Levo SL Gen 1 Levo SL vs Orbea Rise **edit update**

[Mcharza]

I'm not trying to persuade anyone else to think the way I do, I'm just explaining why I think what I think: so it'd be great if nobody wasted their time trying to tell me why I'm wrong. I've just checked, and it's still OK for people to have different opinions.

Whaat! But you’ve spent or wasted a lot of time proving that Rise is a bad choice

 

[chamaruco]

And my point is that while they can be used in the same way, that's not the same as being designed to do the same thing. It doesn't make them comparable.

By way of (tongue-in-cheek!) analogy: these are both high-end guitars:

Paul Reed Smith Custom 24

B&G "Little Sister"

They're made of broadly the same materials; both cost north of three grand, and can be used to play the same things.

But they aren't remotely comparable.

One (the PRS) is a creative evolution of the best of what has gone before, with novel and imaginative solutions introduced, to make it (at the time of its release) uniquely different from - and arguably better than - anything else available; the other (the B&G) is a derivative hotch-potch mash-up, which wilfully plagiarises the work of others purely in order to get a slice of market share.

(And yes, I freely admit that for me you can replace "PRS" with "Levo SL"; and "B&G" with "Orbea Rise" in that sentence without missing a beat. And yes, I'm a PRS player.)

Point being: two things being capable of being used in a similar way doesn't necessarily make them meaningfully comparable, and there's enough difference between the geo, spec, design thinking and implementation of these two bikes to make the argument that they're not aimed at the same riders, a pretty easy one to make.

eZesty? Yes. Rise? No.

It's fine with me if you don't get my take on it, but there it is.

Ehi! This PRS has the knobs of my Gibson les paul custom!?

 

[Jimbo Vills]

I've just checked, and it's still OK for people to have different opinions.

It’s just a shame you don’t respect others that are not the same as yours.

But I’m sure I’ll get a long, patronising response with plenty of italics explaining the contrary.

 

[Norcalsl]

Orbea Rise frameset is 1kg heavier than Levo SL frameset. So on the same specs the Rise build will always be 1kg heavier than SL

Good point. It's kind of funny how some people have gotten suckered into the Rise marketing regarding weight.

 

[Chicane]

How about cockpit sizing for you? I demoed a L SL expert with Fox 36 and with my 34.5 inseam at 6’ and the higher than average seat height, I felt the SL had a roomy cockpit. I test road a L Occam the other day to get an idea about the Rise Geo, but it had a Fox 34 .5 less slack than the Fox 36 and the steep ST didn’t work for me at all. I felt way over the bars and I’m not sure how much the .5 slacker Fox 36 will change the Geo for me, but I’m glad I didn’t pull the trigger in the Rise, without a test ride first. I also slammed the seat back to max on the rails and I was still looking down at the front axle.

 

[Jilleride45]

I read every post about this nonsens "battle" Levo SL vs Orbea Rise. And I see that nobody doesn't say one important thing, Orbea Rise frameset is 1kg heavier than Levo SL frameset. So on the same specs the Rise build will always be 1kg heavier than SL. For many of you 1kg isn't to much, but for a 65 kg rider like me , 1kg is important. My SL based on a Comp Carbon frame is 16.6 kg without pedal, without sacrificing the important thing, 160 Lyrik, MT7, Minion 3C 2.5 front 2.4 rear, full XTR and lightweight carbon wheels buil around DT240..... Another important thing is time. LEVO SL is 1 year old with thousands of units sold and not to much problems . Let's see the users opinions on Rise after 1 year , not now based on marketing reviews made from people who claim a 16.3 kg Ebike without even knowing that they tested a 18+ kg bike. And one more thing is the claim range of the Rise : 360w with 60Nm vs SL 320w with 35Nm. 4 hours range on Rise and 4 hours on SL. So, my guess is that, or Rise cut the assist sooner or the assist begin later than SL, because otherwise is a physics-electical nonsens, but I may be wrong and Orbea's engineers have discovered a more efficient way to consume energy and deliver more power at the same time . Rise could be a good bike, but let time judge this and do not assume a battle that does not yet exist.

I apologize if I upset anyone

Great points! The ep8 motor alone is a couple,of pounds heavier than the mahle motor. Power assistance is not free, it cost watts. So more assistance equates to less range for a given size battery.

 

[Jilleride45]

For the shorter riders out there, there's a massive 8 cm difference in standover height in size S according to the spec sheet. The difference shrinks to 4 cm in size L. The figures may not be 100% comparable but it does seem that the Rise frame is a good deal lower in that area. It never bothered me on the SL in size L, but my gf has mentioned a couple of times that her Levo is a bit too tall when standing over.

Run her rear shock in low and drop the front fork to 140. Or run it mullet at 140 front. Or just put some 27.5 2.8 wheels on there

 

[Ameiza]

Great points! The ep8 motor alone is a couple,of pounds heavier than the mahle motor. Power assistance is not free, it cost watts. So more assistance equates to less range for a given size battery.

Still need to concider the total build weight and weight distribution, in in relation to the cost. Having an extra kilo in the low centre of the bike is not critical. Also, you get paid by the extra torque.
The Rise offers equal or better suspension, brakes, drive system and cockpit for less money (depending on the models in comparison).

In the end, the competition will be beneficial to all of us anyway...

 

[Sunny]

The EP8 has a peak power of 500 watts (Shimano confirmed this to me at the EP8 launch event). So the 60Nm version will be a bit less than that.

I’m getting along term Orbea Rise in Jan by the way and have a lot planned with this bike, including some direct comparisons to my Levo SL.

Hi Rob,
As these 2 bikes are looking to bridge the gap from analogue to E-MTB, I feel there is an element missing from all the comparisons. I would like to see some back to back comparisons against analogue bikes. How much quicker are these bikes up hill and will these new light weight EMTBs keep up with analogue bikes above the cut-off where peddling is required.
If you can point me in the direction of any info already out there already which demonstrate these differences - that would be great.
I'm yet to demo a light weigh version, but I was not impressed with the Turbo Levo above 15mph (pedalling though treacle springs to mind).

Thanks in advance.

 

[Dpca10]

Rob:
When you review them side by side can you please comment on the natural ride quality. To clarify the Levo SL feels just like an acoustic bike with super strong legs. This really can’t be understated and both the Shimano, Brose, and Bosch feel to some extent like you are dragging the bike along with you when you milk the battery in Eco or worse Off. The SL is very natural and I think that is due to decoupling or low friction in the SL motor. I don’t think the software is solely responsible but you can tell us. Thanks!

 

[ReVolt]

Good point. It's kind of funny how some people have gotten suckered into the Rise marketing regarding weight.

I’m not sure they have. Most people realise that the Ltd version is a statement model and most people will go for the 18.5kg Team or M10 real world versions which are still incredibly lightweight by normal 25kg full fat standards. The Orbea is clearly a direct competitor, or at least a variation within the same broad category, which is why so many SL owners are being a tad over defensive imo.

 

[R120]

Hi Rob,
As these 2 bikes are looking to bridge the gap from analogue to E-MTB, I feel there is an element missing from all the comparisons. I would like to see some back to back comparisons against analogue bikes. How much quicker are these bikes up hill and will these new light weight EMTBs keep up with analogue bikes above the cut-off where peddling is required.
If you can point me in the direction of any info already out there already which demonstrate these differences - that would be great.
I'm yet to demo a light weigh version, but I was not impressed with the Turbo Levo above 15mph (pedalling though treacle springs to mind).

Thanks in advance.

The reality is that any EMBT will smoke an analogue bike uphill, but the key difference is how they ride on a trail in comparison to an analogue bike, and the SL has to date nailed that better than any other bike. On the majority of trails an EMTB isn't going to be faster than a regular bike, potentially on more aggressive trails where the extra weight come into play in keeping the bike stable, but I think there are few trails where an EMTB has a genuine advantage.

 

[jmulvaney]

How does the Rise ride with motor off? I use my Levo SL 50% of the time without motor (when riding with analogue mates and family).

 

[RickBullotta]

I’m not sure they have. Most people realise that the Ltd version is a statement model and most people will go for the 18.5kg Team or M10 real world versions which are still incredibly lightweight by normal 25kg full fat standards. The Orbea is clearly a direct competitor, or at least a variation within the same broad category, which is why so many SL owners are being a tad over defensive imo.

Well, it’s a “variation” with 60% more power.

 

[Norbici]

Thanks for the comparison. Really interesting for those of us who are in doubt. Is the EP8 quieter than the SL? And the Brose? Is the rattle annoying when descending?
Thanks!

 

[coloradorise]

I rode an Orbea Occam briefly, which the Rise is based on, and was impressed at how light, nimble, responsive and efficient it was. I would think that the Rise would be an excellent choice for anyone looking for these characteristics. Also, it's a great choice if value for your money is a top consideration.

 

[Ntinos]

What is Rise autonomy compared to SL ?

 

[Norcalsl]

How does the Rise ride with motor off? I use my Levo SL 50% of the time without motor (when riding with analogue mates and family).

From PineBike Rise review:

"A three-stage gearing system with six gears is optimized for the high RPMs of the motor and utilizes efficient reduction gears to allow for the motor's compact design. A one-way clutch delivers smooth engagement while reducing drag for a natural riding feel. Said drag has been reduced by 36 percent over the old motor, with greatly minimized driving noise."

Unfortunately, the article does no quantify what the "reduced" drag is.

As for the Mahle motor on the SL, this is from a Bike Rumor article:

"With the motor turned off, the internal drive system is completely decoupled, resulting in a claim of zero motor drag."

I ride my SL unassisted a lot, and can't feel any motor resistance.

 

[Chicane]

How does the Rise ride with motor off? I use my Levo SL 50% of the time without motor (when riding with analogue mates and family).

I rode a Rise around the streets for a good 10 min yesterday and I felt zero drag with the motor switched off. It felt like riding my analog bike.

 

[Mikek6710]

Agree on the zero drag with the SL, had mine out for a 15 mile ride and actually pedaled it a decent amount with the motor assist off. It does feel heavy after long periods especially compared to my friends newly built SJ EVO Carbon but that is one nice thing about it compared to the normal Levo. Considered a few other brands (Intense, Vitus, Orbea) before buying the Levo but wanted local support when spending a good amount of money.

 

[Gutch]

Orbea is the buy! ?

 

[MLX John]

Orbea is the buy! ?

Sounds like you're enjoying the bike. How's the power compared to your previous Decoy? What kind of range are you getting?

There's no dispute that my bike cost a lot of dough. 39.2#

 

[Gutch]

Sounds like you're enjoying the bike. How's the power compared to your previous Decoy? What kind of range are you getting?

There's no dispute that my bike cost a lot of dough. 39.2#



View attachment 49514

That’s an awesome bike and very light. I’m currently waiting on a part to complete my build before I shred. I’ll let you know though. My final weight should be around 43#.

 

[Chicane]

Sounds like you're enjoying the bike. How's the power compared to your previous Decoy? What kind of range are you getting?

There's no dispute that my bike cost a lot of dough. 39.2#



View attachment 49514

150 or 160mm fork? 2020 or 21 Airspring?

 

[MLX John]

2020, currently at 150mm. Tried a 160mm air shaft, made the bike feel a little sluggish. Aftermarket 2021 DPX2. Sent it to Fox, they performed the '21 stock Levo SL DPX2 tune.

Just got a '21 Stumpjumper (130mm/140mm), so am going to give the 160mm air shaft another go.

 

[Shjay]

Would like to see a mulleted Ezesty with the software update compared with the Rise & SL

 

[sendler2112]

I have a 2020 and a 2021 Levo SL. Both are expert large. The 2021 is mine, the 2020 is my wife's. My friend just bought the Orbea Rise M10 size large. I rode his bike for a bit today. You can look at their respective websites for details on spec setups. Here is my comparison of his bike and mine.

I see that you didn't talk about differences in motor noise between the two bikes uphill and down. It's also interesting that the Rise has quicker steering. Could that just be down to a lighter tire?

 

[TorAtle]

I see that you didn't talk about differences in motor noise between the two bikes uphill and down. It's also interesting that the Rise has quicker steering. Could that just be down to a lighter tire?

The noise is higher pitched and louder on the SL, so a clear win for the Rise here especially when you consider that it is more powerful. I have not found the rattling to be intrusive yet. Regarding the quicker steering, could it be that the fork offset is 44mm vs 51mm?

 

[sendler2112]

Do Rise owners find that the cockpit geometry is too far forward for comfortable pedaling? I'm 5'9/ 175.3cm. i have long femurs apparently since every bike I own ends up with the seat all the way back in order to keep from having my knee too far in front of the pedals. My medium Specialized Camber had to have a setback seat post to make it fit. I rode the Levo SL in size large at the shop and it fit perfectly for reach and top tube with the 45mm stem. The seat was all the way back and I could have used 2mm more to the rear but could live with it. The Rise in large has 19mm more forward reach from the crank to the steerer and 9mm shorter top tube. Which means the rear most position of the seat will be 28mm more forward that the SL. This may be a deal breaker for the Rise for me.

 

[sendler2112]

I'm really torn between the Rise and the SL (which have a steady stream of used ones on ebay). Aside from the downhill rattle and an extra 900g for motor and battery, the Shimano EP8 is a much better motor. Much quicker and more responsive to pedal pressure and more powerful if you want it. Also more tunable in the app. The Rise cockpit is more forward though so I might have to swap to a setback dropper to get the best pedaling position. Check out the video examinations of the motors.
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