Dengfu E22 Frame Thread

[bram.biesiekierski]

nice ride! whats is your chainring size and largest cassette gear? whats that work out to on the rev limit?
I still run the stock 40-42t with 50 rear and I get around 8.5-9mph. I'd like a little more torque for the steepest bits, but no one I ride with can keep up with this platform anyways

you could use some old innertube for your chainstay for a slightly sleeker look

Hi.

The chain ring is a 36t praxis steel e ring.

And the rear cassette is an e13 helix 12spd. 9-50t.

That combo will do 50kph on flat pavement without peddling.

I wasn't sure what chainring size I would need. But I made a guess to 36t, based on what sort of speeds/gears I used on the manual mtb bike, on the types of trails I like to ride. I knew the motor was going to be an advantage. But I also knew it wouldn't magically make me a better rider. IE faster through corners etc. On technical terrain, the speed limiting factor was always going to be my ability.

I figured 36t would be a good match, as it would increase my speed range over the 32t I have on my manual bike. But not shift it so far outside of the range that is suited for the terrain I ride. And with the motor assistance, I could safely increase the ratio range a bit, because I wouldn't need super granny gears down low.

I think its a pretty good match so far. I find myself using the middle to mid-high cassette gears mostly for what I've ridden so far.

I kind of like the brutal acceleration you get from the motor with this combo. But sometimes I find a quick blast on the throttle builds speed fast, but you run out of that gear very fast aswell. And most times i dont really want to shift up, as I know there's corners or something coming up where I will want that acceleration again.

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

So, I've received a ton of messages through Insta, Facebook etc over the last couple of days. Stating that the Dengfu E22 & E10 are becoming more difficult to purchase due to availability. And in some circumstances, are now showing as "out of stock".

I have messaged Carbon Cycle who confirm that they will be selling the Framesets and complete builds for both. No date has been provided yet.

GBK will be getting a shipment of E22 Framesets over the next week and shall update their website accordingly. Currently, they still have mediums

I am in talks with another distributor for the Dengfu line of ebikes. This is due to the ever increasing demand for Frameset options for those who live in the States. I'll update the thread and the Facebook Dengfu community as soon as I get confirmation (and have performed a test to ensure that its legit).

Dengfu naturally have the frames so feel free to reach out to them via email (email address details are on their website).

PLEASE NOTE, I am only obtaining the information as to where riders can source the framesets (and batteries). The motors, wire harness/looms, chargers, display etc, can be sourced fairly easily by numerous avenues/distributors (In some circumstances, it is actually cheaper to source components from different ddistributors compared to buying a bundle deal Frameset).

I'll keep you all posted as soon as I get 'written' confirmation from from each avenue / distributor.

In the meantime, please don't hesitate to reach out or chime in on the thread if you are struggling to find safe and legit methods (regardless of your location) to source the Framesets of either the E10 and/or E22

 

[patdam]

take care also at the swing arm axle,. alike the rear wheel axle it unscrewed several time on mine E10 at beginning. I put a mark with paint to quickly see when they unscrew

 

[Mabman]

Just wanted to update on the performance of my "cheap" 15ah 52v 2170 DingTai battery. After like 15 charges and showing improvement with each charge range wise it seems to have settled in getting a reliable 25 miles/2500'vert using 2/3 and the occasional 4 of 5 modes. I would say 60% 2, 30% 3 and 10% 4. On the same rides I was only able to rely on the stock DengFu/Luna 840wh supplied battery using the same amount of power for a 20 mile ride which is what led me to figuring out another battery. To be fair out of the box the new battery was pretty much on par with the stock one but as time has gone on it has improved.

I managed to waste the stock SRAM drivetrain in about 1000 miles and replaced it with a cheap 11spd Sensah RX setup a friend turned me on to. Cost a hundred bucks for the derailleur/11-50 cassette and Shimano 11spd chain for another $40. I opted for my preferred grip shifter for another $40 which is a one time deal. After another 400 miles it is doing at least as well as the SRAM and I figure that replacing the chain and cassette in the future will be well under $100 which suits my cheap nature.

 

[bram.biesiekierski]

Just wanted to update on the performance of my "cheap" 15ah 52v 2170 DingTai battery. After like 15 charges and showing improvement with each charge range wise it seems to have settled in getting a reliable 25 miles/2500'vert using 2/3 and the occasional 4 of 5 modes. I would say 60% 2, 30% 3 and 10% 4. On the same rides I was only able to rely on the stock DengFu/Luna 840wh supplied battery using the same amount of power for a 20 mile ride which is what led me to figuring out another battery. To be fair out of the box the new battery was pretty much on par with the stock one but as time has gone on it has improved.

I managed to waste the stock SRAM drivetrain in about 1000 miles and replaced it with a cheap 11spd Sensah RX setup a friend turned me on to. Cost a hundred bucks for the derailleur/11-50 cassette and Shimano 11spd chain for another $40. I opted for my preferred grip shifter for another $40 which is a one time deal. After another 400 miles it is doing at least as well as the SRAM and I figure that replacing the chain and cassette in the future will be well under $100 which suits my cheap nature.

Does the DingTai battery fit the standard mounting system? Or have you done away with that and just plug in?

Is the 52v a straight swap for the motor/controller? I'm assuming your motor is standard 48v?

Is you motor a CAN motor? Is the 52v compatible there?

 

[Mabman]

Does the DingTai battery fit the standard mounting system? Or have you done away with that and just plug in?

Is the 52v a straight swap for the motor/controller? I'm assuming your motor is standard 48v?

Is you motor a CAN motor? Is the 52v compatible there?

It is the same case and plugs into the standard mount.

UART Motor that via the display can switch between 48v and 52v. Not sure about anything to do with the CAN motor, sorry.

 

[bram.biesiekierski]

It sounds like some of the m510 crew are plugging in 52v batteries, but not charging them past 58v.

 

[Mabman]

I guess I could try running the 52v battery on the display 48v mode. I know that in the flash file I have it set to 52v though....But in general it is a known fact that most 48v systems can handle up to 58v. I also have a 48v DT battery set up with 2170 cells and the few times I have used it it is on par with the stock battery but haven't used it enough yet to see the improvements I have with the 52v.

One thing for sure though that I will reiterate is that I feel that the 52v battery wakes up the M620 nicely over the 48v providing just that much more snap until they both are below 48v actual then the 2170 cells out perform the 18650's down to LVC. Sorry I can't get any more scientific than that.....

 

[agro_86]

A little update on my post above regarding a modded cover plate to allow for more cells as well as the use of 21700 cells which I am convinced work better than 18650's for the G510 after using them for awhile now. Also I feel that 52v is a better voltage for the G510. Probably for the E10/M600 as well but I don't have a test mule for that theory.

As I alluded to I am not at all set up to make the plate and I thought about getting one 3d printed but I don't even know anyone that is into that....so I had the bright idea to contact Ben Rides who monitors this site as a rep for DengFu to see if they had any interest in making them? After a few back and forths I wasn't getting much love for the idea but I also felt like he wasn't totally getting my drift either. In the end he said he was passing it on to the powers that be. He did mention that they have had requests to make a dual battery frame of some sort but to my mind that is not a better option, at least for trail use, than one that just has more wh's.

The one thing I did find out from my battery contact was that it is totally possible to do what they refer to as a soft case 21700 cell battery with the cells oriented so as to be perpendicular to the down tube which will actually result in more cells allowed in general as well as the ability to use a BMS of an even higher Amp rating than the 40A mine currently use. I personally don't need that option but those that are using hopped up controllers now or in the future might appreciate that feature. But what does seem like a good idea is a Smart/Bluetooth BMS and that is also a viable option that is not available for use in the stock case due to their larger size in general. Also it is possible to maintain the stock discharge system so that stock cased batteries can still be used as needed.

I let the air out of my fork and measured the distance between the tire and the downtube and measured the difference and concluded that if the plate could be max 26mm deeper it would allow for plenty of clearance. Being that 21700 cells are 21mm that means that at least one more layer of cells could be added which by my calculations should result in at least a 25ah battery possible.

Not sure if there is any interest in this project but if there is perhaps dropping a line to Ben showing interest may help it come to be? If they do end up making it at some point the battery design will be fairly easy but not going to do anything about that until the plate is made.

i am over the moon that i have finally found some answers to my questions. i really wanted to make sure I could get some 21700 Samsung 50E Cells into my dengfu e22 before going out to purchase one. you seem to be pushing for that quite a bit and i definitely agree and support that.
so after reading on this forum i have now discovered that it is possible to fit 42 21700 (for 14S3P) into the stock battery case one thing i am having trouble confirming is whether it is possible to fit 56 21700 (for 14S4P) into the frame with a smart BMS (108x65x15 mm) and have them in there secure enough to withstand some light jumps. of course that would mean they would not be housed inside the battery box.
Any suggestions or issues i would be facing with having roughly 4kg of weight resting against the cover? would it be strong enough or should i scrap that idea and stick to keeping the battery box?

 

[Mabman]

i am over the moon that i have finally found some answers to my questions. i really wanted to make sure I could get some 21700 Samsung 50E Cells into my dengfu e22 before going out to purchase one. you seem to be pushing for that quite a bit and i definitely agree and support that.
so after reading on this forum i have now discovered that it is possible to fit 42 21700 (for 14S3P) into the stock battery case one thing i am having trouble confirming is whether it is possible to fit 56 21700 (for 14S4P) into the frame with a smart BMS (108x65x15 mm) and have them in there secure enough to withstand some light jumps. of course that would mean they would not be housed inside the battery box.
Any suggestions or issues i would be facing with having roughly 4kg of weight resting against the cover? would it be strong enough or should i scrap that idea and stick to keeping the battery box?

Go to Mayners post #162/163 to see probably what is the limit of battery size for the E22 and how it can be installed.

 

[agro_86]

Go to Mayners post #162/163 to see probably what is the limit of battery size for the E22 and how it can be installed.

thanks for you reply i was up to thread 120 and just skipped forward. guess i would have got there eventually. considering Mayners has put 112 18650 into the frame i think 56 21700 shouldn't be a problem. the only thing i have left to sort out is the rear shock bushings which lucky enough was right after Mayners battery post but still very confused. shock has polymer bushing in it already which measure 16.4mm with 12mm internal. guess ill have to contact the local suspension specialist to work it out

 

[CaptainBobt]

thanks for you reply i was up to thread 120 and just skipped forward. guess i would have got there eventually. considering Mayners has put 112 18650 into the frame i think 56 21700 shouldn't be a problem. the only thing i have left to sort out is the rear shock bushings which lucky enough was right after Mayners battery post but still very confused. shock has polymer bushing in it already which measure 16.4mm with 12mm internal. guess ill have to contact the local suspension specialist to work it out

See my post on bushings and the helpful responses from other memebers. The mounting bolt for the e22 is 8mm so you will need reducers to fit down the 12mm internal to 8m, 16.4 width is pretty close the yoke mount and the frame bracket on the top tube is 32. Here's another picture of my shock

 

[Chrisnow]

thanks for you reply i was up to thread 120 and just skipped forward. guess i would have got there eventually. considering Mayners has put 112 18650 into the frame i think 56 21700 shouldn't be a problem. the only thing i have left to sort out is the rear shock bushings which lucky enough was right after Mayners battery post but still very confused. shock has polymer bushing in it already which measure 16.4mm with 12mm internal. guess ill have to contact the local suspension specialist to work it out

check my post on bushing size. i enclosed pdf file with detailed measurements

 

[bram.biesiekierski]

These 2 attachments are the shock hardware specs directly from Dengfu.

 

[agro_86]

check my post on bushing size. i enclosed pdf file with detailed measurements

Thanks Chrisnow. it make life much easier when i was calling local shops to try to find them. i think they were just going to order then in for me and hit me with a nice fee for making a phone call. just rang the guys in the UK. (offset bushings) worked out much cheaper even with the shipping.

 

[RAW76]

What hydraulic brake is everyone using? Is there any 4 piston with 3 pins out there? Ive only seen 2 pins like the magura emt5 or the tektro hd-e725. Or the brake sensor with magnet is still the best way to go?

 

[agro_86]

What hydraulic brake is everyone using? Is there any 4 piston with 3 pins out there? Ive only seen 2 pins like the magura emt5 or the tektro hd-e725. Or the brake sensor with magnet is still the best way to go?

Actually i was wondering the same thing. Im in the process of ordering all my parts. I bought the shigura set up. magura mt7 callipers and shimano xt 8100 levers. However the levers dont really have space to fit sensors. Do people just run then without?

 

[bram.biesiekierski]

What hydraulic brake is everyone using? Is there any 4 piston with 3 pins out there? Ive only seen 2 pins like the magura emt5 or the tektro hd-e725. Or the brake sensor with magnet is still the best way to go?

I am a big fan of Hope brakes. Both my bikes run Tech 3 levers and either E4 or V4 callipers.

They are powerful brakes. Reliable so far. Lots of adjustment for lever throw and bite point. Plus they use automotive brake fluid, which is like half the price of MTB brake fluid.

 

[Mabman]

Now that better weather and long days are here, I even took off my mud guards, the old standard 20ish mile laps are being rested and with the help of a piggy back battery new farther reaching terrain is on the menu. I haven't worn out the two yet but have done several just under 40 mile which knowing that I average just about 30wh/mi use at my preferred good clip and plenty of ele I can stretch it to 50 miles max but more likely 45+ comfortably. I mostly use 2/3 for my rides with a bit of 4 on really steep trail type terrain which we have some of here in the hood.

Makes a heavy bike heavier for sure but still don't really feel the weight once it is rolling. Low speed handling is still really good and medium to high speed is very planted and secure. The techish single track I have ridden is totally doable also. So I am proclaiming the extra $$ to get it set up, which was around $400 total was well worth it!

BTW my frame is a med but on large frames it will fit on the downtube, here is a pic of my friends E22 bike but with an Ortleib bag

Mine is a Stasher from Amazon. They were made to haul beer cans and came with liner material most of which was taken out to better fit the stock style battery casing.

I am happy I ended up with the two battery system because it will probably end up using my 52v most of the time for my <25 mile adventures that occur most days. But have some routes lined up to do with my Z1 buddy above that will be lots of fun!

 

[CaptainBobt]

What hydraulic brake is everyone using? Is there any 4 piston with 3 pins out there? Ive only seen 2 pins like the magura emt5 or the tektro hd-e725. Or the brake sensor with magnet is still the best way to go?

I agree no need for sensors with 4 potters, can't speak for the m620 yet because the mail man hasn't delivered yet but I use magura m7 calipers and levers 180mm rotors on a 65 lb fat bike with a modded BBHD pushing 2000 to 2500 watts using a 52V 24ah battery . And no issues stopping whatsoever from 40+mph.even downhill.

 

[CaptainBobt]

Now that better weather and long days are here, I even took off my mud guards, the old standard 20ish mile laps are being rested and with the help of a piggy back battery new farther reaching terrain is on the menu. I haven't worn out the two yet but have done several just under 40 mile which knowing that I average just about 30wh/mi use at my preferred good clip and plenty of ele I can stretch it to 50 miles max but more likely 45+ comfortably. I mostly use 2/3 for my rides with a bit of 4 on really steep trail type terrain which we have some of here in the hood.

View attachment 92025

Makes a heavy bike heavier for sure but still don't really feel the weight once it is rolling. Low speed handling is still really good and medium to high speed is very planted and secure. The techish single track I have ridden is totally doable also. So I am proclaiming the extra $$ to get it set up, which was around $400 total was well worth it!

BTW my frame is a med but on large frames it will fit on the downtube, here is a pic of my friends E22 bike but with an Ortleib bag

View attachment 92026

Mine is a Stasher from Amazon. They were made to haul beer cans and came with liner material most of which was taken out to better fit the stock style battery casing.

I am happy I ended up with the two battery system because it will probably end up using my 52v most of the time for my <25 mile adventures that occur most days. But have some routes lined up to do with my Z1 buddy above that will be lots of fun!

That's a nice set up, fits well. On a side note is that rear fender stock on the Luna or did you get it aftermarket ..?

 

[Mabman]

Not stock, Mudrocker XL, beast coverage on the market IMNSHO. I have the same for my bike and they are easy on, easy off also just by wasting a few zip ties. A little noisy due to some flappage but I live in a can be wet climate and don't like a wet back/arse.....

 

[CaptainBobt]

Not stock, Mudrocker XL, beast coverage on the market IMNSHO. I have the same for my bike and they are easy on, easy off also just by wasting a few zip ties. A little noisy due to some flappage but I live in a can be wet climate and don't like a wet back/arse.....

Sweet Thanks. I like to ride even in colder weather. Makes all the difference when your backside is powder fresh..

 

[bram.biesiekierski]

For anyone curious. This is the head tube angle on a large e22, when you fit a 170mm 29" fork, and run mullet config, and tweak the shock stroke, for slightly more travel.

Exactly 65°. Which is 1° slacker than the standard 66°, just by increasing the front axle to crown length, and mulleting it.

It would probably be even slacker, maybe 64.5° or so if I didn't increase the shock stroke via the offset bushings. And have equal width mullet tyres. (Currently has 29x2.4 front, and 27.5x2.6 rear.)

 

[BonBond]

For anyone curious. This is the head tube angle on a large e22, when you fit a 170mm 29" fork, and run mullet config, and tweak the shock stroke, for slightly more travel.

Exactly 65°. Which is 1° slacker than the standard 66°, just by increasing the front axle to crown length, and mulleting it.

It would probably be even slacker, maybe 64.5° or so if I didn't increase the shock stroke via the offset bushings. And have equal width mullet tyres. (Currently has 29x2.4 front, and 27.5x2.6 rear.)

View attachment 92030

came here to ask about forks....

I'm thinking about some Zeb Ultimate RC2 or Fox 38 Float Performance forks, but can only get what I'm looking for in 160mm at the 'right price'.

Are people generally fitting 160mm forks to their E22s (I'm going mullet too)?

 

[BonBond]

What did you decide?

I went medium in the end, I spoke to Dengfu and they suggested that the large might be a bit large fore me. Fingers crossed I made the right move!

 

[BonBond]

came here to ask about forks....

I'm thinking about some Zeb Ultimate RC2 or Fox 38 Float Performance forks, but can only get what I'm looking for in 160mm at the 'right price'.

Are people generally fitting 160mm forks to their E22s (I'm going mullet too)?

Also, can somebody help me with the rear suspension please? Does the frame need suspension with an eyelet or bearing mount on the lower?

 

[bram.biesiekierski]

came here to ask about forks....

I'm thinking about some Zeb Ultimate RC2 or Fox 38 Float Performance forks, but can only get what I'm looking for in 160mm at the 'right price'.

Are people generally fitting 160mm forks to their E22s (I'm going mullet too)?

In my instance. I had been eyeing the Marzocchi Z1 coil for my Trek Remedy, even before I started with the eBike build. I was specifically looking to try a coil spring fork, as I was so impressed by the feel/characteristics of coil spring shock in the rear, and just wanted to try it. (So glad I did BTW.)

Then when I started collecting parts for the e22 build, i saw pushys.com dropped the retail price by 25%, and I had an additional 15% discount code that stacked with the sale. Even at retail price, Marzocchi is already cheaper than equivelant rockshox and fox offerings, and the added discounts at that point meant it was a no brainer. So I ordered one.

The Z1 comes in both 29" and 27.5" variants. I opted for the 29" as I that was the logical choice. I could still run a 27.5" wheel in a 29" fork if i had to. But if I wanted 29" wheel, the door was open. And I don't see any negatives with 29" front wheel what so ever.

The Z1s are adjustable in travel, but the default for the 29" Z1 is 170mm. So I just rolled with that as its how it was out of the box.

As for the reason to mullet the e22. Well, I prefer 27.5 rear wheels. For me, I don't like 29" rear wheels on bikes with more than about 140mm travel. I tend to grind ass on the tyres. My legs aren't the longest. And my riding style down more steep terrain has my butt always out in the rear wheel path. So soon as I G-out, I always buzz my bum. A 29" rear wheel would only make that so much worse.

I think full 29" on trail bikes is great. The benefits are there. They are just more efficient. But once you start getting a bit more travel, they just don't work for me.

And with a big powerful eBike. It doesn't really matter if you have a big heavy fork. Or a big bouncy inefficeint peddaling platform. Or a 27.5" wheel that rolls 2% less effeficiently than a 29". Because you have more than enough power on tap to overcome it.

 

[bram.biesiekierski]

Also, can somebody help me with the rear suspension please? Does the frame need suspension with an eyelet or bearing mount on the lower?

If you look back on the previous post, I put up the shock hardware measurements from dengfu.

You just need standard 1/2" x 15mm eyelets, with standard 1/2" x 1/2" IGUS bushings. Don't get trunion mount.

If your shock is rockshox, or most other brands, then they usually come with that standard. If your shock is fox or marzocchi, then they usually have bushings with a little extra width. You can just take these out and fit standard IGUS bushings in place. Or you can look for shock mounting hardware that takes that into account.

 

[BonBond]

If you look back on the previous post, I put up the shock hardware measurements from dengfu.

You just need standard 1/2" x 15mm eyelets, with standard 1/2" x 1/2" IGUS bushings. Don't get trunion mount.

If your shock is rockshox, or most other brands, then they usually come with that standard. If your shock is fox or marzocchi, then they usually have bushings with a little extra width. You can just take these out and fit standard IGUS bushings in place. Or you can look for shock mounting hardware that takes that into account.

cool, thanks - so this will work?

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