Hows everyone getting on with their New AMflow

[Polar]

I agree, it's not for those adverse to risk.

It was a total gamble here in the US, glad I got it this year. Especially because I couldn't try one before buying, and I got the Pro, so it was a big chunk of $$$. A good friend of mine who lives in Europe, got one in Germany, and told me about it, so I had some sense of what to expect. It exceeded my expectations however.

I thought about that ... , definitely gambling. However found this forum because I saw Amflow is supporting those in a thread here, and I am hopeful and somewhat confident that DJI will support me as much as they can based on what I've seen. I have a DJI drone, love it, and have never had any issues.

Best case - my wishful thinking: the quality is as exceptional as the design, and I won't need support or parts for a long time, ideally never until the battery cycles are near the end.

Bad case - is that I need a new motor, battery, or display in the next couple of years...that all seems easily replaceable on the bike,..., the down side, I agree, will be until they are in the US, or if never, if I need parts, I will have to ship from another country, and pay for + wait the time it takes, for that.

Absolute worst case: Its finally garbage quality and design, breaks all the time, and I give up on it - I just lost $12K. I accepted that risk when I bought it. In the US at the moment, and because its new / there hasn't been enough time for people to really put serious miles on them.

I have no idea what to expect or will happen long term, but the bike is so awesome, so far... it was worth every bit of wait, $, and gamble, for me for sure. Technically its a super smart design so that gives me some confidence.

But ......Riding it does feel like hitting the Jackpot at the Casino. It Rips.

The worst thing Amflow could do is not to go an extra mile in warranty and support cases since it's a new brand on the market aiming high and all brands especially new will have some types of problems.
Specialized has mainly kept their market positions due to very good warranty and support but the same can't be said about Canyon now handling battery issues.
At least for me warranty and support is key and bad news travels fast.

 

[Bikedriver19]

Did you purchase off of Alibaba?

Yep. I went with Double spring company, because they gave me the option of paying 30% only, up front, then the balance when it shipped. They were great.

 

[Bikedriver19]

Pretty sure dji will not come to the USA with China’s new sanctions. Also pretty sure the bike exceeds class 1 status.

Maybe Drones will have some issues moving forward, due to use, ..I see the law suits in the news, but bikes? Come on now.... Doubt that. (Bikes are not used for military purposes as far as I know). After the lawyers battle it out, I think DJI will be here eventually, or at least in canada soon, seeing that forbidden rumor.

Pretty sure you are wrong about it not being class 1, or being able "to be classified" as class 1. There is no way they would be selling in Germany, if that were not the case. There is so much BS in the industry with Torque and power #'s, always has been.... at the end of the day, all that matters is the continuous nominal rating at room temp, which the manufacturer defines at some nominal voltage. The intermittent range of an electric motor, is always above the continuous.

Class 1 is 750 watts, continuous, must be pedal assist and must max at 20 mph, if I understand correctly.

IF I had to guess the "800 watts" being claimed is exactly 750 watts cont. from the motor, max for class 1 (and you putting in that extra 50+ watts with your legs). Even if the motor puts out 750 watts, there are always some efficiency losses in the drive, gearing, etc...

OR it could the drive puts out 800 watts, but with efficiency losses, ends up at 750 watts output.

1000 (and I even heard 1250 watts or something) intermittent peaks is no problem for a motor that can drive at 750 watts cont. And who knows, some of that power being "claimed" is maybe coming from human power too.

Regardless of the technical claims and #'s, the feel of this drive ROCKS.

I feel, its about time someone made a true "class 1" ebike, that doesn't weigh a ton. Pretty sure, DJI did just that.

 

[avman]

apologies for not replying to this thread good with the bike now.
Done about 60 miles on it as I was injured shortly after getting it back.
No issues with the motor since.

 

[mustclime]

Maybe Drones will have some issues moving forward, due to use, ..I see the law suits in the news, but bikes? Come on now.... Doubt that. (Bikes are not used for military purposes as far as I know). After the lawyers battle it out, I think DJI will be here eventually, or at least in canada soon, seeing that forbidden rumor.

Pretty sure you are wrong about it not being class 1, or being able "to be classified" as class 1. There is no way they would be selling in Germany, if that were not the case. There is so much BS in the industry with Torque and power #'s, always has been.... at the end of the day, all that matters is the continuous nominal rating at room temp, which the manufacturer defines at some nominal voltage. The intermittent range of an electric motor, is always above the continuous.

Class 1 is 750 watts, continuous, must be pedal assist and must max at 20 mph, if I understand correctly.

IF I had to guess the "800 watts" being claimed is exactly 750 watts cont. from the motor, max for class 1 (and you putting in that extra 50+ watts with your legs). Even if the motor puts out 750 watts, there are always some efficiency losses in the drive, gearing, etc...

OR it could the drive puts out 800 watts, but with efficiency losses, ends up at 750 watts output.

1000 (and I even heard 1250 watts or something) intermittent peaks is no problem for a motor that can drive at 750 watts cont. And who knows, some of that power being "claimed" is maybe coming from human power too.

Regardless of the technical claims and #'s, the feel of this drive ROCKS.

I feel, its about time someone made a true "class 1" ebike, that doesn't weigh a ton. Pretty sure, DJI did just that.

But the fact that they promote that it can run 29er or mullet makes it illegal. Class one is limited to 20mph. Put a 27.5 on and it will do 22 mph and thus not a class one. This also opens them up to legal issues, something like “ my kid mulleted the bike , it went to fast and he/she got hurt, pay me money”.

 

[Bikedriver19]

Hey, Bro- a few some questions for you, …

• So curious….Why cant anybody put any wheel size, they want, or do anything they want, with their bike? What's "legal"
  
  
• My next door neighbor, has a crotch rocket tricked out, Hyabusa and it goes WAY past the speed limit, I should probably call the police, and have him arrested, right? God forbid, he has a bike, and has modified a bike, that can go 1 mph more than what is “legal”. He is such a BAD man. Cuz ya know… He will break the law, eventually, with that bike.
  
  
• Most of the guys, I ride with, myself included until recently, ride delimited bikes, should I call “the mountain bike police”? Should I turn myself in?
  
  
• Do you honestly think anyone, that is or will be riding this bike, gives a shit, about what is “legal”? (FYI, I don’t. I only care about the way it rides, and how fun it is.) But please - Send the MTB police, and catch me, if you can. That will be fun.

Man,… are those tears in your eyes?,…don’t cry. Its OK, come over here and I will give you a Hug. You can climb that hill, with your slow bike, and we will still love you.

 

[RichMorr]

But the fact that they promote that it can run 29er or mullet makes it illegal. Class one is limited to 20mph. Put a 27.5 on and it will do 22 mph and thus not a class one. This also opens them up to legal issues, something like “ my kid mulleted the bike , it went to fast and he/she got hurt, pay me money”.

The avinox head unit and I believe the app gives you the option to change the wheel size, so I’m guessing this will alter the speed sensor and limit it too class 1 regulation.

 

[Bikedriver19]

The avinox head unit and I believe the app gives you the option to change the wheel size, so I’m guessing this will alter the speed sensor and limit it too class 1 regulation.

The sensor / encoder disk on the Amflow, is on the back wheel, and you change this on the app. IT is the same disk with either wheel size, the app has no way of knowing what wheel size you actually have on the bike. I tested this, and I think this is pretty much the same for most bikes.

ITs the same the other way around, one of my buddies turned his Trek 29 into a mullet, and his bike cuts out < 20 mph. (He's older, not a fast rider, so he doesn't care.), and you can do the same, with this bike.

I have a hard time understanding "restrictions" and "classes" (But I've got no class), I have no idea why there are "limitations" in the first place for ebikes, I have never understood that.

You can ski 40 mph down a mountain, with small children and people all over the ski trails.
OR its like going down to the car dealership, buying a new Mercedes, but it is limited to the speed limit.... press on the gas, and it shits out at 55 mph.... kinda stupid.
The speed limit might be X...but still, you have the right, to buy a Lamborghini, if you want to.
And racers on closed courses,...why are we limiting them? We don't in any other sport.

Skiers and snowboards are not limited.
Cars are not limited
Motorcycles are not limited
DH riders are not limited going down the hill

Why are ebikes limited? Makes no sense. A lot of People are still scared of them, I think.

Ride responsibly, and within your abilities, ..its the same for every sport. Doesn't matter how "fast" your machine or you can go.

 

[mustclime]

Guess you don’t know the legal system in the USA. Back in the 80’s Porsche came out with the 930 turbo. A bone head doctor brought one and ran out of skill , the car left the road backwards at mock way to fast . Guy died and Porsche had to pay. The judge ruled if the car goes off the road nose first it’s the driver's falt, car leaves the road butt first, it’s the car makers fault. If the bike company does not put in safeguards to prevent people getting around class one limits, they will be liable.

 

[Bikedriver19]

Guess you don’t know the legal system in the USA. Back in the 80’s Porsche came out with the 930 turbo. A bone head doctor brought one and ran out of skill , the car left the road backwards at mock way to fast . Guy died and Porsche had to pay. The judge ruled if the car goes off the road nose first it’s the driver's falt, car leaves the road butt first, it’s the car makers fault. If the bike company does not put in safeguards to prevent people getting around class one limits, they will be liable.

Guess you've never been skiing.... or if the ski patrol needs to rescue someone that gets hurt, the mountain is liable, right?.

Lamborgini, Mclaren, Ferrari, Motocross Bikes, anything dangerous....all will now be restricted, or sorry, you can't have them anymore....cuz you could get hurt.

Dude, this is utter nonsense. You can kill yourself on a kids bike with training wheels. You can drive any car, restricted to 55 mph or not, into a cement wall, and also kill yourself. The car isn't responsible.

Imagine going to a motocross race, or a formula 1 race, ...and everything is restricted to 20 mph. How ridiculous.

 

[Bikedriver19]

also, Power is power, at the end of the day. Remember that law of conservation of energy from high school Physics"

For any given power, there is a trade off between speed and torque. Smaller wheel, more torque, less speed. Larger wheel, more speed, less torque. You can't just get more power out of thin air. Any extra power is coming from your legs.

 

[timo2824]

The sensor / encoder disk on the Amflow, is on the back wheel, and you change this on the app. IT is the same disk with either wheel size, the app has no way of knowing what wheel size you actually have on the bike. I tested this, and I think this is pretty much the same for most bikes.

ITs the same the other way around, one of my buddies turned his Trek 29 into a mullet, and his bike cuts out < 20 mph. (He's older, not a fast rider, so he doesn't care.), and you can do the same, with this bike.

I have a hard time understanding "restrictions" and "classes" (But I've got no class), I have no idea why there are "limitations" in the first place for ebikes, I have never understood that.

You can ski 40 mph down a mountain, with small children and people all over the ski trails.
OR its like going down to the car dealership, buying a new Mercedes, but it is limited to the speed limit.... press on the gas, and it shits out at 55 mph.... kinda stupid.
The speed limit might be X...but still, you have the right, to buy a Lamborghini, if you want to.
And racers on closed courses,...why are we limiting them? We don't in any other sport.

Skiers and snowboards are not limited.
Cars are not limited
Motorcycles are not limited
DH riders are not limited going down the hill

Why are ebikes limited? Makes no sense. A lot of People are still scared of them, I think.

Ride responsibly, and within your abilities, ..its the same for every sport. Doesn't matter how "fast" your machine or you can go.

Cars and motorcycles are definitely limited depending on what class and series you're racing. Engine size, the amount of cylinders, even silly things like wheel/tire size and throttle area, how many gears, final gear ratio, automatic/manual. There's all kinds of rules, this includes a tech inspection before each race.

 

[Bndit]

The sensor / encoder disk on the Amflow, is on the back wheel, and you change this on the app. IT is the same disk with either wheel size, the app has no way of knowing what wheel size you actually have on the bike. I tested this, and I think this is pretty much the same for most bikes.

ITs the same the other way around, one of my buddies turned his Trek 29 into a mullet, and his bike cuts out < 20 mph. (He's older, not a fast rider, so he doesn't care.), and you can do the same, with this bike.

I have a hard time understanding "restrictions" and "classes" (But I've got no class), I have no idea why there are "limitations" in the first place for ebikes, I have never understood that.

You can ski 40 mph down a mountain, with small children and people all over the ski trails.
OR its like going down to the car dealership, buying a new Mercedes, but it is limited to the speed limit.... press on the gas, and it shits out at 55 mph.... kinda stupid.
The speed limit might be X...but still, you have the right, to buy a Lamborghini, if you want to.
And racers on closed courses,...why are we limiting them? We don't in any other sport.

Skiers and snowboards are not limited.
Cars are not limited
Motorcycles are not limited
DH riders are not limited going down the hill

Why are ebikes limited? Makes no sense. A lot of People are still scared of them, I think.

Ride responsibly, and within your abilities, ..its the same for every sport. Doesn't matter how "fast" your machine or you can go.

Your ebike is not limited on downhill, just go 100mph if you want.

 

[irie]

...
You can ski 40 mph down a mountain ..

There's nothing to stop you going downhill at any speed you want on your bike.

 

[Bndit]

Guess you've never been skiing.... or if the ski patrol needs to rescue someone that gets hurt, the mountain is liable, right?.

Lamborgini, Mclaren, Ferrari, Motocross Bikes, anything dangerous....all will now be restricted, or sorry, you can't have them anymore....cuz you could get hurt.

Dude, this is utter nonsense. You can kill yourself on a kids bike with training wheels. You can drive any car, restricted to 55 mph or not, into a cement wall, and also kill yourself. The car isn't responsible.

Imagine going to a motocross race, or a formula 1 race, ...and everything is restricted to 20 mph. How ridiculous.

Public trails are not race tracks, you don't/cannot ride formula 1 car an a public road either. Races are races, riding on public trails/roads is different. Ride a acoustic bike, it's not restricted

 

[mustclime]

Guess you've never been skiing.... or if the ski patrol needs to rescue someone that gets hurt, the mountain is liable, right?.

Lamborgini, Mclaren, Ferrari, Motocross Bikes, anything dangerous....all will now be restricted, or sorry, you can't have them anymore....cuz you could get hurt.

Dude, this is utter nonsense. You can kill yourself on a kids bike with training wheels. You can drive any car, restricted to 55 mph or not, into a cement wall, and also kill yourself. The car isn't responsible.

Imagine going to a motocross race, or a formula 1 race, ...and everything is restricted to 20 mph. How ridiculous.

You can not ski at any resort in the USA without signing a liability waiver. All cars sold in the USA have under steer dialed into their suspension setups so at the limit they will plow off the the road front end first. I know of no emtb’s sold in the USA that are factory released 29er / mullet able because of the speed issue.

 

[Bikedriver19]

Public trails are not race tracks, you don't/cannot ride formula 1 car an a public road either. Races are races, riding on public trails/roads is different. Ride a acoustic bike, it's not restricted

Whatever.

Sure - Public roads are not race tracks, but anyone has the right, to by a lambo, Ferrari, Mclaren, Bugati...the list goes on, and drive it on public roads. How you drive is up to you, ...you can drive like an idiot, it you want, but there could be severe consequences. Life and ANY extreme sport, is without risk.

Anyone can get a volspeed, or speedbox, for their emtb., if compatible, and derestrict it.
Anyone can supercharge or add a twin turbo, to their car.

For ebike races especially, on a closed courses (race tracks). I see no reason at all to have a speed limit on an emtb.


Back to the topic - the Amflow. How is everyone doing?, I am doing fantastic with mine.

I would derestrict mine, if I could, and I will someday, if I can. But it I can't - no big deal, it's not bad at all, with the 21 mph mark, with a 29 set to 27.5. The "speed" of this bike, is really more about how much more speed you can get uphill, than down or on flat, in my opinion. It goes steep downhill, at the same speed as any other bike. On Flat - you buddy with the derestricted bike, has the advantage. Out of the corners, and uphill, it is super fast, they have no chance.

 

[skismith]

Whatever.

Sure - Public roads are not race tracks, but anyone has the right, to by a lambo, Ferrari, Mclaren, Bugati...the list goes on, and drive it on public roads. How you drive is up to you, ...you can drive like an idiot, it you want, but there could be severe consequences. Life and ANY extreme sport, is without risk.

Anyone can get a volspeed, or speedbox, for their emtb., if compatible, and derestrict it.
Anyone can supercharge or add a twin turbo, to their car.

For ebike races especially, on a closed courses (race tracks). I see no reason at all to have a speed limit on an emtb.


Back to the topic - the Amflow. How is everyone doing?, I am doing fantastic with mine.

I would derestrict mine, if I could, and I will someday, if I can. But it I can't - no big deal, it's not bad at all, with the 21 mph mark, with a 29 set to 27.5. The "speed" of this bike, is really more about how much more speed you can get uphill, than down or on flat, in my opinion. It goes steep downhill, at the same speed as any other bike. On Flat - you buddy with the derestricted bike, has the advantage. Out of the corners, and uphill, it is super fast, they have no chance.

Have you cast your
Vote yet: POLL: Do you want to be able to derestrict your Amflow PL?

 

[lar1337]

Whatever.

Sure - Public roads are not race tracks, but anyone has the right, to by a lambo, Ferrari, Mclaren, Bugati...the list goes on, and drive it on public roads. How you drive is up to you, ...you can drive like an idiot, it you want, but there could be severe consequences. Life and ANY extreme sport, is without risk.

Anyone can get a volspeed, or speedbox, for their emtb., if compatible, and derestrict it.
Anyone can supercharge or add a twin turbo, to their car.

For ebike races especially, on a closed courses (race tracks). I see no reason at all to have a speed limit on an emtb.


Back to the topic - the Amflow. How is everyone doing?, I am doing fantastic with mine.

I would derestrict mine, if I could, and I will someday, if I can. But it I can't - no big deal, it's not bad at all, with the 21 mph mark, with a 29 set to 27.5. The "speed" of this bike, is really more about how much more speed you can get uphill, than down or on flat, in my opinion. It goes steep downhill, at the same speed as any other bike. On Flat - you buddy with the derestricted bike, has the advantage. Out of the corners, and uphill, it is super fast, they have no chance.

Hey there....awesome your enjoying your new bike

What speed are you able to maintain up hill on a decent extended gradient? Say 500 meters

As a comparison on my Bosch gen4 I cruise up at 12mph if iam trying harder it's more like 15-16mph iam usual zapped at that speed at the top lol. Tech climbs are obviously slower as it's more about skill (mines average at best) momentum must help though.

 

[Astro66]

I see no reason at all to have a speed limit on an emtb.

Except that without speed limits, it will be legislated differently to a bicycle. I can ride my EMTB anywhere a bicycle can be ridden. I'd like to keep it that way.

That isn't going to happen when EMTBs start riding at 50kph on trails shared with pedestrians. If you can come across a pedestrian on the trail. A non-limited EMTB will be excluded. And that's nearly every trail I currently ride.

 

[irie]

Except that without speed limits, it will be legislated differently to a bicycle. I can ride my EMTB anywhere a bicycle can be ridden. I'd like to keep it that way.

That isn't going to happen when EMTBs start riding at 50kph on trails shared with pedestrians. If you can come across a pedestrian on the trail. A non-limited EMTB will be excluded. And that's nearly every trail I currently ride.

They are currently excluded now in the UK, and for good reason. Hopefully no amount of bleating will change this.

 

[Astro66]

They are currently excluded now in the UK, and for good reason. Hopefully no amount of bleating will change this.

Australia has the same 25kph speed limit on ebikes, that are ridden on any public land. Thus I can ride my ebike anywhere a bike can go.

I also want that maintained. That's what these people who call for speed restrictions to be removed don't realise.

 

[irie]

Australia has the same 25kph speed limit on ebikes, that are ridden on any public land. Thus I can ride my ebike anywhere a bike can go.

I also want that maintained. That's what these people who call for speed restrictions to be removed don't realise.

I disagree.

Bluntly, they do realise, but are determined to pursue their own selfish aims to the detriment of the vast majority of other riders.

 

[DylanJM]

But the fact that they promote that it can run 29er or mullet makes it illegal. Class one is limited to 20mph. Put a 27.5 on and it will do 22 mph and thus not a class one. This also opens them up to legal issues, something like “ my kid mulleted the bike , it went to fast and he/she got hurt, pay me money”.

If you put a 27.5 wheel on a bike whose motor cutoff is set to 29 don't you actually get a lower cutoff speed rather than a higher? Also this is the same with any motor, it's not unique to DJI although perhaps most manufactures only allow dealers to modify the 29/27.5 setting when in the shop.