Autoshift on the Shimano XT di2 + EP801

[Jil]

Hi,

Who has tested the Autoshift mode on the XT Linglide Di2 transmission, coupled to EP801 motor ?
How does it work in real life ? What about gear shift under full load ? And maintenance ?
What mileage do you get on it ? I'm really curious about the frequency of cassette/chain replacement.

Any feedback will be highly appreciated

 

[kla456]

Hi,

Who has tested the Autoshift mode on the XT Linglide Di2 transmission, coupled to EP801 motor ?
How does it work in real life ? What about gear shift under full load ? And maintenance ?
What mileage do you get on it ? I'm really curious about the frequency of cassette/chain replacement.

Any feedback will be highly appreciated

I am also interested in this and I'm surprised there are no replies to your post. Maybe Shimano should increase its 'influencer' budget?

 

[Ride 2d@y]

FWIW, I rode the system (and SRAM Transmission) at a demo event. Both SRAM and Shimano systems did not shift fast enough on the hilly single tract test loop . . . however I see the potential etc.

 

[Dhd12]

I have the system on my 2023 Canyon Spectral:On. It took a little time to source all the parts and I had a local Shimano specialist set it up. Think it was the first one for Shimano Spain. Have done around 900km so far with zero problems. I leave the bike in auto mostly. Going to the trails (on the road) i sometimes I shift manually whilst in auto mode as the cadence shift point is set at 72rpm and it looks a little weird peddling that fast in a sleepy Spanish Pueblo. It takes a little getting used to but works as it should when left to its own devices. It was the video above that made me decide to buy. The Freeshift is superb, I have it set to gear four as the default start point. I also have the Absolute Black steel chainring with alloy spider to compliment the system.
Some gear changes are totally silent, some you can hear but no crunching of gears when you suddenly come to a steep uphill section. When coasting downhill you can detect the Freeshift doing its job, but it´s very rocky where I live and you normally can´t hear it. I like it, it´s showing zero wear so far. Time will tell as they say. Shout if you want photos.

 

[kla456]

I have the system on my 2023 Canyon Spectral:On. It took a little time to source all the parts and I had a local Shimano specialist set it up. Think it was the first one for Shimano Spain. Have done around 900km so far with zero problems. I leave the bike in auto mostly. Going to the trails (on the road) i sometimes I shift manually whilst in auto mode as the cadence shift point is set at 72rpm and it looks a little weird peddling that fast in a sleepy Spanish Pueblo. It takes a little getting used to but works as it should when left to its own devices. It was the video above that made me decide to buy. The Freeshift is superb, I have it set to gear four as the default start point. I also have the Absolute Black steel chainring with alloy spider to compliment the system.
Some gear changes are totally silent, some you can hear but no crunching of gears when you suddenly come to a steep uphill section. When coasting downhill you can detect the Freeshift doing its job, but it´s very rocky where I live and you normally can´t hear it. I like it, it´s showing zero wear so far. Time will tell as they say. Shout if you want photos.

SHOUTING!

 

[Dhd12]

I have some Pinnd cranks on the way if they ever get customs clearance

 

[Dhd12]

SHOUTING!

Sorry it’s a bit grubby

 

[kla456]

I have some Pinnd cranks on the way if they ever get customs clearance

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Looks like you bought the CF8 and added the parts and got it set up? This model of Spectral seems to come set up with XT Di2.

Spectral:ON CFR

Canyon Factory Racing bikes are the best of the best. Pairing a world-class carbon frame with best-in-class components and unrivalled battery range, this e-MTB was born to go farther faster.

www.canyon.com

Do I detect a note of disappointment in your post that its not freeing you off like said in the EMBN video, rather you have to ride to the settings, or is it that you need to get the settings right for each rider and for each ride trail?
I'm also impressed by the EMBN video but you probably know there's no high regard for Shimano on this forum.

 

[Dhd12]

SHOUTING!

Looks like you bought the CF8 and added the parts and got it set up? This model of Spectral seems to come set up with XT Di2.

Spectral:ON CFR

Canyon Factory Racing bikes are the best of the best. Pairing a world-class carbon frame with best-in-class components and unrivalled battery range, this e-MTB was born to go farther faster.

www.canyon.com

Do I detect a note of disappointment in your post that its not freeing you off like said in the EMBN video, rather you have to ride to the settings, or is it that you need to get the settings right for each rider and for each ride trail?
I'm also impressed by the EMBN video but you probably know there's no high regard for Shimano on this forum.

The Cfr is 12 speed so no autoshift i´m afraid. Just freeshift. Not disappointed at all, what I wanted was not available to buy so I built what I wanted. It will continue to evolve with components that i like

 

[kla456]

The Cfr is 12 speed so no autoshift i´m afraid. Just freeshift. Not disappointed at all, what I wanted was not available to buy so I built what I wanted. It will continue to evolve with components that i like

Ok, I had not picked up that its only for 10 and 11 speed. 11 speed is fine. Can you say something about riding the settings or setting for the rides? Is it that you need to get the settings right (for the rider) then adjust for each ride/trail? Does it ever frustrate you by auto selecting an unsuitable gear, or by preempting your choice to decide? Next time, would you invest in Shimano Autoshift or in a top non-auto such as Sram XX Eagle AXS?
Many thanks for your response (the only one) - seems like Shimano is not much favoured on this forum.

 

[Dhd12]

Ok, I had not picked up that its only for 10 and 11 speed. 11 speed is fine. Can you say something about riding the settings or setting for the rides? Is it that you need to get the settings right (for the rider) then adjust for each ride/trail? Does it ever frustrate you by auto selecting an unsuitable gear, or by preempting your choice to decide? Next time, would you invest in Shimano Autoshift or in a top non-auto such as Sram XX Eagle AXS?
Many thanks for your response (the only one) - seems like Shimano is not much favoured on this forum.

@kla456 You don´t have to do anything once it´s set to suit your particular preference before a ride. There are quite a few options for shift settings. Then you have two auto options, that can be selected on the shifter remote, They can be set differently eg one for road and one for trails. You also have a manual option. In either of the auto modes you can still shift manually if you feel it´s not in the correct gear. It takes a little while to adapt to autoshift/E-bike as the cadence is higher than i´m used to. The system works very well BUT it shifts differently to a normal mountain bike. My normal bike has full XX1 Sram and before that I had XTR.
I think it´s going to be a very robust system. Lets hope no motor problems arise ha ha
When I bought it Sram had not brought out their version of autoshift and i´m not sure if you can buy the parts individually yet.
I like building/modifying to suit what I need hence the Spectral 8 and not the higher end CFR. I fancy coil front and rear in the future and a change of wheels.
It´s not a cheap mod so maybe that´s why no other replies. At this moment in time I would still go this route.
Btw got a couple of KOM´s on Strava since the mods and I´m no spring chicken

 

[aarfeldt]

I use it on my 2023 Rise (11 spd)
It works quite well, and it's quite funny to play with the settings.

 

[wenna]

Just got my bike with the 12-speed free-shift only mech. Haven´t had time to test it yet, but it was super easy to set B-screw, High/Low and index (micro adjust).

I wonder why there is no auto-shift on the 12-speed?
When I ran an error check from the PC it did shift through the gears automatically during the check, so I wonder why not "irl"?

 

[Mudrider]

wenna the reason there is no autoshift on the 12speed is that 12 speed chains and think possibly the cassette's cogs are slimmer, also maybe microsline is also a limiting factor. shimano obviously believe they can't make them durable enough for shifting under full load like when climbing a steep hill.

 

[wenna]

wenna the reason there is no autoshift on the 12speed is that 12 speed chains and think possibly the cassette's cogs are slimmer, also maybe microsline is also a limiting factor. shimano obviously believe they can't make them durable enough for shifting under full load like when climbing a steep hill.

Yeah that´s my guess too but it would be interesting the hear Shimano´s explanation in detail.

A thought I had is that they should be able to make it smart enough to only shift during certain loads.

 

[luna87824]

"A thought I had is that they should be able to make it smart enough to only shift during certain loads"
Day dreaming while riding?

 

[Ride 2d@y]

My guess is they are aiming 12 speed for light weight/enthusiast customers vs. general use - plus it does not shift fast enough . . .

 

[Mudrider]

Yeah that´s my guess too but it would be interesting the hear Shimano´s explanation in detail.

A thought I had is that they should be able to make it smart enough to only shift during certain loads.

It needs to shift under load, say your climbing a hill and it get steeper, the motor is only designed to supply so much torque, if the load goes higher than the motor torque output the motor will stall, you have to cut the power to the motor to prevent damage to the motor windings. So shifting down a cog is 100% necessary under full load unless you want to come to a stop.

 

[kla456]

I still don't understand why they can't offer auto-shifting for 12 speed bikes even if it meant auto over cogs 2-12 and manual for cog 1 (like an overdrive cog) and a special cassette. Surely they can't leave it like is?

 

[Dhd12]

It needs to shift under load, say your climbing a hill and it get steeper, the motor is only designed to supply so much torque, if the load goes higher than the motor torque output the motor will stall, you have to cut the power to the motor to prevent damage to the motor windings. So shifting down a cog is 100% necessary under full load unless you want to come to a stop.

“the motor is only designed to supply so much torque,”
Yet to find anything it can’t get up. The limiting factors are your legs and stopping the front lifting.
I live in the mountains in Andalusia and my Spectral:On has Autoshift and Freeshift.
It’s the length of the freehub/width of the cassette that is the limiting factor.. The range is fine with 11 gears

 

[2stroked]

Hi,

Who has tested the Autoshift mode on the XT Linglide Di2 transmission, coupled to EP801 motor ?
How does it work in real life ? What about gear shift under full load ? And maintenance ?
What mileage do you get on it ? I'm really curious about the frequency of cassette/chain replacement.

Any feedback will be highly appreciated

Just installed it on my Tazer but had to change it to 11spd which was a pain getting the free hub.
I struggle with the auto shift because it would shift too much but I’m still playing with it but what I did find out is if you ride in manual mode apparently it will learn your shifting patterns so hopefully it learns.
It would shift down at the top of climb when it didn’t need to?
I’ve set it at level 7 for climbing and 75 cadence but I’m a bigger guy and still playing with it.
This is a pretty helpful page

AUTO SHIFT Customization Quick Manual | SHIMANO BIKE-US

Quick setup manual to make a SHIMANO EP-series e-bike truly yours by customizing the Shift timing and Climbing response of AUTO SHIFT in the E-TUBE PROJECT Cyclist app.

bike.shimano.com

 

[kla456]

I've found two bikes with 12-speed Shimano auto-shift pre-installed. One SL @ 17kg and one enduro @ 24kg
ORBEA RISE M-TEAM
STATIC SHRED E-RACE
It was explained above the technical reason preventing 12-speed auto-shift but maybe that's been overcome?

 

[wenna]

I've found two bikes with 12-speed Shimano auto-shift pre-installed. One SL @ 17kg and one enduro @ 24kg
ORBEA RISE M-TEAM
STATIC SHRED E-RACE
It was explained above the technical reason preventing 12-speed auto-shift but maybe that's been overcome?

12-speed does not have autoshift, only freeshift (but that´s all you need in my opinion)
Unless Orbea has some kind of custom firmware.

 

[kla456]

I think 12-speed now can have Shimano auto shift.
Check static-bikes.co.uk and check specs of Orbed Rise M-Team 2023

 

[wenna]

I think 12-speed now can have Shimano auto shift.
Check static-bikes.co.uk and check specs of Orbed Rise M-Team 2023

Can´t see any mention of Autoshift, only Auto freeshift.

I have the EP801 and the M8150 derailleur, both on latest firmware and there is only freeshift and auto freeshift.

Auto freeshift is that it automatically shifts during coasting, but only while coasting.

Freeshift is awesome being able to shift without pedaling but the auto freeshift is hit and miss.

 

[2stroked]

Only 11 speed is auto shift unfortunately, sucks because I had to convert my bike to HG from HG+. The last 3 low gears to 50t is a big jump as well.
I put a steel front ring and going to try the Linkglide chain to see if that makes a difference over the HG chain.
I’m sure once it’s figured out it will be awesome, I do like the free shift and being able to shift when coasting.
I’m wondering if it’s also killing my battery a bit quicker as well

 

[Astro66]

I still don't understand why they can't offer auto-shifting for 12 speed bikes even if it meant auto over cogs 2-12 and manual for cog 1 (like an overdrive cog) and a special cassette. Surely they can't leave it like is?

You need the strength of a Linkglide cassette for Autoshift. Linkglide doesn't have a 12 speed cassette. You would destroy a Hyperglide + cassette with Autoshift as the motor shifts under full load.

BTW ......... Shimano rumours of a 12 speed Linkglide Cassette coming in August, giving the possibility of 12 speed Autoshift with a Firmware Update.

 

[kla456]

You need the strength of a Linkglide cassette for Autoshift. Linkglide doesn't have a 12 speed cassette. You would destroy a Hyperglide + cassette with Autoshift as the motor shifts under full load.

BTW ......... Shimano rumours of a 12 speed Linkglide Cassette coming in August, giving the possibility of 12 speed Autoshift with a Firmware Update.

Thanks for the reply Astro, I pretty-much get that now. A new hip next month after that will replace a 10 speed 2022 Merida e160 with something similar with manufacturer-installed Auto-shifting. Can't find even one bike now! Otherwise, get a new 11 speed Merida E160 and lbs will install it. Could get the 2022 bike converted to 11 speed with auto-shifting I suppose? But better starting fresh.

 

[Astro66]

Thanks for the reply Astro, I pretty-much get that now. A new hip next month after that will replace a 10 speed 2022 Merida e160 with something similar with manufacturer-installed Auto-shifting. Can't find even one bike now! Otherwise, get a new 11 speed Merida E160 and lbs will install it. Could get the 2022 bike converted to 11 speed with auto-shifting I suppose? But better starting fresh.

I'm in the process of installing the 12 speed XT Di2 on a brand new Merida e160 700, with an EP6 motor. Shimano doesn't make it easy. Thankfully the shop I bought the bike from is being helpful, loaning me the programming cable so I can switch the motor to accept electronic shifting.

I won't have Autoshift. But I will have Freeshift, which is what I really want.

 

[kla456]

No new Shimano bikes with auto-shift installed on the market so far - at least that I can (can't) find.