Levo Gen 2 Are Brose & Specialized Fixing Their Motor Problem ?

[dobbyhasfriends]

2021 Levo comp turbo. 3500 miles now for me. Not a single issue. How lucky am I?

weight and riding conditions have a lot to do with it IMO.
I weigh 100kg and live in Wales.. most of the blokes I ride with that have multiple failures are similar.
my son hasnt had a motor issue at all but he only weighs around 70kg... most light riders I know have very few problems

 

[philmedomsley]

2021 Levo comp turbo. 3500 miles now for me. Not a single issue. How lucky am I?

I am lucky as well. Two and a half year old Levo 4500+ miles, ride all through the year in the north of England. My partners Levo has 5000+ miles. Both bikes jet washed after every ride. Neither bike has had any issues.

 

[brizi2003]

weight and riding conditions have a lot to do with it IMO.
I weigh 100kg and live in Wales.. most of the blokes I ride with that have multiple failures are similar.
my son hasnt had a motor issue at all but he only weighs around 70kg... most light riders I know have very few problems

I weigh around 70kg. I don't think weight is a factor. Water getting inside the motor is the problem I keep having. Barely wash it at all these days!! Wipe down with a damp cloth if it's lucky. And it's kept in a dry garage. Although I do sometimes ride in wet conditions. Crank bearings keep on developing play after a while. Hopefully, bearing man's extra seals will make them last longer. Those people without problems are so lucky!

 

[Trail Blazer]

Hi all you Levo riders

I’m a proud owner of a Levo Gen 3 Pro…soo far 950 km on mountain trails. Yesterday I heard a humming and whining. Some minutes after I got error stating speed sensor error. Restarted 3 times but it looses all power.

Is a major error or just cable issues?

 

[robbydobs]

As an owner of a Kenevo 2019 model with a 2 year warranty which has now expired and having had the 4th motor repaired by Performance Line bearings, I was looking forward to new serviceable motors being the focus of the latest Eurobike exhibition, but as suspected the motors were smaller, lighter, quieter but sadly still no provision for servicing. I hate just throwing stuff away but that seems to be where development is right now. I've only really just woken up to the idea that ebikes won't last as long as conventional bikes without repeated major investment in replacement of major parts i. e. Battery and motor. Great while they're working but significantly more expensive to maintain than non ebikes!

Very much agree with this!

I have a Shimano powered bike. No problems after 2800 miles, but I have only 6 months left on the warranty.
After that the only option to fix the motor is to pay 920 to madison! (no warranty with ebay motors).

Was looking at trying to get a Specialized on a cycle to work scheme, but this thread isn't helping!

I still enjoy riding my unpowered MTB, maybe it's best to stick to that until they sort all this out.

Incidentally, I bought a Radwagon e-cargo bike with a hub motor. All the electrical parts of that seem to be a lot cheaper/easier to replace or fix.

 

[MagisterBibendi]

Brose 1.3 original motor of Turbo Kenevo Expert going on, but with several repairs:

• First issues just after the warranty expired with cranks not turning backwards freely, somewhere around 6000 km on the bike. Some water ingress from the crank, opened up the motor and replaced the small needle roller bearing and left crank bearing as it was feeling somewhat sticky. Also did the Performance Line Bearings upgrade to improve water resistance.
• The original sprag bearing on the pulley wheel was broken with around 8000 km total on the bike. Changed both the sprag bearings to heavy duty upgrades from PLB. (Also noteworthy that during this time there wasn’t observable water ingress from the crank anymore, likely attributable to the PLB upgrade kit from the previous motor opening).
• The original belt snapped at 8500 km. If I recall right this is pretty close to the predicted service life of the belt so wasn’t too upset about it. Opened up the motor and changed the belt to the new (more reinforced?) belt from Brose.

I am on my second battery, the first developed faults and did not change assistance levels properly, did not connect to Mission Control etc. probably because of water ingress from the loose power button. The first symptoms developed around 5000 km and the battery was replaced by warranty (also product recall was announced by Spesh for the original battery). Also had to replace the motor-battery connector once.

It is an absolute disgrace that these motors are treated as non-serviceable units by the manufacturers. What Performance Line Bearings have done here (i.e. made replacement/upgrade parts available and also instruction videos for the maintenance) has been a massively good turn for the home mechanics and bike owners out of warranty. But this should have been made possible by the manufacturers themselves! Imagine if a motocross bike had an engine/transmission failure and instead of a full exploded views and detailed service instructions in the service manual there would be only a page stating: ”In the event of a failure, replace the whole motor unit”… Well, factory warranties in MX bikes are pretty much nonexistent, so the situation is a bit different overall, but from the viewpoint of mechanically inclined eMTB hobbyist it just feels very absurd to treat the motor units as non-serviceable.

I have had such a good time riding with this bike and it has seen some really hard use. Doing a crank service to the motor myself has been actually a very nice learning experience and can recommend it if you are mechanically inclined, have access to a press and decent tools and have time going through PLB youtube instruction videos back and forth over and over again I cannot even imagine how much riding time and also money I would have lost if I would have had to buy a new motor (after warranty) or send the bike over to replacements/repairs every time when something occurs in the motor.

It’s the electrical side of things that worries me somewhat as I still plan to continue my journey with the -19 Kenevo for quite some time to the future. The new battery lost 9% of its capacity relatively quickly, and at least I myself would be pretty helpless in the event of any more electrical issues occurring.

Manufacturers, make motors more reliable and serviceable for home mechanics in the first place!

 

[MTBGUY65]

I can't believe that Specialized is not more concerned or offering more to loyal customers. Of course, have a 2019 Levo Expert that is in the shop getting the 4th motor replacement currently. I realize they extended the warranty which was great but mine will expire in November so I am starting to get a little nervous as this bike is in great condition and I would not be very happy to have to purchase a new motor the next time it fails.

I also just purchased a 2022 Levo Expert Carbon that I was hoping Specialized would have figured out the issues with the newer motor but I am seeing in this forum that is not the case.
I almost never ride in wet and muddy conditions and always keep my cadence up never lugging the motor so I don't feel I am abusing the motor but come on Specialized, you need to do something and soon for you loyal customers to keep your good name.

I feel they should offer a lifetime warranty on the motors for original owners as long as they are working through their LBS.
We pay a lot of money for these bikes and we wouldn't be doing that if we didn't think they were the best out there. I do love both of my bikes and have tried others and for me, I wouldn't want to switch.

Any ideas out there???? No, I don't want to buy a different bike so don't even go there.

 

[High Rock Ruti]

I can't believe that Specialized is not more concerned or offering more to loyal customers. Of course, have a 2019 Levo Expert that is in the shop getting the 4th motor replacement currently. I realize they extended the warranty which was great but mine will expire in November so I am starting to get a little nervous as this bike is in great condition and I would not be very happy to have to purchase a new motor the next time it fails.

I also just purchased a 2022 Levo Expert Carbon that I was hoping Specialized would have figured out the issues with the newer motor but I am seeing in this forum that is not the case.
I almost never ride in wet and muddy conditions and always keep my cadence up never lugging the motor so I don't feel I am abusing the motor but come on Specialized, you need to do something and soon for you loyal customers to keep your good name.

I feel they should offer a lifetime warranty on the motors for original owners as long as they are working through their LBS.
We pay a lot of money for these bikes and we wouldn't be doing that if we didn't think they were the best out there. I do love both of my bikes and have tried others and for me, I wouldn't want to switch.

Any ideas out there???? No, I don't want to buy a different bike so don't even go there.

High Rock Ruti

Only takes three people in the USA to start a class action suit, there's also a really strong case to suggest an "unfair and deceptive trade practice".

My guess is by extended the warranty they've offered a "reasonable" settlement in anticipation of liability?

OMG is this a mountain biking forum, I've wandered off into hinterlands, or am I complainant # 1


Warm Regards Ruti

 

[MTBGUY65]

High Rock Ruti

Only takes three people in the USA to start a class action suit, there's also a really strong case to suggest an "unfair and deceptive trade practice".

My guess is by extended the warranty they've offered a "reasonable" settlement in anticipation of liability?

OMG is this a mountain biking forum, I've wandered off into hinterlands, or am I complainant # 1


Warm Regards Ruti

I am not very knowledgeable about the legal side of things but I would definitely be part of a class action suit if there are any people who have that legal expertise to get something started.

I know just from reading this thread and previous threads that this has been and is an ongoing issue. People who have paid a lot of money for these bikes. I for one have been very fortunate that I haven't had any of my motors fail while way far out in the backcountry. So for some having to walk for miles and potentially having their bike not available for several weeks when Specialized knows there are issues is extremely unacceptable.

 

[High Rock Ruti]

I am not very knowledgeable about the legal side of things but I would definitely be part of a class action suit if there are any people who have that legal expertise to get something started.

I know just from reading this thread and previous threads that this has been and is an ongoing issue. People who have paid a lot of money for these bikes. I for one have been very fortunate that I haven't had any of my motors fail while way far out in the backcountry. So for some having to walk for miles and potentially having their bike not available for several weeks when Specialized knows there are issues is extremely unacceptable.

High Rock Ruti

Hello @MTBGUY65

Have you lost motors, not miles from home?

Warm Regards Ruti

 

[Bomble]

My Levo died a couple of times in the middle of nowhere forcing me to peddle and push it back with my knackered knees.
I couldn’t trust it after that and managed to get a full refund as it wasn’t fit for purpose.
Real shame as I loved the bike.

 

[MTBGUY65]

High Rock Ruti

Hello @MTBGUY65

Have you lost motors, not miles from home?

Warm Regards Ruti

1st original motor siezed up on me about a half mile from my house took a week to get replaced.
2nd motor started to make a horrible noise that I recorded and the LBS submitted that to Spesh who agreed it needed to be replaced or would soon fail.
3rd motor started to keep running after I would stop pedaling which is not what you want when you are on technical trails. That was very scary at times not having control over the motor. LBS submitted to Spesh and was replaced fairly quickly since they had a spare on hand.
4th motor is currently in the shop for over a week now during the height of our MTB season. It is making a loud creaking/clicking sound and the LBS is waiting to hear back from Spesh so TBD when I will get it back.

 

[High Rock Ruti]

High Rock Ruti

Well you certainly qualify for a membership in a class action. I was half kidding, but I suspect there may be some momentum.

Warm Regards Ruti

 

[WilliamBenner]

I found this video on YouTube. I have communicated with these guys in the past. Seems like they know what they're doing, and prices are really reasonable:

 

[MTBGUY65]

I found this video on YouTube. I have communicated with these guys in the past. Seems like they know what they're doing, and prices are really reasonable:

I had already been on their website and it looks like a great service for sure. What is the cost to ship a Brose motor over the pond especially from the West Coast is probably going to be pretty pricey unless you are shipping it the slowest way available?

Again if this is all known by this awesome business why wouldn't Spesh be working with Brose on trying to do some of the same things to make the motors more bomber and not have to deal with all the bad press they are receiving?

It just sucks that they seem not to care about their loyal customer base who are spending large amounts of money.
It just appears so short-sighted......

 

[jsharpe]

I had already been on their website and it looks like a great service for sure. What is the cost to ship a Brose motor over the pond especially from the West Coast is probably going to be pretty pricey unless you are shipping it the slowest way available?

Again if this is all known by this awesome business why wouldn't Spesh be working with Brose on trying to do some of the same things to make the motors more bomber and not have to deal with all the bad press they are receiving?

It just sucks that they seem not to care about their loyal customer base who are spending large amounts of money.
It just appears so short-sighted......

Their website suggests US customers order from Home - eBike Motor Repair so I'm guessing shipping would be more reasonable

 

[WilliamBenner]

Their website suggests US customers order from Home - eBike Motor Repair so I'm guessing shipping would be more reasonable

Yes indeed, when I communicated with them in UK, they stated that they had this US-based branch.

When I was communicating with them, it was regarding a motor for Momentum, so I'm not sure about their costs for Brose or for shipping and such...

 

[jsharpe]

Yes indeed, when I communicated with them in UK, they stated that they had this US-based branch.

When I was communicating with them, it was regarding a motor for Momentum, so I'm not sure about their costs for Brose or for shipping and such...

I've still got a while left on my 4yr extended warranty but after a couple thousand miles on my 1st replacement motor I think the spray clutch is going. I did have a fairly mild pedal strike a few rides ago and can't help but wonder if the upgraded version referenced in this video might have made the difference. As with the earlier post, I wish that Specialized and Brose would have done all this stuff to their new/replacement motors.

 

[funck]

QWIC & Brose doesn’t have solved the problem yet: 7000km on my QWIC Performance MA11 speed pedelec with the 3rd Brose TF (45km/h) mounted …

 

[Jedman5c]

I can't believe that Specialized is not more concerned or offering more to loyal customers. Of course, have a 2019 Levo Expert that is in the shop getting the 4th motor replacement currently. I realize they extended the warranty which was great but mine will expire in November so I am starting to get a little nervous as this bike is in great condition and I would not be very happy to have to purchase a new motor the next time it fails.

I also just purchased a 2022 Levo Expert Carbon that I was hoping Specialized would have figured out the issues with the newer motor but I am seeing in this forum that is not the case.
I almost never ride in wet and muddy conditions and always keep my cadence up never lugging the motor so I don't feel I am abusing the motor but come on Specialized, you need to do something and soon for you loyal customers to keep your good name.

I feel they should offer a lifetime warranty on the motors for original owners as long as they are working through their LBS.
We pay a lot of money for these bikes and we wouldn't be doing that if we didn't think they were the best out there. I do love both of my bikes and have tried others and for me, I wouldn't want to switch.

Any ideas out there???? No, I don't want to buy a different bike so don't even go there.

2022 Gen 3 SW Levo going to the shop next week for its 4th motor. My favorite bike ever, but this is getting old.

 

[Howz]

Well it had to happen eventually i suppose my 2019 carbon comp was making a few strange noises and also was starting to overrun at times, I took it in the Chester Specialized concept store last week and they have confirmed it needs a new motor, I spent a while running around trying to get hold of the original receipt (purchased used from here) as Specialized won’t entertain any warranty claim without it, eventually got hold of it from the original supplier so alls good with that. Chester Specialized tell me that they don’t stock motors and it’s strictly a one out one in sort of thing with head office, so not sure how long it’s going to take?

 

[Kimmoi]

Firstly I would like to say that the bike shops that are really getting involved in getting peoples bikes fixed and back on the trails are doing amazing work. When I am at the shop chatting about these things, the numbers of faults they say they are fixing on a daily basis is staggering, whether they are doing this as great customer service or being incentivised by Specialized I don’t know but, its very appreciated along with the extended warranty for the 19/20 bikes.

On my current bike I have already had 2 motors replaced outside of the standard 2 year warranty period, one of which only lasted 2 months, very few miles and never even got wet. So I have had 3 replacements as well as the original, all of these motors aside from the original were supposed to be the latest and greatest. So for me as well as many others, the extended warranty is amazing.. Having said that, this is my experience in the UK and I’m aware that this isn’t the case for the rest of the world where in some places, support is poor or just non-existent.

But the problems..

2 guys I ride with that have the same bike (20 Levo comp) and have had 5 and 6 motors respectively, 3 of these were DOA out of the box.

Ive currently have a 2020 Levo comp and before that I had a 19 Levo carbon comp.

The 19 bike had to have 2 motors and that was still kind of early days of the failures.

The 20 bike has had 3 replacements as well as the original.

The motor failure rate among the groups I ride with does not seem to have slowed down, I know its not scientific data and is all anecdotal but when everyone you know with a Levo has had multiple motors as well as other control issues this is what you take into account when considering your next purchase.

So has the extended warranty taken the focus off the failure rate? I think so, people are happy to keep replacing motors and the warranty expiry is still far away enough not to worry.

But I’m planning on keeping my bike, I don’t want to be paying for motors every couple of months that fail for reasons unknown.

The only reason I haven’t bought another brand of bike with a different motor is the warranty and service that these bike shops are providing. I have had specialized bikes since the early 2000’s and always love em but this is beyond what even the most hardcore spesh fans can deal with..

I think like most of us with the brose motor, we thought that spesh and brose were on the case, the problems were being ironed out and that reliability was around the corner but its clear this isn’t the case.. the motor failure modes are (to the casual observer) exactly the same as they have always been. How to explain the DOA motors, dead out of the box, or my last replacement.. working perfectly at the top of the trail and dead at the bottom with mission control reporting “no motor found” - I guess I'm lucky I wasn't on a big mountain ride, 15 miles and 3000 feet of climbing from home

All in all, as much as I love my Levo when it comes time to get a new bike which for me would be around the usual Spesh cycle at Gen4 time, how can I even consider the Levo or Kenevo when all my experience shows that I would willingly be buying a great bike but with a lemon for a motor.. Im not the only one, in the groups I ride with it’s a constant topic of conversation along the lines of,

“I love my Levo BUT………”
or
“I want the new Gen3 Levo BUT…..”

yea – the motor.

Examples can even be found in reviews and failures aren't limited to Gen2, The Loam Wolf recently reviewed the Gen3 Levo Expert which they rated really, really highly but that came with a faulty motor out of the box.

I guess the light(s) at the end of the tunnel are The Bearing Man and the emergence of retro fitable after market motors that were seeing at eurobike as an option for when our warranties are gone.

So after all that rambling I guess what I am saying is..

Has the warranty taken the focus off the failures (yes) and have those failures been solved.. (no)

imagine this was a new car - as has been pointed out many times, they are comparable in price.. no one would be accepting a similar failure rate.

Would be interested to hear all opinions and experience

I have 2021 Levo Comp, soon 7000km. No issues. Great bike, and veeeery great motor.

 

[RoyHudd]

Steve_Sordy wrote: "Using their customers as Beta testers for a product that is just not ready is poor practice"
Microsoft have been laughing since the early nineties .

 

[Blebo19]

Brose has heat dissipation trubles

 

[Binhill1]

Hard decision do you fork out A few thousand for a new bike or a thousand for a motor and maybe 1200 for a battery eventually. Think I would have a cheaper bike next time as I am getting on in years now and would quite happily enjoy easier trails .

 

[TOLM]

Sorry, no experience with brose motors here

How are motors in SL models holding? I mean turbo Levi SL specifically

Thank you!!

 

[salko]

SL (Mahle) motors don't have a belt transmission (what makes them much louder) and their torque is only about 1/3 of Brose, so not really comparable ...

 

[MiTurboComp]

I have 2021 Levo Comp, soon 7000km. No issues. Great bike, and veeeery great motor.

I’ve just invested in a ‘22 Gen 3 (Brose) Levo. This is a sobering forum thread. My van is also the subject of many disappointments aired amongst van forums members. Those forums have helped me navigate it‘s upkeep and maintenance. My van is not fast nor economical by any standards- I just love it’s utility and drive ability.

Beyond ‘luck of the draw’, please share why you believe your Brose has been issue free.

- What type of riding you do (technical, downhill, racing, trail, etc.)?
- Your common riding conditions (wet, mud, dust, heat, cold, etc.)?
- Maintenance habits that have helped (cleaning, storing, charging, etc.)?

Here to learn,

MiTC

 

[Bndit]

I ride only trails (so no commute or that kind of stuff, or I commute with it but via trails...) year around and my home trails are mainly rocks and roots. Not big hills because we don't have any here in southern finland. Have done also some bike park with it. Riding style is fast and no mercy to the bike, all conditions from dry to mud and snow, not colder than -10 celcius. I wash it regulary, specially after muddy rides, with water. Always charge it to full after each ride. Store it at warm and dry place. It's -21 Levo Comp, Gen2 but same motor Gen3 than yours. 2100km's on the clock. Never had any issues with it except freehub broke down and it was maybe my own fault when I replaced tire

 

[Kimmoi]

I’ve just invested in a ‘22 Gen 3 (Brose) Levo. This is a sobering forum thread. My van is also the subject of many disappointments aired amongst van forums members. Those forums have helped me navigate it‘s upkeep and maintenance. My van is not fast nor economical by any standards- I just love it’s utility and drive ability.

Beyond ‘luck of the draw’, please share why you believe your Brose has been issue free.

- What type of riding you do (technical, downhill, racing, trail, etc.)?
- Your common riding conditions (wet, mud, dust, heat, cold, etc.)?
- Maintenance habits that have helped (cleaning, storing, charging, etc.)?

Here to learn,

MiTC

-Technical, enduro, trail, not much downhill.
-everything you mentioned, i ride all year around. +30celsius to -30celsius.
-No maintenance to motor. Normal charging. Washing with water when bike is really dirty.