Article Testing the new Shimano EP8 motor

[HeatproofGenie]

As for the test on range, do one in Boost and one in Trail. Again people don't ride an entire ride in boost unless they are short on time, going to do a short ride only or have some much battery capacity it doesn't matter. As for the latter that's not the case with any 504wh Shimano system so what I'd like to see is if in a real world ride the increased battery capacity and reduced drag of the EP8 and 630wh battery lead to significantly greater range and vertical climbed.

 

[TheBikePilot]

I've got the bosch motor and the rattle is such a non issue, I cant believe the fuss being made about it. yes you can hear it, but its not intrusive at all, especially with all the other noises that are going on when you're flying down a rocky descent.

The Shimano rattle is more pronounced on the flat and is more of an annoyance. I could live with the Bosch rattle, not so much the Shimano.

However, some may not feel it too bad.

 

[Mteam]

The Shimano rattle is more pronounced on the flat and is more of an annoyance. I could live with the Bosch rattle, not so much the Shimano.

However, some may not feel it too bad.

Yeah fair enough, if the ep8 rattle is loads worse/louder/constant than the bosch then I can see it being a problem.

 

[Dirtnvert]

Not true. Bike manufactures already had it. They didn’t start back tracking until the customer started freaking out about the loud rattle. Commencal was locked and loaded to start shipping out bikes in a few weeks, now who knows how long it will take.

Its really too bad. I wish it wasnt true. I like a lot about shimano parts over the years and commencals new bikes are pretty amazing and at the forefront for geo. Hope they get it together

 

[Eddy Current]

As an owner of a Rocky Mountain and his coffe grinder slider ... at first it was really annoying ... now after many time, is like you don’t heard it no more. Brain can do some miracles.

 

[jooles]

I'm very surprised if Shimano, during testing didn't pick up on the clunking. It's a bit obvious from the GoPro footage.

Wonder if it's another issue ?

 

[stiv674]

There's a comment about a mount failure in the Commencal forum...

 

[STATO]

This might help.

View attachment 39531
...

Thanks for sharing those, found some info on Shimano and other places but not that.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Have you ever ridden alongside the Bosch, its a constant chain slap type of sound as soon as you back off and annoys me even though I'm not riding the bike, its his second engine and much worse than the first before it failed, he's reluctant to back it as its the second engine but if were mine it would have gone back long ago.

Now if the Shimano is even louder then that says a lot, not for me I'm afraid.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

So an update:

Ridden another brand today with the EP8 (brief ride). Has the exact same clattering noise BUT not quite as pronounced as the Merida.

I also did the drop test of the back tyre on the floor on another 3 brands bikes and the noise is replicated on all of them.

BUT interestingly, out of the 13 test riders here I’ve not heard anyone mention the noise on their own test bikes after they’ve finished their first ride.

Im also not going to mention it at all to anyone over the next couple of days (I don’t want to lead anyone to hear it) . I’ll let you know if anyone else notices it.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Just wanted to add to the above - it’s not some lame flex that I have some superior testing procedure to anyone else. I am maybe just more susceptible to noises than some other folks.

I remember the first ride on the Bosch Gen4 last year. I heard it in immediately on a downhill trail section. My fellow bike Mag tester friend heard nothing. We all have different tolerances to these noises.

 

[MattyB]

So an update:

Ridden another brand today with the EP8 (brief ride). Has the exact same clattering noise BUT not quite as pronounced as the Merida.

I also did the drop test of the back tyre on the floor on another 3 brands bikes and the noise is replicated on all of them.

BUT interestingly, out of the 13 test riders here I’ve not heard anyone mention the noise on their own test bikes after they’ve finished their first ride.

Im also not going to mention it at all to anyone over the next couple of days (I don’t want to lead anyone to hear it) . I’ll let you know if anyone else notices it.

If that is the case it seems unlikely the rattle alone is the cause of the recall; it also explains why Shimano got to this stage without it being flagged as a "no-go". The videos certainly make it sound worse than the Bosch, but I know the mic pickup can be unrepresentative. The plot thickens...

 

[Zimmerframe]

We all have different tolerances to these noises.

My Mrs would drive you mad ...

 

[R120]

Personally on the Bosch bikes I have ridden the rattle doesn't bother me, in fact unless I deliberately listed for it, then it just blends in with the rest of the noises going on.

However if you spent a lot of time on an original Levo then any of the new motors is going to sound loud.

 

[Mteam]

Personally on the Bosch bikes I have ridden the rattle doesn't bother me, in fact unless I deliberately listed for it, then it just blends in with the rest of the noises going on.

However if you spent a lot of time on an original Levo then any of the new motors is going to sound loud.

Yep the noise from the bosch on my orbea is a total non issue,

I don't think we should listen to noises on a video and decide its a problem, the mic picks some noises up easier than others, and ends up making certain frequencies louder than others. You need to ride the bike and decide for yourself whether it's an issue to your ears.

 

[highpeakrider]

Ive never heard any rattles or noise from my new Bosch powered Whyte.

 

[remosito]

No matter how Shimano initially responded to the noise issue... compromise is a compromise. It only takes one really bad "feature" to derail a product, no matter how many good "features" the new product has. Judging from the real-world reactions so far I've seen from us paying customers, the fact that the new motor has this noise is already a problem.

"I really like a noisy bike!" ... said no one ever LOL

and if they'd left the drag in the ones which are now happy because less drag would be howling....

I really like this bike with crazy ass drag...said no one ever LOL

you can't please everybody.

 

[steve_sordy]

My hearing is OK, functional, but nowhere near as good as it used to be. When my grandson is in front of me he can hear bikes behind me when I hear nothing. So I may be OK with the Bosch and maybe OK with the EP8, I am certainly OK with the e8000!

But I do know that my hearing difficulty is frequency based, ie. mostly my hearing is OK, but certain frequencies are significantly down. For example, my wife is convinced I don't listen to her, but in fact it that I just don't hear her!

 

[remosito]

My hearing is OK, functional, but nowhere near as good as it used to be. When my grandson is in front of me he can hear bikes behind me when I hear nothing. So I may be OK with the Bosch and maybe OK with the EP8, I am certainly OK with the e8000!

But I do know that my hearing difficulty is frequency based, ie. mostly my hearing is OK, but certain frequencies are significantly down. For example, my wife is convinced I don't listen to her, but in fact it that I just don't hear her!

Age does have it's upsides

Mine ain't what it used to be either. Worst though is trying to follow conversations in very noisy environments with lots of other people talking though.... Hearing motor noises less is quite the boon though...

Always make an extra ruckus if hikers I am about to overtake look like they are "not quite 20 anymore"... Not only are chances they ain't hearing me higher. They seem to get bigger frights too when surprised...

 

[Dirtnvert]

Maybe i should think about a haibike. My eyesight is fading

 

[raine]

and if they'd left the drag in the ones which are now happy because less drag would be howling....

I really like this bike with crazy ass drag...said no one ever LOL

you can't please everybody.

Well, it's no secret that E-8000 has drag. If the new EP8 had the same or less drag, IMO that would be fine. But the E-8000 does not randomly clunk like it's broken, yet from what we've seen so far the new EP8 apparently does. IMO That's not fine - otherwise, none of us would be discussing it right now. This is supposed to be a "new and improved" motor, and by the numbers it is - but with the added caveat of some new noise that the user has no control over (unlike say, being able to reduce chain slap with a chainstay protector or eliminating cable housing tapping with some zip ties).

Sure this clunk might not bother some people, that's perfectly fine. But it doesn't erase the fact that it's there, and comparing it to Bosch is irrelevant. Either way, hopefully Shimano gets it sorted out.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Official statement from Shimano on motor delay:

 

[raine]

Thank you @Rob Rides EMTB for keeping us in the loop with actual facts.

 

[RickBullotta]

Official statement from Shimano on motor delay:

FYI, here's the section of the ISO bicycle testing standard this refers to. Makes me wonder if the engineers may have been a bit aggressive in weight reduction? Who knows.

 

[remosito]

Well, it's no secret that E-8000 has drag. If the new EP8 had the same or less drag, IMO that would be fine. But the E-8000 does not randomly clunk like it's broken, yet from what we've seen so far the new EP8 apparently does. IMO That's not fine - otherwise, none of us would be discussing it right now. This is supposed to be a "new and improved" motor, and by the numbers it is - but with the added caveat of some new noise that the user has no control over (unlike say, being able to reduce chain slap with a chainstay protector or eliminating cable housing tapping with some zip ties).

Sure this clunk might not bother some people, that's perfectly fine. But it doesn't erase the fact that it's there, and comparing it to Bosch is irrelevant. Either way, hopefully Shimano gets it sorted out.

You do know the EP8 has much reduced drag and that's most likely the reason for the clunking? And is the "compromise" Shimano has been saying they had to make.

So it still is a new and improved motor. Especially for folks who care more about drag and efficiency.

 

[raine]

You do know the EP8 has much reduced drag and that's most likely the reason for the clunking? And is the "compromise" Shimano has been saying they had to make.

So it still is a new and improved motor. Especially for folks who care more about drag and efficiency.

Yes I do - re-read my comment.

 

[Gary]

take the chain off an E8000 and spin the cranks forwards with the motor switched off. you'll find motor the drag is actually already minimal.

 

[MrBrownstone]

Welp just got in from a ride on my e8000 equipped BMC and man o man what a brilliant motor after all these hard miles. Trail mode is just brilliant, intuitive, seamless.

 

[Al Boneta]

Yup. But individual bike manufacturers could offer kits to do so. Might require different cover, adapter for the wiring harness, etc...

They wouldn’t want to canibalise new bike sales

 

[KeithR]

Ur forgetting specialized. They give complimentary blow jobs whilst doing routine motor changes. So yeah they care a lot

There you go then - you know what to do: buy a Specialized, break it, and then you might finally get somebody to pay some attention to your little Special Place...