Fuel EXe Trek Fuel EXe Megathread!

[Oldfella]

My LBS was trying to find a clicking noise on my 9.8XT. They said they were torquing the upper shock bolt and the bolt broke. The bolt is aluminum so be careful with it. The bolts aren't readily available.

Just joined the thread about your creaking. Have you had it sorted. I have a similar noise and found the bearings in the chain stay were binding. Took it in and they replaced them but it seems the chain stay holes are too small and when the bearings are pressed in they bind up. Has to be bad manufacturing and I am waiting for a new chain stay.
Easiest way to tell is remove the rear wheel and stick your finger in the chain stay hole and see if the bearings move freely.

 

[speed300]

Bike has been silent as a ghost, but I just had my new wheels and XT cassette installed and got it back now it has a HORRIBLE creaking that sounds like it's coming from the bottom bracket. Don't know if this is coincidence or related to wheels/cassette install. Anybody resolved this?

Bike started as a 9.5 and I'm pretty much done with it now:

• Fox 36 Factory Grip 2 160mm
• Fox Float X2 factory shock
• XT 4-pot brakes and rotors
• XT drive train
• One-up Carbon 35mm bar
• Race Face 60mm stem for a little extra reach
• Atlas pedals and some fat grips
• i9 355 carbon wheels, hydra hubs, and maxxis dissector rubber

 

[JP-NZ]

As mentioned above start with the seat stay bearings and rear axle area

 

[Emailsucks98]

@speed300 Nice build!

I’ve heard something About a plastic spacer that needs to be installed behind Shimano microspline cassettes, might be worth checking- If it only happens while pedaling.

Just got back from a 15 mile snow ride. My “amazingly quiet” EXe started creaking badly midride and I could feel something shifting around. Tracked it down to a loose crank-arm bolt, which I was able to tighten on trail using a OneUp EDC tool. You put the 6mm and flathead/locking tools against each other to get a 8mm. Was a good reminder these things take constant maintenance!

 

[ciro]

150km on my 9.5. Had the standard loose chainring and now I have the faulty display. Won't turn on without plugging in the charger. Hopefully a new display unit will get to me asap

 

[Flow81]

I don't know enough about the TQ motor to explain how drag like this could occur.
In any case the EXe should not feel like "a real dog" at 50% assist. 150W assist is quite a boost.

It sounds suspiciously like it may just be a psycho-somatic phenomenon where your legs and brain sense the change in assistance. Do you feel the same thing when you go from Turbo to Trail or from Trail to Eco? It's a common sensation with all ebikes.

If it does turn out to be a problem with the TQ motor we'd like to hear more about the diagnosis.

Update on motor drag: Trek has done some testing and the supposed drag has not been "psycho-somatic". They are replacing the motor. Thank you Trek. Excited to ride the TQ motor the way it was designed to!

Lower shock bolt:
I have a nasty clack clack sound coming from my motor / lower shock mount area. I have read through all the lower shock bolt posts and also followed the service bulletin for the mounting hardware. I am not sure the mounting hardware is the issue here.

The lower shock bolt is a stock standard mass-produced machine bolt you can buy from any hardware shop. Shoulder diameter 7.9mm and 7.85mm on the thread. Bolts are generally used to resist vertical forces or from clamping together. In shock mount applications bolts are subjected to lateral forces (pulling perpendicular). This means the bolt diameter and mounting holes needs to be closely matched. I spoke to the Betterbolt guys and they make M8 shock bolts at 7.96mm, exactly for that reason.

After 2 months of riding, the lower shock mounting holes (in the frame) is currently measuring 8.2 and 8.24mm respectively. I will keep an eye on it, but once you have play it can only go one way if side-loading forces are applied.

I ordered a Trek Bolt M8 x 1.25 x 64mm bolt (W511147) as @njatherton suggested and filed the head down to 13.5mm. The bolt is a little long, but I added a 2mm washer on the head side. But this bolt also measures 7.9mm diameter.

I am concerned that with the already enlarged mounting holes on my frame (±8.2mm), no amount of bigger bolt finding or electrical tape will close the gap in the long run. I can try and use a 6mm bolt, with some form of nylon bushing, but I feel this is really too much hacking on a 2 month old bike. The bolt diameter and mounting holes needed to be matched much closer than what it was out of the factory. Using a mass production machine bolt with broad tolerances (south of 8mm) also didn't help.

The new Trek Fuel EX uses this type of stock off the shelf bolt too, and I think this is really corner cutting from Trek. Other (older) Trek bikes uses proper shock bolts designed to closely match the mounting hole.

There is no play when I cycled the suspension in my garage, but once I have square edged hits it goes clack clack clack. I really hope its not the lower shock bolt hitting the metal of the mounting holes due to the excessive play in that area. The dealer is baffled.

Maybe the sound is not the bolt, maybe its in the motor, who knows. But the big gap between mounting hole and shock bolt is a concern in the long run.

 

[Swingset]

Bolts that are threaded and see shear are prone to fail. Trek uses a shouldered bolt that is used in shear (shock compression) and in tension (clamping the shock bushings). A good joint design would be threads are completely out of the shear plane with the shoulder taking that load. I measured everything and they have about .001" clearance between the bolt OD and the holes in the frame (mine). That is pretty damn close and insures that they can assemble without having to do some match machining on some bikes. That would suck in a production environment.

So the Fox stuff has IGUS bushings in the shock eyelet with a very slight interference fit. No slop. The two sources of play are the bolt OD/Spacer ID and the bolt OD and frame ID. It does not take much slop here to equal a bunch at the rear wheel. So they rely on compressing the frame mount width onto the width of the shock spacer to apply enough friction to take the play out. The frame mount is very stiff and it takes a bunch more torque to actually clamp the shock spacer enough to not move. Really the shock moves to the compressed side of the hole and the friction keeps it there on the rebound side. On my bike it takes well more than the spec 17Nm to eliminate the problem. Ignoring it and lets the holes oval in the frame is really a bad idea.

 

[Emailsucks98]

So the Fox stuff has IGUS bushings in the shock eyelet with a very slight interference fit. No slop. The two sources of play are the bolt OD/Spacer ID and the bolt OD and frame ID.

I have been wondering if a mismatch between shock hardware & DU bushings could be the source. I noticed Igus bushings definitely have a larger I.D. compared to the typical bronze DU bushings Rockshox uses. I just noticed this when switching shocks, swapping to the bronze bushings fixed it.

 

[Swingset]

From my experience. RS uses DU metal bushings with bonded Teflon like liner. IGUS makes a variety of engineered plastics. They both interchange with each other. The IGUS probably provides a hair more damping. Not much.

 

[senergy]

I've been waiting a month so far for the "fix" for the shock movement. I just sent a follow up asking will the holes get "ovaled while I'm waiting and if so, that will then require a warranty frame. Not sure that will help speed the process up, but at least it's documented.

 

[Keith3007]

Seems a few out there doing the 9.5 plus build. Happy with how mine turned out but could do without the stack of unwanted components. View attachment 105850

 

[Flow81]

I've been waiting a month so far for the "fix" for the shock movement. I just sent a follow up asking will the holes get "ovaled while I'm waiting and if so, that will then require a warranty frame. Not sure that will help speed the process up, but at least it's documented.

Good call! Trek have some work to do regarding the shock movement.

 

[Cell4soul]

Seems a few out there doing the 9.5 plus build. Happy with how mine turned out but could do without the stack of unwanted components. View attachment 105850 View attachment 105851

Sick……I did the same thing. Matte Dnister Black is the best color, my opinion.

 

[TopUnit]

Hi all, I had the creaking ‘bottom bracket’ i’d done a bit of quick checking on the bike and found the chainring had a bit of play and then searched the web and found you guys posting about the new 50Nm torque setting for the chain ring lock nut. out comes the tool kit and off comes the crank, found the lock nut was wonky so i took it off. looks like it loosened itself then managed to get cross threaded. i’m sure it wouldn’t have been built that way. anyway threads are trashed and my LBS are sending me a new locknut. i’d done about 20km on holiday with the creaking and assume the nut had been loose longer than that. hopefully nothing got past the o-ring and into the View attachment 103656 motor as the the nut wasn’t seated.
fortunately the opposite threads on the motor look like steel and are in good shape. i’ll get it into the shop for them to check once back from summer holliday.

I don't see a seal in that lock nut. I see the oring but no seal to the spindle.
Trek says in the manual supplement that damage to the seal could allow water to damage the motor.
Presumably no seal would also allow water to damage the motor.

Has the seal been removed?
Has anyone else checked if their locknut has a seal?

 

[Emailsucks98]

Has the seal been removed?
Has anyone else checked if their locknut has a seal?

Mine looked exactly like yours. I was freaked out when I saw that part of the manual, as I had just removed/re-torqued that lock ring multiple times, trying to hunt down a creak (which ended up being my rear hub driver).

I haven't heard of anyone recieving that sleeve, and it sounds like Trek dealers aren't even using it.

I've decided it's nothing to worry about!

 

[TopUnit]

Mine looked exactly like yours. I was freaked out when I saw that part of the manual, as I had just removed/re-torqued that lock ring multiple times, trying to hunt down a creak (which ended up being my rear hub driver).

I haven't heard of anyone recieving that sleeve, and it sounds like Trek dealers aren't even using it.

I've decided it's nothing to worry about!

Thanks
My question is whether Trek is fitting the seal that they say is necessary to avoid water damage

 

[Emailsucks98]

Thanks
My question is whether Trek is fitting the seal that they say is necessary to avoid water damage

That's a great question. I've wondered if the ISIS BB tool w/o sleeve simply pushes the seal inboard, where it's a bit less effective but still there.

 

[Swingset]

Normally I would say the oring is called the seal. But it does say there is one of each. Good catch

 

[Jack of All Trails]

I have my bike in the shop to get this same problem looked at along with a 2nd broken remote, will let you know if they resolved it (Torpedo7 in NZ)

2nd time it's been in the shop, it has had the computer replaced, broken remote and the motor rumble when soft pedalling.

Nice bike but definitely version 1.0 issues, also doesn't help that replacement parts seem to be held in Australia.

Thanks, sorry to hear of your woes, hope they get to the bottom of it. I've also noticed issues with paint chipping more than my other bikes riding the same trails in the same way. I saw a PinkBike review where they noted that the acoustic version they used in their test chipped badly. Although, it did win their bike of the year.

 

[Jack of All Trails]

Hey Jack, I know precisely what you mean.
My 9.8 started doing the same and I had it back and forth between me and the Trek store trying to solve it.

They'd "fix" it, torque to spec and it'd be ok at the shop but as soon as I got on the trail it started again. Sounded like a farm gate.
The store I bought it from recommended I take it to another local store as a technician there has some experience with this.

So have your store talk to Lachlan at Trek Springvale in VIC.
They solved it on mine and it's completely silent. They can advise your store on what to do perhaps.

Let us know how you get on.

Thanks Rev, I'll do that. You're a champ - much appreciated! Happy (and silent) trails.

 

[gmcttr]

Thanks
My question is whether Trek is fitting the seal that they say is necessary to avoid water damage

I finally got my EXe 9.8XT 2 days ago. I stripped the frame to install a Ride Wrap kit.

The chainring lock nut had the seal attached that slips over the ISIS crankarm shaft. After I finished I found a blue plastic sleeve in the TQ box that the charger came in.

My 9.8XT has all the spec'd components.

 

[TopUnit]

I finally got my EXe 9.8XT 2 days ago. I stripped the frame to install a Ride Wrap kit.

The chainring lock nut had the seal attached that slips over the ISIS crankarm shaft. After I finished I found a blue plastic sleeve in the TQ box that the charger came in.

My 9.8XT has all the spec'd components.

OK Great, It sounds like new deliveries have the seal installed in the locknut, plus they are supplying the sleeve that is used to ensure that the seal doesn't get damaged when installing the locknut.

I was getting the impression that the seal may not be installed on some bikes.
I'd suggest anyone that doesn't have the seal installed in the locknut should be asking for it.

My motivation for asking about this is

1. In light of the recent clutch failure (seperate thread) to make sure that the seal is being installed, since the clutch failure could be due to water damage which could be due to a damaged seal or missing seal. (Just one possibility, it could be something else)

2. To make sure my CAD model is right (because I haven't seen a photo of the seal, and I don't have an EXe to check)
I'd love to see a photo of the locknut with the seal installed, someone?
A photo of the sleeve would be interesting too

Below is a cross section from my CAD model showing the proximity of the clutch to the seal.
Just the bearing seals in between which generally aren't rated to be water proof.
Of course the bearing could also get damaged if there is no locknut seal.

 

[Jack of All Trails]

Bike has been silent as a ghost, but I just had my new wheels and XT cassette installed and got it back now it has a HORRIBLE creaking that sounds like it's coming from the bottom bracket. Don't know if this is coincidence or related to wheels/cassette install. Anybody resolved this?

Bike started as a 9.5 and I'm pretty much done with it now:

• Fox 36 Factory Grip 2 160mm
• Fox Float X2 factory shock
• XT 4-pot brakes and rotors
• XT drive train
• One-up Carbon 35mm bar
• Race Face 60mm stem for a little extra reach
• Atlas pedals and some fat grips
• i9 355 carbon wheels, hydra hubs, and maxxis dissector rubber

View attachment 105781

Hi Speed, did you manage to fix your creaking? I have been having similar issues. Bike looks amazing btw.

 

[ciro]

I don't see a seal in that lock nut. I see the oring but no seal to the spindle.
Trek says in the manual supplement that damage to the seal could allow water to damage the motor.
Presumably no seal would also allow water to damage the motor.

Has the seal been removed?
Has anyone else checked if their locknut has a seal?

View attachment 105872
View attachment 105871

Just checked my 9.5 after this. Definitely a seal attached to the lockring.

Can anyone provide dimensions for the protective sleeve? Mainly the thickness of the plastic.

Didn't get one with my bike but I wouldn't mind printing one up for when I have to tighten again.

 

[Free_Tibet]

Mine looked exactly like yours. I was freaked out when I saw that part of the manual, as I had just removed/re-torqued that lock ring multiple times, trying to hunt down a creak (which ended up being my rear hub driver).

I haven't heard of anyone recieving that sleeve, and it sounds like Trek dealers aren't even using it.

I've decided it's nothing to worry about!

Hi all. Fyi my Trek shop received the new Lockring that now has the 50Nm marking stamped on it. It came with the protective blue sleeve. Unfortunately they misplaced it before I picked up the bike so I can't send a pic of it at the moment. They are now trying to get me a sleeve as I will need it for working on / maintaining the bike.

 

[Psythepie]

A couple of pictures of the sleeve, just to prove they exist & some people received them @ciro, unfortunately I don't have a vernier at home but if I remember I'll take it to work with me on Monday & measure it up for you.

 

[Emailsucks98]

I was getting the impression that the seal may not be installed on some bikes.
I'd suggest anyone that doesn't have the seal installed in the locknut should be asking for it.

I’ll order them up this weekend, excellent sleuthing gents! It’s be great to know the PN#’s for the seal & sleeve are, if I can figure that out I’ll post it up.

 

[Canyon Shawn]

Is there any advantage to putting an oval chainring on one of these?

 

[Mteam]

Is there any advantage to putting an oval chainring on one of these?

No ,there's no point in oval rings on any mid motor ebike because the chainring changes its position relative to the cranks -unlike a normal bike where the chainring is fixed in position relative to the cranks

 

[TopUnit]

Just checked my 9.5 after this. Definitely a seal attached to the lockring.

Can anyone provide dimensions for the protective sleeve? Mainly the thickness of the plastic.

Didn't get one with my bike but I wouldn't mind printing one up for when I have to tighten again.

I'd recommend getting one from Trek. It needs to be very smooth and it needs to be slightly tapered (conical) so that it slowly expands the seal to the right diameter by the time it gets to the shaft.