2024 Santa Cruz Heckler SL

[cykelk]

Rider weight without gear is about 75 kg. Bike as built up (DH tires, Vivid shock, but otherwise light components) is ~44 lbs / 20 kg.

Vivid worth the swap?

 

[Andeh]

Vivid worth the swap?

I'm a pretty big fan of it. It's a solid midpoint between a coil and an air shock. The initial sensitivity/grip is very good, much more than the stock SDU, but has very tuneable bottom out support between bands and HBO. It's 200g more than the SDU, but it's not noticeably reducing range for me.

 

[Btek2024]

I'm a pretty big fan of it. It's a solid midpoint between a coil and an air shock. The initial sensitivity/grip is very good, much more than the stock SDU, but has very tuneable bottom out support between bands and HBO. It's 200g more than the SDU, but it's not noticeably reducing range for me.

Hey Andeh,

What tune did you go with on the vivid ?

I'm looking to replace the stock fox dps.

 

[Andeh]

Hey Andeh,

What tune did you go with on the vivid ?

I'm looking to replace the stock fox dps.

C37 tune, that's what SC specs for the Nomad/Megatower/Bullit. I had one on my Nomad already (with that tune) and got along with it right away.

 

[DB88MOTO]

A few rides on mine from the past week. I'm ~170lbs with ~220W FTP on an indoor trainer. According to the Fazua data my "all day Zone 2 power" in the real world MTB situation is somewhere around 160W.

- 19 mi / 3600 ft / 88% used / Rocket
- 24 mi / 4150 ft / 99% used / Rocket + some in a custom, boosted River profile. I think forced-Eco hits at 5%
- 18.7 mi / 4230 ft / 51% used / Eco (a custom acoustic-group profile)
- 9 mi / 2750 ft / 55% used / Rocket with 300 to 400 ft hike-a-bike

For those first two rides ^ I rode with a buddy on the same bike who is about my weight but significantly more fit. I think he finished the first with 30% left (I had 12%) and the second with somewhere in the 20% range.

amazing ! thank you for the info. these are perfect number for when I ride with my analog buddies.. cheers from Canada

 

[DB88MOTO]

I'll represent the metric system here
I've done about 40km and 1200m vertical with a mix of all three modes. I'm 81kg without gear.

haha thank you. that's a great ride on a SL. more than what I need. time to get one. cheers!

 

[Rodres]

I'm a pretty big fan of it. It's a solid midpoint between a coil and an air shock. The initial sensitivity/grip is very good, much more than the stock SDU, but has very tuneable bottom out support between bands and HBO. It's 200g more than the SDU, but it's not noticeably reducing range for me.

Thanks for this! I was surprised to see the stock SD select+ feels a bit harsh (quite poppy though) and doesn't give a lot of options with such a low bb already. I have another VPP bike with a much more linear SDU and that feels great in the rough.
Might start thinking about that Vivid.

 

[Andeh]

Thanks for this! I was surprised to see the stock SD select+ feels a bit harsh and doesn't give a lot of options with such a low bb already. I have another VPP bike with a much more linear SDU and that feels great in the rough.
Might start thinking about that Vivid.

The problem with the Select+ is that it doesn't have adjustable HSC. I ran mine for a few days and noticed it tended to get hung up. I then pulled apart the SDU that I had on my old Levo and moved the reservoir assembly over to get the adjustments (but keep the HBO & roller bearing eyelet, plus the SC spec'd damper tune assembly). I opened HSC all the way (which is what SC suggests on the models that get the Ultimate), and it felt much better.

In the recent '25 releases, RS started selling that same Reservoir as an upgrade kit, for $230. RS was telling me that the Linear XL air can would help a little with small bump also (I think that's ~$90). If you've got a competent suspension service guy nearby, that could be a cheaper option than a whole new shock. I haven't tried it myself back to back with the Vivid though.

 

[Rodres]

The problem with the Select+ is that it doesn't have adjustable HSC. I ran mine for a few days and noticed it tended to get hung up. I then pulled apart the SDU that I had on my old Levo and moved the reservoir assembly over to get the adjustments (but keep the HBO & roller bearing eyelet, plus the SC spec'd damper tune assembly). I opened HSC all the way (which is what SC suggests on the models that get the Ultimate), and it felt much better.

In the recent '25 releases, RS started selling that same Reservoir as an upgrade kit, for $230. RS was telling me that the Linear XL air can would help a little with small bump also (I think that's ~$90). If you've got a competent suspension service guy nearby, that could be a cheaper option than a whole new shock. I haven't tried it myself back to back with the Vivid though.

Yeah I saw the reservoir upgrade is available and actually considered it. Seems a much cheaper option if it really releases the compression damping a bit (I tend to run it fully open on the other VPP bike btw).
Awesome input, thanks man!

 

[Jake From State Farm]

So.. Cascade components will be releasing the LT Link this month for the Heckler SL. I have mine built up pretty insanely as it is but I ended up screwing my stantions up on my 170mm Fox 38 so I decided to get a 180mm Fox 38 (X2damper) and swap the orange lower. It's currently 20mm over forked.. If the Heckler SL link will be anything like the Bronson Link we can expect 160/170/180. In the coming months I'll likely have it 180/180 Essentially a Nomad SL.. lol
I've been running some Michelin DH16's that I like but might have to give the 22's a go. The ONXY classics really do make a huge difference. I might grab one of the Fazua60 Ochain's and see how that works with the ONXY hubs since they are instant engagement. Anyone GEO heads out there know what will change geometry wise with the bike being 180/180?

 

[Andeh]

Every 10mm more fork travel slackens HTA & STA by about 0.4 degrees, and raises BB by 4mm. If you're going from a fork like a 36 or Lyrik to a 38/Zeb which has slightly longer A:C distance for the same travel, it will be a tad more. My guess is a 180/180 version would be around 63* HTA, 66* STA, 350 BB height. It almost certainly will require going to a 230x60/62.5/65 shock, up from the stock 210x55.

I'm definitely interested in the link also, but won't go that far. For my trails I like the poppy nature of the Lyrik 160, so likely will just bump up to 160 rear to match. Maybe I'll do 170/170... I have a Nomad also and when I ride that bike after riding my Heckler a lot, it feels super squishy.

 

[Jake From State Farm]

Every 10mm more fork travel slackens HTA & STA by about 0.4 degrees, and raises BB by 4mm. If you're going from a fork like a 36 or Lyrik to a 38/Zeb which has slightly longer A:C distance for the same travel, it will be a tad more. My guess is a 180/180 version would be around 63* HTA, 66* STA, 350 BB height. It almost certainly will require going to a 230x60/62.5/65 shock, up from the stock 210x55.

I'm definitely interested in the link also, but won't go that far. For my trails I like the poppy nature of the Lyrik 160, so likely will just bump up to 160 rear to match. Maybe I'll do 170/170... I have a Nomad also and when I ride that bike after riding my Heckler a lot, it feels super squishy.

Do you know off the top of your head what the geo numbers are stock at 160/150? I'd be interesting to compare them. I def know that with out adding more travel to the rear the over forking will be more pronounced correct? The bike actually feels pretty good at the HTA it's currently at. 63 Degrees is as steep as my V10. The Nomad is 63.5/8.

 

[Andeh]

Do you know off the top of your head what the geo numbers are stock at 160/150? I'd be interesting to compare them. I def know that with out adding more travel to the rear the over forking will be more pronounced correct? The bike actually feels pretty good at the HTA it's currently at.

64.0 HT, 76.9 ST, 341 BB.

The reason why a lot of designers run 10-20mm less rear travel in rear is because the rear travel number is axle travel, and fork travel gets reduced by a bit when you factor in HTA (I want to say fork axle travel is usually -15mm from linear travel). Actual travel balance depends a lot on rider style and trails. I ride flats, so always feel like my bikes feel better when rear travel matches front, regardless of what the numbers say. But I could see someone riding really steep, chunky trails with clips preferring to run +20mm fork to soak up the hits and letting the rear skip over rocks. The most important thing is to set it up for what rides well for the trails you actually ride, not the ones you wish you rode.

One deciding factor for me is I actually prefer how the Lyrik feels to the Zeb, but you can't run the Lyrik as 170 anymore. So I'll be taking fork feel more than travel numbers.

 

[Jake From State Farm]

64.0 HT, 76.9 ST, 341 BB.

The reason why a lot of designers run 10-20mm less rear travel in rear is because the rear travel number is axle travel, and fork travel gets reduced by a bit when you factor in HTA (I want to say fork axle travel is usually -15mm from linear travel). Actual travel balance depends a lot on rider style and trails. I ride flats, so always feel like my bikes feel better when rear travel matches front, regardless of what the numbers say. But I could see someone riding really steep, chunky trails with clips preferring to run +20mm fork to soak up the hits and letting the rear skip over rocks. The most important thing is to set it up for what rides well for the trails you actually ride, not the ones you wish you rode.

One deciding factor for me is I actually prefer how the Lyrik feels to the Zeb, but you can't run the Lyrik as 170 anymore. So I'll be taking fork feel more than travel numbers.

I'm in SoCal so I ride a variety of stuff. Lots of chunk and steeps but also a lot of flatter stuff in between. Really depends on the sessions but I'd rather be over biked on flatter stuff than under biked on more technical steeper trails. I get you though. I ride flats too but also ride clipless sometimes just to get more comfortable on them when I wanna use them. The good thing with SC and VPP is that it's pretty responsive and requires a 22-25% rear sag even at longer travel.

 

[Redlemon]

I'm in SoCal so I ride a variety of stuff. Lots of chunk and steeps but also a lot of flatter stuff in between. Really depends on the sessions but I'd rather be over biked on flatter stuff than under biked on more technical steeper trails. I get you though. I ride flats too but also ride clipless sometimes just to get more comfortable on them when I wanna use them. The good thing with SC and VPP is that it's pretty responsive and requires a 22-25% rear sag even at longer travel.

Only the V10 requires such low sag which is actually 21-24%.

Pretty much all other trail/enduro/eMTB from Santa Cruz are 29-32% recommended sag, including Heckler SL.

 

[Jake From State Farm]

Only the V10 requires such low sag which is actually 21-24%.

Pretty much all other trail/enduro/eMTB from Santa Cruz are 29-32% recommended sag, including Heckler SL.

Yeah that's what I'm running on the SL. I run 22% of the V10. I just meant the platform feels very progressive. Not sure on the exact leverage rate but VPP always feels like it runs pretty stiff.

 

[LautSprecher]

Fresh build.

 

[Rodres]

Fresh build.
View attachment 147786

Looking awesome!
Wondering if that ring controller cable is too floppy without the dropper cable to guide it?

 

[LautSprecher]

Looking awesome!
Wondering if that ring controller cable is too floppy without the dropper cable to guide it?

I did attach it to the bar. No problem.
It was said 1000 times but not by me: the ring controller feels so fkn cheap. Hope their will be an updated one soon.

 

[rätch]

Hey Guys, anyone riding the new Vivid air with approx. 75kg/165lbs rider weight?

What setup are you running on the Vivid? Currently one volume spacer is installed, I'm considering to remove this one and riding completely without it.

 

[Andeh]

I am running mine at whatever pressure the RS Trailhead app says for my naked weight + 15 lbs (to account for bike & gear), with the ebike box unchecked. As far as I can tell, that box just adds like 15-20 lbs to your riding weight to account for extra weight of a full power ebike. I weigh <165 without gear, normally use 172 for pressure calcs, and used 180 for the HSL since it's about 8 lbs heavier than a normal bike. That puts me at 215 psi. My shock has the firmer C37 tune and running 2 tokens. I tried it with 0 and it bottomed out very easily jumping.

 

[LautSprecher]

Try a custom tune - it will change everything.

 

[rätch]

I am running mine at whatever pressure the RS Trailhead app says for my naked weight + 15 lbs (to account for bike & gear), with the ebike box unchecked. As far as I can tell, that box just adds like 15-20 lbs to your riding weight to account for extra weight of a full power ebike. I weigh <165 without gear, normally use 172 for pressure calcs, and used 180 for the HSL since it's about 8 lbs heavier than a normal bike. That puts me at 215 psi. My shock has the firmer C37 tune and running 2 tokens. I tried it with 0 and it bottomed out very easily jumping.

Thanks for your feedback! I'm running die Vivid with C34 tune and 1 token. My worry is also to drive quickly into the bottom out without token(s). Perhaps it would be worth testing it without and adujst the hbo against the bottom out.

Try a custom tune - it will change everything.

I'm near Austria - but do not know any tuner for the Vivid

 

[LautSprecher]

Thanks for your feedback! I'm running die Vivid with C34 tune and 1 token. My worry is also to drive quickly into the bottom out without token(s). Perhaps it would be worth testing it without and adujst the hbo against the bottom out.


I'm near Austria - but do not know any tuner for the Vivid

Anyrace in Bavaria. They need the shock for 1 - 2 weeks.
A bit pricey but it’s totally worth it.

 

[rätch]

Anyrace in Bavaria. They need the shock for 1 - 2 weeks.
A bit pricey but it’s totally worth it.

I've checked their website - that's really pricey, you're right

 

[LautSprecher]

I've checked their website - that's really pricey, you're right

You‘ll get a performance out of the VPP you never experienced. New bike then.
You‘ll be angry about the performance of your fork after that.

 

[rätch]

The stock performance is already really good, I'm happy with that. But I struggle with the utilization of the full travel. The last mm are not used, even when HBO, LCS + HSC are adjusted to fully open. Also with released air and full body weight sitting on the bike.

 

[Weeksy]

The stock performance is already really good, I'm happy with that. But I struggle with the utilization of the full travel. The last mm are not used, even when HBO, LCS + HSC are adjusted to fully open. Also with released air and full body weight sitting on the bike.

HAve you measured it to see how much it's using ? Not all shocks/forks have the 'end' of the travel at the end of the sliders etc... So it could be that it looks like it's not, but it actually is ?

 

[Andeh]

The stock performance is already really good, I'm happy with that. But I struggle with the utilization of the full travel. The last mm are not used, even when HBO, LCS + HSC are adjusted to fully open. Also with released air and full body weight sitting on the bike.

At full bottom out, the O-ring will not reach the end of the stanchion, there's about 1-2mm of free space in reserve (roughly a bit more than 1 O-ring's width).

On both my Vivids with C37 tunes, I run 2 tokens, 30% sag, and HBO fully closed / +, it bottoms out on any jump over ~3'/1m but I can't feel it because it's such a memory foam feeling at the end.

 

[rätch]

HAve you measured it to see how much it's using ? Not all shocks/forks have the 'end' of the travel at the end of the sliders etc... So it could be that it looks like it's not, but it actually is ?

At full bottom out, the O-ring will not reach the end of the stanchion, there's about 1-2mm of free space in reserve (roughly a bit more than 1 O-ring's width).

On both my Vivids with C37 tunes, I run 2 tokens, 30% sag, and HBO fully closed / +, it bottoms out on any jump over ~3'/1m but I can't feel it because it's such a memory foam feeling at the end.

Looks like there are 50mm of travel in use, same result without air sitting on the bike. 1-2 mm should always be free, ok. But the last 5mm are missing according to the measuring tape. However, 55mm should be available