SZZS specific CEF50-main thread (initial builds and troubleshooting related only)

[temon10]

720whr battery?

yes 720Wh, so also can't supply bafang 36v battery for now. All I can do just waiting.

 

[mike_kelly]

Ok now that we are all stuck waiting...
I have never built an emtb, a number of chinese MTB and Fatbikes but not ebike.
Are there any tips and tricks to running the cables and mounting the motor? Gotta do this in the right order or have to tear it all apart to do it again? Battery connectors etc. Padding the cables so they don't rattle?
Let's transfer some knowledge here!

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Ok now that we are all stuck waiting...
I have never built an emtb, a number of chinese MTB and Fatbikes but not ebike.
Are there any tips and tricks to running the cables and mounting the motor? Gotta do this in the right order or have to tear it all apart to do it again? Battery connectors etc. Padding the cables so they don't rattle?
Let's transfer some knowledge here!

I can only offer my experience with DengFu E06 and 2 LC004s....it's fairly straightforward. There should be spots to clip in or zip tie cable route thru the downtube. The battery cradle and latching key mechanisms could be a little confusing but trial-and-error. Fortunately, there's no key/latch cover, so it's should be less complicated... hopefully.

There are just 3 motor mount bolts and a cover with 4 mini screws and was the only mounting hassle for me at first but made sense once figured out. The wiring is plug-and-play.

Most of in general haven't done a IRC headset yet.

Just whomever gets it first, be a hero and post some basic pics in a separate on a build-up thread!

I'm gonna practice my stout and IPA drinking skills post-ride on my e-fattie until then.

 

[LEE.]

Linda, says you have to choose between the m820 motor, 43V 410wh battery and 36V 720wh.
The 43V 410wh battery is marked for eMTB and the 36V 360wh (36V 720wh) battery is marked for eRoad on the Bafang home page.
What should I choose?

 

[thaeber]

View attachment 109145

Linda, says you have to choose between the m820 motor, 43V 410wh battery and 36V 720wh.
The 43V 410wh battery is marked for eMTB and the 36V 360wh (36V 720wh) battery is marked for eRoad on the Bafang home page.
What should I choose?

Take the additional 3 lbs and go big! Pretty shure You regret the decision for the smaller battery, if no range extender is available.

 

[mike_kelly]

It totally depends on how you ride. If you ride a 12 mile single every day then there is no reason to carry the extra weight. if you ride all day adventures to the top of a 5,000ft mountain then you probably want the 720whr. If you ride 12 miles singletrack and once in a while do a big adventure then you probably what a 410whr and an extender for the times you go farther. There is no right answer it just depends on how you ride.
All the M820 ffamily can be used for road or mtb. Both the 360whr 36v and the 410whr 43v can be used for mtb. The 36v 360whr mtb battery is FT100.b360.c.

 

[Suns_PSD]

I agree with this except I already do 17 miles and 2000' in very chunky terrain on my pedal bike.

Seems the 410 would do 30-35 miles like it was nothing.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

It totally depends on how you ride. If you ride a 12 mile single every day then there is no reason to carry the extra weight. if you ride all day adventures to the top of a 5,000ft mountain then you probably want the 720whr. If you ride 12 miles singletrack and once in a while do a big adventure then you probably what a 410whr and an extender for the times you go farther. There is no right answer it just depends on how you ride.
All the M820 ffamily can be used for road or mtb. Both the 360whr 36v and the 410whr 43v can be used for mtb. The 36v 360whr mtb battery is FT100.b360.c.

I too say go big battery! Especially if you're big (heavy load like me) and doing big range, and/or doing big elevation gain.

While 3 lbs might be too big of weight penality for some.... possibly not. Just consider that "range anxiety" was one of the bigger complaints by a few expert reviewers on the Forestal Siryon's smaller 360 Wh Aurora battery with the EonDrive's 60Nm tune. Not the "torquier" Bafang's 75 Nm tune. Since, they are both Bafang 820 motors, which should eat more battery first (esp. in turbo/superburst Rocky mode)?

If you're going to carry an extender at all times to curtail range anxiety, then you just added weight back either on the frame and/or rider load via backpack. The good news is the very low drag resistance with the power off...so that's some advantage 3 lbs less will have when pedaling with out assistance. But I wouldn't want that exclusive backup plan. Just me!

 

[mike_kelly]

I agree with this except I already do 17 miles and 2000' in very chunky terrain on my pedal bike.

Seems the 410 would do 30-35 miles like it was nothing.

It all depends on elevation. Moving against gravity takes the most energy. I don't think you could do 35 miles with 2000 elevation change on a 410whr but that is a guess from my experience with my Orbea Rise with 540whr.
It , of course, also depends on how many whrs you put in. Eco? Trail? Boost?
The lighter bike will give you more range but time will only tell how much.

 

[stuff]

I chose the 410w 43v motor. Linda confirmed that next week it’ll be shipped. Yey!

 

[Waynemarlow]

Good choice, if you’re going to go 750Wh battery you may as well build a full fat and be done with.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Good choice, if you’re going to go 750Wh battery you may as well build a full fat and be done with.

Or spend 60% less for the same travel and same high-end componentry, and yes give up some turbo power. Hence, the M820-75Nm, 720Wh battery! BTW, true the Orbea Wild M-LTD 625 Wh 85 NM in large w/38 forks is claimed 36.5 lbs, but for $11,999 USD, AND availability, according to several local Orbea dealers is well very "limited" worldwide!
So, you're comparing apples to oranges...

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Or spend 60% less for the same travel and same high-end componentry, and yes give up some turbo power. Hence, the M820-75Nm, 720Wh battery! BTW, true the Orbea Wild M-LTD 625 Wh 85 NM in large w/38 forks is claimed 36.5 lbs, but for $11,999 USD, AND availability, according to several local Orbea dealers is well very "limited" worldwide!
So, you're comparing apples to oranges...

Clarification: I did err here on travel, weight, and battery capacity. So, after my weigh-ins of my all my compemlnentry...I posted my updated dry-weight last Friday, to be 45.6 lbs I believe.

Compared to the Orbea Wild LTD:
-I have 180/Zeb 38 fork travel vs. LTD's 170 = +10 mm
- I get 165+ rear vs. 160 "= +5 mm
- I get greater battery capacity 720 v. 625 = +95 Wh.
- I get 220 mm v. 203 mm rotors = + 17 mm
- I get the heavier casing tires (Maxxis Exo)
- I have an overbuilt (heavier) carbon Onxy hub 36 spoke wheel.
- Fully DIY serviceable M820 with readily available parts and no warranty penality for cracking open the drive unit to do basic service maintenance.
- CEF50 is 75Nm v. LTD 85Nm = -10 Nm

All of this more is "Enduro" than the enduro-trail Wild LTD. Again, not bragging, but with discounted high-end componentry, I still save about a pound, and should spend a total of $5.5k USD.

Conclusion; Sure, the critical minus (-) is 10 less Nms. However, there are a lot of pluses (+) on this build over the Wild LTD. Jus' say'n: different strokes for different folks...and I certainly don't have much disposable income.

So win/win for me on my M820-75Nm, 720 Wh 180/165, mid-powered, truly light-duty E-enduro build.

 

[mike_kelly]

Clarification: I did err here on travel, weight, and battery capacity. So, after my weigh-ins of my all my compemlnentry...I posted my updated dry-weight last Friday, to be 45.6 lbs I believe.

Compared to the Orbea Wild LTD:
-I have 180/Zeb 38 fork travel vs. LTD's 170 = +10 mm
- I get 165+ rear vs. 160 "= +5 mm
- I get greater battery capacity 720 v. 625 = +95 Wh.
- I get 220 mm v. 203 mm rotors = + 17 mm
- I get the heavier casing tires (Maxxis Exo)
- I have an overbuilt (heavier) carbon Onxy hub 36 spoke wheel.
- Fully DIY serviceable M820 with readily available parts and no warranty penality for cracking open the drive unit to do basic service maintenance.
- CEF50 is 75Nm v. LTD 85Nm = -10 Nm

All of this more is "Enduro" than the enduro-trail Wild LTD. Again, not bragging, but with discounted high-end componentry, I still save about a pound, and should spend a total of $5.5k USD.

Conclusion; Sure, the critical minus (-) is 10 less Nms. However, there are a lot of pluses (+) on this build over the Wild LTD. Jus' say'n: different strokes for different folks...and I certainly don't have much disposable income.

So win/win for me on my M820-75Nm, 720 Wh 180/165, mid-powered, truly light-duty E-enduro build.

Also the WIld does not give a kicker boost over the 85nm. The M820 will pop you up to 95nm when you need it.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Also the WIld does not give a kicker boost over the 85nm. The M820 will pop you up to 95nm when you need it.

Hoping it works as advertised...please Bafang no frustrating 4-sec delayed ramp-up (a la Fazua60). However, I do luv Shuttle SL and probably the Relay if I could ride one, but not for me, and not at that price?

 

[mike_kelly]

View attachment 109145

Linda, says you have to choose between the m820 motor, 43V 410wh battery and 36V 720wh.
The 43V 410wh battery is marked for eMTB and the 36V 360wh (36V 720wh) battery is marked for eRoad on the Bafang home page.
What should I choose?

I thought I responded to this...
You have the wrong 36v battery for the CEF50. The 36v 360whr battery for the CEF50 is the FT100.b360.c and I have two on order for my two bikes. You can see the battery page from the Bafang catalog above earlier in the thread.

 

[mike_kelly]

Hoping it works as advertised...please Bafang no frustrating 4-sec delayed ramp-up (a la Fazua60). However, I do luv Shuttle SL and probably the Relay if I could ride one, but not for me, and not at that price?

and who wants to buy a bike someone else puts together

 

[Stephen B]

I want to build one of these but I Don't have any experience building a bike, let alone an electric mtb.
I currently ride a approximately 18 year old Stumpjumper full suspension. I think I want a light weight and I have a fairly tight budget.

Is this possible?

Does anyone have a component list, and where is the best place to buy everything?

Stephen.

 

[mike_kelly]

I want to build one of these but I Don't have any experience a building a bike, let alone electric mtb.
I currently ride a approximately 18 year old Stumpjumper full suspension. I think I want a light weight and I have a fairly tight budget.

Is this possible?

Does anyone have a component list, and where is the best place to buy everything?

Stephen.

You know everyone's build is going to be different. So many of the parts are arbitrary choices. Many of our parts will be based on the deals we could find at the moment. The fun for most of us is finding/hunting for the parts, looking for deals and making something ourselves. When I got my Orbea Rise I stripped ALL the parts off and built it up myself from scratch with the parts I wanted.
So it can be very rewarding. But I think you need to choose this path because you want to learn about building a bike not for saving money or you may be very unhappy. If you had to pay someone to build it for you, you are not going to save a lot of money.
Also remember we are all gamblers here. This is a new motor and a previously unknown, in the US, frame supplier. But the price is very good if it all works out.

To quote Churchill, "Play the game for more than you can afford to lose... only then will you learn the game."

 

[mike_kelly]

You know everyone's build is going to be different. So many of the parts are arbitrary choices. Many of our parts will be based on the deals we could find at the moment. The fun for most of us is finding/hunting for the parts, looking for deals and making something ourselves. When I got my Orbea Rise I stripped ALL the parts off and built it up myself from scratch with the parts I wanted.
So it can be very rewarding. But I think you need to choose this path because you want to learn about building a bike not for saving money or you may be very unhappy. If you had to pay someone to build it for you, you are not going to save a lot of money.
Also remember we are all gamblers here. This is a new motor and a previously unknown, in the US, frame supplier. But the price is very good if it all works out.

To quote Churchill, "Play the game for more than you can afford to lose... only then will you learn the game."

I found Rockshox Deluxe Select rear shocks, in the right size, for $143 and I choose a X-Fusion Slider fork at 1790g and $350. So it is possible to meet your budget if you work and search well.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Or spend 60% less for the same travel and same high-end componentry, and yes give up some turbo power. Hence, the M820-75Nm, 720Wh battery! BTW, true the Orbea Wild M-LTD 625 Wh 85 NM in large w/38 forks is claimed 36.5 lbs, but for $11,999 USD, AND availability, according to several local Orbea dealers is well very "limited" worldwide!
So, you're comparing apples to oranges...

I built my E10 M600 with 810Wh battery for less than £ 1500, so your bike is more than expensive in comparison, but thats just stats. Sorry you're not exactly quoting like for like. One is a DIY component build, the other a branded bike with full two year warranty, take it back to the dealer when there's a problem. Sorry my view of a lightweight needs to be 18kgs to make the lightweight worth while ( you can build sub 22kgs FF's without too much trouble ) and that means probably only a 34mm 140 - 150mm suspension ( maybe only front suspension dare I say it ) with probably only 50Nm of motor torque and 450Wh battery, to be used mainly on trail riding and less demanding terrain.

I'm wishing you well in what you are doing however, its an interesting experiment and I wish you luck as I do wonder whether a lot of the current crop of carbon frames are over engineered, but please if your frame doesn't survive, don't blame the manufacturer as you seriously have upped the weight and terrain from what it was designed for. Good luck and keep us informed on the outcome.

 

[Stephen B]

I need to get a list and start adding up.

 

[mike_kelly]

I need to get a list and start adding up.

Easy.
WHeels - Hubs, spokes, nipples, Rims-Tires-Tubes/goo and goo stuff
Drivetrain- Rear Derailleur, Chain, front chainring if not using the stock 44t, Cassette, Shifter, housing
Seatpost, Remote if dropper, seatpost clamp, Seat
Pedals
Handlebars, Stem, Grips, headset spacers if needed
Brake calipers, Brake levers, housing, Rotors and Rotor bolts, brake adapters depending on your fork and rotor choices
Suspension- Rear Shock, Front forks
Supplied with frame - Headset, Spare derailleur hanger, Rear thru axle
Motor- Cables, Sensor, battery, display, remote, bolts, battery connectors, Battery cover not needed in this case
Tools -Allen, Torx wrenches sets, Headset press, 15mm pedal wrench or Allen, spoke wrench, Bafang motor tools to remove spyder, Tire irons,

Bob's your uncle.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

I built my E10 M600 with 810Wh battery for less than £ 1500, so your bike is more than expensive in comparison, but thats just stats. Sorry you're not exactly quoting like for like. One is a DIY component build, the other a branded bike with full two year warranty, take it back to the dealer when there's a problem. Sorry my view of a lightweight needs to be 18kgs to make the lightweight worth while ( you can build sub 22kgs FF's without too much trouble ) and that means probably only a 34mm 140 - 150mm suspension ( maybe only front suspension dare I say it ) with probably only 50Nm of motor torque and 450Wh battery, to be used mainly on trail riding and less demanding terrain.

I'm wishing you well in what you are doing however, its an interesting experiment and I wish you luck as I do wonder whether a lot of the current crop of carbon frames are over engineered, but please if your frame doesn't survive, don't blame the manufacturer as you seriously have upped the weight and terrain from what it was designed for. Good luck and keep us informed on the outcome.

Yes, that certainly was a helpful, well-thought out critical-analysis. If you had the receipts as the kids say (actual facts) you would have valid disruptive, contrarian input....rather than just simple trolling. I don't need luck, I've presented facts thus far.

 

[mike_kelly]

I built my E10 M600 with 810Wh battery for less than £ 1500, so your bike is more than expensive in comparison, but thats just stats. Sorry you're not exactly quoting like for like. One is a DIY component build, the other a branded bike with full two year warranty, take it back to the dealer when there's a problem. Sorry my view of a lightweight needs to be 18kgs to make the lightweight worth while ( you can build sub 22kgs FF's without too much trouble ) and that means probably only a 34mm 140 - 150mm suspension ( maybe only front suspension dare I say it ) with probably only 50Nm of motor torque and 450Wh battery, to be used mainly on trail riding and less demanding terrain.

I'm wishing you well in what you are doing however, its an interesting experiment and I wish you luck as I do wonder whether a lot of the current crop of carbon frames are over engineered, but please if your frame doesn't survive, don't blame the manufacturer as you seriously have upped the weight and terrain from what it was designed for. Good luck and keep us informed on the outcome.

Unless you bought your frame, motor and battery used. You are not going to get those prices from Dengfu and then that does not include any other parts. Unless you had all the parts anyway and then it is not accurate for anyone else.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Some good news for any other 36V 720Wh Bafangers! Hot off the press!

 

[mike_kelly]

So are you just waiting for the battery? Is your frame done?

 

[TCFlowClyde]

So are you just waiting for the battery? Is your frame done?

I assume that it's all done. Which probably means add another 1-2 weeks for mine to ship?

 

[mike_kelly]

Could be waiting for the motor I suppose.

 

[temon10]

Could be waiting for the motor I suppose.

Linda said waiting the 720Wh battery finished.