GIANT Traumas. Are they BATTERY firmware related?

[Evolution Stu]

Thanks for the kind thoughts guys.
I must admit, I am not at all sad that drama is over. I only perservered as 4 of us have virtually the same bike so between us we accumularted a mass of spares for weekends away which means if we break a wheel, a set of bars, a freehub, cassette, deraillier or even a bloody fork, between us we had a spare or two. That even goes for battieries, controllers, looms, the lot.

That however is of course the reason this was so infuriating , even with all these spares, mine was the bitch!
Turns out Steve and Al were still on old 2019 battery firmware which isnt too bad, and Phils same age Reign was less susceptible to these issues due to battery and motor cover improvements. But when the issue did arise, had had the same as me, Steves battery mysteriously powered his bike.

I have also learnt that the PWX-1 has MUCH bigger and stronger axle bearings than the PWX-2 which is why (We assume) I kill my motor bearings faster than the other 3 lads who ride with me with similar age and mileage Giants, but they all have the PWX-1 motor. Once the bearing play starts, we get water cavitating into the motor electrics.... the beginning of the end.

I suppose if i rode smoother trails it may help... My 100KG bouncing on the motor bearimngs in attack position on my usual go to trails must be hell for them.

Mondays ride is a great example...
Its all rough as you like natural terrain, but the Rossthwaite and Castle Crag sections are particularly harsh on the bike.

 

[malc101]

Interesting decision by Yamaha to save weight on the motors by reducing bearing sizes after PWX1. Too bad you were not across the table from the desk clerks while they suggested that change.

 

[Kiwi Giant]

Thank you for all your hard work and taking the time to keep us all informed. Without your insight we would probably still be in the dark.

 

[Evolution Stu]

Interesting decision by Yamaha to save weight on the motors by reducing bearing sizes after PWX1. Too bad you were not across the table from the desk clerks while they suggested that change.

Dissapointing indeed, since we seem to have only gained an "Auto" mode that I never use anyway. Otherwise its identical in size to the PWX-1 i think.

 

[cappuccino34]

Dissapointing indeed, since we seem to have only gained an "Auto" mode that I never use anyway. Otherwise its identical in size to the PWX-1 i think.

Oh yes, that useless Auto mode that annoyingly is the default setting on power up, along with 'lights on', like it's an old Volvo or something.

It's little wonder that Giant are in financial trouble, is it?

Really, would you buy another?

 

[Evolution Stu]

Oh yes, that useless Auto mode that annoyingly is the default setting on power up, along with 'lights on', like it's an old Volvo or something.

It's little wonder that Giant are in financial trouble, is it?

Really, would you buy another?

Highly unlikely.
Fact is, it was a great spec for the money. (Etax aside) Nothing compared.
No idea how they are now, not looked at new stuff fora a couple of years.

 

[cappuccino34]

Highly unlikely.
Fact is, it was a great spec for the money. (Etax aside) Nothing compared.
No idea how they are now, not looked at new stuff fora a couple of years.

If you fancy a change there's tons of discount on everything now.

The downside is that our current bikes are worth nowt. :-/

 

[Evolution Stu]

If you fancy a change there's tons of discount on everything now.

The downside is that our current bikes are worth nowt. :-/

Nah, I considered it, and in doing so hired the Orbea Rise lightweight from Whinlatter for the day to see if I could be tempted away and couldn’t see any real improvement to tempt me away for double the price. Same effect on my mates Whyte, awesome bike, but almost double the price again and a very long way from double the abilities… Will stick with mine now it’s reliable.

 

[cappuccino34]

Nah, I considered it, and in doing so hired the Orbea Rise lightweight from Whinlatter for the day to see if I could be tempted away and couldn’t see any real improvement to tempt me away for double the price. Same effect on my mates Whyte, awesome bike, but almost double the price again and a very long way from double the abilities… Will stick with mine now it’s reliable.

You'll have to have a go on my Fulgur, might change your mind.

 

[Evolution Stu]

I thought since another 6 months have passed I should report that the bike continues to work faultlessly and has been out on big mountain days every single week with multiple 3 day weekends. Not a single electrical issue in 18months.

That two years of ruined rides, days and weekend trips was absolutely 100% caused by the battery firmware.

I hope my troubles and the detail in this topic continues to help other people.

 

[cappuccino34]

I thought since another 6 months have passed I should report that the bike continues to work faultlessly and has been out on big mountain days every single week with multiple 3 day weekends. Not a single electrical issue in 18months.

That two years of ruined rides, days and weekend trips was absolutely 100% caused by the battery firmware.

I hope my troubles and the detail in this topic continues to help other people.

In other news Stu...

I don't suppose you have a way to either read the micro (Toshiba TMPM475FYFG) or a way to write the Giant firmware into a Yamaha board do you?

I have a mate's bike here (with only 150 miles on it but out of warranty) and the main board is dead. There's no parts available from the crooks that are Giant, so a new motor at a ridiculous £1500 is the only way forward as far as Giant are concerned, but the boards are PHYSICALLY identical to the Yamaha boards that are available for £240-ish.

From what I can gather, the Yamaha comms is UART and Giant is CAN. Both systems are supported by the controller, so I figured if I can program a Yam board with Giant firmware it may be a way to keep more Giant motors out of landfill.

I haven't been able to ascertain whether the micro can be read at all, or if it's maybe write-only.

 

[Evolution Stu]

In other news Stu...

I don't suppose you have a way to either read the micro (Toshiba TMPM475FYFG) or a way to write the Giant firmware into a Yamaha board do you?

I have a mate's bike here (with only 150 miles on it but out of warranty) and the main board is dead. There's no parts available from the crooks that are Giant, so a new motor at a ridiculous £1500 is the only way forward as far as Giant are concerned, but the boards are PHYSICALLY identical to the Yamaha boards that are available for £240-ish.

From what I can gather, the Yamaha comms is UART and Giant is CAN. Both systems are supported by the controller, so I figured if I can program a Yam board with Giant firmware it may be a way to keep more Giant motors out of landfill.

I haven't been able to ascertain whether the micro can be read at all, or if it's maybe write-only.

This is something i have been meaning to take a look at myself but never got round to stripping my spare motor.
I will mail Kenny upstairs and see if that part number means anything to him, but i doubt it.

 

[Evolution Stu]

This is something i have been meaning to take a look at myself but never got round to stripping my spare motor.
I will mail Kenny upstairs and see if that part number means anything to him, but i doubt it.

Update.
Just asked him and its not one we know anything about sadly.

 

[Art538]

Hello all, today was at the official dealer have updated the battery to the latest version! But my bike does not turn on and does not turn on(((Maybe I should try with a different battery to reset the error? The bike in the store works fine with my battery! Thanks for the tips.

 

[Evolution Stu]

Hello all, today was at the official dealer have updated the battery to the latest version! But my bike does not turn on and does not turn on(((Maybe I should try with a different battery to reset the error? The bike in the store works fine with my battery! Thanks for the tips.

Hello,
Are you aware that you need to plug it into a charger directly to activate the battery after a firmware update?

It goes into transportation mode after programming, for safety.

The dealer “should” know this, but worth mentioning.

 

[O'l Timer]

Gooday all. I have been following this thread for a while now.....even contributed to it when my Son had shutting down issues a while ago. His would shut down...put my battery in ..worked....etc etc. We both have 2021 Trance X E+ 2 Pro 29er bikes. Took his to a Giant dealer and they straight away replaced Battery under warranty and he has had no problems ever since. Mine ran with no issues until about a month ago. Went out and after a mile the battery cut off. Tried rebooting, off and on and dead as a proverbial dodo. Got home and put my son's battery in and completed my 30 miler no probs. Know what this is I thought. Reported it to Giant Shoreham where I bought it and they said bring it in and update the Firmware. Every time I went to use it after update, sometimes it would not stay switched on, sometimes it would switch on and shut off after several minutes, sometimes dead as......Got back in touch with Shoreham and they said to bring it back. They were going to change controller, wiring and Gateway next. Just been in touch and they have also changed the battery and say the "Fault" has now been cured and I will pick up next week. My question is :- Does the "Firmware" suddenly become a problem. My bike has been running with no issues and suddenly decides to have Shutting down problems after a year and a half. Nothing has changed in my usage......rightly or wrongly as soon as I come home with generally 1-2 leds worth of battery life left, I put it on charge. In my case it seems firmware and most of the electrical system had no effect, but changing the battery appears to have cured it...crossed fingers......Perhaps these batteries are more than a store for electricity and contribute to the communication system. My head hurts thinking about it now. Hopefully back to riding next week.......

 

[Evolution Stu]

Gooday all. I have been following this thread for a while now.....even contributed to it when my Son had shutting down issues a while ago. His would shut down...put my battery in ..worked....etc etc. We both have 2021 Trance X E+ 2 Pro 29er bikes. Took his to a Giant dealer and they straight away replaced Battery under warranty and he has had no problems ever since. Mine ran with no issues until about a month ago. Went out and after a mile the battery cut off. Tried rebooting, off and on and dead as a proverbial dodo. Got home and put my son's battery in and completed my 30 miler no probs. Know what this is I thought. Reported it to Giant Shoreham where I bought it and they said bring it in and update the Firmware. Every time I went to use it after update, sometimes it would not stay switched on, sometimes it would switch on and shut off after several minutes, sometimes dead as......Got back in touch with Shoreham and they said to bring it back. They were going to change controller, wiring and Gateway next. Just been in touch and they have also changed the battery and say the "Fault" has now been cured and I will pick up next week. My question is :- Does the "Firmware" suddenly become a problem. My bike has been running with no issues and suddenly decides to have Shutting down problems after a year and a half. Nothing has changed in my usage......rightly or wrongly as soon as I come home with generally 1-2 leds worth of battery life left, I put it on charge. In my case it seems firmware and most of the electrical system had no effect, but changing the battery appears to have cured it...crossed fingers......Perhaps these batteries are more than a store for electricity and contribute to the communication system. My head hurts thinking about it now. Hopefully back to riding next week.......

Firmware cant change unless its reprogrammed.
(have you done an update via the App lately?)

The battery does indeed form a very important part of the bikes communication system and the slightest glitch from its output will shut the bike down for safety.

 

[Art538]

Firmware cant change unless its reprogrammed.
(have you done an update via the App lately?)

The battery does indeed form a very important part of the bikes communication system and the slightest glitch from its output will shut the bike down for safety.

My problem is not solved( Battery works, computer works, bluetooth module also (even connects and tests, but the test stops at the motor and does not go further) Can the motor be blocked? Or something burned on the board? I tried to replace the battery with another, the result is the same (the computer only turns on the bluetooth, but no image).Thanks for any advice.

 

[Evolution Stu]

My problem is not solved( Battery works, computer works, bluetooth module also (even connects and tests, but the test stops at the motor and does not go further) Can the motor be blocked? Or something burned on the board? I tried to replace the battery with another, the result is the same (the computer only turns on the bluetooth, but no image).Thanks for any advice.

Afraid this isn't an issue I have ever seen, sorry.
Sounds like a canbus gateway issue but that's purely an educated guess since ive no experience with those as thankfully the earlier bikes don't have them.

 

[Megavolt]

Hello colleagues!
I have a Giant Reign 1 2021 everything was fine for 2 seasons until recently. Have you had such a moment that you charge the battery 625 wh (with all updates) and it is not fully charged 98% not 100% when the charger shows the end of the process ????.

 

[Evolution Stu]

Hello colleagues!
I have a Giant Reign 1 2021 everything was fine for 2 seasons until recently. Have you had such a moment that you charge the battery 625 wh (with all updates) and it is not fully charged 98% not 100% when the charger shows the end of the process ????.

Lots of users on social media groups seem to be reporting issues like this since the latest firmware update.
Apparently they charge fine OFF the bike though. Worth a test.

 

[Megavolt]

Lots of users on social media groups seem to be reporting issues like this since the latest firmware update.
Apparently they charge fine OFF the bike though. Worth a test.

Thanks for the answer, I'll give it a try.

 

[Evolution Stu]

Thanks for the answer, I'll give it a try.

Be good to get your feedback on it mate, handy for others to read.

 

[O'l Timer]

I will also leave an update. I have had my Gateway,Wiring, controller and a new battery fitted at a main Giant shop. Only used the once so not sure if my random shutting down has been addressed, but do know that it is now not charging on bike. Came back from a test ride with 2 or 3 bars left, didn't notice the % in the app. Put bike on charge and 24 hours later I checked and green light flashing @ 52%. Noticed that charger was not warm. Left another hour and still at 52%. Thought charger may have died but charged off bike and in a couple of hours up to 97% ish.....Charger warm to touch. Put it back in bike and on charge...green light flashing, and in another couple of hours still no % difference. Charger had reverted to cold...relatively speaking. So battery was going through the motions but not charging. Another thing....should the charger be attempting to put charge into battery at 97% full. I have tried to "top up" the battery before and did not attempt to charge when nearly full...not sure what the % was. Giants think that the charging port lead is suspect and are going to change that on Friday so will post after that. Going to use the bike before then to run battery down so shop can show me the battery charging, (with my charger) and if not, after reading these latest posts will ask if my old firmware can be put back. That will prove something. If not possible, I will post what the solution is.

 

[trailaddict]

I've asked LBS to put old Firmware onto the Smart Gateway to get rid of the just recently introduced issue of slow charging in the bike. They said its impossible, but Giant is working on a Solution. Two weeks later no feedback feom Giant when this will be addressed. Very disappointed at the moment. But the Bike is still a marvelous ride

 

[O'l Timer]

Gooday trailaddict.......very interesting post. Looks like you have answered my queries. Look as though I will be charging off bike for the foreseeable future. Will show the shop these comments....if not charging.....and see if they have any news. I'm already accepting a wasted journey on Friday.......

 

[Evolution Stu]

should the charger be attempting to put charge into battery at 97% full.

The charger will normally put the red light on and do nothing of the battery is in the mid to high 90s. I have never seen anything conclusive as to what point it won’t charge, but in the 90s seen the issue many times myself. I’ve always had to discharge to the 80s to get it to charge.

Sorry to read of you you having all these charging problems, the Giant EMTB Facebook groups are full of similar complaints, bikes will now only charge properly OFF the bike.

Crazy the software problems this company has all these years into production.

 

[Megavolt]

Be good to get your feedback on it mate, handy for others to read.

Good afternoon colleagues!
I went for a ride after an incident where the battery didn't charge fully when charging on the bike. After the ride the battery was discharged to 68% . Then I took the advice of (Evolution Stu))) cheers) charged separately from the bike and everything went to 100% charge! But going into the application I saw the readings of the distance traveled during the entire time of use 55 km, earlier this figure was equal to 4675 km.
Apparently there was a zeroing or memory buffer or what to call it guys ???: не уверен:

 

[Evolution Stu]

Then I took the advice of (Evolution Stu))) cheers) charged separately from the bike and everything went to 100% charge! B

Good to hear mate. Giant and their software problems are infuriating!

 

[Megavolt]

Good to hear mate. Giant and their software problems are infuriating!

It's just crazy.: не уверен::болен: Previously my first bike was a Haibike XDURO AllMtn 2.0 and for 3 years no problems whatsoever. I like the Reign , but these magical cases of the Giant Sync Drive platform are very dumb, it's like Giant is testing it all out on us. ))))