Levo SL Gen 1 Official Levo SL Thread

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Seems biggest ‘upgrade’ for saving weight is the NX Cassette.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

And as it happens I have been in these guys Megastore today and saw this which would offer a decent weight saving.

 

[Fivetones]

@Rob Hancill i’m not sure AXS is on that table (I’ve been using that to compare the Comp Carbon and Expert, NX vs GX). It appears there’s a 100g weight penalty on the derailleur too:

https://bikerumor.com/2019/07/09/unboxed-sram-eagle-axs-xx1-xo1-actual-weights-install-notes/

I like the idea of AXS but I think there’s some improvement to be made to this generation (and also reduction of cost).

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

@Rob Hancill i’m not sure AXS is on that table (I’ve been using that to compare the Comp Carbon and Expert, NX vs GX). It appears there’s a 100g weight penalty on the derailleur too:

https://bikerumor.com/2019/07/09/unboxed-sram-eagle-axs-xx1-xo1-actual-weights-install-notes/

Yeah they mentioned at the press camp AXS isn’t really a weight saver, more a highest-on-the-spec list component.

 

[Fivetones]

Yeah they mentioned at the press camp AXS isn’t really a weight saver, more a highest-on-the-spec list component.

Makes sense, I mean we‘re all weenie-ing out a little here.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Having used AXS on the shifting side and dropper post on a few bikes now I much prefer the dropper version.

AXS gear shifting ergonomics is not that great tbh. The shifter is a little awkward and lacks ‘feel’

On the other hand the dropper shifter is excellent. A large paddle style lever and instant engagement.

I’d buy (and have done) the AXS dropper but definitely wouldn’t bother with the shifter / rear mech. In fact I’d rather have the regular cable operated XX1.

 

[miPbiP]

Makes sense, I mean we‘re all weenie-ing out a little here.

word. if I lost as much off my tum as an SL would save over my Levo, I'd be a riding god. (and it is there to loose).

also I'm amazed how much clobber people carry in rucksacks when riding round here (Surrey Hills). it's like they're crossing the Utah desert not pootling in the woods 20 minutes from the nearest pub.

 

[p3eps]

Having used AXS on the shifting side and dropper post on a few bikes now I much prefer the dropper version.

AXS gear shifting ergonomics is not that great tbh. The shifter is a little awkward and lacks ‘feel’

On the other hand the dropper shifter is excellent. A large paddle style lever and instant engagement.

I’d buy (and have done) the AXS dropper but definitely wouldn’t bother with the shifter / rear mech. In fact I’d rather have the regular cable operated XX1.

The dropper is fantastic... the best I’ve experienced by a long shot.

The gear shifter is a little odd, and takes a bit of getting used to - but I really like the ‘tap’ to shift rather than a forceful push of a cable.
I also like the instant smooth shifts.

Not sure how much time I’ll have tonight, but I’ll try and get the GX mech / cable / shifter on the scaleS vs the AXS XX1 / shifter.

 

[TorAtle]

Alternatives to the NX/GX cassette: 12 Huge Cassettes For 1x Drivetrains That Aren't Shimano Or SRAM

 

[Fojsum]

View attachment 26155
Source: https://bikerumor.com/2018/06/23/co...n-whats-the-difference-between-nx-gx-x01-xx1/

On a comp carbon, would it be possible to simply swap from an NX cassette to a GX cassette?

 

[Peter Hill]

Define amazing deal?! I got 15% off today on an Expert.

Where?

 

[p3eps]

Where?

Store in Aberdeen. Apparently you should be able to get 15% off Specialized from most retailers - so I asked!

 

[Zimmerframe]

Where?

it's in one of the Levo SL threads .. can't remember which one though . I think there's 3 juggling for top spot.

 

[Peter Hill]

it's in one of the Levo SL threads .. can't remember which one though . I think there's 3 juggling for top spot.

is this a quiz?

 

[Zimmerframe]

is this a quiz?

For three points ....

OK.. found it :

Specialized Levo SL is a 16.9KG Super Light emtb - EMTB Forums

 

[Vin829]

Just ordered a large green expert model this past weekend. Shop threw in the range extender and $700 off the price of the bike. Now it just needs to be built

 

[p3eps]

So here’s the one you’ve been waiting for... AXS vs wired weights.
Weighed with my wife’s kitchen scales... and I zeroed out the plate before starting ?

Components taken off the SL Expert were the Eagle GX shifter (complete with cable) and the Eagle GX derailleur.
Components to go on (when I get time) are the AXS Eagle wireless shifter, and the AXS Eagle XX1 wireless derailleur + battery.

GX shifter and cable - 179g

GX derailleur - 292g

AXS Wireless shifter - 71g

AXS XX1 derailleur - 349g

AXS battery - 25g

So in summary...
GX shifter / cable / derailleur = 471g
AXS shifter / derailleur / battery = 445g
AXS = a whopping 26g lighter!

Well worth the £658.52 I paid for it!
But on a serious note... I bought this for performance, not for a 26g weight saving. I half expected just the 2 components to be heavier, as I thought the main weight saving was the cassette. Not much in it though... but hopefully the XX1 offers a cleaner crisper shift at the tap of a button. I had the X01 AXS on the Trek Rail 9.9 and thought it was awesome.

 

[Blinkie]

then add on 4kg of kirkhill mud

 

[Peter Hill]

I got 50% off, five spare batteries and a free holiday to California, I cant tell you where from otherwise they will have to kill me!! please tell us something useful ?

 

[Kpmnd85]

I ordered one of these.
chwalbe Eddy Current Rear Addix-Soft, SuperGravity, Tubeless Folding HS497 MTN Bike Tire
Will mount it and find out.

A Maxxis DHRii 2.6" fits in the rear.

I got the Eddy Current but it weighed 1.37kg and instead opted for a Maxxis Minion DHR ii 29 x 2.6" this one:
TB00096300. 29X2.60WT. 66-622 120tpi. 1,035grams. 3C MAXX TERRA 40psi 3C/EXO+/TR

It fits like the original Eliminator. I measured it to to be 2.44" wide at 20psi and 2.48" wide at 40psi. Still 5/8" clearance on the sides and 1/4" clearance from top of tire to frame (same as 2.3" Eliminator.

One observation, Maxxis seems to overstate their tire dimensions and Specialize under calls their dimensions.

 

[Kpmnd85]

In the process of changing the rear tire to the Maxxis 2.6" DHRii, I also had the LBS remove the tubes. In the process the bike got 90 grams lighter
Removed Tubes. -502
Removed Elimiminator. -977
Added Maxxis DHRii. +1035
added tape, Stans. 354
Weight removed. -90 grams

 

[miPbiP]

In the process of changing the rear tire to the Maxxis 2.6" DHRii, I also had the LBS remove the tubes. In the process the bike got 90 grams lighter
Removed Tubes. -502
Removed Elimiminator. -977
Added Maxxis DHRii. +1035
added tape, Stans. 354
Weight removed. -90 grams

you got a 2.6 DHR in the back of an SL? ridden it in mud yet?

 

[westcoastmtbr]

Rob- You have been blown away by the Geo of the Kenevo, and the Levo SL retains the Reach, STA, and HA of the Regular Levo. As for me, I just cannot get a good fit at 6'1" on the Levo XL which is a shame. I feel that Specialized missed the mark on the Geo of this bike. Just look at the progression of the frame Geo numbers going into 2020 and beyond, and it just makes for such an improvement on the overall ride of the bikes. Yes, we do progress along the way, and I figure for this pricing Specialized should have gone more for the S sizing of the bikes. If they had just slackened and lowered it a bit, then I figure it would be a bike worthy of these prices. As you noted so eloquently, you finally found a bike in the Kenevo (Decoy too) that finally fit you properly and that you were "in" the bike. I for one was very surprised that Specialized did not take this opportunity to address Geo fitting for 2020. It's not to say it's not a great bike for many, but who wants Geo from yesteryear? It will be interesting to note how you feel over the long term. My bet is the net generation will bring the Geo numbers into place, and I'm hearing locally here in Northern CA that Specialized has already started integration into a new S sizing Geo SL. Guess I'll just wait for the Geo to step up. Thoughts Rob?

 

[Fivetones]

That’s a fair point. More like the Stumpjumper Evo.

 

[Kpmnd85]

you got a 2.6 DHR in the back of an SL? ridden it in mud yet?

Is your question regarding the difference in the ability of an Eliminator and DHRii to shed mud or the dimensional differences. If there is a mud problem, it will likely be with both tires...

I do not understand how Maxxis calls their tire a 2.6". And frankly, Specialized could call their 2.3" at least a 2.4". Per the pictures (see top of page 8 for original eliminator pictures). It turns out the dimensions are the same for a 2.3" Eliminator and a 2.6" DHRii. Both measure 2.44" wide with a micrometer. The clearance on the top is also the same 0.25". I went as far as inflating the DHRii to its max pressure of 40psi to see is this would make the tire expand to a significantly different profile (got 2.48" which is negligible).

Its drizzling here today, so looks like a good time to find out . I'll report back.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Rob- You have been blown away by the Geo of the Kenevo, and the Levo SL retains the Reach, STA, and HA of the Regular Levo. As for me, I just cannot get a good fit at 6'1" on the Levo XL which is a shame. I feel that Specialized missed the mark on the Geo of this bike. Just look at the progression of the frame Geo numbers going into 2020 and beyond, and it just makes for such an improvement on the overall ride of the bikes. Yes, we do progress along the way, and I figure for this pricing Specialized should have gone more for the S sizing of the bikes. If they had just slackened and lowered it a bit, then I figure it would be a bike worthy of these prices. As you noted so eloquently, you finally found a bike in the Kenevo (Decoy too) that finally fit you properly and that you were "in" the bike. I for one was very surprised that Specialized did not take this opportunity to address Geo fitting for 2020. It's not to say it's not a great bike for many, but who wants Geo from yesteryear? It will be interesting to note how you feel over the long term. My bet is the net generation will bring the Geo numbers into place, and I'm hearing locally here in Northern CA that Specialized has already started integration into a new S sizing Geo SL. Guess I'll just wait for the Geo to step up. Thoughts Rob?

Yes, the geo of the SL is like that of the Levo. Very conservative. It’s fine for many people, but not super long or slack.

It’s a fast trail bike. Not a long stable enduro descender. Many people will like the nimble feeling. Some might not and prefer the stable feeling a longer slacker bike offers.

Personally, I think that Specialized have stuck with a tried and tested geometry in using the Levo’s geometry. Tried and tested as in they know it’s successful as the Levo is a good seller.

In my opinion the SL platform was an opportunity to focus on the new motor and integration and not worry so much about the suspension / geo. They already did that with the 2019 Levo. It sold in huge numbers. It is safe to use that geo.

I think I the next bike will have a radically different geo. Motor / integration will be nailed. Next is to nail the geo to modern standards.

To add, I have no insider info (If I did I would not be able to comment!), this is pure speculation.

 

[Thomas]

Having used AXS on the shifting side and dropper post on a few bikes now I much prefer the dropper version.

AXS gear shifting ergonomics is not that great tbh. The shifter is a little awkward and lacks ‘feel’

On the other hand the dropper shifter is excellent. A large paddle style lever and instant engagement.

I’d buy (and have done) the AXS dropper but definitely wouldn’t bother with the shifter / rear mech. In fact I’d rather have the regular cable operated XX1.

Better option 12 XTR derailleur and shifter.
Around 20g lighter than AXS, including cable/wire.

 

[miPbiP]

Rob- You have been blown away by the Geo of the Kenevo, and the Levo SL retains the Reach, STA, and HA of the Regular Levo. As for me, I just cannot get a good fit at 6'1" on the Levo XL which is a shame. I feel that Specialized missed the mark on the Geo of this bike. Just look at the progression of the frame Geo numbers going into 2020 and beyond, and it just makes for such an improvement on the overall ride of the bikes. Yes, we do progress along the way, and I figure for this pricing Specialized should have gone more for the S sizing of the bikes. If they had just slackened and lowered it a bit, then I figure it would be a bike worthy of these prices. As you noted so eloquently, you finally found a bike in the Kenevo (Decoy too) that finally fit you properly and that you were "in" the bike. I for one was very surprised that Specialized did not take this opportunity to address Geo fitting for 2020. It's not to say it's not a great bike for many, but who wants Geo from yesteryear? It will be interesting to note how you feel over the long term. My bet is the net generation will bring the Geo numbers into place, and I'm hearing locally here in Northern CA that Specialized has already started integration into a new S sizing Geo SL. Guess I'll just wait for the Geo to step up. Thoughts Rob?

But I'm a medium sized guy on a medium Levo and it's the best fitting bike I ever had. & geo suits me fine as it's a trail bike not a mini-DH.

Maybe it's a tall person's issue.

(I always thought it's odd as frames lengthen, rear ends don't. Probably not great for taller people).

 

[R120]

Because if shimming you want to put the closest size possible

That’s a fair point. More like the Stumpjumper Evo.

If they bought out a version with the stumpy evo geometry, and this motor/electrical systems proves reliable, I would definitely pull the trigger, especially if its 27.5.

The Stumpjumper Evo is one of the most fun bikes I have ever tried.

I do wonder how many people (and this isn't really directed at forum members per say) buy the Levo just because its a specialized and like the way it looks.

My LBS sells Specilized, Giant, and Whyte EMTB's, and are very open that most buyers are not that aware of geometry etc etc, but buy the Levo based off the brand and its looks. The Whyte's they have sold have all been to "hardcore" mountain bikers who are buying it based off researching it, but a lot of the Levo's are impulse purchases for want of a better phrase.

 

[westcoastmtbr]

Yes, the geo of the SL is like that of the Levo. Very conservative. It’s fine for many people, but not super long or slack.

It’s a fast trail bike. Not a long stable enduro descender. Many people will like the nimble feeling. Some might not and prefer the stable feeling a longer slacker bike offers.

Personally, I think that Specialized have stuck with a tried and tested geometry in using the Levo’s geometry. Tried and tested as in they know it’s successful as the Levo is a good seller.

In my opinion the SL platform was an opportunity to focus on the new motor and integration and not worry so much about the suspension / geo. They already did that with the 2019 Levo. It sold in huge numbers. It is safe to use that geo.

I think I the next bike will have a radically different geo. Motor / integration will be nailed. Next is to nail the geo to modern standards.

To add, I have no insider info (If I did I would not be able to comment!), this is pure speculation.

Rob-
You live this stuff everyday and I think you analysis is spot on. Stick with tried and true, but my observation is that not a single new bike or ebike will go with this Geo. When I'm on the Levo I feel like I'll need a 80mm stem to feel right. Fitting "in" the bike has been a game changer for me and many others who have felt out riding take a dramatic turn for the better. I currently ride a Yeti sb130 and I can honestly say my riding has excelled way past my riding of 30 years would offer. GEO has dramatic both in terms of speed, control, and pure smiles.
And let's just look at a typical Awesome bike in the human powered bikes that is a perfect comparison. The Ibis Ripley redone for 2020 is a perfect GEO bike and gets Rave reviews and they cannot keep this bike in stock anywhere in the world. History would tell us Ibis was always conservative on reach and angles but with the 2020 Ripley the Geo Large Size calls for a reach of 475 vs. 455 sl, 76' vs. 74.7' sl seat angle, and HTA of 66.5 vs. 66 (wash) and similar chain stay with the Ripley cause there is no motor. I had a few people comment yesterday at the local bike shop say it's the thing that is holding them back from buying the SL. It's the same Geo numbers that had all of us saying, "I just don't fit on it". In fact, two of the magazines reviewing on YouTube went as far as to say anyone over 6' tall will have a difficult time sizing up the SL, plus that nagging from end is lifting up on them. Can anyone say steeper seat angle! Give the SL similar number to the Ripley and I would take a $2,500 haircut and sell my Decoy today. Again, don't get me wrong, Specialized did an Amazing job on this bike from a motor / battery integration, but I just think they missed out on this frame. Honestly, the other companies will pick up on this and make quick changes to current line ups. It's good for us, just with I could fit on this Darn Bike!! Thanks Rob, and keep up the great work. Oh, finally.. will be interesting to know if you could only have one bike of the three Specialized bikes, which would you keep? Don't answer, we already know. Hint, it's the bike you "fit in"!