Levo Gen 2 Are Brose & Specialized Fixing Their Motor Problem ?

[irie]

Two old programmers reminiscing.

(guy 1) "Back in my day we didn't have these fancy schmancy programming languages that do all the work for you. All we had was zeroes and ones."

(guy 2) "You had ones?!?!"

Reminds me of this old one:

"There are 10 kinds of people: those who understand binary, and those that don't".

Sorry.

 

[RebornRider]

Been there done that got the tee shirt! I wore it to work occasionally on 'tee shirt Friday'.

 

[lisalis]

I'm supposedly getting a Specialized tero x 6 in a few days but i havent paid yet..
This thread is making me question if i shouldnt get a bosch bike instead..
Does anyone knows if there is something to be done to better seal the motor directly ?? Can i like increase the sealing somehow lol..
Also at the shop they said warranty on the motor is 2 years. Is that right ??

 

[Tekmotiv]

Hi, normal warranty on motors will be two years. Personal opinion I like the adaptive software on the Bosch, but they are all good really. Just avoid the pressure washer! If you are anywhere near us come and try out a few as we have bikes with all motors and they do ride differently.

 

[lisalis]

Yeah the issue is that the bosch cx motor is just way noisier.. But is it more reliable ?
Is there a way to make the seals on the 2.2 motor better ? like diy improvement ?

 

[Binhill1]

I used to think Bosch was more reliable but after speaking to someone that does a lot of wet riding like myself I'm not convinced. I'm on Brose motor number 4 he is on 3 . I intended putting my latest motor to get beefed up at Bearing man before I fitted it and was advised not to as warranty would be void .

 

[Tekmotiv]

It is a bit noisier that’s true enough. Nothing we know of , having said that out of 300 or so Brose motors ( same as the rebadged specialized ) sold weve only seen two fail and one was due to being dropped in a lake

 

[brizi2003]

I'm supposedly getting a Specialized tero x 6 in a few days but i havent paid yet..
This thread is making me question if i shouldnt get a bosch bike instead..
Does anyone knows if there is something to be done to better seal the motor directly ?? Can i like increase the sealing somehow lol..
Also at the shop they said warranty on the motor is 2 years. Is that right ??

I had my out of warranty motor refurbished by Bearing Man and they fitted x-type o-rings external to the motor on the crankshaft and I think that has helped keep moisture out. Something you could easily do. I like the Brose motor for it's quiet smooth power. I have another bike with a Bosch motor and it hasn't been trouble free either. They all have their problems but the main thing is being able to get it sorted either under warranty or after the warranty expires. Bearing man can sort several different types of motor and I'd highly recommend them for after warranty repair. Specialized warranty is also excellent.

 

[lisalis]

I had my out of warranty motor refurbished by Bearing Man and they fitted x-type o-rings external to the motor on the crankshaft and I think that has helped keep moisture out. Something you could easily do. I like the Brose motor for it's quiet smooth power. I have another bike with a Bosch motor and it hasn't been trouble free either. They all have their problems but the main thing is being able to get it sorted either under warranty or after the warranty expires. Bearing man can sort several different types of motor and I'd highly recommend them for after warranty repair. Specialized warranty is also excellent.

Do you know if there is a guide online on how to do this ? I'm gonna investigate.
Idk 2 years on the motor isnt that great to me if they have such high failure rates..

Isnt it better with the new v3 of the brose motor ?

 

[lisalis]

Fitting a seal is now standard practice for us and all our partners worldwide, including Michael in the US who made this lovely video. We always add this and several other layers of sealing when repairing these motors.
The picture below shows a cutaway of the crank assembly where you can see our X-ring outer seal a layer of waterproof grease, then our rotary shaft seal, followed by the internally sealed needle roller bearing.

You can also see at the bottom, the gap that the grease fills and what happens to a motor without this sealing.

View attachment 110930 View attachment 110931 View attachment 110932

Is there a guide on how to do this ? i'm getting one soon and want to maximize the chance of not having water infiltrating lol
Where can i get the Orings to put near the crankshaft ?

 

[mustclime]

My bike has never seen a power washer or even a hose. I wait till the mud drys, then I brush it off with a stiff brush. I pull the chain and clean it . I use auto detailing spray to clean the bike. Bought the bike in April 2023 and no issues after 2200 miles.
You hose your bike, you kill your bike.

 

[kawamaha]

Where can i get the Orings to put near the crankshaft ?

You can try it here:

NEW FLOW Brose Motor Reparatur Damme

Vertrieb und Dienstleistung rund ums Rad. Lager, Zahnriemen, Service und Prüfung vom Brose Drive S/T/TF/C new flow for your bike

www.newflow.info

They have brose parts and they repair brose motors

 

[Coedwig]

Do any of the manufacturers have any plans to seriously address water ingress though? Every mechanic I speak to says that every motor is full of water and they are repairing constantly. This is on hire bikes that are not hosed or jet washed as well as customer bikes.

There needs to be a fundamental rethink of the whole design of most of the big name motors. It’s not sustainable.

 

[Weeksy]

Do any of the manufacturers have any plans to seriously address water ingress though?

Not really...

 

[Bearing Man]

Is there a guide on how to do this ? i'm getting one soon and want to maximize the chance of not having water infiltrating lol
Where can i get the Orings to put near the crankshaft ?

Three reasons to not use O-rings on the crankshaft.
1, An O-ring is classed as a "static" seal. If used on a rotating part it will wear quite quickly and when dirt and grit are added, the O-ring cuts into the motor housing and crankarm.
2, If the motor has been used, then there will already be grit and dirt behind the O-ring when you fit it, trapping the dirt where you don't want it.
3, An O-ring will add friction.

This is why we had quad ring seals custom made to create as little friction and wear as possible. This is also why we don't sell them outside of our upgrade, because it's damaging to seal this area without stripping and cleaning the motor thoroughly first.

 

[lisalis]

Three reasons to not use O-rings on the crankshaft.
1, An O-ring is classed as a "static" seal. If used on a rotating part it will wear quite quickly and when dirt and grit are added, the O-ring cuts into the motor housing and crankarm.
2, If the motor has been used, then there will already be grit and dirt behind the O-ring when you fit it, trapping the dirt where you don't want it.
3, An O-ring will add friction.

This is why we had quad ring seals custom made to create as little friction and wear as possible. This is also why we don't sell them outside of our upgrade, because it's damaging to seal this area without stripping and cleaning the motor thoroughly first.

Ok but i'm getting a new specialized with a brose motor and i'm ready to not ride it until i tear it apart and upgrade the seals. Still no way to get the seals ? I will for sure get back to u for a revamp if anything fail

 

[electricbogaloo]

Do any of the manufacturers have any plans to seriously address water ingress though? Every mechanic I speak to says that every motor is full of water and they are repairing constantly. This is on hire bikes that are not hosed or jet washed as well as customer bikes.

There needs to be a fundamental rethink of the whole design of most of the big name motors. It’s not sustainable.

The trick is to wash your ebike only when its absolutely necessary. Ebikes are not really suited for riding them in wet conditions all the time and then hosing them down with a pressure washer. People asking why the manufacturers simply don't make them more water resistant are forgetting that this will make the bikes way heavier, less efficient and more expensive. People always want light bikes with the most power and range. Yes, you could make the motor waterproof but it would then be less efficient and have less power because it would overheat more. Also the bike would weigh significantly more.

And most people don't ride that much in wet conditions.

Another source of water ingress is transporting the bike on the back of a car in the rain. With car speeds there can be water pressure similar to a pressure washer. I always avoid transporting my bike in the rain or even letting it sit in the rain over night.

 

[lisalis]

The trick is to wash your ebike only when its absolutely necessary. Ebikes are not really suited for riding them in wet conditions all the time and then hosing them down with a pressure washer. People asking why the manufacturers simply don't make them more water resistant are forgetting that this will make the bikes way heavier, less efficient and more expensive. People always want light bikes with the most power and range. Yes, you could make the motor waterproof but it would then be less efficient and have less power because it would overheat more. Also the bike would weigh significantly more.

And most people don't ride that much in wet conditions.

Another source of water ingress is transporting the bike on the back of a car in the rain. With car speeds there can be water pressure similar to a pressure washer. I always avoid transporting my bike in the rain or even letting it sit in the rain over night.

I mean what we should use bike cover when transporting the bikes on a car rack ?

 

[mustclime]

I mean what we should use bike cover when transporting the bikes on a car rack ?

Short answer, yes. I keep a large trash bag and a roll of tape in my car. If it’s starts to rain while I am transporting my bike. I pull over and wrap my drive unit. It’s a e bike, it needs more care than a meat powered bike.

 

[Ou812]

I don’t treat my e-bike any different from my regular bikes, they get washed and lubed after every muddy ride. I even use a pressure washer albeit it on low pressure. My levo has about 800 Scottish miles on it currently and I’ve had no problems out of it. The warranty does end next month though, that’s probably when the motor will shit the bed

 

[electricbogaloo]

I mean it also goes for regular bikes too. The years I rode dh and rode a week in mud in pds and pressure washed the bike at race weekend was the time I changed many bearings because they were rusty after every season.

 

[Reno Vaziar]

Mám Bulls E-stream EVO AM 6 2021 s motorom Brose S-mag najazdené 5700km,žiadne problémy som s motorom nikdy nemal.Ale je zas pravda že sa o všetko príkladne starám.Okrem brzdových kotučov , doštičiek a reťaze som ste nič nemenil.

 

[electricbogaloo]

It kinda seems like there are less cases of broken motors in the last year or so. At least the forums I'm monitoring it has died down a bit.

 

[salko]

But there are also rumors that new motors are not as punchy as old ones, I wonder what is a connection here ... 🫣

 

[Bearing Man]

It kinda seems like there are less cases of broken motors in the last year or so. At least the forums I'm monitoring it has died down a bit.

Perhaps my constant warnings against pressure washers, deep water, car racks etc. Is starting to pay off. Or maybe because we and our partners around the world are upgrading thousands of predominately off road motors

 

[electricbogaloo]

Probably a mix of everything but there certainly must have happened something. I still occasionally read about a busted motor with the belt failing but the reports about multiple sbapped belts in a short timeframe seem to be a thing of the past (hopefully).

But there are also rumors that new motors are not as punchy as old ones, I wonder what is a connection here ... 🫣

I never rode an old motor and I'm rather lightweight so its hard for me to judge. But heavy people should probably stay away from belt driven systems and try to get the most reliable motors and accept that their system will be stressed more. The problem in identifying the issues is that the stress on the system is way higher when a 100kg rider rides the motor in turbo all the time and a 60 kg rider rides mostly in eco.

 

[head]

My motor was replaced this year after 3,125 km. It was working but started making cracking sounds, so it was replaced under warranty.

 

[James_MTB]

My motor lasted 3 1/2 years, 4300km, and the belt snapped.

Got 35% of a new motor.

 

[whitymon]

My motor lasted 3 1/2 years, 4300km, and the belt snapped.

Got 35% of a new motor.

Why would you get a new motor for a snapped belt where it would only require a new one? What info are we missing here?

 

[James_MTB]

Why would you get a new motor for a snapped belt where it would only require a new one? What info are we missing here?

The shop assumed the belt snapped. It wouldn't pedal backward. I wasn't offered the option to repair it.