SZZS specific CEF50-main thread (initial builds and troubleshooting related only)

[TCFlowClyde]

Running the numbers: Burly Enduro CEF50 720 Wh plus build. W/Zeb 180 & RS Ultimate-MegNeg 165ish

Bottom-line = projected 47+ lbs keep'n it real!

Based on a large Rise M-Team Carbon 540 Wh Fox 36 build =45 lbs overall

Now CEF50 Enduro plus = 45 lbs Rise + 1.5 lb 720 Wh battery + .6 lb Zeb fork + .4 lb Maxxis plus 60TPI tires = 48 lbs

Conclusion: this might be on the higher end depending if my componentry drops some weight.

Update#1 : both build are using carbon wheelsets. The Rise MT runs Mavic 29 ers. I run plus LightBike/Onxy 45 mm but 27.5ers, so weight is a wash?

Update#2: Shimano RS60 motor is 5.75 lbs v. Bafang M820 at 5.01. So -. 8 lbs!

So revised= 47.2 lb +/-

 

[mike_kelly]

CEF50+XFusion Slider 1900g+ carbon wheels=39lbs?

 

[TCFlowClyde]

CEF50+XFusion Slider 1900g+ carbon wheels=39lbs?

In large frame w/410 Wh battery 40-41+ lbs? Even w/carbon wheels. Might depend on the lighter 34 mm (X-fusion 29) v. 36 mm stanchion forks.

I think many will go 36 for an E-mtb and makes sense. Just supports rider weight and heavier E-mtb weight for any rough sections.

 

[mike_kelly]

In large frame w/410 Wh battery 40-41+ lbs? Even w/carbon wheels. Might depend on the lighter 34 mm (X-fusion 29) v. 36 mm stanchion forks.

I think many will go 36 for an E-mtb and makes sense. Just supports rider weight and heavier E-mtb weight for any rough sections.

Thinking about the bike for my wife and 34mm stanchions are overkill for her. Mine I just need to get under 50lbs for the train.

 

[Suns_PSD]

How much longer till someone receives their frame?

Look forward to seeing some real world frame weights.

 

[mike_kelly]

My crystal ball is out for servicing right now or I would check.

 

[mike_kelly]

I think the motor will be the issue not the frame.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

How much longer till someone receives their frame?

Look forward to seeing some real world frame weights.

Unfortunately, still a month out before most can hoist on a bike scale. If they actually send out 3/1 (Linda re-confirmed frames on schedule recently)...then mid to late March to buyer's door?

Plus, I too am wondering if Bafang is shipping M820 kits out to dealers yet? It's been white noise thus far, unless someone has heard different?

Maybe question for Linda. She's probably getting tired of my emails.

 

[mike_kelly]

Unfortunately, still a month out before most can hoist on a bike scale. If they actually send out 3/1 (Linda re-confirmed frames on schedule recently)...then mid to late March to buyer's door?

Plus, I too am wondering if Bafang is shipping M820 kits out to dealers yet? It's been white noise thus far, unless someone has heard different?

Maybe question for Linda. She's probably getting tired of my emails.

I know she is tired of mine. I think they were primarily a wholesaler and did not realize how much babysitting retail takes. They will save time if they get a website up with spec's clearly posted so they don't have to answer the same question ten times.

 

[mike_kelly]

My biggest concern is getting the right voltage motors to the right customers.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

I know she is tired of mine. I think they were primarily a wholesaler and did not realize how much babysitting retail takes. They will save time if they get a website up with spec's clearly posted so they don't have to answer the same question ten times.

Basic CEF50 info is missing and frankly a bit "low effort". Off-putting to many.

I give LC big props for a polished website for theirs (yet to materialize an actual frame to the general public).

But on the manufacturer lead times, that's always a challenge unless stock is on the warehouse racks. And it's a new product line.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Alright, I asked for fitment hardware and Bafang M820 kit shipping update.

 

[LAnton]

The geometry of the CEF50 had to be done for a 140 mm suspension stroke. It would be the lightest trail bike on the market. The geometry is very good, BB Height 360 mm. This is a very versatile frame, having installed the rear wheel 27.5, front 29 and fork 140mm, the Height will be 330-335 mm.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Delivery date: On frame -820 motor kit. Both are on schedule...

 

[temon10]

Delivery date: On frame -820 motor kit. Both are on schedule... View attachment 107364

hope so. Already paid half hahahaha

 

[thaeber]

Decent Enduro Carbon Rims only save 2-300 g per wheelset compared to my favorite aluminum rim, DT FR560.

 

[stuff]

Once my frame arrives i’m building it with 1500g carbon enduro wheelset (eie rims, dt2
350, cx ray), pike ultimate, xt drivetrain and 410w battery.

Expecting it to be on the 18k’ish.

 

[temon10]

Once my frame arrives i’m building it with 1500g carbon enduro wheelset (eie rims, dt2
350, cx ray), pike ultimate, xt drivetrain and 410w battery.

Expecting it to be on the 18k’ish.

pike ultimate lighter than fox 36?

 

[temon10]

Let's discuss about main component beside frame, motor and battery weight. What is the best budget component with light weight :
1. Fork 160mm 29er
2. Rearshock 210mm
3. 4 piston brakeset
4. 11 speed groupset
5. 29er alloy wheelset
6. Tires

 

[LAnton]

6. Maxxis dissector 29х2.4

 

[stuff]

pike ultimate lighter than fox 36?

1850g, also I have it already and at 160mm

 

[stuff]

Let's discuss about main component beside frame, motor and battery weight. What is the best budget component with light weight :
1. Fork 160mm 29er
2. Rearshock 210mm
3. 4 piston brakeset
4. 11 speed groupset
5. 29er alloy wheelset
6. Tires

1. Pike select / yari
2. Deluxe select+ 210x50
3. Slx m7120
4. Used xt 11/46 11s
5. Custom xm481 rims, ztto m1 hubs and sapim d-light spokes
6. Agressor / assegai exo+ both

 

[gido]

It looks like Yeti 160E

Yeti 160E

WE DON’T PARTY UNTIL THE RACE IS OVER. SO WE TOOK OUR TIME TO DESIGN AN e-MTB THE WAY A YETI e-MTB HAS TO BE DESIGNED: READY TO TOE THE LINE AT EWS-E RACES. MEET THE 160E: THE WORLD’S FIRST RACE SPECIFIC e-MTB.

yeticycles.com

 

[forsa355]

It looks like Yeti 160E

Yeti 160E

WE DON’T PARTY UNTIL THE RACE IS OVER. SO WE TOOK OUR TIME TO DESIGN AN e-MTB THE WAY A YETI e-MTB HAS TO BE DESIGNED: READY TO TOE THE LINE AT EWS-E RACES. MEET THE 160E: THE WORLD’S FIRST RACE SPECIFIC e-MTB.

yeticycles.com

also looks very similar to a Transition Repeater

Transition Bikes

29 Inch Wheels / 160mm Travel / Buckle up and get ready to charge, the Repeater is down for anything. With 160mm travel, 29 inch wheels, the Shimano EP8 motor system, and a 630w battery, you can maximize fun on the ups and the downs.

www.transitionbikes.com

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Maybe what to reasonably expect in comparison of the complete builds:

CEF50 v. Siryon (Neon, mid-end build):
Overall weight: 43 lbs. 2.4kg Siryon frame +360 Wh Aurora battery 1.6 kg, fit w/ heavier casing tires, and 36 fork. Same M820 motor (different tunes)...Jus' say"n.

 

[TCFlowClyde]

also looks very similar to a Transition Repeater

Transition Bikes

29 Inch Wheels / 160mm Travel / Buckle up and get ready to charge, the Repeater is down for anything. With 160mm travel, 29 inch wheels, the Shimano EP8 motor system, and a 630w battery, you can maximize fun on the ups and the downs.

www.transitionbikes.com

Both are awesome full-powered bikes that I would luv to own. But on a tight budget. I can barely afford this Bafanger 820 build.

 

[LAnton]

2. For light riders, the RS Sid luxe 210x50 may be suitable. Approximate weight 240-260g.

 

[stuff]

Given that forestal will have a 250w range extender for their M820, maybe this means that we'll be able to use it on the CEF50.
Hope Linda confirms me that they ship the frame next week, looking forward to build it once it arrives

 

[TCFlowClyde]

Given that forestal will have a 250w range extender for their M820, maybe this means that we'll be able to use it on the CEF50.
Hope Linda confirms me that they ship the frame next week, looking forward to build it once it arrives

Good news! The request is in for CEF50 range extenders...it really is a necessity for the 410 Wh riders! Definitely let Linda know you want one.

Simple Logic! Since they already make the big 720 Wh battery 3rd-party, it should be easier to produce and ensure full main battery compatibility. I'm trying to convince Linda that she should expect higher aftermarket sales, because most will want at least one if not two.

Quell range anxiety! Trust me, peeps using the mid-powered motors already are practically begging for these extenders for their RS60, TQ50, and Fazua60 PAS platforms. Except for RS60, the other two, newer systems have been slow to get enough extenders to riders. The more requests to Linda, the better and sooner production can happen!

Weigh-in. It's like and . Almost, every rider enjoys this recovery meal after an epic ride...make sure you get home in time to enjoy it with friends that didn't run out battery ! Plus, this an opportunity for this forum to help make a potentially great frame build even sweeter by consumer-demand on the CEF50 manufacturer!!!

 

[TCFlowClyde]

On second thought, maybe a burly 44-45 lb CEF50 720Wh Zeb 180/165ish Enduro travel IS possible?

Argument #1. Here's my argument compared to the the newest, lightest full-powered offerings. The novel Orbea Wild LTD in large w/625 Wh motor-drop battery with Bosch Cx motor 85Nm, beefy tires, and Fox 38 fork weighs an amazing 46.5 lbs!!!

***Here's the key#1. They claim to save a full 900 g/1.98 lbs while getting a 51% stronger downtube w/o cutouts and removable cradle hardware.

Argument #2: Now compare it to the Transition Relay large build 460 Wh trailside removable battery, Fazua60, and Fox 36 at 19.8 kg/43.6lbs
***Here's the key #2. It's fair to assume w/o the cutout and cradle removable battery hardware, add back on at least 1.5 lbs.

Claimed motor weights:

The Bosch Cx85 weighs = 2.9 kg/6.3 lbs
The Fazua60 weighs = 1.95 kg/4.3 lbs
The M820-75 weighs = 2.3 kg/5.1 lbs

Ergo...the weight difference is in the M820 motor savings compared to the Bosch Cx85 (6.3 - 5.1 = 1.2 lbs) and in the frame weight savings from the Relay (-1.98 lbs). Now add back in the weight of 720, Wh battery (+ 1.2 lbs).

This projects that the CEF50 720 Wh 180Zeb/heavier tires should be +1.98 lbs heavier than the Relay (43.6 lbs + 1.98 lbs = 45.4 lbs) but lighter than the Wild (46.5 lbs - 1.98 lbs = 44.52 lbs).

Tradeoffs. While one gains power, travel, beefier tires, and range over the Relay, it loses power, but gains range being slightly lighter, and possessing a higher capacity battery than the Wild. It will also lose convenience of easy, trailside battery removal to the Relay. But only the m820 motor is DIY serviceable w/o voiding the warranty, plus it's widely available and half the cost of the Fazua60 and Bosch CX85.

Take home message. I should reasonable expect that CEF50 big 720 Wh, enduro-build to range between 44.52-45.4 lbs!

Big Question. So, for only another pound or two, why not buy the Wild LTD, and never worry about turbo power?

Easy answer. I should be spending about $5,500 total for my build. The Orbea Wild LTD build is $11.999. That's 5.75k/45.5 lbs = $121 per lb vs. 12k/46.5 lbs =$242+ per lb. Or I can build two of mine rather than one Orbea Wild! Worth it!

Here's the "receipts".