Battle of the M820 lightweights. Questions / comparisons regarding CEF50 vs LCE930.

[un..inc]

Hi everyone...
I'm torn between the CEF50 and the LCE930....
Can someone tell me how the frames REALLY differ?
I know there is a lot of information here, but unfortunately too much to find it easily.
CEF50 comes in L and XL
What about the weights?
Which one weighs more?
Which manufacturer can supply which motors, batteries, displays and switches?
With lightcarbon I know the costs for painting, how is it here with the CEF50? How is the ordering process there?
I haven't seen any examples and costs yet.
What are the costs for the CEF50 as opposed to the LCE930?

Visually, I like the CEF50 better from some angles and the LCE930 from others. I like the rocker on the CEF50 better, but the lightcarbon seems a bit slimmer.

Sorry if some questions have already been answered here several times, but maybe the comparison will help other interested users.

Thank you for your help!

 

[brbr]

Hey,
On my side it was 1086 usd shipped to France with carbon handlebar taxes included for LCE930.
If you want a big battery, go for cef50, if you want a smaller battery, be careful as the bafang is not available yet.
You can buy the motor in a kit with a cef50, not with lce930.
I think the cef50 is slightly lighter than the lc930.
I just received my frame, the quality seems very good.
Also, if tou’d like to run a t type transmission (latest wireless sram derailleurs), you will need and udh, not available on the cef50.

 

[mike_kelly]

The CEF50 frame is lighter than the 930, weights are on the first pages, easy to find.
Only one manufacturer of motor etc - Bafang
CEF50 costs may change but current were painted for under $50
Cost for the CEF50 is lower. Total cost is up to your choice of parts.

 

[un..inc]

The CEF50 frame is lighter than the 930, weights are on the first pages, easy to find.
Only one manufacturer of motor etc - Bafang
CEF50 costs may change but current were painted for under $50
Cost for the CEF50 is lower. Total cost is up to your choice of parts.

Don't get me wrong, I know there's only Bafang as a motor supplier. Hence the caption "M820".
I wasn't aware of the specifications-thread for the CEF50.
This clarifies a lot.
After reading this, I am still confused about the fork travel.
Some say 160mm, the chart sais 170mm.
I already have an 160mm fork on hand.

 

[mike_kelly]

Not enough difference to worry about.

 

[Migli54]

Has anyone done a serious comparison of these frames? The 200g difference between the two is not really the key point... Does anyone know the volume of the possible battery compartment?
What are their advantages and disadvantages?
From my point of view, the geometry of the LCE930 is more accomplished, but that's just my feeling...

 

[forsa355]

Has anyone done a serious comparison of these frames? The 200g difference between the two is not really the key point... Does anyone know the volume of the possible battery compartment?
What are their advantages and disadvantages?
From my point of view, the geometry of the LCE930 is more accomplished, but that's just my feeling...

I think the biggest difference is the battery options. Currently there is only one commercial battery for any of them... the 720wh CEF50 battery. Still waiting for an official Bafang battery. The LCE930 has a slimmer downtube and won't accommodate a big battery. I actually prefer the slimmer stealth look of LCE930, but prefer the overall looks of the CEF50 frame. I just built my CEF50 and did a complete build video... almost finished editing it and will upload to Youtube hopefully this weekend. You can see the frame in detail in that video

 

[Migli54]

Great! Send me the link as soon as possible . If I understand correctly the CEF50 with 720wh is not really a light weight? Can you get it under 19 or 20kg ?

 

[forsa355]

Here's a video I made showing a detailed view and build of the CEF50 frame and M820 motor. Once I get a few more rides in, I'll be creating a detailed review of both the frame and motor.

 

[mike_kelly]

Great! Send me the link as soon as possible . If I understand correctly the CEF50 with 720wh is not really a light weight? Can you get it under 19 or 20kg ?

Yes the build for my wife is 39lbs

 

[spokémon]

From my point of view, the geometry of the LCE930 is more accomplished, but that's just my feeling...

I'm curious, can you tell us why you think this?

 

[spokémon]

Great! Send me the link as soon as possible . If I understand correctly the CEF50 with 720wh is not really a light weight? Can you get it under 19 or 20kg ?

I think you missed the point. CEF50 is currently the only M820 frame that can take a 720Wh battery. It doesn't mean you have to use a 720Wh battery.

 

[Migli54]

I'm curious, can you tell us why you think this?

The two geometries are very similar indeed, but the point that worries me about the chassis is the design of the carbon suspension rod (the link between the front and rear triangles). Usually, this part is made of soft materials like aluminum. I wonder how this part ages over time when subjected to constant stress. I'm also concerned about the head tube, whose bearings are pressed directly into the carbon frame. The routing in general seems to have been well thought out, and finally the LCE930 looks more like a light weight in general, it's thinner and stealthier and allows a 200mm seat tube insert compared with 180 for the CEF50.
This is just my humble opinion, and I'd be delighted to hear from you if you have any points to correct.

 

[Migli54]

I think you missed the point. CEF50 is currently the only M820 frame that can take a 720Wh battery. It doesn't mean you have to use a 720Wh battery.

The battery debate bores me to tears. Nothing personal though People all want the biggest battery.... But they don't take into account engine consumption, their mode of use. And when we ask 3300 ebikers about their riding time, they average 1 to 3 hours maximum per trip. So why on earth add all that unnecessary weight and have 720wh when the very DNA of lightweight is to optimize lightness?.

PS :
But yes, you're right, CF50 allows greater freedom on the battery. But I'm not sure if the 720wh is CE certified for us Europeans. I'm sure the one from Bafang is.

 

[eugene8]

I think the weakest point of CEF50 is the rear triangle top part that is not interconnected but goes into swing arm separately. It's going to flex much and will wear out the bearings quicker and potentially damage the frame. I've seen this weak link on other non emtb carbon frames from China mostly XC bikes.

 

[JimLee-Lightcarbon]

The battery BT F014 410wh now finished the first mass production, you can get it from bafang company, also we can supply it for sample order or personal buyer, but price is higher than bafang,
We will not compare with our peers. If you need to know more about our frames, you can contact us by email.
In addition, regarding spray painting, we use a single customized high-temperature spray paint, which is completed in the same spray paint factory as specialized/facotry/canyon and other brands, so the cost will be higher.
In addition, if you need a large battery for long-distance riding, it may be better to use the M510 motor. In bafang's ebike, all ebike with M820 are equipped with small batteries, which may indicate some problems.

 

[thaeber]

allows a 200mm seat tube insert compared with 180 for the CEF50.

Realy? Only 180 possible?

 

[Migli54]

Feel free to correct me if it's wrong Pokemon

 

[spokémon]

seat tube insert compared with 180 for the CEF50.

Can you tell us where you got this info?

 

[Migli54]

Can you tell us where you got this info?

@spokemon @thaeber @LAnton

Hi guys... Go to the manufacturer's website, click on geometry and look at the seat tube insertion length... I'll copy them for you to make it easier. Best regards

 

[mike_kelly]

Shenzhen Zhaosheng Carbon CEF50 lightweight using Bafang M820 motor (Specifications Thread)

sub-threads Main conversation - https://www.emtbforums.com/threads/m820-bafang-cef50-frame-lightweight.32042/ External Batteries Range extenders -...

www.emtbforums.com

 

[AlexRus]

Feel free to correct me if it's wrong Pokemon

I installed a 213 mm from Bike Yoke, but had to slightly upgrade the wiring to the charging port.
frame M size
175sm rider

 

[Migli54]

I installed a 213 mm from Bike Yoke, but had to slightly upgrade the wiring to the charging port.
frame M size
175sm rider

Thanks for the info, the product sales page seems to be wrong.

 

[Migli54]

So, if we try to summarize in a few lines the feedback on the CEF50... (I read diagonally quickly, there will certainly be corrections)
- Overall satisfied with the quality of the frame, the after-sales service and the paints offered by the company.
- Apparently it's possible to fit 55x210, contrary to the specification which mentions max 50.
- The 22.2 mm bushes need to be reworked (at least one).
- Impossible to mount a shock absorber with a coil.
- The weight of the batteries is wrong on the specification (more like 4kg for the 720wh).
- The headset size is also wrong. And they are currently of poor quality.
- Members have already broken the shroud. -> Fragile
- Members have already broken the lower seatstays -> Fragile
- Impossible to fit a UDH derailleur.
- Linkage is carbon
- No horizontal bar at the top of the seatstays to solidify the assembly.

 

[spokémon]

So, if we try to summarize in a few lines the feedback on the CEF50... (I read diagonally quickly, there will certainly be corrections)
- Overall satisfied with the quality of the frame, the after-sales service and the paints offered by the company.
- Apparently it's possible to fit 55x210, contrary to the specification which mentions max 50.
- The 22.2 mm bushes need to be reworked (at least one).
- Impossible to mount a shock absorber with a coil.
- The weight of the batteries is wrong on the specification (more like 4kg for the 720wh).
- The headset size is also wrong. And they are currently of poor quality.
- Members have already broken the shroud. -> Fragile
- Members have already broken the lower seatstays -> Fragile
- Impossible to fit a UDH derailleur.
- Linkage is carbon
- No horizontal bar at the top of the seatstays to solidify the assembly.

Thanks for the summary.
Can you give us your summary of the LCE930 as well please?

 

[patdam]

So, if we try to summarize in a few lines the feedback on the CEF50... (I read diagonally quickly, there will certainly be corrections)
- Overall satisfied with the quality of the frame, the after-sales service and the paints offered by the company.
- Apparently it's possible to fit 55x210, contrary to the specification which mentions max 50.
- The 22.2 mm bushes need to be reworked (at least one).
- Impossible to mount a shock absorber with a coil.
- The weight of the batteries is wrong on the specification (more like 4kg for the 720wh).
- The headset size is also wrong. And they are currently of poor quality.
- Members have already broken the shroud. -> Fragile
- Members have already broken the lower seatstays -> Fragile
- Impossible to fit a UDH derailleur.
- Linkage is carbon
- No horizontal bar at the top of the seatstays to solidify the assembly.

Not received this i have ordered, but following reading of returns, i'm don't tink you can affirme all of thats

- I consider that 210x55 not fit, someone who used it have marks of impact on his bases and it's the guy who have also cracks.
- Now they delivery their frame with UDH hanger
And for positive point we can say also that they are particulary at earing of the customers and they accept personalize (holes in frame for cables routing in place of headset)

 

[temon10]

Not received this i have ordered, but following reading of returns, i'm don't tink you can affirme all of thats

- I consider that 210x55 not fit, this who used it have mark of impact in his bases and it's the guy who have also cracks.
- Now they delivery their frame with UDH hanger
And for positive point we can say also that they are particulary at earing of the customers and they accept personalize (holes in frame for cables routing in place of headset)

210x55 will fit on mullet setting. Mine no problem.

 

[patdam]

210x55 will fit on mullet setting. Mine no problem.

Ok, i have corrected my opinion and i will check when i will receive my frame. As i seen, The problem don't come frome the wheel size, but at level of articulations of the stays and bases. may be you don't go to full rear shock compression ?

 

[Muerte]

Ok, i have corrected my opinion and i will check when i will receive my frame. As i seen, The problem don't come frome the wheel size, but at level of articulations of the stays and bases. may be you don't go to full rear shock compression ?

Do you already have received your frame, build it up? Thoughts?

 

[patdam]

Do you already have received your frame, build it up? Thoughts?

Yes received. not tested for the moment (snow at up and mud at down). I just need to finish build skid plate, this received need to be thrown in the trash. those i can said (for my opinion).

- Very good: packaging, quality of paint and carbon build showing, quality control (delivered with frame/ motor/battery pre assembled)

- 210x51 mandatory

- 29" necessary if you would 350 BB height (the less necessary for me)

- The frame and geometry seem to provide an "serious bike" alike dengfu E10. mostly dedicated to fast down, may be less funny than i whould, but i could really said after ride. On my XL, With 150 forks (pike) i have 63.5° front and 1300 whellbase, i will test 160 later but i'm afraid thatwill be to much.