Kenevo Gen1 Official 2018/2019 Kenevo thread

[Oggym17]

Has anyone put a Mudhugger Front shorty on the rear of a Kenevo? (Asking for a friend ??)

If so, does it fit ok or move about? I’ve seen them on Levos, but the Levo has a bar across to zip tie the mudguard too. The Kenevo doesn’t have the bar and I wondered if it would just keep sliding down.

Thought it might protect the frame/bearings in winter.

 

[Mission MTB]

Oh my ?? View attachment 120

HELL YEAH!

 

[Botts101]

Glad you are on here to tell me what I like and don’t like or how I feel.
If you like it terrific. Lots of my customers like it.
I don’t like it because I just don’t like the way it feels.
It doesn’t make you wrong or me right. But not liking it doesn’t make me wrong either.

The biggest thing I like about the Levo is that it feels like a mountain bike when I ride it. I am not looking down at my handlebars and seeing a display and a birds nest of wires. The bike handles like the Stumpjumper it was based on. I don’t get that when I compare a Giant Full-E to a Giant Trance. The handling is weird on the Full-E.

I still sell plenty of other EMtbs in my shop.

My favorite is a bike I don’t even sell. Am I going to ride I bike I don’t sell? No it’s not in my best interest to do so.

Exactly - I want an ebike which looks like a regular bike (not some ugly bulky thing - ie 99% of the ebikes on the market) Also - the Kenevo on Turbo is CRAZY power/plenty....it's not even peddling...so if you need more power than this just get a moto. Having said that, to each their own...

 

[Mcharza]

Rode yesterday. Only on trails with huge rock gardens and roots and with eco mode. 2 hours, 20 km and ascent 280 m. Eats my battery 35%

 

[Donnie797]

Has anyone put a Mudhugger Front shorty on the rear of a Kenevo? (Asking for a friend ??)

If so, does it fit ok or move about? I’ve seen them on Levos, but the Levo has a bar across to zip tie the mudguard too. The Kenevo doesn’t have the bar and I wondered if it would just keep sliding down.

Thought it might protect the frame/bearings in winter.

I've tried (with a mudhugger front race) but wasn't pleased with it. The mudhugger came to close to the tyre and i had an issue with the suspension - when compressed, the mudhugger touched the motor housing. This is because the "front race" mudhugger is a long version - it might work better with the short. I think i will give it another try and cut it, so i also can get more space between the tyre and the mudhugger.

I had another cheap mudguard lying around so i used that instead, but i'm also not so happy with it. First, the looks. Second - there's too much space left on the bottom, it helps a good bit, but still allows the dirt to get into that sneaky hole in the motor housing. The stability is oookay... it's not a super tight installation and it can move a bit, but that's not that bad.

 

[Mambat]

Silicone spray here as well, on all dampers every 3-4 rides.


The 57mm stroke spring for the Enduro fits well and goes up to 640lbs.- and the missing 6mm can easily be adjusted with the coil-plate.

Will this not shorten the travel of the shock? You will no longer have 180mm?

 

[Donnie797]

Will this not shorten the travel of the shock? You will no longer have 180mm?

I can't say 100%, maybe somebody here is a coil shock pro? But from my understanding adjusting the coil plate is not reducing the travel of the shock, it's just changing the preload on the spring. You theoretically could have a 180mm travel shock with a 2cm long spring, that would just make no sense. The travel of the shock is not directly related to the spring length - it would have still the same travel if you remove the spring completely. The spring just makes riding fun

 

[idahoskiguy]

Donnie797 is mostly correct......however if the preload on the spring shortens the spring too much it will fully compress under load and a fully compressed spring will limit the shock travel. This is why I uprated the spring on my Kenevo XL from a 504 lb spring to a 571 lb spring, no more bottoming and fewer pedal strikes with the heavier spring but I weigh 100 kg with gear.

 

[JonasH]

Rim ding on Roval wheels.
I have had trouble with rim dings on the rear wheel, and are wondering if any other members had the same issue on their Kenevo? I’m 75 Kg with gear and run 20 PSI in the original Butcher tires. I have tried Huck Norris and DYI inserts. Problem seems to occur when the tire lets out air when the going gets a bit wild and then the damage comes. I have straighten out the rim edge about 5 times already and I’m getting frustrated. Have anyone testet the DT Swiss Hybrid series? Wondering if they are better?

​

 

[Tucker]

Rim ding on Roval wheels.
I have had trouble with rim dings on the rear wheel, and are wondering if any other members had the same issue on their Kenevo? I’m 75 Kg with gear and run 20 PSI in the original Butcher tires. I have tried Huck Norris and DYI inserts. Problem seems to occur when the tire lets out air when the going gets a bit wild and then the damage comes. I have straighten out the rim edge about 5 times already and I’m getting frustrated. Have anyone testet the DT Swiss Hybrid series? Wondering if they are better?

if your running the standard butchers with piss poor sidewalls I am not surprised, I had the same issue dude, for more aggressive riding and lower pressures you need a more adequate tyre, Magic Mary 2.6 DH SG is what I use, very stiff side walls and can handle the lower pressures very well with great rim protection. on offer at the mo at CRC

 

[Donnie797]

if your running the standard butchers with piss poor sidewalls I am not surprised, I had the same issue dude, for more aggressive riding and lower pressures you need a more adequate tyre, Magic Mary 2.6 DH SG is what I use, very stiff side walls and can handle the lower pressures very well with great rim protection. on offer at the mo at CRC

That would be my choice as well - or the new Schwalbe "Eddy Current" made for e-mtbs.
I would definitely first try a tyre with a more stable sidewall before switching the rim. A Magic Mary combined with an additional tyre insert should be amazingly tough. The roval rims itself are not that bad from what i've heard?

 

[JonasH]

Yes, i hear you I'm just assesing if i'm going to wait for Eddy Current or go for MM. I have MM soft, SS on my manual bike and i'm super happy with that. Have been considering to buy the MM in 2,8 but then as i understand you, the sidewalls in SS will pretty mutch give me the same rim ding effect as the butchers?
Anyone know when the Eddy Current will be available?

 

[JonasH]

if your running the standard butchers with piss poor sidewalls I am not surprised, I had the same issue dude, for more aggressive riding and lower pressures you need a more adequate tyre, Magic Mary 2.6 DH SG is what I use, very stiff side walls and can handle the lower pressures very well with great rim protection. on offer at the mo at CRC

This one? Schwalbe Magic Mary Addix Wire Bead MTB Tyre - DH | Chain Reaction Cycles

 

[Tucker]

@JonasH yer mate that's the one, great tyres for aggressive riding

 

[Tucker]

Yes, i hear you I'm just assesing if i'm going to wait for Eddy Current or go for MM. I have MM soft, SS on my manual bike and i'm super happy with that. Have been considering to buy the MM in 2,8 but then as i understand you, the sidewalls in SS will pretty mutch give me the same rim ding effect as the butchers?
Anyone know when the Eddy Current will be available?

think the eddy is coming sometime in September, but no official date yet, you will be very happy with the MM in 2.6 dh carcass

 

[Donnie797]

This one? Schwalbe Magic Mary Addix Wire Bead MTB Tyre - DH | Chain Reaction Cycles

Yes, the DH offers the best protection and because it's the ultra soft compound it has the best grip as well - but the durability (on the rear wheel) will not be the best. Check out this Schwalbe MM chart:

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Yes, the DH offers the best protection and because it's the ultra soft compound it has the best grip as well - but the durability (on the rear wheel) will not be the best. Check out this Schwalbe MM chart:
View attachment 4098

I think at £36 a tyre its not too much bother to replace if the wear rate is higher than others.

 

[DEADMEAT]

Rim ding on Roval wheels.
I have had trouble with rim dings on the rear wheel, and are wondering if any other members had the same issue on their Kenevo? I’m 75 Kg with gear and run 20 PSI in the original Butcher tires. I have tried Huck Norris and DYI inserts. Problem seems to occur when the tire lets out air when the going gets a bit wild and then the damage comes. I have straighten out the rim edge about 5 times already and I’m getting frustrated. Have anyone testet the DT Swiss Hybrid series? Wondering if they are better?

My very first ride on my Kenevo, about 7 minutes in, BOOM! hit a step, ripped a hole in the tyre and dented the rim really badly...

This led me to my first conclusion, do not use folding tyres on an e-bike. Why? because if you don't have a spare tube with you, or you've already used it, you're carrying a very heavy bike all the way home! Folding tyres are bullshit, and when they go flat they fall off, so unless you want your bare rim scraping along the floor the whole way home you have to carry it, and believe me that sucks.

Second conclusion after fixing that and getting on with the ride (and obviously subsequent rides) is that the Butchers are just plain scary. The tread profile is awful, the side knobs are like literally on the sidewall of the bloody tyre with a mahoosive gap between them and the centre knobs, transitioning between them is sketchy as, i've heard the same complaint levelled at the old High Roller.
It's just my opinion but there is just not enough sidewall support for what is a very large tyre to be run at appropriate pressures for such a tyre to be effective at anything but pootling pace, tyre squirm anyone? I had to pump them up so much i might as well use smaller tyres, as they are shorter and less leverage is applied to the sidewalls.
As suggested by many people here, get the Schwalbe 2.6 MM's WIRE BEAD. Not only do they offer massively more protection, and stay on the bloody wheel if you flat, but are the number one performance upgrade you can make, transforms the bike, might be the best tyre i've ever ridden in fact... Totally predictable lean characteristics, tons of grip and no squirming around

Third conclusion, The rims are just weak and i'm still weighing up what options there actually are.
I've since fitted Hope Tech DH wheels, and they're great, i guess, but are much, much too heavy, so i'm thinking maybe heavy duty carbon rims mated to relatively lightweight hubs might be the answer but £$£$£$!!!

 

[Donnie797]

I think at £36 a tyre its not too much bother to replace if the wear rate is higher than others.

That's true, but the protection is very close together on the soft and ultra soft, the grip as well - the difference isn't huge, but surely depends on the riding style. For pro's or really agressive riders, i would definitely vote for maximum grip (ultra soft compound), not thinking twice about durability.

My own experience with the ultra soft tyres on the rear (on my non-e bike) is, that they wear out pretty fast, but that's also because i'm 100kg - a tyre will last much longer for lighter riders (a friend of mine has 55kg and rides his soft racing ralph tyres for years).

The following is the chart of the Eddy Current - grip & protection looks fine to me and the durability should be outstanding (really looking forward to them as my next set):

 

[JonasH]

My very first ride on my Kenevo, about 7 minutes in, BOOM! hit a step, ripped a hole in the tyre and dented the rim really badly...

This led me to my first conclusion, do not use folding tyres on an e-bike. Why? because if you don't have a spare tube with you, or you've already used it, you're carrying a very heavy bike all the way home! Folding tyres are bullshit, and when they go flat they fall off, so unless you want your bare rim scraping along the floor the whole way home you have to carry it, and believe me that sucks.

Second conclusion after fixing that and getting on with the ride (and obviously subsequent rides) is that the Butchers are just plain scary. The tread profile is awful, the side knobs are like literally on the sidewall of the bloody tyre with a mahoosive gap between them and the centre knobs, transitioning between them is sketchy as, i've heard the same complaint levelled at the old High Roller.
It's just my opinion but there is just not enough sidewall support for what is a very large tyre to be run at appropriate pressures for such a tyre to be effective at anything but pootling pace, tyre squirm anyone? I had to pump them up so much i might as well use smaller tyres, as they are shorter and less leverage is applied to the sidewalls.
As suggested by many people here, get the Schwalbe 2.6 MM's WIRE BEAD. Not only do they offer massively more protection, and stay on the bloody wheel if you flat, but are the number one performance upgrade you can make, transforms the bike, might be the best tyre i've ever ridden in fact... Totally predictable lean characteristics, tons of grip and no squirming around

Third conclusion, The rims are just weak and i'm still weighing up what options there actually are.
I've since fitted Hope Tech DH wheels, and they're great, i guess, but are much, much too heavy, so i'm thinking maybe heavy duty carbon rims mated to relatively lightweight hubs might be the answer but £$£$£$!!!

How wide do the Hope Tech DH wheels come in inner witdh?

 

[DEADMEAT]

How wide do the Hope Tech DH wheels come in inner witdh?

28mm. But really, those wheels, with those big MM's, it's all too heavy, look elsewhere dude honestly... My front wheel (albeit with a tube) weighs about the same as my Mrs' rear with the same tyre setup tubeless on a Crank Brothers Iodine 2, with the cassette and everything. Now i'm not recommending those wheels as i haven't had a chance to really smash them yet, though they are probably the best looking wheels you can put on a Kenevo

Look out for their new Lithium E-MTB wheelset though, 35mm inner, plain gauge spokes, much stronger and little weight penalty, could be awesome. But they charge £100 extra for an XD driver, leaving you with and making you pay for a Shimano driver you don't fucking need and no one will want, and that shit really pisses me off massively, OFFER IT AS AN EITHER/OR OPTION YOU GREEDY F**KS!!!
I'm going to wait until they're a bit more widely available, meaning cheaper deals that can offset the extra bullshit £100 for the driver i need whilst looking into other options in the meantime

 

[JonasH]

28mm. But really, those wheels, with those big MM's, it's all too heavy, look elsewhere dude honestly... My front wheel (albeit with a tube) weighs about the same as my Mrs' rear with the same tyre setup tubeless on a Crank Brothers Iodine 2, i'm not recommending those wheels as i haven't had a chance to really smash them yet, though they are probably the best looking wheels you can put on a Kenevo
Look out for their new Lithium E-MTB wheelset though, 35mm inner, plain gauge spokes, much stronger and little weight penalty, could be awesome. But they charge £100 extra for an XD driver, leaving you with and making you pay for a Shimano driver you don't fucking need and no one will want, and that shit really pisses me off massively, OFFER IT AS AN EITHER/OR OPTION YOU GREEDY F**KS!!!
I'm going to wait until they're a bit more widely available, meaning cheaper deals that can offset the extra bullshit £100 for the driver i need whilst looking into other options in the meantime

Have you looked at these? DT Swiss - Wheels Hybrid / E-Bike What's your take?

 

[DEADMEAT]

Have you looked at these? DT Swiss - Wheels Hybrid / E-Bike What's your take?

If you mean the Lithiums, i've only seen pics and specs on the internet. It's worth mentioning though that i think any problems CB had with there hub design a few years ago have been resolved, that's certainly the consensus of the more recent reports i've read online and the hubs in my Mrs' wheels seem solid. My only concern is how strong can a wheel with so few spokes actually be?

Ah, you changed the quote No i've not looked at those but i will now

 

[JonasH]

If you mean the Lithiums, i've only seen pics and specs on the internet. It's worth mentioning though that i think any problems CB had with there hub design a few years ago have been resolved, that's certainly the consensus of the more recent reports i've read online and the hubs in my Mrs' wheels seem solid. My only concern is how strong can a wheel with so few spokes actually be?

Ah, you changed the quote No i've not looked at those but i will now

Sorry, forgot to add the link

 

[DEADMEAT]

Have you looked at these? DT Swiss - Wheels Hybrid / E-Bike What's your take?

Now this is where things get interesting, because with DT you're not just talking some rims on some generic hub, hubs are important right? For me, and with the stupid amount of time i've put into thinking and reading about this, the single most beneficial attribute i could wish for in any given wheel would be a hub with instant engagement. DT are at least trying to tackle this but Onyx are the only real option here. I think even more so than on a conventional bike, instant engagement would be a massive plus on an E-Bike. I notice a much more pronounced pawl engagement 'donk' than ever on my Kenevo, which is obviously going to happen really, so i think the slightly softened but totally instant engagement of the Onyx, coupled with the smooth engagement of the Brose motor would be a match made in heaven, especially if you like the idea of silent coasting!!
I hate ratchety hubs so much i turn the pedals just to stop it happening, the trouble is the Onyx hubs are a bit heavy, and very pricey, and to offset the weight of the hub you need a lightweight rim, probably carbon = pricey again, you probably want your wheels to match, so, unnecessary, expensive matching Onyx front hub, another carbon rim, and your well over a grand, maybe two, for some wheels, which is fine, if you can afford it, which is why i haven't done that yet

I think any of those DT wheels would be great, but in a rare showing of prioritizing form over function, they're just not sexy enough to spend money on when things like the CB Lithiums are available at around the same price or much less, and instantly engaging, silent Onyx hubs even exist

One option is to just buy a 28h Onyx hub and get it laced into the stock rim, getting an instant performance benefit, then slowly build a wheelset around that, which is probably what i'm going to do, but those bloody CB wheels just look so f**king cool they interfere with my common sense circuits!

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Yes, the DH offers the best protection and because it's the ultra soft compound it has the best grip as well - but the durability (on the rear wheel) will not be the best. Check out this Schwalbe MM chart:
View attachment 4098

That's true, but the protection is very close together on the soft and ultra soft, the grip as well - the difference isn't huge, but surely depends on the riding style. For pro's or really agressive riders, i would definitely vote for maximum grip (ultra soft compound), not thinking twice about durability.

My own experience with the ultra soft tyres on the rear (on my non-e bike) is, that they wear out pretty fast, but that's also because i'm 100kg - a tyre will last much longer for lighter riders (a friend of mine has 55kg and rides his soft racing ralph tyres for years).

The following is the chart of the Eddy Current - grip & protection looks fine to me and the durability should be outstanding (really looking forward to them as my next set):
View attachment 4104

Hi @Donnie797 I was surprised how many miles I got out of my Ultrasofts but saying that I am a bit lighter than you 75kg v 100kg.

I recently had issues with the Soft versions susceptibility to cuts/slices in the terrain I ride. Also, if you are going down the Soft route I would recommend using nothing less than SG (Super Gravity) or DH (Down Hill) casings to give you the extra protection.

Not sure if you saw my recent post below. I was quite surprised with the data captured.

Kenevo and Levo stock Butcher tyres - grip questions ??? - EMTB Forums

 

[Donnie797]

Hi @Donnie797 I was surprised how many miles I got out of my Ultrasofts but saying that I am a bit lighter than you 75kg v 100kg.

I recently had issues with the Soft versions susceptibility to cuts/slices in the terrain I ride. Also, if you are going down the Soft route I would recommend using nothing less than SG (Super Gravity) or DH (Down Hill) casings to give you the extra protection.

Not sure if you saw my recent post below. I was quite surprised with the data captured.

Kenevo and Levo stock Butcher tyres - grip questions ??? - EMTB Forums

Yes, i ride the "soft" super gravity version and really like them, no single problem yet (little cuts and holes have sealed fine). And the grip is much better on our dirt than with the Butcher on the Kenevo - but i want to wear them out before changing (and hopefully the Eddy Current is available then, want to test that).

Thanks for the link, haven't seen your post yet. Very deailed analysis from what i see on the first glance but I need some more time to get through that - will comment there, thanks

 

[profgruen]

Dear all

I received my Kenevo Expert last Friday and seek your advice esp on the tyres. As I found the 2.8 butcher bad from directional stability and had a spongy impression, coming from a Haibike nduro with 2.5 minion dhf front and 2.4 minion dhr2 rear which suited well I changed to the 2.6 butchers.

On my Spec Enduro I drive mm 2.4 trailstar sg - all fine.

What shall I say?
Its fine on all trails except steep dry trails with loose stones. Both my hometrails here have such steep passages with loose stones - I ve ridden them more than hundred times with the haibike nduro and the spec enduro slow but with a flow and with grip and without problems. With the new Kenevo and the 2.6 butchers it was a nightmare (rode it two times now). I really had fear and partly problems to find enough grip and steer the direction. It feld like riding down and cant findenough and stable grip. Yes,steep, lots of loose stones and first leaves on the ground - but such a difference to my mms and minions??

Not enough with that on my way back after the trails and still app 2 miles on asphaltic roads I suddenly lost the air from the rear tyre. Nothing rto see, didnt touch anything - a miracle. I inflated the tyre again and look - it holds the air without problems. Air pressure front and rar 1.4 bar.

Never experienced such a problem and I ride since appx 20 years mtb ...

Can you please tell me if this grip problem ist mainly a problem of the tyres (i drive not tubeless by the way) what I believe or might it have osmething to do with the fork setup (pressure still a bit too high)

Thanks for your help

 

[profgruen]

Apart from tyres - and I write another thread in order not to bee too long ...

Motor is awesome, range great (both better than my nduro with bosch cx). never thought that the „new“ Brose S is that strong.

Motor setup like Danny 797 I believe: 10% eco for riding with my bio bike-buddy. 50% Trail for ebike buddies and actually Turbo 90% for superman mode and very steep uphills.

Coil of ttx22m is 18074-11 for 85kg (whereas Oehlins say 75 kg). However my weight is appx 75 kg with riding gears (but without protectors) and with the coil above I have a 50% sag before starting, 80-100 % uphill and flat with roots and punching through in downhill sections. I‘d been interesting if you made the same experiences with your Kenevo coils?

Thank you in advance for your experiences and advices

Wolfgang

PS: I read nearly all posts in this area from you but would be intrested on your recent/actual know how/experienced ?

 

[profgruen]

ad tyres: many in here recommend the Magic Mary Ultrasoft Dh case 2.6 or super gravity; many recommended me the 2.8 mm instead.
Which is better at all? I believe 2.8 makes more grip/traction but the butcher 2.8 on kenevo testbike made it like swimming on a cloud and for me difficult to find the exact line (in comparison to my 2.5 minion and 2.4 mm sg on the other bikes)

also problems with knicking away at high speed in bikepark wallrides is mentioned at using 2.8 tyres. Does someone has experience with comparison of MMary 2.8 vs 2.6?

I understand from most postings that butcher 2.6 or 2.6 have bad grip/traction compared to Mmary Dh casing or Super Gravity ultrasoft or even a Minion Dhf/Dhr2 2.6 or 2.8, correct?