Serious issues with Rise LTD CARBON crank arms

RonDank

New Member
May 1, 2021
5
5
Israel
4 weeks ago me and my ridding friend received our brand new Orbea Rise M-LTD. What an excitement! A week later while ridding on a steep trail my left crank arm fell off, I lost the cap and luckily did not harm my self. Next morning I went to the shop where I bought the bike from and they in turn talked to Orbea in Spain to understand better the issue. Orbea recommendation were to use a 14 Nm torque and thread locker/ lock tite. Unfortunately they have not mentioned that other buyers had the same issue!!! Well enough two days later my friend had exactly the same issue; the left crank arm fell and the cap was-lost.

We got really furious and wrote a detailed extremely strong email to Recycles the official importer of Orbea into Israel demanding an official response to the matter. It is no fun, frighting and dangerous experience.

Not few hours had passed and I received a phone call from the manager of Recycles Israel, apologising for the inconvenience and reassuring me that he personally going to bring up the issue with Orbea in Spain. Well enough the following day I received another phone call from the manager saying that he has spoken with Orbea, who apparently were well aware of similar issues around the wold, and offered me and my friend to replace the e-thirteen carbon crank arm with Shimano XTR crank arms, at no cost to us. He also suggested that he will find a way to compensate us for the trouble we went through. Within a day he supplied the new Shimano XTR crank arms and replaced it for us! Wow what a service….

There is no doubt what-so-ever that the e-13 crank arms are not the right ones for these kind of e-bikes. They have only one single bolt to attach the arm to the Shimano EP 8 drive, without thread lock and not using the special hole the Shimano has in the drive of the motor to allow a small hook to be inserted in to give an extra strength to the arm!

Shimano’s crank arms all have 2 bolts, thread locks and a small hook to be inserted into the motor drive spindle.

I believe and demand that Orbea should order a recall for all its’ Rise M-LTD and replace these faulty, wrong, unsafe, dangerous e-13 crank arms! It was only a miracle that I was not heart when losing the crank arm while ridding a technical trail.

It is nice that Orbea are trying to produce a light e-bike, but at what cost? The cost of the safety of their ridders?

I read that there were some issues with the chainring of e-13 as well!

I want a reassurance, in writing, from Orbea Spain that their ridder’s safety is in their top priority and that they are going to recall and change the crank arms to all its Rise LTD ridders, as well as a thorough investigation of the quality of the chainring.

Once again I want to thank Recycles, the importer of Orbea into Israel, and their manager, as well the owner of the shop in Netanya were I bought the bike and got the service from, for a quick and professional handling of the matter. A pleasure to have such a service from a supplier!

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Zimmerframe

MUPPET
Subscriber
Jun 12, 2019
14,028
20,818
Brittany, France
This might help.

 

Bigtuna00

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
556
337
CA
Shimano’s crank arms all have 2 bolts, thread locks and a small hook to be inserted into the motor drive spindle.

I was wondering about those holes in the spindle. My e13 cranks seemed to be lined up with them, but I couldn't figure out why. However, looking at the Shimano plate, I can't say I believe that would make a huge difference (part is Y0J698050). Seems like something that's useful to speed assembly, but not a safety feature. I.e. it may prevent the crank from falling off in your garage while you're digging for your torque wrench, but there's no way that tiny pin is going to do anything useful when riding.

I don't agree that a two-bolt system is inherently "safer". There's more opportunity for improper torquing and if one of the bolts fails there's no guarantee the second one will be tight enough to prevent failure.

In all cases so far (thinking of the alloy cranks as well) it appears to be a case of improper assembly. Keep in mind the cap is not for retention. It's for preload during assembly. Just because your cap falls off doesn't mean your crank will fall off. The cranks fall off because they are improperly tightened. Or, said another way, you could remove the caps after installing the cranks. They're no longer needed. Note: I'm not saying go remove your caps, I'm pointing out there's no way an aluminum cap tightened to 2NM is going to retain your cranks.

This might help.

Yes and no. That thread is for the *alloy* crank arms and e13 already has a TSB for this:


If the carbon cranks have a problem as well, the TSB needs to be updated.

I noticed when I pulled my cranks the other other day only one of the caps was a bit hard to get off and it appears it had loctite applied, but the other was really easy to get off and had no loctite.

@e*thirteen Components would appreciate your input here.
 

Bigtuna00

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
556
337
CA
I think in fairness they expect the motor to fail before the cranks on the brose :p :ROFLMAO: (Brose owner) ...
Indeed that was my bad, I put the wrong link, meant to link to the root-level folder for user manuals. It's fixed. But, can confirm, I am on motor #3 from Brose and my cranks are fine :)
 

Zimmerframe

MUPPET
Subscriber
Jun 12, 2019
14,028
20,818
Brittany, France
Indeed that was my bad, I put the wrong link, meant to link to the root-level folder for user manuals. It's fixed. But, can confirm, I am on motor #3 from Brose and my cranks are fine :)
Oooh, excellent .. you fall into my "Superhero" group for a parallel project of three or more. One more for the list.
 

Bigtuna00

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
556
337
CA
My cranks have QR codes embedded on them, but those codes just point to User Manuals – ethirteen support, which of course has no manual for these cranks.

One of my crank arms had a flimsy QR sticker placed over one of the embedded QR codes. Unfortunately it doesn't go anywhere :(

PXL_20210501_205444271.jpg
 

Bigkatoomer

Member
Feb 25, 2021
56
88
Surrey, England
Thanks for sharing the problem here. I'm going to refit my slightly creaking cranks tonight on my M10 (2 bolt Alloy e13). Before I do, can anyone help confirm the torque settings and crucially (because I'm a fat-fingered idiot) if there are any reverse threads to be aware of on the caps or cranks?
 

kmruuska

Member
Apr 25, 2021
8
33
Luxembourg
Thanks for sharing the problem here. I'm going to refit my slightly creaking cranks tonight on my M10 (2 bolt Alloy e13). Before I do, can anyone help confirm the torque settings and crucially (because I'm a fat-fingered idiot) if there are any reverse threads to be aware of on the caps or cranks?

E*13 service bulletin says first 2Nm on the preload cap and then 14Nm on both bolts alternating while you tighten. Please remove the seal ring on the inside of the crank and apply threadlocker on the preload cap threads. No reverse threads here.
 

RickBullotta

E*POWAH Elite World Champion
Jun 5, 2019
1,849
1,579
USA
It is bothersome that there has been no formal TSB/recall for the carbon cranks. Mine also fell off, and I was able to get it reliably functioning with 3rd party alloy preload caps, 242 Threadlocker, removing the seal/spacer, and 2 Nm/14 Nm torque as with the alloy cranks.

If Orbea offered me to replace the cranks with XTR crank arms, I'd probably take the offer, but I'd ask them to compensate me with something for the additional weight of the XTR arms vs the lightweight crankset I paid for.
 

R120

Moderator
Subscriber
Apr 13, 2018
7,819
9,190
Surrey
It is bothersome that there has been no formal TSB/recall for the carbon cranks. Mine also fell off, and I was able to get it reliably functioning with 3rd party alloy preload caps, 242 Threadlocker, removing the seal/spacer, and 2 Nm/14 Nm torque as with the alloy cranks.

If Orbea offered me to replace the cranks with XTR crank arms, I'd probably take the offer, but I'd ask them to compensate me with something for the additional weight of the XTR arms vs the lightweight crankset I paid for.

What the weight difference - I would take the XTR all day long, I doubt it’s more that 150g
 

RonDank

New Member
May 1, 2021
5
5
Israel
What the weight difference - I would take the XTR all day long, I doubt it’s more that 150g
As far as I have been told when they replaced my crank arms from the carbon e-thirteen to the Shimano XTR the weight difference for the pair is 70 grams. For me it worth every gram.....!
 

b33k34

Member
Apr 15, 2021
269
99
UK
I remain really puzzled by the problems with these. The crank interface should be sound - it's exactly the same as the one Shimano are using isn't it? Also odd that the preload bolt is falling out (with or without thread lock). On regular shimano cranks once the pinch bolts are tightened (to 14nm based on label on the cranks,. same as e13 spec) it's pretty much impossible to remove the preload bolt - some part of the crank must press on it or the whole axle compresses just enough to hold it tightly. but once the pinch bolts are loosened it's only hand tight...
 

RonDank

New Member
May 1, 2021
5
5
Israel
I remain really puzzled by the problems with these. The crank interface should be sound - it's exactly the same as the one Shimano are using isn't it? Also odd that the preload bolt is falling out (with or without thread lock). On regular shimano cranks once the pinch bolts are tightened (to 14nm based on label on the cranks,. same as e13 spec) it's pretty much impossible to remove the preload bolt - some part of the crank must press on it or the whole axle compresses just enough to hold it tightly. but once the pinch bolts are loosened it's only hand tight...
I believe that every thing is explained quite clear in the first post of this thread.
We are talking here only regarding the Rise M-LTD models which come with carbon e-thirteen crank arms. All other models are supplied with alloy crank arms. The carbon one are with one bolt only! Mine fell while paddling and my friend’s one fell as well few days later. Both were replaced by the local dealer, who received authorisation from Orbea Spain, to a Shimano XTR ( which is in line with all the rest of the components in the Rise M-LTD).
 

b33k34

Member
Apr 15, 2021
269
99
UK
I believe that every thing is explained quite clear in the first post of this thread.
We are talking here only regarding the Rise M-LTD models which come with carbon e-thirteen crank arms. All other models are supplied with alloy crank arms. The carbon one are with one bolt only! Mine fell while paddling and my friend’s one fell as well few days later. Both were replaced by the local dealer, who received authorisation from Orbea Spain, to a Shimano XTR ( which is in line with all the rest of the components in the Rise M-LTD).
Ok - I had misread these posts and was sure people were also reporting issues with the alloy cranks.

see here - Cranks for EP8 motor - EMTB Forums
 
Last edited:

chrismechmaster

Well-known member
Subscriber
Dec 7, 2020
816
420
Newbury
I was wondering about those holes in the spindle. My e13 cranks seemed to be lined up with them, but I couldn't figure out why. However, looking at the Shimano plate, I can't say I believe that would make a huge difference (part is Y0J698050). Seems like something that's useful to speed assembly, but not a safety feature. I.e. it may prevent the crank from falling off in your garage while you're digging for your torque wrench, but there's no way that tiny pin is going to do anything useful when riding.

I don't agree that a two-bolt system is inherently "safer". There's more opportunity for improper torquing and if one of the bolts fails there's no guarantee the second one will be tight enough to prevent failure.

In all cases so far (thinking of the alloy cranks as well) it appears to be a case of improper assembly. Keep in mind the cap is not for retention. It's for preload during assembly. Just because your cap falls off doesn't mean your crank will fall off. The cranks fall off because they are improperly tightened. Or, said another way, you could remove the caps after installing the cranks. They're no longer needed. Note: I'm not saying go remove your caps, I'm pointing out there's no way an aluminum cap tightened to 2NM is going to retain your cranks.


Yes and no. That thread is for the *alloy* crank arms and e13 already has a TSB for this:


If the carbon cranks have a problem as well, the TSB needs to be updated.

I noticed when I pulled my cranks the other other day only one of the caps was a bit hard to get off and it appears it had loctite applied, but the other was really easy to get off and had no loctite.

@e*thirteen Components would appreciate your input here.


e*thirteen are on this forum so it would be good if they reply to us with this issue
I also spend £8300 on a M team and worried about riding it @e*thirteen Components
 

Bigtuna00

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
556
337
CA
e*thirteen are on this forum so it would be good if they reply to us with this issue
I also spend £8300 on a M team and worried about riding it @e*thirteen Components
Yep, tagged them twice but no reply so far. I suspect the issue has grown into a conversation between Orbea and e*thirteen if people are getting their cranks replaced with a different brand under warranty...so we may have to wait for an "official" statement.

On the other hand providing basic documentation with torque values doesn't seem unreasonable...
 

dlgis

Member
Jan 23, 2021
31
12
UK
There’s a recall in the UK. My M10 went back to the shop a couple of weeks ago for the preload and crank bolts to be checked, but nothing replaced as far as I’m aware. There seems to be less creaking from the crank area since it came back.
 

RonDank

New Member
May 1, 2021
5
5
Israel
There’s a recall in the UK. My M10 went back to the shop a couple of weeks ago for the preload and crank bolts to be checked, but nothing replaced as far as I’m aware. There seems to be less creaking from the crank area since it came back.
Recall for what? Try to be precise please:)
 

chrismechmaster

Well-known member
Subscriber
Dec 7, 2020
816
420
Newbury
Yes is possible can you say what’s the recall is for ??
Don’t want to do a 150 mile round trip to find out they apply thread lock ( which I have already done )
 

dlgis

Member
Jan 23, 2021
31
12
UK
Here’s the email from Orbea. Not worth a long trip to a shop if you can hold a spanner.


TECHNICAL BULLETIN - UPDATED SPECIFICATIONS FOR THE ALUMINUM CRANKSET ON THE RISE M20 AND M10
Dear Customer,
Our crankset supplier E-Thirteen has given us new specifications regarding the installation of their aluminum cranks on the EP8 motor. This affects our Rise models that have these cranks mounted on the EP8-RS motor.
The aim is to avoid the problems caused by a poorly tightened crankset that can result in minor loosening, premature wear and even the crank or the preload cap falling off the bike. This poses no risk for the rider, but these effects can shorten the life of the crankset.
The correct adjustments require the use of specific tools and a precise procedure that must be performed by a technician. For this reason, we are requesting that you contact your official Orbea dealer for help. This process will be free of charge for you.
We apologize for any inconvenience caused by this procedure. Our official dealers will be more than happy to answer any questions you might have.
Please remember that you can also contact us using any of the methods indicated on our website.
Sincerely yours.​
 

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