un peu plus bruyant, je suis tout à fait d'accord. Comme je l'ai dit, je n'ai pas d'expérience en VTT sans moteur. la forêt où je peux entendre mon vélo et en tirer des leçons, donc le bruit n'est pas un gros problème pour moi.

Je ne suis pas du tout offensé ! J'apprécie vraiment le débat pour les options et les points de vue différents. J’apprécie également beaucoup à quel point vos réponses et vos messages ici sont informatifs ! Je recherche plusieurs points de vue pour pouvoir choisir entre eux ceux qui me conviennent le plus.

Comment en êtes-vous arrivé à 28kg avec le E82 ? Je pense qu'il me manque quelque chose parce que je n'arrive pas à accéder à ces chiffres. De plus, je ne pense pas que le cadre E82 soit beaucoup plus lourd que le LCE971, même si la plus grosse batterie ajoute environ 1 kg.

Oui, le câblage du casque est épouvantable sur le E82 mais apparemment, ils essaient de le réparer avec un meilleur casque. Cependant, mon plan est de leur faire percer des trous près du casque pour les câbles et d'après ce que j'ai parlé avec Ben de Dengfu, ils sont capables de le faire en usine, je conserverai donc la garantie.

La plupart du temps, j'utilise un petit sac à dos Camelback, donc le porte-bidon n'est pas nécessaire pour moi. Peut-être que si je commence à sauter davantage, cela deviendra ennuyeux, mais les pilotes de motocross/enduro utilisent aussi des similaires, donc je suppose que ce n'est pas si mal ?

La version m560 750w a eu plusieurs versions plus récentes et d'après ce que j'ai trouvé, elles ont pu résoudre le problème de surchauffe et réduire un peu le bruit. La plupart des informations peuvent être trouvées ici.

Bafang M560

This is all I found so far.

www.emtbforums.com

Apparemment, Bafang prévoit de présenter la dernière version lors du salon du vélo d'été et effectue actuellement quelques lots de tests du moteur avec quelques correctifs. Et j'ai dit que le bruit n'était pas un gros problème pour moi. Mais là encore, la version 500 W sera probablement suffisante pour moi et je pourrai également profiter du moteur silencieux.

Edit : Je pense que mon option de rêve pour la fourche/amortisseur est Lyrik (150 mm)/Zeb (170 mm) Ultimate charger 3 rc2 et RockShox Super Deluxe Ultimate RCT2. J'ai entendu tellement de bonnes choses à leur sujet et c'est beaucoup plus facile à utiliser en libre-service que les suspensions Fox.

Okay, I understand a little better now, and you do have some experience in the world of cycling, so your personal reasoning seems sound to me. It's true that if having a throttle is essential for you, the M560 seems like a better choice.

And regarding the battery for your usage, I think you're right to opt for a larger battery.

Yes, perhaps I got a bit carried away with 28 kg, but what I meant by that is that it won't be feather-light. When I mentioned this weight, it's because in my mind, it went like this:

My bike 23kg
Difference between LCE971 and E82 frame +500g?
Motor +400g
Battery +800g
FOX 38 +300g
Float X2 +200g
DH tire + 700g
Panzer + 220g
Sealant + 200g
Total: 26.3kg
And for this weight, it's still concerning my bike, which has been optimized for weight, with all titanium screws, lightweight axles, custom cables, titanium saddle, carbon wheels, carbon handlebars... That's why I said around 28 kg.

As for routing cables through the headset, if it's done properly by the person doing the assembly, it's very neat and functional. I saw someone on the threads
E82 Dengfu frame now available
complaining that turning the handlebars changed gears, but that's simply because they didn't route the cables correctly.

And yes, Camelback (the EVOC bags are fantastic), I also use it very often. I sometimes use a water bottle, but only for short rides.

Thanks for the link; I wasn't aware that there was good progress on the M560. I'll keep an eye on that; it interests me. It might be worth being patient and waiting for the release of this motor.

I can't provide feedback on the new Charger 3 charger regarding the forks, but I do have the Super Deluxe Ultimate

So I've only ridden 150km with this shock, and for now, I can say it does its job. I'm still in the tuning phase, but from what I can tell, it seems to have good progression with good sensitivity at the beginning of the stroke. You have to consider the frame's kinematics as well. So there might still be a slight difference in behavior depending on the frame and especially the settings.

And it's true that RockShox is much easier to use than Fox... When I look at the settings on my Fox 36, it's like a maze .

And based on what you're describing about your riding style, I'm not sure if you really need a Zeb. I think a Lyrik could suit you; however, if you go for an E82 with 170mm of rear travel, you won't be able to have 150mm or 160mm upfront. You'll need a longer yoke and reduce the rear travel. But again, based on how you describe your riding style, I don't think it would be a problem whether you're at 150 or 160mm of travel.

 

[Swannking]

Okay, I understand a little better now, and you do have some experience in the world of cycling, so your personal reasoning seems sound to me. It's true that if having a throttle is essential for you, the M560 seems like a better choice.

And regarding the battery for your usage, I think you're right to opt for a larger battery.

Yes, perhaps I got a bit carried away with 28 kg, but what I meant by that is that it won't be feather-light. When I mentioned this weight, it's because in my mind, it went like this:

My bike 23kg
Difference between LCE971 and E82 frame +500g?
Motor +400g
Battery +800g
FOX 38 +300g
Float X2 +200g
DH tire + 700g
Panzer + 220g
Sealant + 200g
Total: 26.3kg
And for this weight, it's still concerning my bike, which has been optimized for weight, with all titanium screws, lightweight axles, custom cables, titanium saddle, carbon wheels, carbon handlebars... That's why I said around 28 kg.

As for routing cables through the headset, if it's done properly by the person doing the assembly, it's very neat and functional. I saw someone on the threads
E82 Dengfu frame now available
complaining that turning the handlebars changed gears, but that's simply because they didn't route the cables correctly.

And yes, Camelback (the EVOC bags are fantastic), I also use it very often. I sometimes use a water bottle, but only for short rides.

Thanks for the link; I wasn't aware that there was good progress on the M560. I'll keep an eye on that; it interests me. It might be worth being patient and waiting for the release of this motor.

I can't provide feedback on the new Charger 3 charger regarding the forks, but I do have the Super Deluxe Ultimate

So I've only ridden 150km with this shock, and for now, I can say it does its job. I'm still in the tuning phase, but from what I can tell, it seems to have good progression with good sensitivity at the beginning of the stroke. You have to consider the frame's kinematics as well. So there might still be a slight difference in behavior depending on the frame and especially the settings.

And it's true that RockShox is much easier to use than Fox... When I look at the settings on my Fox 36, it's like a maze .

View attachment 138718

And based on what you're describing about your riding style, I'm not sure if you really need a Zeb. I think a Lyrik could suit you; however, if you go for an E82 with 170mm of rear travel, you won't be able to have 150mm or 160mm upfront. You'll need a longer yoke and reduce the rear travel. But again, based on how you describe your riding style, I don't think it would be a problem whether you're at 150 or 160mm of travel.

That’s great work. Thank you. Mine painted blue.

 

[Slaine]

Great review about this frame, awesome job to improve this bike.
I agree with you Denver on lot off things.
Yoke is not the right geometry part for enduro bike, when you discuss with suspension mechanic guy he said it is the worst idea on MTB
Secondly, I prefer to play with my bike on trail and choose the best line instead to have a big travel on my suspension and go strait