Price of bikes - some thoughts....
- Thread starter Redbikejohn
- Start date
tomato paste
Active member
TP is just one of many examples. The overall point is that you are making a causal argument related to production that does not hold for most industries. At which point the usage of 'Well you know supply has been severely restricted...' doesn't provide meaningful analysis. When cars are sold out of the lot, generally prices don't increase, for either new or used cars. So what is the cause of price increases? It's complicated would be a valid response, or even better: 'I don't know, but I'll go investigate/research'. Then come back with some research or provide the details of your investigation! Falling back on 'Well you know supply...' or 'Well you know demand...' is just lazy conversation.
EDIT: please do note that even TP has a supply chain, and your understanding of what makes bikes componentry 'more complicated' is probably just confirmation bias. Here and here.
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I've spent a career in supply chain & would be amazed if toilet roll, (weird example but let's go with it) is any less complicated a supply chain than anything else, taking into account the totality of actual stuff required to deliver a finished product to consumers. That it's more readily available than say an XTR mech is neither here nor there. Any number of factors can be responsible for resilience within a supply chain, the assumption that it's just simplicity is nothing more than a perception based on not much at all. Certainly not experience of actually making things & delivering them to onward processors.
I think you'll find that in the states there has been high demand for cars. This has caused substantial increases to new car prices with dealers asking huge margins sometimes over the normal price. Second hand prices have also escalated considerably in response to demand.
Meanwhile in Europe, as costs have increased companies are stopping production of lower profit models - the citroen C1 for example - to concentrate on more expensive models.
tomato paste
Active member
Just realized that demand for US car production has been falling steadily for 50 years.
steve_sordy
Wedding Crasher
Isn't that because of overseas competition with lower prices and better specified, more reliable cars?
Sales of light vehicles (whatever that is) are erratic but the trend is up.
www.statista.com
Sales of light vehicles (whatever that is) are erratic but the trend is up.
U.S. light vehicle sales 1976-2023 | Statista
US light vehicle sales neared 14 million in 2022, including light truck and car sales. Light vehicle sales by year in the US have fluctuated in recent years.
www.statista.com
Yes. But as production was cut back due to lack of demand (covid). Then there was suddenly demand - you have more demand than supply and hence - Price increases !
There's only so much shit you can wipe away before it starts to get painful. 
Yeah. pretty much exactly the same process as it takes for raw metals and plastics to end up as an XTR rear mech hanging off an S-worx Levo in Basingstoke.
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You really should consider giving up smoking, it's making you stupid in public.
tomato paste
Active member
To be as clear as possible, this may very well be the case. But, those conditions are not necessarily cause for a change in prices.
The point is that the linkage between price and supply conditions is not so direct nor as simple as 'supply bruh', and more generally, the factor causally related is market power.
Of course they are. Any setback whether that be materials avaialability, labour shortages and any price increase along your supply/manufacturing/distribution chain is costing companies more money.
and No one said it was Bru'
Goanae jist stop whingin like a couple ay spoilt weins?
It doesn't actually matter what you or Rusty think.
tomato paste
Active member
Lots of goods and services face constraints imposed by COVID, and not all prices are increasing like bike prices. Everyone is supporting a narrative created by someone, which may have truthful components. But be mindful that every time you hear stuff like this repeated, there is usually much more going on under the surface, and taking more your money without contest or protest is a part of that verbal positioning.
* sigh *
Of course there is much more going on below the surface in the cycle industry. There always has been and always will be.
You're way off the mark thinking everyone in the chain is conspiring to get rich from the price increases you're stamping your feet about.
probably go back to googling toilet paper facts. You were starting to get the hang of that
Of course there is much more going on below the surface in the cycle industry. There always has been and always will be.
You're way off the mark thinking everyone in the chain is conspiring to get rich from the price increases you're stamping your feet about.
probably go back to googling toilet paper facts. You were starting to get the hang of that
tomato paste
Active member
This is not a statement about the cycling industry. We need people who are aware and capable of sound political economic analysis. Statements and discussions centered on "supply bruh" do not reflect the reality in which we live. This 'neoclassical econ' narrative is deeply unhealthy for almost everyone here. Everyone here can do better, and should!
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Oh do behave.
You're a complete noob to any aspect of cycling who only two years back knew absolutely nothing about bikes at all so please stop trying to herald yourself as some sort of expert analyst for the entire industry.
You keep harping on about narratives. No one actually cares. Especially a bunch of lazy Ebikers. Its just very easy and convenient to whinge about the cost of things online. Hence so many dull threads about it on here.
Thank you for adding humour to this one.
You're a complete noob to any aspect of cycling who only two years back knew absolutely nothing about bikes at all so please stop trying to herald yourself as some sort of expert analyst for the entire industry.
You keep harping on about narratives. No one actually cares. Especially a bunch of lazy Ebikers. Its just very easy and convenient to whinge about the cost of things online. Hence so many dull threads about it on here.
Thank you for adding humour to this one.
tomato paste
Active member
Hey where's my bike purchase recommendation? You're weeks late on that. ?
G500? It's tempting, but l would take the Falcon 7X for its lower running costs.
Redbikejohn
Member
- Thread starter
- #110
Well talk about light blue touch paper and stand back! ?
To add my 2p worth. Price of individual components can't be used as a gauge to price of the whole. There has been plenty of articles where cars/bikes have been costed from parts and its horrendous.
To add my 2p worth. Price of individual components can't be used as a gauge to price of the whole. There has been plenty of articles where cars/bikes have been costed from parts and its horrendous.
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Swissrider
Well-known member
Interesting thread but many seem to ignore the basics of the bike industry or virtually any industry (the fashion industry is an exception which almost defies logic or economics).
Fortunately for us there is neither a monopoly or cartel fixing bike prices. It’s the market. If a bike company charges more than its rivals for a similar spec bike it won’t sell enough to be sustainable unless their product is clearly superior by design and execution - a situation which is usually temporary until competitors catch up. These bikes are difficult to value as one might need to pay 20% more for a 5% improvement. For some, this premium is well with paying, for others not. On the other hand, if a company cuts margins to the bone and/or fails to invest in development, their bikes might sell in the short term, but if the company doesn’t make enough profit, it will eventually go bust. The sweet spot between not going bust and making excess profit creates a sustainable price and not surprisingly decent bikes of similar spec cost about the same and it’s certainty not worth moaning about this level of price. It is what it is. After my house, car and motorbike, my EMTB is the most expensive item I own and it’s hard to put a price on the pleasure I’ve had over the last three years and 4000k on it!
Fortunately for us there is neither a monopoly or cartel fixing bike prices. It’s the market. If a bike company charges more than its rivals for a similar spec bike it won’t sell enough to be sustainable unless their product is clearly superior by design and execution - a situation which is usually temporary until competitors catch up. These bikes are difficult to value as one might need to pay 20% more for a 5% improvement. For some, this premium is well with paying, for others not. On the other hand, if a company cuts margins to the bone and/or fails to invest in development, their bikes might sell in the short term, but if the company doesn’t make enough profit, it will eventually go bust. The sweet spot between not going bust and making excess profit creates a sustainable price and not surprisingly decent bikes of similar spec cost about the same and it’s certainty not worth moaning about this level of price. It is what it is. After my house, car and motorbike, my EMTB is the most expensive item I own and it’s hard to put a price on the pleasure I’ve had over the last three years and 4000k on it!
Aye. And into VW T5s ?
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