cappuccino34
Active member
Very useful information, thank you.
Levo SL Gen 1 Levo SL killed by Orbea?
- Thread starter hbakken
- Start date
KeithR
Well-known member
It's not a "problem". It's just not right for you.
Most riders who buy an SL buy it because it's 240w. It's what we want. You buying the wrong bike doesn't make the bike the problem.
KeithR
Well-known member
Are you going to be in a race?
There's no debate that the SL is less powerful - that's precisely why most of us buy them. If you want a more powerful bike, fine - but it doesn't detract at all from the idea that the SL is designed to do things a certain way, and it does it brilliantly.
If that's not what you want, look elsewhere. But try one first.
Mcharza
E*POWAH BOSS
It seems that this forum is also becoming like other forums. Black and white opinion. There is only one truth (MINE), others are useless, even though people’s needs are different.
KeithR
Well-known member
That doesn't characterise this discussion at all.
Mcharza
E*POWAH BOSS
Agreed, not from you
KeithR
Well-known member
Noted. Thanks.
I don't belive you. We all bought the bike because of the weight. If next years model has twice the max power at the same weight we would be thrilled. It's not that we need or want "4x you" like the Levo has, we just want the 1x or 2x assistance to stay the same all the time. Obviously the bike is not better if it reaches max power faster!
With the ezesty you have to wind into the power so there’s far less discernible torque kicking in. In that way, even at 60nm it just doesn’t feel like one of the earlier full fat 60nm ebike motors from a few years back. I’m absolutely convinced that apart from the rattle, the Rise will be a more useable proposition than Fazua bikes or the SL, especially for those who have already tasted the full fat and want to go semi skimmed. Added the price, the spec (M10), the looks and pedigree and it’s a winner imo. But then nobody here‘s tested it so a leap of faith for sure.
Orbea is using the EP8 which weighs 2.6 KG ?
KeithR
Well-known member
And I really don't care what you believe. You're projecting your personal opinions onto other people's motivations and assuming that what you think must be what everyone thinks.
It isn't. I very deliberately chose the SL for what it is, not what it isn't; and - having posted that phrase here before - I know that I'm far from being alone in that.
There appears to be very little "buyer's remorse" among SL riders.
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Exactly !! Where did the 4.6kg come from - possibly from your expert empirical analysis. Oh but then we’re trolls...??
cappuccino34
Active member
It's difficult not to come across as an arse sometimes, but stirring up discussions of why this or that is better sometimes brings up views and thoughts that we might not have considered or thought about. I'm not here to fall out with anyone, and I'm absolutely happy to have my assumptions shown to be wrong because I've read (and believed) numbers.
What I KNOW is:- I've got a Giant Trance zero and I'm really sick of it breaking, so I'm looking for a different bike.
I ride it mostly in Eco, and even then I sometimes reduce the power in Eco to 50% (the lowest available) with the app because even Eco does more that I feel is needed (100% of rider torque, apparently) and I sometimes want more range, because when you run out of battery with it it's like trying to ride through a tar pit, it's awful.
I was looking to buy a more modern analogue bike than the one I've just given away that I've had for 20 years, but a lighter e-bike with minimal drag could serve both purposes, which is particularly why I like the IDEA of the Fazua and thus why I'm driving 2hrs 40 to Kielder and back again tomorrow so I can try one for myself. If I like it great, if I don't I'll see if I can get a ride on an SL.
The reason that I FEEL that the SLs output may be too low is because we live in a very hilly area and sometimes that bit of extra oomph is handy, and watching the various tests it does look to be lacking.
That said, the tests themselves are often lacking.
cappuccino34
Active member
I'm not saying that you're wrong, and you obviously love yours, but there's absolutely loads on fleaBay though? I appreciate that Spesh may have sold zillions of them and, with all the crap going on at present, some people maybe need out to get some money back in to pay their bills and wot-not but the number for sale seems disproportionately high?
Some are really cheap too.
There’s certainly more SL’s than Levos. Rarely see used Ezestys, not sure if that’s because owners love them or because not many have been sold...
You will get about 12 miles of range out of the Fazua though with the updated setting in the highest mode, plus as a riding experience its a bit meh compared to the latest Shimano/Bosch etc - for me the "power" of the motor is an irrelevance, the software is what defines the riding experience, and IMO the Fazua is a bit behind on this now when you compare it to the Bosch emtb mode or Shimano trail mode.
cappuccino34
Active member
I don't think many have been sold. It's one of few e-mtbs that are still in stock and often heavily discounted because they're not moving.
It's probably a bit like cars. You current one has 300hp and you wouldn't buy its replacement if it had only 290hp, even though you only ever actually use 20hp on the road.
More is always better, right?
Mcharza
E*POWAH BOSS
I feel you, because in my own experience, emtb's help too much. But this, of course, depends on the riders fitness level.
In fact, riding my Kenovo my settings are almost always Eco mode, which is set to 18/30. This makes it feel a bit like riding a normal mountain bike and wouldn’t help too much.
If Kenovo got the same engine as the Levo SL, it would be the Ultimate bike for me
cappuccino34
Active member
Agreed, my day-job is involved with calibration software.
I don't expect to use high setting much though.
As I already said, I'm going to Kielder tomorrow with the lad and his bike and I've arranged to hire an E-zesty for the afternoon. I've loaded a route on my nav that will hopefully be similar to the routes we regularly do from home. Hopefully similar enough to learn if the Fazua setup is for me or not.
I've almost convinced myself that the Ezesty is not actually 'the one' for me for one or two other reasons, nothing to do with the motor setup.
I REALLY like the details and thought that's gone into the Scapin E-bone, it's a properly sexy thing but it's also properly sexy money at £10k-£15k, depending on spec.
I'd be absolutely wounded if I bought one and then didn't like the motor/battery/software setup.
Also I dont buy that people get the SL because its low power, I know a fair few people with them and they all bought it because of the weight primarily, and I suspect thats why most people will buy the Orbea too.
Sure maybe so people do buy it because of the power, but the low power of the SL was not the leading factor in its design, its a result of its design - Specilized set out to make the lightest emtb they could, and order to do that they had to put a less powerful motor in it which would be lighter than the Brose, and meant that they could put a smaller battery in as the motor wouldnt need a big battery to get decent range.
The great thing about an SL is that Mahle have managed to make a motor that is low power, but rides more powerfully and has more range than the numbers on paper would suggest, and its only an issue if you regularly ride with full fat emtb riders taking on a lot of elevation.
So in answer to the title of this thread, has the Orbea killed the SL?, well yes if what you are looking for is the lightest EMTB with a still near enough full fat assistance, but no if you just want the lightest trail EMTB and are happy with a moderate level of assistance, though even there there are Fazua powered bikes like the Willier 101FX that are lighter than the SL, but more XC focused
One thing that is for sure is that the Levo line up is getting dated now compared to many other bikes in terms of geometry, and whilst this may not be a concern for many people, its what holds me back - and IMO the Orbea currently is a more attractive option because of the geometry. I suspect we will be seeing some new bikes from Specilized in the near future which will remedy this though.
Sure maybe so people do buy it because of the power, but the low power of the SL was not the leading factor in its design, its a result of its design - Specilized set out to make the lightest emtb they could, and order to do that they had to put a less powerful motor in it which would be lighter than the Brose, and meant that they could put a smaller battery in as the motor wouldnt need a big battery to get decent range.
The great thing about an SL is that Mahle have managed to make a motor that is low power, but rides more powerfully and has more range than the numbers on paper would suggest, and its only an issue if you regularly ride with full fat emtb riders taking on a lot of elevation.
So in answer to the title of this thread, has the Orbea killed the SL?, well yes if what you are looking for is the lightest EMTB with a still near enough full fat assistance, but no if you just want the lightest trail EMTB and are happy with a moderate level of assistance, though even there there are Fazua powered bikes like the Willier 101FX that are lighter than the SL, but more XC focused
One thing that is for sure is that the Levo line up is getting dated now compared to many other bikes in terms of geometry, and whilst this may not be a concern for many people, its what holds me back - and IMO the Orbea currently is a more attractive option because of the geometry. I suspect we will be seeing some new bikes from Specilized in the near future which will remedy this though.
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I think you just momentarily forgot you were on the forum and not talking to the ladies and rounded up like you normally do
That's a terrible analogy ?
I think if you read all the posts and see peoples frustrations and then how everyone's actually taken steps back, I'm amazed about how mature everyone's being for a group of mainly guys talking about something they're passionate and equally, opinionated about ..
I really thought this thread would end up in the wastelands .. but it's more than holding it's head above water !
Well done guys.. Remember , there is no right . There's just different.
You spelt Whyte wrong by the way - and they're too heavy even if they do ride well.
cappuccino34
Active member
Sorry, analogous model Police on here already. ?
I maybe used the power analogy because I find it especially amusing taking a 200hp car on track and absolutely handing it to tossers with "700 bhp" who can't drive, run out of brakes, boil up, break down and generally demonstrate very well why the TRULY competitive cars are the ones that are MOST EFFECTIVE at using all of the power that they have, rather than having too much for what they need.
Sorry, analogous model Police on here already. ?
I maybe used the power analogy because I find it especially amusing taking a 200hp car on track and absolutely handing it to tossers with "700 bhp" who can't drive, run out of brakes, boil up, break down and generally demonstrate very well why the TRULY competitive cars are the ones that are MOST EFFECTIVE at using all of the power that they have, rather than having too much for what they need.
don't take it personally, it was just a bad analogy.?
Bikes are like cars, computers, or pretty much any other product, you buy something that you think is the nuts, and then two minutes later someone goes and launches something that sh!ts all over your pride and joy.
At the end of the day all that matters is that you love the bike you have, and hope other peoples bikes do the same for them.
We are lucky that we have bikes like the Orbea and the SL, and no doubt we will see other bikes launched over the coming year which give even more options in the lightweight EMTB Sector.
In fact it wouldnt surprise me if the next generation SL has more power and less weight.
At the end of the day all that matters is that you love the bike you have, and hope other peoples bikes do the same for them.
We are lucky that we have bikes like the Orbea and the SL, and no doubt we will see other bikes launched over the coming year which give even more options in the lightweight EMTB Sector.
In fact it wouldnt surprise me if the next generation SL has more power and less weight.
cappuccino34
Active member
I don't suppose anyone was wondering what my username is about.
I thought you were this lady ?
Ok .. 200hp and 615kg's is cool in a car NICE ! 2:34 for anyone who doesn't watch t20 minute youtube videos - ok , so everyone then. 5:19 in action ... 19:00 booming it .. and flying into the top three ! .. SWEET .
Looks tiny even compared to a lotus evora .. (or whatever version) .. sorry lotus fans..
NICE ! 2:34 for anyone who doesn't watch t20 minute youtube videos - ok , so everyone then. 5:19 in action ... 19:00 booming it .. and flying into the top three ! .. SWEET .Looks tiny even compared to a lotus evora .. (or whatever version) .. sorry lotus fans..
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cappuccino34
Active member
I thought you were this lady ?
Crikey, she can't sit still.
Can't spell Cappuccino either but hey ho.
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