Bafang M500 and M600 motors
- Thread starter Rob Rides EMTB
- Start date
Mabman
E*POWAH Elite World Champion
5' 10". Have used 170's since 1999 but going to long travel FS was having issues with strikes as many do. I am not sure if rider height has as much to do with it as the cadence frequency ability to be higher with the shorter cranks and leverage not as much of an issue? Nothing scientific to add other than seat of the pants time in the saddle comparison on known terrain, primarily the ups.
thaeber
Well-known member
Hmmm…short cranks significantly shorten the „platform“ You are standing on in downhill. I never tried, but isn‘t that a weird feeling?
hi. have you link / reference of this miranda crank arms ? at my last request they have answered that they don't produce arms for bafang M series. thanks
Mabman
E*POWAH Elite World Champion
They only do so for the larger M620 series motors with the ISIS interface. I found them on Amazon and they came from I believe Aus or the UK? Took a few weeks regardless.
Does kind of raise the ? why did they switch to proprietary for the M5/600. Maybe they just didn't want to pay the ISIS licensing fee.....
Last edited:
Mabman
E*POWAH Elite World Champion
Ever ridden a motorcycle with just pegs?
Waynemarlow
E*POWAH Master
Not sure which motor we are looking for shortened cranks for ? Luna have 150mm cranks for the M500 / M600
LUNA X1 Enduro Short Crank Arms
Providers of quality ebikes, electric bike batteries, motors and components at affordable pricing.
lunacycle.com
It’s only for M200 motors
it is original arms shortened, i have build it but not tested, i find 150 tooshort. I'm ask for miranda because they builts machined arms, more strong than cast, but they had saied me that they don't produce for M600Not sure which motor we are looking for shortened cranks for ? Luna have 150mm cranks for the M500 / M600
LUNA X1 Enduro Short Crank Arms
Providers of quality ebikes, electric bike batteries, motors and components at affordable pricing.
Sorry i'm not any fluent in english and it'is not any clear for me. You have purchase these arms in 155 and mount it on M600 motor ? TheM500/600 arms have not classic "ISIS" alike those visible in the pic (teeths more large). It seem that some M620 have standard ISIS (but not all, as i think has reading ?)
Waynemarlow
E*POWAH Master
Have you actually tested them on the bike ? I thought 150mm would be way too short as well, but having now fitted them, really finding they suit the motor and bike. It does feel a bit weird for the first hour but now they just feel normal even though I ride 170's on my analogue.
No i havn't tested, but i will do it. At this time, when i have shortened the arms it is only to soluce problem of cranks ground touch. In reality i didn't find really a differency on motor functioning, i estimate also that reducing arms length, reduce human torque and by consequency consume more battery power. But i will test.
I'll be shipping my bike with 160mm cranks. If there is enough interest, I may order extra for after market sales
Saw those, but shipping to the UK is more than the cranks themselves. I'm just as much cheep as I am cheeb!Not sure which motor we are looking for shortened cranks for ? Luna have 150mm cranks for the M500 / M600
LUNA X1 Enduro Short Crank Arms
Providers of quality ebikes, electric bike batteries, motors and components at affordable pricing.
Waynemarlow
E*POWAH Master
You may want to check with Luna as I don't remember there being such a high shipping, I know that you now have to pay UK VAT at Luna but if it had been that high I would have done my first option, get the original pedal threads filled by welding and then drill & tap to 160mm which I think is the length Specialized spec on their new EBikes.
I can set percentages on the M600, but they will never be saved. Too bad Bafang didn't make it to the individual mode settings. He would get more points from users ...
thaeber
Well-known member
No, never on trails. That’s exactly why I‘m asking, no experience at all. And, how does it feel? Do you need much time to get used to it, or is it just a matter of a couple of minutes? Thanks!
Animalector
Active member
well you don't have to worry about which foot is forward ;-)
Mabman
E*POWAH Elite World Champion
I was surprised by the same response from another that had asked the same actually. Although I try and pay attention to Q factor, the distance between the crank arms, I had never considered if there would be any downsides to shorter cranks ability to post on while riding. Well of course other than my first lesson I got when going around a left hand corner with my right foot down as usual and the pedal jamming into the ground and getting bucked off rather rudely that is.....which helped lead me to shorter cranks and also that one should not post foot down on 150+ travel bikes......
So I would say there is 0 penalty for using shorter cranks as you describe and didn't take me any time at all to get used to them either. What I really get the most out of them it turns out is their enhanced pedaling performance going up and across interacting with the PAS. I won't be specing them on a push bike though and stick with the 170's that I have used since switching from 175's in 1999. If I maintained one anymore that is.
The only crank arms I could find at this point for the M600 were Luna's 150mm. Would love to find out some other options are available but I couldn't find any.
LUNA X1 Enduro Short Crank Arms
Providers of quality ebikes, electric bike batteries, motors and components at affordable pricing.
lunacycle.com
Interesting vid discussing the M600 motor. It talks in details about the cadence bias and fast ramp up of the power and probably backs up my initial thoughts of how the torque sensing works.
Sadly if only we could play around with the bias to suit our own requirements, it would be a pretty robust and mechanically sound engine with just tad bit of porkiness about it.
Bafang M600S ebike motor review - EMTB Forums
Bafang are among the biggest ebike motor manufacturers. But they’re not focusing much on the European market. Many of their motors are illegal to use in the EU because the rated power output is too high and because the speed limit can be adjusted. The Bafang motors have a few advantages. Many of...www.emtbforums.com
That review is interesting, but what it sounded like to me is they took the collection of firmware available, probably include 'Luna's' 14.5 firmware, used the BESST tool to change them, and are claiming life has 'special firmware' versus just picking one out of presumably 14.4, 14.5(Luna Ludicrous, not great for most), 14.6 and equivalents for e.g. if they are building a 43v or 48v bike for someone?
As others have said, user configurability as to the bias and ramp times etc. would go a long ways towards making the motor suitable for a wider range of users. I have the VESC/Ludiv2 controller and can say it certainly isn't cadence-based..for that matter I don't think it uses the cadence sensor at all currently (confirmed this after I swapped wheels and while 'reminding' myself 10x 'don't forget to swap the magnet over' - I forgot to swap it over...
). I usually ride in PAS 2-3 of 9, assist seems pretty linear to torque input, and might like to reduce the rampup very slightly but only from a complete standstill. I did also move to the shorter Luna crank arms, and had some concern, as aomeone else had noted - you are reducing the moment lever, or amount of leverage you have and certainly this 'should' impact the torque input to the sensor and controller for a given amount of rider input. It has not impacted the VESC/Luna V2 controller/ride negatively for me, at low PAS levels... meanwhile someone still running the 'questionable' 14.5/LundiV2/shunt mod firmware (levels 1 and 2 were useless, 3 was too much power assist, jerky etc.) found that moving to the shorter cranks made the 'bad' firmware' overall ride much better with the shorter cranks.
Nothing really new here - stuck on Bafang either opening up use of BESST configurability further, improving their firmware, making their app actually useable - or ideally a combination of all 3, or someone releasing a programmable controller available to all M600 owners, as by all accounts it seems the issues are really in the programming versus the motor itself.
for login on firmware versions?
You can find a login bypass script out there (I think someone posted in this thread) and can find a bunch of the available firmware on endless share and on GitHub here: GitHub - OpenSourceEBike/Bafang_M500_M600
Make sure you decode the filenames and e.g. don't install 43v on a 48v system or vice versa etc. though or fun things like battery thresholds, cutoffs and percentages will be all jacked up..
I expect there would be, depending on cost and construction etc. I looked everywhere for something between the 170mm originals and Luna's 150mm but none appear to exist.
thaeber
Well-known member
thaeber
Well-known member
For all that are looking for a shorter crankset, this new Miranda Delta crank is available on Miranda online shop in 150 mm length. Other length are in Production and will be added soon.
mirandabikestore.com
Delta LS Cranks 150 Q:16 RF Baf Cold-forged aluminium alloy Standard (Black) for E-BIKE
What's included: Right and left crank arms, installation bolts
mirandabikestore.com
Waynemarlow
E*POWAH Master
Been running my M600 on 52 volts without a problem until yesterday where the Err 07 ( over voltage ) popped up on first connection, didn't seem to stop the engine and the motor just carried on as usual. The float fully charged voltage is just under 59 volts and I had simply unplugged the charger and fitted the battery, so the voltage would have been at its absolute peak.
Not found any really downsides to 52 volts as yet and with the shorter cranks the motor is really sweet to the point that I had an hour on a brand new Bosch Gen 4 motor equiped Focus and couldn't wait to get back on mine. Yes the Bosch is better at detecting torque inputs off the pedals, but it doesn't seem to want run into the higher cadence levels I can get with the 52 volt M600 and is somewhat noisier. From riding alongside the Bosch I would guess max power levels are not unsimilar.
Not found any really downsides to 52 volts as yet and with the shorter cranks the motor is really sweet to the point that I had an hour on a brand new Bosch Gen 4 motor equiped Focus and couldn't wait to get back on mine. Yes the Bosch is better at detecting torque inputs off the pedals, but it doesn't seem to want run into the higher cadence levels I can get with the 52 volt M600 and is somewhat noisier. From riding alongside the Bosch I would guess max power levels are not unsimilar.
That would be great! Wrong spline in the pic though - you have a set coming?For all that are looking for a shorter crankset, this new Miranda Delta crank is available on Miranda online shop in 150 mm length. Other length are in Production and will be added soon.
Delta LS Cranks 150 Q:16 RF Baf Cold-forged aluminium alloy Standard (Black) for E-BIKE
What's included: Right and left crank arms, installation bolts
thaeber
Well-known member
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