Any answers at Spesh day about motor and moisture issues ?

[Paul Mac]

yup. a longer warranty would really help me move on from my reluctance to drop big bucks on an SL Expert. 2 years (which is 2 summers) goes very fast.

I agree, I believe Trek has just extended their warranty to 3 years which is transferable.
I think this is a step in the right direction, especially for resale.

 

[Murch]

I watched the live cast but didn't hear anything about just the general motor failures not due to water. My bike was only 3 months old and never touched any water when the motor failed. The dealer said Specialized told them it was a failed torque sensor which is pretty much the same answer they get for all the failed motors in our area.

 

[Four Flusher]

The bottom line is specialized doesn't care about post sales satisfaction. Here a perfect example. I bought two '19 Levos in June of '19. My wife's medium was built in April '19, my large was built in January '19. When I noticed that my wife's bike had important fixes like the pivot protector, I was kind of bummed. Especially when I started reading this forum and saw that this was a known problem since introduction back in the fall of '18. Sure Specialized sent my dealer a pivot protector, but it galls me that they shipped me a bike with known issues. I loved my Levo, it changed my life, in six month I rode 1000 miles of single track and had the most fun I've had in 20 years. At 70 yrs old, I can afford to by a new EMTB every year but even though I liked my Levo, I really don't like the way they handle running changes. At the same time I purchased my Levos my brother and his girlfriend both bought Rocky Mountain Powerplays. When a fix was needed, they replaced a pulley with a glide, the RM dealer contacted them and added the fix. I've read several places that dealer support is key to buying a EMTB and I really agree. So since my local specl dealers are not that great, I opted to buy a '20 Instinct A70, for this years bike. Who knows what I'll buy next year?

 

[Topov]

After the live cast I was lucky enough to have an in depth conversation with one of the Specialized execs, 2 things came to light that were of interest to us, If we are OUT of the initial 2 year Warranty and a motor fails, whether we buy a motor at discount or not through rider care that motor WILL come with a new 2 year warranty.
The other thing that was discussed was as specialized owners would we be interested in an extended warranty for regular services by a specialized shop/service centre. I cannot answer that for everyone but please comment on the idea so Specialized will know how we feel about it

 

[miPbiP]

yup - the maximum frequency for buying new motors is 2 years.

and extended warranty options would encourage me to purchase.

 

[StuR]

After the live cast I was lucky enough to have an in depth conversation with one of the Specialized execs, 2 things came to light that were of interest to us, If we are OUT of the ininial 2 year Warranty and a motor fails, whether we buy a motor at discount or not through rider care that motor WILL come with a new 2 year warranty.
The other thing that was discussed was as specialized owners would we be interested in an extended warranty for regular services by a specialized shop/service centre. I cannot answer that for everyone but please comment on the idea so Specialized will know how we feel about it

Yes to extended warranty?

 

[StuR]

Just got back from another smashing day out on the M4 .
Been to Berkshire cycles for a new motor.
Had the Holy Trinity of failures in the last month - Power lead , TCU and motor.
Chris and his team were outstanding as usual.

Collared Chris about my concerns and he very graciously spent about 45mins with me.
Got the following answers -
1. Currently Spesh don't offer a rolling warranty but that may change
2.He personally is committed to helping out way beyond warranty expiration . Without wishing to formally quote what he said , he wasn't just referring to making customers a brew when they pop in ?
Good news for those who are in commutable distance
3.New Power lead is very likely
4.New TCU is a distinct possibility
5.New Brose 2.1 is not going to happen
6.Retro remedials to better waterproof ports , very unlikely
7.Recommends against using water displacement sprays or packing with grease etc.
8.Totally understands why some are doing this
9.Stresses that keeping electrical components as dry as possible is the best way
10. Go full circle and utilise the warranty when it goes tits up
11.The motor in the SL will most likely be upgraded and much more powerful in the not too distant future and will be in the next gen Levo/Kenevo
12.Spares for the current Bikes will be held for quite a few more years

Some very honest answers from Chris , if every dealer was more like him we would have less stress amongst owners .
Not all ideal scenarios and his commitment to warranty assistance will only benefit a local minority

My thoughts are -
Spesh need a squeeze to extend warranty and offer better after sales service as has just been posted.

 

[Paceman]

After the live cast I was lucky enough to have an in depth conversation with one of the Specialized execs, 2 things came to light that were of interest to us, If we are OUT of the initial 2 year Warranty and a motor fails, whether we buy a motor at discount or not through rider care that motor WILL come with a new 2 year warranty.
The other thing that was discussed was as specialized owners would we be interested in an extended warranty for regular services by a specialized shop/service centre. I cannot answer that for everyone but please comment on the idea so Specialized will know how we feel about it

Yes, an extended warranty for regular services at my local Specialized dealer would be great ?

 

[Paul Mac]

Just got back from another smashing day out on the M4 .
Been to Berkshire cycles for a new motor.
Had the Holy Trinity of failures in the last month - Power lead , TCU and motor.
Chris and his team were outstanding as usual.

Collared Chris about my concerns and he very graciously spent about 45mins with me.
Got the following answers -
1. Currently Spesh don't offer a rolling warranty but that may change
2.He personally is committed to helping out way beyond warranty expiration . Without wishing to formally quote what he said , he wasn't just referring to making customers a brew when they pop in ?
Good news for those who are in commutable distance
3.New Power lead is very likely
4.New TCU is a distinct possibility
5.New Brose 2.1 is not going to happen
6.Retro remedials to better waterproof ports , very unlikely
7.Recommends against using water displacement sprays or packing with grease etc.
8.Totally understands why some are doing this
9.Stresses that keeping electrical components as dry as possible is the best way
10. Go full circle and utilise the warranty when it goes tits up
11.The motor in the SL will most likely be upgraded and much more powerful in the not too distant future and will be in the next gen Levo/Kenevo
12.Spares for the current Bikes will be held for quite a few more years

Some very honest answers from Chris , if every dealer was more like him we would have less stress amongst owners .
Not all ideal scenarios and his commitment to warranty assistance will only benefit a local manority

My thoughts are -
Spesh need a squeeze to extend warranty and offer better after sales service as has just been posted.

Yes I agree Berkshire cycles are a God send and I think Specialized owe him a great deal for uk sales, however he is also heavily invested in the turbo levo and I'm sure will do everything possible in the future to help customers.
But having said that it was still a pain to keep going to see him to get things sorted, in fact a bit embarrassing.
The reason for this is six of us bought from him and between us we were literally there every other weekend.
All six of us had at least one motor and cable failure, some several times.
Watching the Specialized guy talking on Robs video the other day, didn't fill me with any confidence either.
I will probably have another look at the gen 3 Levo, I'm sure it will be sorted by then ?

 

[Levo Laland]

I was there on Saturday.

Tech guy at the event recommended using a contact grease on all of the electrical connections to the motor. He also said it wouldn’t be a bad idea to protect the main seals on the motor especially on the non drive side. So I’ve ordered some Dielectric grease and some Extra Heavy duty grease (used on tractors, plant machinery and trucks) should be good enough for an Ebike in the British winter!

When fiddling with the SL’s on display I discovered that the seals on the new motor actually create enough friction to be able to turn the drivetrain backwards, but the bikes on display were brand new.

Tech guy said that they have to swallow the cost of approx 20% of the motors replaced as Brose find that the motors have failed due to “issues not covered by the warranty“.

Tech guy also said that the new advanced diagnostic feature in the new MC app sends them a lot of information about the bike faults that will enable them to help you get the bike running again and avoid trips to the bike shop.

Main Turbo guy said a new version of the TCU is coming soon. He also liked the idea of a approved used Ebike scheme which was suggested at the event.

The main talk was filmed and is on YouTube.

 

[R120]

The most interesting thing for me is seeing the evolution of this motor into a bigger version - no matter what Specilized say I cant see that they are going to stick with Brose in the longer term, they have a great deal with them in that they can use their own software, but they are still reliant on a motor system developed for the general market, that they tweak. A good example is the amount of ports on the Brose, Specilized clearly intimate they would rather have less and have another way of connecting ancillary such as lights, which they alluded to in the video that they have come up with for the SL, but Brose are not going to go down this route given the other kind of bikes that use the motor.

Effectively Brose development aims with a motor are different to those for Specialized, and the more Specialized develop the Levo the more divergent they get. Currently having to work with the Brose ecosystem is the weak point of the Levo, and no doubt the warranty a lot more motors than Brose would do if left up to dealing with them, in order to keep customers happy.

By getting into bed with Mahle, they are able to start developing whole systems whereby the motor and frame/bike are designed in conjunction, and can instigate motor design changes that can ignore the wider market - that's going to be far more cohesive design process, and going to a 48v system through the Turbo range is the next obvious step.

In terms of customer care I think Spoecilized are going above and beyond, provided that your dealer is of the same mindset - more than any other brand of EMTB I would say its critical you get one from a good dealer - I am not a Specilized fan boy of any sort, but all I would say is that the current problems are probably going to lead into an amazing Gen 3 Levo, as if any company is going to learn from them its Specilized, and they are also the only company that seems to have anything but a glacial development cycle.

 

[Specialized Rider Care]

Thanks to all that have posted on this thread, we fully understand concern about the longevity and reliability of your Turbo. Naturally a forum post to answer multiple questions is going to be challenging - but here goes...

Firstly - sincere apologies to anyone out there that has had reliability issues - we know your Turbo was a carefully considered purchase and don't take that for granted. Our primary guiding principle is that the Rider is the boss, we stand behind our warranty and empower our service teams to do the right thing. It's great to hear many of you talk positively about the way your retailers have supported you, we'd always recommend you buy from a good local retailer with a reputation for after-sales care.

Secondly - anyone reading this thread is statistically more likely to have had a fault (many of us head off to forums when we have a problem). We regularly monitor failure rates and thankfully the majority of riders aren't having problems, however we do accept that there are an increased number of water-based faults in the UK in particular. On the Levo 2019/20 these are largely due to the power cable seal failing at the motor connection (which is covered under warranty and will be replaced by a newer version) but we continuously monitor warranty issues and investigate in partnership with our suppliers - as you'd expect. Again - apologies if you've been affected.

Thirdly - we have our Global Warranty Policy posted online which contains details of our warranty policy and our Assisted purchase program (as mentioned at the beginning of this thread) for riders outside of the 2 year warranty. Please do take a moment to check it out and download your local warranty policy document - we've done our best to make it clear and simple, there shouldn't be any small print. Service teams are empowered to support retailers and riders outside of the warranty period where there are exceptional circumstances or suspected component batch issues.

On the topic of replacement/refurbished/repaired motors and extended warranties we hear you, we're working on a detailed response to this one.

 

[StuR]

Thanks to all that have posted on this thread, we fully understand concern about the longevity and reliability of your Turbo. Naturally a forum post to answer multiple questions is going to be challenging - but here goes...

Firstly - sincere apologies to anyone out there that has had reliability issues - we know your Turbo was a carefully considered purchase and don't take that for granted. Our primary guiding principle is that the Rider is the boss, we stand behind our warranty and empower our service teams to do the right thing. It's great to hear many of you talk positively about the way your retailers have supported you, we'd always recommend you buy from a good local retailer with a reputation for after-sales care.

Secondly - anyone reading this thread is statistically more likely to have had a fault (many of us head off to forums when we have a problem). We regularly monitor failure rates and thankfully the majority of riders aren't having problems, however we do accept that there are an increased number of water-based faults in the UK in particular. On the Levo 2019/20 these are largely due to the power cable seal failing at the motor connection (which is covered under warranty and will be replaced by a newer version) but we continuously monitor warranty issues and investigate in partnership with our suppliers - as you'd expect. Again - apologies if you've been affected.

Thirdly - we have our Global Warranty Policy posted online which contains details of our warranty policy and our Assisted purchase program (as mentioned at the beginning of this thread) for riders outside of the 2 year warranty. Please do take a moment to check it out and download your local warranty policy document - we've done our best to make it clear and simple, there shouldn't be any small print. Service teams are empowered to support retailers and riders outside of the warranty period where there are exceptional circumstances or suspected component batch issues.

On the topic of replacement/refurbished/repaired motors and extended warranties we hear you, we're working on a detailed response to this one.

Thank you @Specialized Rider Care for getting involved , it is appreciated .
It's good to see our concerns are not falling on deaf ears .
I look forward to your comments on the final point .
For me personally id appreciate your suggestions on how we can lessen the chances of water ingress .
I accept that it might be unreasonable to expect ingress to never happen but surely it could be dramatically reduced.
Does Spesh have any comment or planned remedial fixes that could work in the real world.
I mean by that - a fit and forget type solution that doesn't include drastic action like removing items and drying them after every ride ?

Thanks

 

[Kentish]

Thanks to all that have posted on this thread, we fully understand concern about the longevity and reliability of your Turbo. Naturally a forum post to answer multiple questions is going to be challenging - but here goes...

Firstly - sincere apologies to anyone out there that has had reliability issues - we know your Turbo was a carefully considered purchase and don't take that for granted. Our primary guiding principle is that the Rider is the boss, we stand behind our warranty and empower our service teams to do the right thing. It's great to hear many of you talk positively about the way your retailers have supported you, we'd always recommend you buy from a good local retailer with a reputation for after-sales care.

Secondly - anyone reading this thread is statistically more likely to have had a fault (many of us head off to forums when we have a problem). We regularly monitor failure rates and thankfully the majority of riders aren't having problems, however we do accept that there are an increased number of water-based faults in the UK in particular. On the Levo 2019/20 these are largely due to the power cable seal failing at the motor connection (which is covered under warranty and will be replaced by a newer version) but we continuously monitor warranty issues and investigate in partnership with our suppliers - as you'd expect. Again - apologies if you've been affected.

Thirdly - we have our Global Warranty Policy posted online which contains details of our warranty policy and our Assisted purchase program (as mentioned at the beginning of this thread) for riders outside of the 2 year warranty. Please do take a moment to check it out and download your local warranty policy document - we've done our best to make it clear and simple, there shouldn't be any small print. Service teams are empowered to support retailers and riders outside of the warranty period where there are exceptional circumstances or suspected component batch issues.

On the topic of replacement/refurbished/repaired motors and extended warranties we hear you, we're working on a detailed response to this one.

Someone's working late! ?

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Thanks to all that have posted on this thread, we fully understand concern about the longevity and reliability of your Turbo. Naturally a forum post to answer multiple questions is going to be challenging - but here goes...

Firstly - sincere apologies to anyone out there that has had reliability issues - we know your Turbo was a carefully considered purchase and don't take that for granted. Our primary guiding principle is that the Rider is the boss, we stand behind our warranty and empower our service teams to do the right thing. It's great to hear many of you talk positively about the way your retailers have supported you, we'd always recommend you buy from a good local retailer with a reputation for after-sales care.

Secondly - anyone reading this thread is statistically more likely to have had a fault (many of us head off to forums when we have a problem). We regularly monitor failure rates and thankfully the majority of riders aren't having problems, however we do accept that there are an increased number of water-based faults in the UK in particular. On the Levo 2019/20 these are largely due to the power cable seal failing at the motor connection (which is covered under warranty and will be replaced by a newer version) but we continuously monitor warranty issues and investigate in partnership with our suppliers - as you'd expect. Again - apologies if you've been affected.

Thirdly - we have our Global Warranty Policy posted online which contains details of our warranty policy and our Assisted purchase program (as mentioned at the beginning of this thread) for riders outside of the 2 year warranty. Please do take a moment to check it out and download your local warranty policy document - we've done our best to make it clear and simple, there shouldn't be any small print. Service teams are empowered to support retailers and riders outside of the warranty period where there are exceptional circumstances or suspected component batch issues.

On the topic of replacement/refurbished/repaired motors and extended warranties we hear you, we're working on a detailed response to this one.

Thanks for responding so quickly @Specialized Rider Care it is very much appreciated.
If, as you state above,
thankfully the majority of riders aren't having problems, however we do accept that there are an increased number of water-based faults in the UK in particular.
I do not think it is unreasonable for us as owners that have had failures to request and receive a ’rolling 2 year warranty period’ for failed motors, TCUs and cable failures. If it is such a low count then the cost impact to you will be fairly low and it would be a huge ‘good will gesture’ from you. I believe one of your competitors Bosch already offer a rolling warranty on their motors.

I am really interested in hearing your response on the following subject.
On the topic of replacement/refurbished/repaired motors and extended warranties we hear you, we're working on a detailed response to this one.

 

[congerball]

Thanks for the response @Specialized Rider Care ????

 

[Beekeeper]

don't buy, it's not obligatory.

they don't even want you to, they only make them for the headlines.

Reminds me of “tulip mania” in the 17th Century.
Ebikes are more expensive than cars and still rising.
The tulip bubble resulted in a single tulip bulb being worth more than a house until people realised this was all rather silly and decided they would actually be just as happy with just an entry-level tulip bulb. What happened after that light’bulb’ moment is well....... history

 

[ebikerider]

Rolling warranty please.

 

[TheBikePilot]

I was informed that if a motor was replaced the Warranty restarted on that motor or is that incorrect?

When I had the battery replaced last July that was the information I was given?

 

[miPbiP]

I was informed that if a motor was replaced the Warranty restarted on that motor or is that incorrect?

When I had the battery replaced last July that was the information I was given?

My understanding:

* motors replaced during first warranty period are only themselves warrantied in that period. Makes sense or people would abuse it and get infinite motor replacements.
* any (paid for) replacements after initial warranty period are then themselves warrantied for 2 years.

So max frequency of buying motors is 2 years.

 

[TheBikePilot]

My understanding:

* motors replaced during first warranty period are only themselves warrantied in that period. Makes sense or people would abuse it and get infinite motor replacements.
* any (paid for) replacements after initial warranty period are then themselves warrantied for 2 years.

So max frequency of buying motors is 2 years.

Ah OK I see.

Also, I know Chris said that they do with each claim on a case by case basis so I do have faith in the system is human beings not a rulebook.

Battery and Power Cable for me so far..(motor replaced but I am sure it was confirmation bias off the internet having come off a 2017 Levo which was nearly silent...)

 

[kombos]

Tech guy said that they have to swallow the cost of approx 20% of the motors replaced as Brose find that the motors have failed due to “issues not covered by the warranty“.

I guess this means Spesh (their dealers) return a motor to Brose and Brose denies the claim saying the failure is not the fault of the manufacturer (Brose). I'm curious as to what the cause of failure for these are.....seeming caused by the bike owner. If so, it is these that could also be prevented by the bike owner....

 

[aarfeldt]

On the Levo 2019/20 these are largely due to the power cable seal failing at the motor connection (which is covered under warranty and will be replaced by a newer version)

Is it possible for the rider to verify if he's using the new/old power cable visually ?

I assume new bikes comes with the new power cable.
Will the bikes serial number be enough to verify ?

 

[miPbiP]

I guess this means Spesh (their dealers) return a motor to Brose and Brose denies the claim saying the failure is not the fault of the manufacturer (Brose). I'm curious as to what the cause of failure for these are.....seeming caused by the bike owner. If so, it is these that could also be prevented by the bike owner....

and implies Brose not Spesh take the hit on warrantied replacement motors.

 

[#lazy]

The lifetime roval wheel cover , does that include crash damage ?

 

[salko]

According to the Specialized Global Warranty Policy if you crash your Specialized or Roval-branded product, you can only buy a new one under ASSISTED REPLACEMENT program ...

 

[Zimmerframe]

This was mentioned earlier in the thread : but Brose Drive S for sale via e-bay : £1k

Weirdly has two motor types on the photos :

Ebike Motor nachrüstatz Brose Central Motor Drive S Mag Horizontal E01680 | eBay

 

[Paceman]

"I assume new bikes comes with the new power cable. "

I wouldn't assume this, the new internal power cable only came out last month; most of the 2020 Levos and Kenevos will have already been distributed from the factory well before then.

 

[Mikerb]

Easiest way to identify thr latest cable is that it a very small white zip tie just next to the big zip tie that is used to prevent the cable being pulled at the battery plug end......and another v small white zip tie on the d section of the motor end plug

 

[salko]

Old cable vs New cable