Levo SL Gen 1 The Reason for delay in 2023 Levo SL...(and various other discussions on lightweight bikes......)

[KnollyBro]

For me because I am still biker and outdoor lover first, I just wanted slight performance help (hence why SL bike). KSL does that, but it also sounds like shit and drowns the sounds of forest. I feel no reason not to be critical of it, it's just simple fact.
For you it isn't problem, then don't mind us saying it is.

I use Eco (30/80) and Trail (40/80) so I need to work a lot to get assistance from the motor, hence I never even use the 35nm, on average it barely gives me 20. And I am ok with that. Just make it more silent, TQ will absolutely juggernaut everything Mahle. Lets just watch all brands jump on it, it's the winning formula.
When I bought Kenevo SL, I wasn't even deciding based on engines, for me it was not a thing. KSL was simply the best bike, it won based on trail performance alone. At the time, there wasn't TQ alternative anyway, but I would have probably still chosen KSL even with the noise since there still isn't bike of same performance (but perhaps the Rotwild G375 and eventual Transition will get very close). Bike performance was 90perc. of choice, 10perc. was me deciding between engines. Reading this forum I know it's more balanced towards the engine choice for many, but doesn't mean all.

Light-weight e-bikes are niche category so it makes sense it will attract people with very specific preferences.
I don't give a fuck about power :- ). I don't like writting negative posts like this because it reminds me we are all very priviledged well-earning people arguing about expensive toys.
But I am still surprised why other feel the need to sound surprised when we voice different opinion on priorities. Voice yours, don't comment on others.
Suns_SPD has been making great observations and seems to just rile people up. He isn't criticizing your choice of bike, he's just trying to find perfect his. You don't need to defend your bike or keep posting it.

If the "KSL was simply the best bike, it won based on trail performance alone."... "At the time, there wasn't TQ alternative anyway, but I would have probably still chosen KSL even with the noise since there still isn't bike of same performance"
then I am not sure why you are complaining about the noise, especially in a thread primarily about the next Levo SL. In future, if you going to quote me, you should at least try to understand the intention of my post. IF and WHEN Specialized releases their next model, it will be on their terms, based on their market research and most riders will end up customizing their bikes to suite their riding area and style. I am not posting a picture of my bike to defend it, I posted that picture because its an oxymoron and its a nice picture

THIS picture also describes MY frustration with Specialized. Feel free to comment. I can't hear you over the noise of your motor

 

[chamaruco]

What an odd accusation.

Yes, when I register for a forum Google uses my saved photo automatically that I chose as they are the best part of me and I'm very proud of my family. I'm not hiding.

People were questioning why there are issues between e- bikers and bike riders and I gave my honest experience from someone that is pro e-bike, and was promptly attacked; which I find is typical within a segment of the community.

Love e-bikes but if you live in a place with multi use, bidirectional, poor sight line trails, they need to be regulated appropriately as they are motorized and therefore not just 'a bike' as many pro e-bikers like to claim.

I think you are a funny fake. Thanks for this sunday

 

[Chicane]

Let's get back to the SL and how quite the motor is. The first Ebike I ever rode was the SL back in Nov. 21 when I was curious about ebikes after having some knee issues and my demo was a 26 mile ride on my familiar trails. It took the pressure off my knees just enough and had me grinning with excitement, but that vacuum cleaner motor wind was very evident and even had me shutting the motor off as I passed others. I will have to admit that it was a little embarrassing, but I figured it was normal for all ebikes at the time. Despite the noise, the SL has enough power for me and I almost bought one about 3 -4 different times, until the Rise was dropped. I ended up with a Rise 6 months later and I prefer the extra power and the current geo of the Rise. I'm another waiting patiently to see what this new SL is all about compared to the Trek and Pivot.

 

[KnollyBro]

Let's get back to the SL and how quite the motor is. The first Ebike I ever rode was the SL back in Nov. 21 when I was curious about ebikes after having some knee issues and my demo was a 26 mile ride on my familiar trails. It took the pressure off my knees just enough and had me grinning with excitement, but that vacuum cleaner motor wind was very evident and even had me shutting the motor off as I passed others. I will have to admit that it was a little embarrassing, but I figured it was normal for all ebikes at the time. Despite the noise, the SL has enough power for me and I almost bought one about 3 -4 different times, until the Rise was dropped. I ended up with a Rise 6 months later and I prefer the extra power and the current geo of the Rise. I'm another waiting patiently to see what this new SL is all about compared to the Trek and Pivot.

The Rise looks like a nice bike and with it less than a year old, what significant changes are looking for from the Levo SL compared to the Rise? Would you upgrade so soon?

 

[Zimmerframe]

its a nice picture

Despite everyone's differing views on motor noise/it's importance/power numbers/their importance .... there's no denying that it's a great looking bike !!!! When it's descending, which is the main reason you have a KSL, motor noise is irrelevant.

 

[Chicane]

The Rise looks like a nice bike and with it less than a year old, what significant changes are looking for from the Levo SL compared to the Rise? Would you upgrade so soon?

Mainly looking for a plusher rear suspension and wanting to try something new with a different ride feel just because I can and I'm curious. I will demo the Pivot Sl when my LBS gets one and they also sell Specialized, so demoing the SL will also be possible. I would also like to ride the Trek Exe, but demoing this bike is almost impossible.

I've owned the Rise for almost 1 1/2 years now and still like everything about the bike and in no hurry to get rid of it. The power output is perfect for everything I ride (set at 56nm max) great battery range and I have no complaints overall. I've also had zero issues with the bike or motor, but as the 2 year warranty comes near and the way Shimano responds, sometimes it's better to sell while the value is still decent.

 

[Suns_PSD]

If the sound of nature is more important, you are a strong climber and you are limited as to where you are able to ride your emtb, why do have an emtb if you don't see the need to go faster? Asking for a friend.

Well, I have a small fleet of bikes, and we have different trails and situations locally. So the e-bike won't be for all trails. I will continue to use my Spur for example for the chunky windy XC style trails that are in my back yard as it's appropriate and I already average about 11 mph on them.

Some trails here are wholly inappropriate for an e-bike (imagine children playing in the middle of the trails, which actually happens here as the trails are in the middle of a large metro area), some other trails are motorcycle legal and directional which are also great for e-bikes, some are private land where you pedal up a dirt road for 25 minutes for a 4 minute descent, and a couple that I intend to ride on a mid-power e-bike definitely don't allow e-bikes however they are very steep with no traffic and certainly no bi-directional traffic so it's entirely safe and unnoticed for other trail users. There are also bike trips I take where e-bikes are allowed, like Bentonville and possibly others.

I greatly enjoy pedaling my bike, breathing really hard, all of that. It's all that's keeping me youthful and somewhat skinny. I'm just a bit tired of pedaling uphill 80% of the time for 20% flat/ downhill. Trying to make it a bit more equal by speeding up the climbs a bit, that's all. This is why I'm buying my first e-bike, almost certainly the new Spesh SL, the Transition Relay (currently in the lead) or the Forestal Siryon. The segment is changing quickly and I'm not rushing in to a decision but will purchase by the Spring when more options have been shown.

Certainly, I recognize that other people live in real mountains, where you pedal up a dirt road for an hour+ and then have a one-way descent, long sight lines, very empty trails and so on. Power would be a primary consideration in that circumstance. But I don't. The majority of our trails are bi-directional and just undulating, so our needs and even what is appropriate and safe for other trail user has to be considered.

I have ridden full powered e-bikes, and I'm aware that the watts produced is only in the neighborhood of 1 hp. However, this is not equivalent to an only 1 hp motorcycle because the rolling resistance and weight are dramatically less combined with instantaneous torque, plus the stealthy-ness of e-bikes. This creates a need for careful consideration where they can be used in consideration of the safety of other trail users.

That's not meant as a jab or attack on anyone, so please no name calling. This is just what I've experienced.

 

[Suns_PSD]

View attachment 100402

Despite everyone's differing views on motor noise/it's importance/power numbers/their importance .... there's no denying that it's a great looking bike !!!! When it's descending, which is the main reason you have a KSL, motor noise is irrelevant.

It's the best available combo currently imo and the sale prices recently were super tempting.

 

[Doomanic]

I greatly enjoy pedaling my bike, breathing really hard,

Me too, just not at the same time... ©Bambam

 

[Losiak]

I just saw new Specialized Poland reel on FB and Instagram with old Green Levo SL with loud engine ? maybe new model is around conrer ? It doesn't make sens to make ads with almost 3 years old bike and loud whiiii from engine?
Maybe this guy going somwhere to pickup new one

 

[chamaruco]

Yes, the claim is SOUNDS GOOD! proud to be whiiii

 

[Loamranger]

It's a bit crazy really .

It's still the same bike it was ! It's not degraded, dissolved. The main difference is marketing BS. Admittedly Spesh are one of the worst for pushing that, so you could argue they're victims of their own success

The Levo SL thread was one of the most active threads there ever was. The bike still pulls 300w from the battery - pretty much the same as any of the other bikes in the "lightweight" category. Yes, the quoted torque is less, but for all bikes that varies through the cadence range. It's a smaller motor than a FF, there is no magic. Efficiency of motors and batteries hasn't changed/improved.

For 99% of the people buying them, they'll still be amazing, more reliable than most of the competition, better service and backup than most of the competition. Yes, the motor's not silent, but hell, not everyone who buys an e-bike is worried by some whine.

Everyone will want the new one with more torque .. but you use that, you have less range .. so we have 100 threads about how cool everyone is that they only use their NEW SL2 only ever on Eco ! Then they start with the threads wanting a lighter lightweight as they get back with 50% battery .

Agree entirely and for many people 35Nm is enough.

 

[Lightme]

Why did they pick this? Dude looks like he’s coming home from 5th grade class, For the 6th year in a row.

It’s Adam Ondra. Probably the best rock climber in the world.

 

[p3eps]

According to Rob’s Insta stories, he’s in Spain testing a new top secret bike. Does anyone know what it is… or could it be the 2023 Levo SL?!

 

[Mteam]

According to Rob’s Insta stories, he’s in Spain testing a new top secret bike. Does anyone know what it is… or could it be the 2023 Levo SL?!

My guess is a new orbea wild FS.

 

[Loamranger]

Stop worrying folks, my guess is you won’t see some of these new bikes for sometime, not just Specialized, 2024 earliest I would think.

 

[p3eps]

My LBS were still confident last weekend that they were going to see a new SL this month.

 

[Ou812]

There’s been tons of sighting of the new bikes already, I’ve seen the Spesh guys out riding them myself. I don’t know why Spesh is still dragging their feet with the release, the people I know that were in the market for a light e-bike have went with other brands.

 

[chamaruco]

In Spain to test specialized hurting the local manufactures..orbea &co. Maleficent!

 

[sdcoffeeroaster]

There’s been tons of sighting of the new bikes already, I’ve seen the Spesh guys out riding them myself. I don’t know why Spesh is still dragging their feet with the release, the people I know that were in the market for a light e-bike have went with other brands.

Companies drag their feet for the obvious reason that the product is not finished yet, has issues they are working out and/or might not meet spec. Marketing will always try to push hardest for the earliest release in spite of this depending on how well they understand technical issues. It always a tug of war in companies like Specialized. Release early before the product is ready and risk recalls or release late and miss some of that market sales window. Just my experience as a R&D mechanical engineer with 35 years in the medical device industry.

 

[Ou812]

Companies drag their feet for the obvious reason that the product is not finished yet, has issues they are working out and/or might not meet spec. Marketing will always try to push hardest for the earliest release in spite of this depending on how well they understand technical issues. It always a tug of war in companies like Specialized. Release early before the product is ready and risk recalls or release late and miss some of that market sales window. Just my experience as a R&D mechanical engineer with 35 years in the medical device industry.

I chatted with the group that was riding them back in May, they were ready to go back then and I was told the release was coming in the next few weeks. I think they postponed the release after all the other companies started dropping their lightweight bikes, I’m guessing they had to make some last minute changes to make the bike more appealing.

 

[Suns_PSD]

Which is good for us.

 

[Ou812]

Which is good for us.

Definitely, I’m waiting on them to be released before I make up my mind. I’m looking at a frame only to do a custom build. I had planned to do a stumpy Evo custom build but being honest with myself I haven’t really ridden my normal bikes since I bought the e-bike.

 

[Suns_PSD]

Definitely, I’m waiting on them to be released before I make up my mind. I’m looking at a frame only to do a custom build. I had planned to do a stumpy Evo custom build but being honest with myself I haven’t really ridden my normal bikes since I bought the e-bike.

An S-works frame only option, preferably well under $7K, would definitely be the best-case scenario.

Here's hoping.

I have a custom built '21 SJEvo currently and do just love that bike. An electrified version of the same sounds just right.

 

[Doomanic]

An S-works frame only option, preferably well under $7K, would definitely be the best-case scenario.

The current model is available as a frameset, but it's a bit more than you're hoping for. I see no reason why the new model would be cheaper.

 

[Ou812]

An S-works frame only option, preferably well under $7K, would definitely be the best-case scenario.

Here's hoping.

I have a custom built '21 SJEvo currently and do just love that bike. An electrified version of the same sounds just right.

I doubt it would be under $7k, the current model is on close out at certain shops at $6k. I can get the Pivot Shuttle SL as a frame set for under $7k but my plan is to use parts from one of my other bikes to do a build, I have nothing that’s super boost so I’d have to build a new wheel set.

 

[Suns_PSD]

I don't get why these e- bikes cost so much, and I'm not particularly price sensitive. A battery an electric motor doesn't cost very much. I get your paying for development but it's really high what they are asking.

That said, yeah, a frame set will likely run $8,399 US or something, which would personally lead me wait a bit longer for the Relay or the performance version of the Siryon.

 

[p3eps]

What I find crazy is that at the moment, I can order a Kenevo SL frame only for £6850… or a Kenevo SL Comp for £5949.

Apart from the colour / stickers, the frames are exactly the same. OK, the frame only comes with carbon cranks and a better shock… but for £900 LESS you’re getting a whole bike!!

IF this new Levo SL ticks all the boxes, then I intend ordering a frame only and stripping my 2019 Levo SL down for parts. There may be a few new bits required, but I hope that my 2019 frame (which had a new engine fitted a few months back) will sell for a few quid and help recoup some of the upgrade costs.

 

[Doomanic]

I can order a Kenevo SL frame only for £6850… or a Kenevo SL Comp for £5949.

The Comp doesn't come with the feeling of smug superiority that the S-Works engenders though...

 

[Dax]

Yep and the carbon is the exact same from comp to sworks. Literally no reason other than color and sticker to buy an sworks when you can sell parts for a comp and upgrade bike to beyond sworks

But how do you whisper ‘I did this in the most expensive way possible’ to your riding buddies, if your frame doesn’t say ‘sworks’?