Well i have to say i would prefer thinner tyres but the bike is built around either 29er wheels or 2.8 tyres on 650b rims. If i run smaller (thinner) tyres on the 650b rims it lowers the bottom bracket too much (for me)
What tyres? The Ultimate Tyre Thread
- Thread starter Rob Rides EMTB
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- magic mary tyres vigilante
Minions weren't designed to be bigger than 2.5 and in many ways making them bigger volume actually detracts from some of both the DHR and DHFs strongest quallities and intentionally designed handling traits.
Fair enough. I'm the opposite. I've been intentionally lowering a lot of my bikes for years.
2.8s are great for some conditions, such as
I've been riding a bit on newly built a local DH track lately, and 2.8s were not great at all. The 2.8 has it's uses, it comes down to how/where you ride. It seems a few manufacturers are going from 2.8 to 2.6 on their bikes for 2019. Cannondale Moterra does, and increases fork travel by 10mm. And a few are swapping to 29" up front while keeping the 2.8 on the rear.
I've been riding a bit on newly built a local DH track lately, and 2.8s were not great at all. The 2.8 has it's uses, it comes down to how/where you ride. It seems a few manufacturers are going from 2.8 to 2.6 on their bikes for 2019. Cannondale Moterra does, and increases fork travel by 10mm. And a few are swapping to 29" up front while keeping the 2.8 on the rear.
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Tim29
Well-known member
What’s wrong with these tire makers.
I just spent 126. Is dollars on a Hans Dampf 2.6x29.
On a 28mm rim it’s narrower then the minion DHF 2.5.
I got a 2.6 as i wanted a bigger tire then the 2.5 i had.
The dhf ensures 2.38 on case, 2.5 widest knobs.
Hans Dampf measures 2.35 case and 2.49 on widest knobs.
Hay tire people. They make this really cool tool called digital calipers. Even a trained monkey can use.
Really gets old spending huge money of tires and they don’t measure even close to there size.
Why don’t you as clowns just put 29x2.? At least then we know where guessing what fricken size we gonna get!!
I just spent 126. Is dollars on a Hans Dampf 2.6x29.
On a 28mm rim it’s narrower then the minion DHF 2.5.
I got a 2.6 as i wanted a bigger tire then the 2.5 i had.
The dhf ensures 2.38 on case, 2.5 widest knobs.
Hans Dampf measures 2.35 case and 2.49 on widest knobs.
Hay tire people. They make this really cool tool called digital calipers. Even a trained monkey can use.
Really gets old spending huge money of tires and they don’t measure even close to there size.
Why don’t you as clowns just put 29x2.? At least then we know where guessing what fricken size we gonna get!!
Theoretical quiz time. (We all know how you like a quiz Tim)
Gullible mountain bicycle enthusiasts everywhere are going wild for 2.6 tyres as they're on trend.
if you were a tyre manufacturer who realised this would you
A. spend 12-18 months re-designing, prototyping and testing a tyre with the same tread patern as one you already produce only one tenth of an inch wider in the hope the trend is a keeper.
B. change the writing on your current tyre moulds/packaging
Gullible mountain bicycle enthusiasts everywhere are going wild for 2.6 tyres as they're on trend.
if you were a tyre manufacturer who realised this would you
A. spend 12-18 months re-designing, prototyping and testing a tyre with the same tread patern as one you already produce only one tenth of an inch wider in the hope the trend is a keeper.
B. change the writing on your current tyre moulds/packaging
Tons
First rode 2.6, 2.7, 2.8, 3.0 around 1997-2000. and rode them all loads. ridden most of the current trendy sizes at some point and have tried more tyres than most as I ride pretty much everyone I meet/ride with's bike each time we stop and they faff about as most mtbers do. If we ever meet for a ride I'll probably have ridden your bike by the time you've got your car locked. If I think your tyres and pressures aren't for me don't take it personally.
FWIW I wasn't actually slagging off 2.6 tyres in my previous post, Just making a little joke remark about the gullibility of the cycling consumer
Whooooooooooshhhh...
I keep forgetting cyclists are more territiorial and touchy about the size of their tyres than their current partners ex's ****
Sorry.
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Tim29
Well-known member
Roflmfao.
I’m not one to trend, i liked the 2.5 but it wasn’t wide enough for mammoth kitty litter excuse of dirt. So i was looking for something between my 29x2.5 DHF and my 27.5x2.8 MM!
The 2.8 floats great and grips good but to slow in the feature part of the course, so thought i try 2.6 Well shit dam my 2.6 turned out to be a 2.4
As for the trends. Hate trendy shit.
I would build a mold spacer and see if the 2.6 bridges the gap. I would also lol at the fact there over millions bikes sold per year, meaning i could def sell enough of those 2.6 tires to pay for the R&D time. After all people are still buying 3.0 ballon wobblers!!
Tim29
Well-known member
Fortunately I’m pretty impressed with the predictable handling of the hans Dampf. I’ve never ran it before. It’s faster then the 2.5 DHF, i also find it a little more predictable. It has a slight fade before it lets go, the DHF doesn’t, it seems to be good and then gone! Not much if any warning 
And if you said it like that, I wouldn't. Whenever you mention Plus tyres it's as an absolute, not an opinion.
I wouldn't say it like that Dom. I'd be far more blunt, but in person from my manner you'd get that it's not really important and I'm not threatening you in the slightest by saying it 
Alistair Staley
Member
He’s still at it isn’t he?
As much as im liking the 2.8 butchers in techy dh and old school trails, Im finding them sluggish to change direction/transition on machine built trails, fast linking hardback clay berms.
I keep thinking i just need more body english to push the bike around, though after getting back on my acoustic ride with 2.35 tyres and liking the way it handles better, and reading here about people riding ebikes on 2.3-2.6 tyres im interested to try something new.
So, without buying a new wheel set, on the 40mm roval rims Im guessing I can go only down to 2.6 tyres and maybe even 2.5?
Probably back in pedal strike territory which is a bum as enjoying that I can pedal through rocks now after having shorter cranks for the last yr, though it looks like you can buy shorter cranks now not like when I had to grind and shape my 165 ones.
I keep thinking i just need more body english to push the bike around, though after getting back on my acoustic ride with 2.35 tyres and liking the way it handles better, and reading here about people riding ebikes on 2.3-2.6 tyres im interested to try something new.
So, without buying a new wheel set, on the 40mm roval rims Im guessing I can go only down to 2.6 tyres and maybe even 2.5?
Probably back in pedal strike territory which is a bum as enjoying that I can pedal through rocks now after having shorter cranks for the last yr, though it looks like you can buy shorter cranks now not like when I had to grind and shape my 165 ones.
Tim29
Well-known member
I found the butcher 27.5x2.8 grid casing to be very slow and unpredictable on most dry surfaces.
I took it off after about 60 miles. Replaced it with adex, 2.8 magic Mary, it didn’t roll any faster but sure was more predictable and works well on every type of dirt and mud
I took it off after about 60 miles. Replaced it with adex, 2.8 magic Mary, it didn’t roll any faster but sure was more predictable and works well on every type of dirt and mud
Just got the new Butcher BLCK DMND in today at the shop and mounted up on my Kenevo. 250g more weight per tire! I’ll try them out Thursday morning.
Tim29
Well-known member
250g more then the butcher grid?
Well Butcher Grid seems to average 990g to 1050g per tire. The tire I took off was 1080g and the new one weighed 1230g. I don’t know if the compound is any different from the stand Butcher Grid. But it seemed way grippier doing parking lot cutties.
Tim29
Well-known member
I only run snake skin side wall up front. Never tried the butcher on the rear. I ran the slaughter rear butcher front. In grid case. They held up well for sure. Just wish front was little more predictable
Not every tire works the same for every rider. Butcher feels like it’s on rails for me and I haven’t had the same success with Schwalbe.
To me there is nothing worse than finding something that works and then someone makes a recommendation that doesn’t work out. Mostly telling someone that you don’t like something they love and it makes them feel bad. That really sucks for me.
Most of the people on Pinkbike seem to revel in it.
Tim29
Well-known member
That’s why i called out the dirt i have issues with it in. Also stated I’ve never used oneon the rear. I have a lot of dampening in my forks, more then double what comes in any fork on the market as i prefer my forks to work more linear then the endustry standards of using tokens to hold your fork up, or keep it from bottoming i also find that wide block knobs on hard surface with loose pee gravel on top cause the tire to roll on the top of the knob.
When i was in Scotland i found my tires i enjoy here didn’t work so goodover there as the ground had much more moisture in it.
I also really enjoyed my slaughter on rear until it rained and the ground got muddy. We have gone 3 months without a drop of rain. The dirt i ride on most is red clay base with granite and loose gravel, but by mid Summer the red clay gets powdery on top and you need a soft knob with med to small spacing to be consistent. My local bike shop i work with is a specialized dealer and most the guys in there swore by the butcher as well, till summer comes and most of them have gone to magic Mary for hard hot summer months.
So i really don’t feel you should take it to personal i don’t like the butcher. However i am very interested in trying the new hillbilly.
When i was in Scotland i found my tires i enjoy here didn’t work so goodover there as the ground had much more moisture in it.
I also really enjoyed my slaughter on rear until it rained and the ground got muddy. We have gone 3 months without a drop of rain. The dirt i ride on most is red clay base with granite and loose gravel, but by mid Summer the red clay gets powdery on top and you need a soft knob with med to small spacing to be consistent. My local bike shop i work with is a specialized dealer and most the guys in there swore by the butcher as well, till summer comes and most of them have gone to magic Mary for hard hot summer months.
So i really don’t feel you should take it to personal i don’t like the butcher. However i am very interested in trying the new hillbilly.
I have great deal of respect for you. Your suspension knowledge is awesome. I made a suggestion that you could use that knowledge to help some of the other members get more out of their suspension set ups, instead of holding it over their heads that they didn’t know anything. You responded with a quiz. I was again impressed with your knowledge.
You don’t like the Butcher tire. I didn’t take it personal at all. It doesn’t work for you, it won’t work for everybody. Maybe it just works for me. It works for me and maybe something will come along that works better. That will be an awesome day. I like when things work better.
If you had understood the point I was trying to make as @Stumpy had, you wouldn’t have felt it necessary to make that comment. Sorry if I pissed you off or offended you.
But since you wish to go there, let’s start with your first couple of statements.
“That’s why i called out the dirt i have issues with it in. Also stated I’ve never used oneon the rear. I have a lot of dampening in my forks, more then double what comes in any fork on the market as i prefer my forks to work more linear then the endustry standards of using tokens to hold your fork up, or keep it from bottoming i also find that wide block knobs on hard surface with loose pee gravel on top cause the tire to roll on the top of the knob.”
I know my grammar isn’t exactly scholarly, but let me help you out a bit, to make this a little easier to understand.
That’s why I described the conditions that give me issues with that tire. I also stated that never used one on my rear wheel. I have a lot of damping (not dampening. Surely the suspension master would know this) in my fork setup, more than (then is a time) double what comes stock on every fork on the market (did you check every fork on the market?) I prefer my forks to work more linear than (then is a time) the industry standard (Really? No one can agree on a bottom bracket standard or even a headset standard, but all of the fork makers agreed on tokens? Even the fork makers that don’t use them?) of using tokens to hold your fork up, or keep it from bottoming. In my experience, wide block knobs on a hard surface with loose pee gravel on top can cause the tire to roll on the top of the knob.
“I also really enjoyed my slaughter on rear until it rained and the ground got muddy.”
Must have been all that double dampening from your fork
Quick tyre review,
Found the limits of the butchers quite quick on my local trails, issues I have faced with the butchers, they would sit on top of the dirt and often skate around, which has caused 3 or 4 crashes due to washing out the front, i can often feel the sidewalls flex alot into hard turns, very low braking ability which has caused several sketchy moments when it gets steep and trying to get my speed under control.
I have since fitted 2 Magic Mary DH Wirebead 2.6 tyres, and it has completely transformed the bike, I can run lower pressures without the undesired tyre flex I experienced with the butchers, there is a lot more grip under braking helping me get more control of the bike, i feel part of it rather than just been along for the ride. I can push the bike hard into corners and the front digs in and sends me in the right direction, very confidence inspiring and predictable tyres.
my findings are based on what i ride, steep, rutted, loamy, off-piste trails, it might have been different if I was riding more bike park/trail centre places, which I think the butchers are most likely more suited towards.
Found the limits of the butchers quite quick on my local trails, issues I have faced with the butchers, they would sit on top of the dirt and often skate around, which has caused 3 or 4 crashes due to washing out the front, i can often feel the sidewalls flex alot into hard turns, very low braking ability which has caused several sketchy moments when it gets steep and trying to get my speed under control.
I have since fitted 2 Magic Mary DH Wirebead 2.6 tyres, and it has completely transformed the bike, I can run lower pressures without the undesired tyre flex I experienced with the butchers, there is a lot more grip under braking helping me get more control of the bike, i feel part of it rather than just been along for the ride. I can push the bike hard into corners and the front digs in and sends me in the right direction, very confidence inspiring and predictable tyres.
my findings are based on what i ride, steep, rutted, loamy, off-piste trails, it might have been different if I was riding more bike park/trail centre places, which I think the butchers are most likely more suited towards.
What width were your butchers , I met a guy at an enduro with a kinevo who was saying the same , and had fitted Mary’s in 2.6 , but he thought a lot of the problem was 2.8 was too wide , although I’ve not spoken anyone who doesn’t rate the Mary as thier best gripping tyre for most conditions
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they was the stock 2.8s that came with the bike dude. On my trail bike on my local trails i would run a Dirty Dan (Spike) and mary on the rear both in SG, so im no stranger to the extra support and grip from that type of tyre.
i also think they haven't made a sidewall with enough support yet in 2.8, bring on the Eddys to test, that will be interesting to see how they perform in the 2.8 in the supergravity carcass, like the idea of the 2.6 mary on the rear with a 2.8 eddy on front especially if the knobs are 20% larger than the mary, it will bring me closer to my old trail bike setup. Even though i am more than happy with the mary on the front I am always open to try new things.
@Tucker Why don't you just run the same set-up you had on your trail bike? (Yeah, I realise this would mean lacing narrower rims to your wheels and understand if you think it's too much hassle/cost)
There's absolutely no reason an E-bike needs anything different tyre wise than a similar travel/geometry non-ebike ridden on the same trails (other than possibly 1 or 2psi more pressure)
Swapping to the same (2.5/2.3 DHF/SS exo) tyres I run on my Enduro bike absolutely transformed my Ebike's handling. And made the bike way more nimble, playful and more fun to ride
There's absolutely no reason an E-bike needs anything different tyre wise than a similar travel/geometry non-ebike ridden on the same trails (other than possibly 1 or 2psi more pressure)
Swapping to the same (2.5/2.3 DHF/SS exo) tyres I run on my Enduro bike absolutely transformed my Ebike's handling. And made the bike way more nimble, playful and more fun to ride
interesting, i did consider trying my trail bike tyres on the E, but settled for the 2.6 DH tyres, like the bigger tyre and benefits it can provide (bigger surface area, more traction, more impact absorption etc), providing you get the right tyre, and after lacing the 2.6 dh tyres they are perfect for me. The reason i haven't tried the 2.6 before was i had to bike up unassisted so compromises had to be made, but obviously now with the KEN i can run bigger tyres as drag and extra weight isn't an issue like before.
Unlike a lot of riders, massive straight line grip is not something that I ever really crave, and when leant over properly a 2.35 or 2.5 minion (DHF, DHR or SS) at decently supportive pressures give me plenty cornering grip. One thing I think you may be missing, When using a big heavy draggy tyre all that extra weight and drag is way less of a problem climbing and at speeds of under 15mph on an Ebike than a non Ebike but all that extra drag still creates a far less nimble, less maneouverable bike. th difference in acceleration is pretty huge too, especially if accelerating past the 15mph assist cut off.
my Vitus came with a 35mm rim on the rear (and much more to my taste 30mm front) and I'd much rather the rear was 30mm too. it's not the end of the world and a 2.3 SS still works fine at that width so not really worth spending £50 and an hour of my time to switch out. If it had come with 40mm rims they would probably have been the first thing I'd have switched out along with the tyres (and tubeless)
Do your trail bike wheels have the same axle standards as your Ebike? might be worth switching complete wheels to see what you think.
The Kenevo is a much heavier bike than the Vitus and I'm not sure what sort of weight the wheelset is or how much difference losing tyre/rim weight will make to one but if you have the parts anyway I'd say it's worth trying. I'm like that though.
my Vitus came with a 35mm rim on the rear (and much more to my taste 30mm front) and I'd much rather the rear was 30mm too. it's not the end of the world and a 2.3 SS still works fine at that width so not really worth spending £50 and an hour of my time to switch out. If it had come with 40mm rims they would probably have been the first thing I'd have switched out along with the tyres (and tubeless)
Do your trail bike wheels have the same axle standards as your Ebike? might be worth switching complete wheels to see what you think.
The Kenevo is a much heavier bike than the Vitus and I'm not sure what sort of weight the wheelset is or how much difference losing tyre/rim weight will make to one but if you have the parts anyway I'd say it's worth trying. I'm like that though.
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