Rail (750Wh) 2022 Bosch Smart 750 Trek Rail Thread

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Great resource, thanks!

According to the description on the Trek site, it looks like that the replacement part you linked comes with the bearing cover as well??

It arrived already and it didn't come with it - I think they also sell a complete kit, that includes all of it. But the top bearing cover is the Knock Block cover as far as I can work out!

 

[DubbyMcDubs]

It arrived already and it didn't come with it - I think they also sell a complete kit, that includes all of it. But the top bearing cover is the Knock Block cover as far as I can work out!

Cool. I think the dropdown on the part page is misleading.

I have a medium 22 Rail 7 with Fox 38's. Hopefully I have the clearance to delete the knock block and run a conventional stem setup.

 

[Paul Mac]

Any body seen or heard of any 2022 Rail 9.8 or 9.9 in medium out there yet?
All I've seen are larges or XLs

 

[MOTO13]

The Bosch is absolutely a great motor. But, boy do their controls suck. If they could get the controls like the Shimano, it would be a perfect set up. I own both Bosch Gen 4 bikes and EP8's. I have come to REALLY like the EP8. And the EP8 controls on my Tazer MX Pro are wayyyyy better than the Bosch. No contest. Bosch has their head stuck up their collective asses on their control system and tuneability. But, you can't deny in pure stock form their motor is great.

 

[DubbyMcDubs]

The Bosch is absolutely a great motor. But, boy do their controls suck. If they could get the controls like the Shimano, it would be a perfect set up. I own both Bosch Gen 4 bikes and EP8's. I have come to REALLY like the EP8. And the EP8 controls on my Tazer MX Pro are wayyyyy better than the Bosch. No contest. Bosch has their head stuck up their collective asses on their control system and tuneability. But, you can't deny in pure stock form their motor is great.

At some point someone has to make a CAN bus converter, along with some custom firmware for the Shimano display, so we can run the shimano controls on the bosch system.

 

[Gee_Whiz]

Do the 2022's exist in the US as of yet? My local Trek mentioned that they dont show them on their incoming inventory sheet for anytime this year

 

[Jhagst]

Yes, last week big bowl bike shop in Petaluma California had large and Ext large 9.8 XTs in stock

 

[Gee_Whiz]

Yes, last week big bowl bike shop in Petaluma California had large and Ext large 9.8 XTs in stock

Thanks!

 

[Hamina]

The Bosch is absolutely a great motor. But, boy do their controls suck. If they could get the controls like the Shimano, it would be a perfect set up. I own both Bosch Gen 4 bikes and EP8's. I have come to REALLY like the EP8. And the EP8 controls on my Tazer MX Pro are wayyyyy better than the Bosch. No contest. Bosch has their head stuck up their collective asses on their control system and tuneability. But, you can't deny in pure stock form their motor is great.

Are you talking about the 2020 GEN4 or the newest 2022 BES3 system?

 

[MOTO13]

I'm not a fan of either one.

 

[davosaurusrex]

@Rob Rides EMTB
Apologies if covered elsewhere but what are your thoughts on 21 XL vs 22 L, handling, battery, geo, interface etc?

Also (if you can remember with all the bikes you test) how the Rails compare to the 2019 E- Sommet you tested? Ta!

 

[Gee_Whiz]

Picked up mine today
2022 Trek 9.8 XT size XL, I upgraded the rims to carbon Line Pro 30, suspension mods next. I went for a small ride today. I do like it better than the 2021 9.7 I had.

View attachment 82335

View attachment 82336

@Jhagst can I ask how tall you are, and how comfortable you feel on this version of the Trek XL vs your other recent bikes?

 

[Jhagst]

I’m 6’2” with a long torso and a bad back. I need the extra room to stretch out otherwise my lower back hurts.
I had a ‘21 Rail in XL, that bike definitely turned better than my ‘22 XL Rail. The ‘21 felt a little cramped for me, the ‘22 fits me better. I’m very happy with my purchase. I had a Santa Cruz Bullet in XL too, that felt amazing but the EP8 motor doesn’t compare to the Bosch. If Santa Cruz put a Bosch motor in…that would be the ultimate bike.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

If you want to totally delete and remove the Trek Knock Block here's what you need.

Part H2271A headset bearing cover - cost £7.64 here
Part W1048249 Non Block frame Chip - cost £10.99 here

Pros
Can use any stem you want, not just the Trek Knockblock Stems
Can use any stack height you want (just like most other bikes out there!)
No need to use the proprietary Knock Block Spacer Adapter (£18.99 price)
No need to use the proprietary Trek knock block stem spacers, use standard ones instead
Cleaner looking stem without Treks bulkier looking lock ring

Cons
If you are a complete numpty and do a spectacular crash you may be extremely unlucky and damage the display, the bars would need to hyper rotate at force to do proper damage I'd have thought. You can buy a new one here for £93.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

@Rob Rides EMTB
Apologies if covered elsewhere but what are your thoughts on 21 XL vs 22 L, handling, battery, geo, interface etc?

Also (if you can remember with all the bikes you test) how the Rails compare to the 2019 E- Sommet you tested? Ta!

There's not a huge amount in it between the previous gen XL and the current Large, in terms of handling / performance.

Biggest difference by far is the new Bosch Smart System and 750Wh battery.

PS - Mapping is definitely coming to the new Bosch Smart. I sent them a message and they publicly responded:

"Hi. Thank you for your detailed feedback and suggestions for improvement. We understand your concern and have good news for you: The navigation function is in the starting blocks. We will provide the update soon, so hold on a little longer. Your Bosch Bike Team"

I bloody love the bike by the way, in the setup I now have its so darn good!!

 

[DubbyMcDubs]

There's not a huge amount in it between the previous gen XL and the current Large, in terms of handling / performance.

Biggest difference by far is the new Bosch Smart System and 750Wh battery.

PS - Mapping is definitely coming to the new Bosch Smart. I sent them a message and they publicly responded:

"Hi. Thank you for your detailed feedback and suggestions for improvement. We understand your concern and have good news for you: The navigation function is in the starting blocks. We will provide the update soon, so hold on a little longer. Your Bosch Bike Team"

I bloody love the bike by the way, in the setup I now have its so darn good!!

View attachment 82812

I look forward to your thoughts on the Ohlins on the Rail. I am thinking of waiting for stock and put one on my 22 Rail 7, and have the Cane Creek progressive spring waiting in the parts drawer

 

[Jhagst]

@Rob, your bike looks great! Nice work

 

[Gee_Whiz]

@Rob Rides EMTB How would you compare the weight and nimbleness of the bike to the Orbea Rise? Obv the Rise is quite a bit lighter.. but is the Trek able to be ridden manually, off of the motor? Do you feel like you can maneuver as well as the Rise through tight spots etc? And does it feel like a heavy bike overall? The Rail seems to be the lightest of the full bikes, so curious how they compare.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

@Rob Rides EMTB How would you compare the weight and nimbleness of the bike to the Orbea Rise? Obv the Rise is quite a bit lighter.. but is the Trek able to be ridden manually, off of the motor? Do you feel like you can maneuver as well as the Rise through tight spots etc? And does it feel like a heavy bike overall? The Rail seems to be the lightest of the full bikes, so curious how they compare.

Totally different. The Rise feels way more XC and trail oriented in geometry and whilst lighter and more nimble it’s way more twitchy.

Rail is definitely just as capable on everything the Rise is, but absolutely smashes the Rise on anything technical / more aggressive stuff.

Personally I would prefer riding the Rail on every single scenario compared to the Rise.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Just to add more on the above, weight doesn’t bother me personally as much on an ebike. So it’s just my personal preference. There will be others that will prefer the handling of the Rise and the ease of living with a bike that’s 4-5 KG lighter

 

[Gee_Whiz]

Just to add more on the above, weight doesn’t bother me personally as much on an ebike. So it’s just my personal preference. There will be others that will prefer the handling of the Rise and the ease of living with a bike that’s 4-5 KG lighter

Thanks Rob! One other question, do you feel as though the Rail might be TOO much bike for just XC, Greens, Blues and some Black or would it still be just as fun?

 

[Jhagst]

I wasn’t happy with the Rockshock Zeb and wanted to install a pair of Fox38’s I had.
The ‘22 Rail 9.8 & 9.9 is equipped with a 1.8” tapered steer tube. To run a standard fork with a 1.5 taper you need a 1.8/1.5 crown race reducer. Unfortunately it seems there are none available in the States. I made a sleeve to adapt the stock Rockshock crown race to my Fox 38 forks. Once pressed together it seems like it will work until adapter crown races are available…supposedly sometime in August.

 

[Yoak]

A little off topic maybe, but is there a way to put a big crown Zeb from my Rail on my Slash that runs a Lyrik at the moment?

 

[Jhagst]

@Yoak, I guess that would depend on how large your head tube is. The 1.8 takes a huge bearing

 

[Sofaboy73]

I wasn’t happy with the Rockshock Zeb and wanted to install a pair of Fox38’s I had.
The ‘22 Rail 9.8 & 9.9 is equipped with a 1.8” tapered steer tube. To run a standard fork with a 1.5 taper you need a 1.8/1.5 crown race reducer.

have they changed the head tube on the new rail?

on my old 2020 (sadly now stolen) rail, it was plug an play when i upgraded the fork to fox 38's - used the exiting headset and crown race. i'm not sure if i'm missing something here but the fox 38's are 1 1/8 to 1.5 tapered as was the head set fitted on the old rails? why do you need a spacer / extra thick crown race on the bottom bearing?

or is this just and ascetics thing of the oversized CSU crown on the forks that come with the rail?

 

[Jhagst]

Yes, new head tube on 2022 9.8 & 9.9. The fork is 1.8 -1 1/8 tapered. The 9.7's and lower still use the standard 1.5 taperd fork

 

[Sofaboy73]

Yes, new head tube on 2022 9.8 & 9.9. The fork is 1.8 -1 1/8 tapered. The 9.7's and lower still use the standard 1.5 taperd fork

Brilliant, just what we need, another new ‘standard’ to make cross comparability increasingly difficult!

 

[Jhagst]

Unfortunately this “Super Taper” is still new. With all the supply issues, it seems like the aftermarket support is a bit delayed. Just trying to explain what a 1.8” tapered steer tube was to the local bike stores or online vendors was a challenge.

But it was all worth it, the 170mm Fox 38 with a Smashpot coil conversion and Ohlins shock are magical. My skill and ability are the only thing holding the bike back.

 

[InRustWeTrust]

There's not a huge amount in it between the previous gen XL and the current Large, in terms of handling / performance.

Biggest difference by far is the new Bosch Smart System and 750Wh battery.

PS - Mapping is definitely coming to the new Bosch Smart. I sent them a message and they publicly responded:

"Hi. Thank you for your detailed feedback and suggestions for improvement. We understand your concern and have good news for you: The navigation function is in the starting blocks. We will provide the update soon, so hold on a little longer. Your Bosch Bike Team"

I bloody love the bike by the way, in the setup I now have its so darn good!!

View attachment 82812

The fork that sits on, is it a fox 38 that is made for e-bikes or is it just a regular fox 38 that is ebike tuned ?

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

The fork that sits on, is it a fox 38 that is made for e-bikes or is it just a regular fox 38 that is ebike tuned ?

Fox 38 Ebike Tuned