Levo SL Gen 1 Levo SL vs Orbea Rise **edit update**

[Jim_bo]

I have a 2020 and a 2021 Levo SL. Both are expert large. The 2021 is mine, the 2020 is my wife's. My friend just bought the Orbea Rise M10 size large. I rode his bike for a bit today. You can look at their respective websites for details on spec setups. Here is my comparison of his bike and mine.

Price:
2021 Levo SL Expert MSRP: $9500
2021 Orbea Rise M10 MSRP: $8000
These bikes have similar spec details (with a possible slight edge to the Rise for having stock Fox factory suspension)... so clearly the Rise wins this category.

Weight:
2020 Levo SL Expert: 40.5lbs
2021 Levo SL Expert: 41.5lbs
2021 Orbea Rise: 41.5lbs.
All weights are with tubeless tires and platform pedals.

Specs:
Both of my Levo SLs are stock except for the suspension. I upgraded the forks on both to Fox 36 factory and the shocks are Fox DPX2 factory on both. This is the same suspension setup as is on the Rise M10. You can read the manufacturer's websites for the rest of the specs.

Setup:
My Levo SL is set with the flip chip on high, but the for is a 160mm vice the stock 150mm. The Rise was stock.

Ride:
The rise steers noticeably quicker than the SL. This makes the front feel like it is lighter and more playful than the SL, although they will both loft the front wheel equally well. While the Rise was playful, the Levo SL is predictable. Slower steering means it takes more effort to turn, but there are no surprises. Other than the steering quickness, the ride is very similar. Fox factory suspension is good stuff and they both take advantage of that.

Ergonomics:
Again, very similar. The rise comes with a flatter handlebar than the SL. But this is much more about preference than performance.

Power delivery:
This is where the two are very different. I have my SL set to 50% for trail mode (medium) which is where I ride mostly. This is reduced from the stock setting of 60%. The rise was set with factory settings in profile 2 and I rode it in its medium setting. The rise has noticeably more power... but not a ridiculous difference like with a FF bike like a Turbo Levo. The SL power curve seems to be much flatter. Once I engage the pedals, the power delivery is pretty constant. This makes it very predictable. The Rise's power is much more progressive. At slow speed, engage the pedals with a little pressure... get a little boost. Engage with a lot of pedal pressure... get a lot of boost. This is a good and bad thing. It seem like it would make very slow speed maneuvering easier with less power coming out... if you are conscious enough not to step too hard on the pedals such that the bike wants to lurch.

Shifting:
My SL has XO shifters/derailleurs. The Rise is all Shimano. While my Sram drive train is very nice and smooth, the Shimano just feels more crisp and precise.

Tires:
The SL comes with Specialized tires that are appropriate and work very well. I will replace these with the same tires when they wear out. The Rise's tires are more cross countryish. Clearly Orbea was looking for weight savings. Replacement tires will cost you some weight, but provide better performance.

Brakes:
My SL comes with Sram Code RS brakes. They are freaking awesome! Super powerful and reliable. In other words... they work as good as XTs... but they seem to have better modulation. The rise comes with XTs. Who doesn't like XTs?

Fit/finish:
Fit and finish of both bikes is excellent. Paint is perfect. Integration is spot on. Neither bike gets a nod in this area. The rise tries to be stealth with a power switch "hidden" on the seat tube and no display on the topbar... but the cooling fins on the Shimano motor screams eBike! The motor on the SL is less conspicuous, but the power switch with the LED display on the topbar is not very discrete. There is an inline LED indicator on the Rise that lets you know which setting you are in... but it is so hard to see that it is almost useless. The SL's indicator on the topbar is almost as useless if there is any direct sunlight. It's better to just feel which setting you're in on both bikes. One advantage of the SL is that there is a bar type battery level indicator that gives you an idea of remaining battery power. On the Rise, you just have to guess unless you want to use your phone app.

Overall:
The rise is a sportier ride. The progressive power delivery could be used effectively by a skilled rider. The quicker steering makes the bike feel more playful. On the other hand, the SL is rock solid stable. It is predictable and super easy to ride. No surprises and consistent performance. Both bikes look amazing. Period. I love the niche that these bikes fill. I did not and still do not want a FF eBike because it does not lend itself to the techy, slow paced riding I like to do. These bikes are like riding an analog MTB if you had super strong legs. Exactly what I love about them.

I'd say neither bike is better or worse than the other. They are just different. They feel different. But again, its more an issue of preference moreso than performance. My bike is red and his is blue, so it would be hard to say red is a better color... same for the rest of the bike. I don't think I'd swap bikes with my friend if he asked me to, but I'm thinking about getting a third bike for a spare/son's bike. Right now, I'm struggling which one would be better.


Edited comments below:

1. I was corrected below... the Rise's motor is a dumbed down version of the shimano EP8
2. The LED indicator on the Rise will indicate when you get to 20% power... still kinda useless
3. The LED indicator on the Rise can be augmented with the Shimano SC-EM800 display as an option.
4. My friend told me that he discovered how to change the level of progressiveness in power delivery.

 

[chrismechmaster]

I have a Levo ff abs just ordered the Levo sl
I don’t know much about the orbea
But the Specialized warranty is second to none if you get a problem
I can get a motor replaced within a day from my local bike shop but been told shimano are a lot lot harder to get a warranty claim should Something go wrong
Can’t help much more I am afraid but it worth thinking about

 

[Pdoz]

Thanks for the comparison we've been waiting for - any chance of an update with some extra numbers?

1 the ready to roll price of your sl with the suspension upgrades?

2 a rough comparison on range - ie if you're mate rides at a similar pace to you, who gets anxious first?

 

[Jim_bo]

I have a Levo ff abs just ordered the Levo sl
I don’t know much about the orbea
But the Specialized warranty is second to none if you get a problem
I can get a motor replaced within a day from my local bike shop but been told shimano are a lot lot harder to get a warranty claim should Something go wrong
Can’t help much more I am afraid but it worth thinking about

I know there have been problems with the motor on the FF Levo. But the SL motors seem to have very few problems from what I have seen. Zero problems from mine so far. On the other hand, the Rise's motor is simply the FF Shimano E8000 that has been dumbed down with firmware. This means the motor will likely ever work more than around 50% or so of its full capacity, so I'll let you extrapolate what that means for reliability.

One thing that is very different is the SL is a 48V system, while the Rise is a 36V system. More voltage means less current which means less heat to dissipate which means more efficiency. I don't know why all bikes are not 48V systems for this reason. However, most countries consider "low voltage" to be less than 50V... so 48V seems to be the top end.

 

[Jim_bo]

Thanks for the comparison we've been waiting for - any chance of an update with some extra numbers?

1 the ready to roll price of your sl with the suspension upgrades?

2 a rough comparison on range - ie if you're mate rides at a similar pace to you, who gets anxious first?

The price is not an easy to answer question. If you upgrade, you sell the stuff you upgrade. So the end price is based largely on how much you sell your upgrade for. Also, the SL Expert in 2021 comes with Fox Performance Elite suspension. This is the EXACT same suspension as the Factory... just with black stanchions instead of gold. I did not upgrade for performance... it was more for bling.

My friend just got his bike...so it may be a while before we can comment on range.

 

[KeithR]

On the other hand, the Rise's motor is simply the FF Shimano E8000 that has been dumbed down with firmware.

It's the new EP8 - still too early to call that one, but there has already been at least one pretty serious reliability-related issue with it that resulted in its release being delayed:

What’s The Holdup With Shimano’s New eMTB Motor?

The release of Shimano’s newly announced EP8 eMTB mid-drive has been delayed because the motor casing might crack in certain configurations, sources say.

www.cyclevolta.com

We can probably assume that's been sorted now, though.

 

[TorAtle]

Nice comparison!

On the other hand, the Rise's motor is simply the FF Shimano E8000 that has been dumbed down with firmware. This means the motor will likely ever work more than around 50% or so of its full capacity

You probably meant EP8, and if one can assume it will sustain 60Nm @ 90rpm it will output around 550W which is not that far off the normal EP8? I have not seen any official power numbers so this is just a calculation. @Rob Rides EMTB, do you know anyone at Orbea or Shimano that is willing to comment?

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Nice comparison!


You probably meant EP8, and if one can assume it will sustain 60Nm @ 90rpm it will output around 550W which is not that far off the normal EP8? I have not seen any official power numbers so this is just a calculation. @Rob Rides EMTB, do you know anyone at Orbea or Shimano that is willing to comment?

The EP8 has a peak power of 500 watts (Shimano confirmed this to me at the EP8 launch event). So the 60Nm version will be a bit less than that.

I’m getting along term Orbea Rise in Jan by the way and have a lot planned with this bike, including some direct comparisons to my Levo SL.

 

[MLX John]

Looking forward to your evaluation and comparison of the Rise and your SL. Which model will you be testing? The M10, Mteam or the LTD?
Can the rise just use the range extender?
Yes, both top tier bikes can get pretty light with uber-light xc components/tires.

Emptybeer built a SL- 31.92 pounds/14.48kg w/pedals dropper, and range extender, removing the internal battery. Lose the extender, install the 4.3 pound internal battery and you get a 33.86 pound/15.36kg bike w/pedals and dropper.

Rise gets the win on price, no doubt about that. I have a SL, almost no stock parts left (actually still using the G2 RSC) Large w/ Pike, DPX2, Cascade link, Bike Yoke 160mm dropper, XT 12 spd w/ XTR cassette 10-51, Praxis carbon crank arms, Next R bar 800mm, Diety Copperhead, WTB Silverado Ti rails, Roval Carbon w/350 DT Swiss, 2.6 Butcher Grid Trail and 2.6 Ground Control 2.6.

39.2 pounds tubeless w/ XT Trail pedals.

Just for kicks, I removed the internal battery, threw on some Bontrager Line Pro 30's shod w/ 2.3 Purgatory Grid, 2.3 Ground control grid. I'd guestimate that the wheelset is about 200+ grams lighter than the Rovals w/ 2.6 tires.

34.11 pounds/15.47 kg with no battery, 36.51 pounds/16.56 kg with range extender...w/pedals.

Here's a glimpse of range possibility using the range extender alone. I'm a fit 51year old, 195 pounds ready to ride. Bike @ 36.51 pounds/16.56 kg Dialed down power to these levels-
Eco 20/50 Trail 35/60 Turbo 75/100
Used Eco for 98% of the ride, used trail and turbo for some short, steep technical bits.
Had 20% battery left (or 10% of a total of 50%. Mission control app reads a fully charged RE as 50%)Also had another range extender in my pack just in case.

 

[KeithR]

including some direct comparisons to my Levo SL.

But - at a pretty fundamental level - they're really not comparable bikes, Rob. They only have "quite light" and "not as powerful as FF bikes" in common. Everything about the ethos, design and implementation of each is totally different.

 

[Ameiza]

With the right parts, even a Heckler can become an 39.5# SL....Stickers are for attention only.

View attachment 48302

I wouldn’t say “right” parts if you remove the dropper ? -too big of a sacrifice. I would rather ride a hard tail with a dropper than a fs without one!

 

[Ameiza]

View attachment 48350

No sarcasm. Even XC riders have droppers these days?

 

[coloradorise]

Great comparison, thanks!
I'm still curious about the suspension... small bump compliance/plushness/traction, etc.

 

[R120]

But - at a pretty fundamental level - they're really not comparable bikes, Rob. They only have "quite light" and "not as powerful as FF bikes" in common. Everything about the ethos, design and implementation of each is totally different.

How do you come to that conclusion? They are both built to do exactly the same thing, offer a lightweight EMTB by sacrificing power and battery capacity, and specified with less burly components as the lighter weight allows this.

They go about achieving this in different ways, but are both designed to do the same thing.

 

[Radu1974]

I read every post about this nonsens "battle" Levo SL vs Orbea Rise. And I see that nobody doesn't say one important thing, Orbea Rise frameset is 1kg heavier than Levo SL frameset. So on the same specs the Rise build will always be 1kg heavier than SL. For many of you 1kg isn't to much, but for a 65 kg rider like me , 1kg is important. My SL based on a Comp Carbon frame is 16.6 kg without pedal, without sacrificing the important thing, 160 Lyrik, MT7, Minion 3C 2.5 front 2.4 rear, full XTR and lightweight carbon wheels buil around DT240..... Another important thing is time. LEVO SL is 1 year old with thousands of units sold and not to much problems . Let's see the users opinions on Rise after 1 year , not now based on marketing reviews made from people who claim a 16.3 kg Ebike without even knowing that they tested a 18+ kg bike. And one more thing is the claim range of the Rise : 360w with 60Nm vs SL 320w with 35Nm. 4 hours range on Rise and 4 hours on SL. So, my guess is that, or Rise cut the assist sooner or the assist begin later than SL, because otherwise is a physics-electical nonsens, but I may be wrong and Orbea's engineers have discovered a more efficient way to consume energy and deliver more power at the same time . Rise could be a good bike, but let time judge this and do not assume a battle that does not yet exist.

I apologize if I upset anyone ?

 

[Mcharza]

Good text and lots of great stuff. But in this forum, no one can wait one year
And besides, buying Levo SL also started as soon as it was released.

 

[Ameiza]

I read every post about this nonsens "battle" Levo SL vs Orbea Rise. And I see that nobody doesn't say one important thing, Orbea Rise frameset is 1kg heavier than Levo SL frameset. So on the same specs the Rise build will always be 1kg heavier than SL. For many of you 1kg isn't to much, but for a 65 kg rider like me , 1kg is important. My SL based on a Comp Carbon frame is 16.6 kg without pedal, without sacrificing the important thing, 160 Lyrik, MT7, Minion 3C 2.5 front 2.4 rear, full XTR and lightweight carbon wheels buil around DT240..... Another important thing is time. LEVO SL is 1 year old with thousands of units sold and not to much problems . Let's see the users opinions on Rise after 1 year , not now based on marketing reviews made from people who claim a 16.3 kg Ebike without even knowing that they tested a 18+ kg bike. And one more thing is the claim range of the Rise : 360w with 60Nm vs SL 320w with 35Nm. 4 hours range on Rise and 4 hours on SL. So, my guess is that, or Rise cut the assist sooner or the assist begin later than SL, because otherwise is a physics-electical nonsens, but I may be wrong and Orbea's engineers have discovered a more efficient way to consume energy and deliver more power at the same time . Rise could be a good bike, but let time judge this and do not assume a battle that does not yet exist.

I apologize if I upset anyone ?

Some valid points, right there!
I for one appreciate that competition in the light weight emtb market.

Don’t forget about the price tag. Seems like a hefty pile of dollars you’ve put into your bike. Specialized has gone mental on the pricing. Let’s just hope the competition helps.

We’re lucky that there will be more choices.

 

[KeithR]

How do you come to that conclusion?

Because of the comments from the folks that prefer the Rise over the SL; for the most part they appear to like it for what it can do that - in their view - the SL can't: the perception seems to be that it fills a different niche.

Different geo (which - ironically - has already seen people on here lament the fact that the Rise is "not slack enough" compared to the SL); different travel; different component choice... There's very little actual common ground - except relative light weight and less power.

So how do you compare them?

• Ride/handling? Different geo and suspension.
• Power/range? Different motors and thinking.
• Weight? Depends on the build (as Radu says, the Rise frameset is actually heavier than the SL).
• Value for money? Depends on the build (but yes, like-for-like that's a win for Orbea).

Ostensibly they're both "trail(ish)" bikes, but there really isn't that much overlap.

And besides - as the saying goes - "comparisons are odious": the Rise has more than enough about it to shine in its own right. Comparisons are by definition subjective, and probably subject to bias, either conscious or unconscious.

Specifically, they don't inform. They just indicate what that rider prefers, which isn't helpful unless I'm more interested in the rider than is probably healthy..!

 

[Gutch]

At the end of the day, if you're smiling who cares?!! Both badass bikes.

 

[TorAtle]

For the shorter riders out there, there's a massive 8 cm difference in standover height in size S according to the spec sheet. The difference shrinks to 4 cm in size L. The figures may not be 100% comparable but it does seem that the Rise frame is a good deal lower in that area. It never bothered me on the SL in size L, but my gf has mentioned a couple of times that her Levo is a bit too tall when standing over.

 

[R120]

Because of the comments from the folks that prefer the Rise over the SL; for the most part they appear to like it for what it can do that - in their view - the SL can't: the perception seems to be that it fills a different niche.

Different geo (which - ironically - has already seen people on here lament the fact that the Rise is "not slack enough" compared to the SL); different travel; different component choice... There's very little actual common ground - except relative light weight and less power.

So how do you compare them?

• Ride/handling? Different geo and suspension.
• Power/range? Different motors and thinking.
• Weight? Depends on the build (as Radu says, the Rise frameset is actually heavier than the SL).
• Value for money? Depends on the build (but yes, like-for-like that's a win for Orbea).

Ostensibly they're both "trail(ish)" bikes, but there really isn't that much overlap.

And besides - as the saying goes - "comparisons are odious": the Rise has more than enough about it to shine in its own right. Comparisons are by definition subjective, and probably subject to bias, either conscious or unconscious.

Specifically, they don't inform. They just indicate what that rider prefers, which isn't helpful unless I'm more interested in the rider than is probably healthy..!

I just think you seem to take any comparison between the two as someone trying to slate the SL which isn't the case, as you say both great bikes, both different bikes, but both the leading contenders in the lightweight category - the interest in comparing them is seeing when one shines and the other doesn't if you are looking at a lightweight EMTB.

They are both lightweight trail 29'r EMTB's, and thats about as much common ground as you get between any bike these days in the same category. The point is they are both designed to do the same thing, which is completely different from saying they are the same.

 

[mark.ai]

Even comparisons between the Levo and Levo SL are interesting, and must be useful to a lot of people! Even though they seem so different.

 

[Jim_bo]

I've ridden both of these bikes. They are very similar with the Rise having a bit more power and a bit quicker steering. They seem to be designed for the same type of riding and would interest the same type of Rider. Saying these bikes are completely different is quite a stretch.

 

[grantini]

I like my SL and I’m not changing! Lol

 

[KeithR]

The point is they are both designed to do the same thing

And my point is that while they can be used in the same way, that's not the same as being designed to do the same thing. It doesn't make them comparable.

By way of (tongue-in-cheek!) analogy: these are both high-end guitars:

Paul Reed Smith Custom 24

B&G "Little Sister"

They're made of broadly the same materials; both cost north of three grand, and can be used to play the same things.

But they aren't remotely comparable.

One (the PRS) is a creative evolution of the best of what has gone before, with novel and imaginative solutions introduced, to make it (at the time of its release) uniquely different from - and arguably better than - anything else available; the other (the B&G) is a derivative hotch-potch mash-up, which wilfully plagiarises the work of others purely in order to get a slice of market share.

(And yes, I freely admit that for me you can replace "PRS" with "Levo SL"; and "B&G" with "Orbea Rise" in that sentence without missing a beat. And yes, I'm a PRS player.)

Point being: two things being capable of being used in a similar way doesn't necessarily make them meaningfully comparable, and there's enough difference between the geo, spec, design thinking and implementation of these two bikes to make the argument that they're not aimed at the same riders, a pretty easy one to make.

eZesty? Yes. Rise? No.

It's fine with me if you don't get my take on it, but there it is.

 

[Ameiza]

And my point is that while they can be used in the same way, that's not the same as being designed to do the same thing. It doesn't make them comparable.

By way of (tongue-in-cheek!) analogy: these are both high-end guitars:

Paul Reed Smith Custom 24

B&G "Little Sister"

They're made of broadly the same materials; both cost north of three grand, and can be used to play the same things.

But they aren't remotely comparable.

One (the PRS) is a creative evolution of the best of what has gone before, with novel and imaginative solutions introduced, to make it (at the time of its release) uniquely different from anything else available; the other (the B&G) is a derivative hotch-potch mash-up, which plagiarises the work of others purely in order to get a slice of market share.

(And yes, I freely admit that for me you can replace "PRS" with "Levo SL"; and "B&G" with "Orbea Rise" in that sentence without missing a beat. And yes, I'm a PRS player.)

Point being: two things being capable of being used in a similar way doesn't make them meaningfully comparable, and there's enough difference between the geo, spec, design thinking and implementation of these two bikes to make the argument that they're not aimed at the same riders, a pretty easy one to make.

E-Zesty? Yes. Rise? No.

It's fine with me if you don't get my take on it, but there it is.

Have you ridden a Rise? How can you be so sure? A lot of arguments of why you ride the SL, but can you really tell that they are non comparable if you haven't ridden the Rise?

And out of curiosity, why do you feel the geo is so much different? They are pretty trail-ish both of them, if not the Rise being a bit more agressive and modern (0.5 deg slacker, longer reach, steeper STA).

I think most in here think the two are in the same category lightweight trail ebikes, with a little different take on things.

 

[KeithR]

Have you ridden a Rise? How can you be so sure?

I can be as sure as anyone else who hasn't ridden the Rise and is telling me I'm wrong about it.

I'm not trying to persuade anyone else to think the way I do, I'm just explaining why I think what I think: so it'd be great if nobody wasted their time trying to tell me why I'm wrong. I've just checked, and it's still OK for people to have different opinions.

 

[R120]

I think we will agree to disagree!

 

[Gutch]

Two wheels, gears, motor, relatively light weight, dual suspension, carbon frames, what’s not comparable? They’re just bikes, btw one is the clearly better choice!! JK!

 

[Jim_bo]

I can be as sure as anyone else who hasn't ridden the Rise and is telling me I'm wrong about it.

Did you even read my posts? I have ridden both. They are much more similar than they are different. Saying these bikes are not comparable would be like saying a Stumpjumper and a Ripmo are not comparable. The Rise is a direct competitor with the SL and they are directly comparable.

I'm not saying you're wrong... I'm just saying that I'm right!! ?