Hi all, 18 miles 2350ft dead battery normal range ?

[Cockersaurus]

Hi everyone new here and to the world of ebikes.
I'm very keen to get myself a Emtb but have been put off by the range Strava screen shot.

So far I have test ridden a turbo levo that at first put me off, couple of months later I realised I rode more Trails new routes in a weekend than I have in the months since.....humm ok I get it I want one. Turbo Leo was fun good bike but did not give me the fizz

earlier this week I test rode the Yt Decoy with a buddy we had a ball loved the bike felt very comfortable natural on the bike (FIZZ) service from the peps at Yt Surrey hills was spot on.

But I was very disappointed / concerned with the range in 2 hours of riding time, I completely killed the battery bike assitance cut out on the last hill back to that car park, we did go ABIT mad but I would want expect more for the price of these things..

I weigh 100kg on a good day
rode in a mix of all modes heavy on boost for the first climb/ lap then trail and eco as I realised not going to make it very far.

Is this the kind of range to be expected?

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

I would have said thats about right. the decoy has a 540 battery? (IIRC) and at 100kg youre around the same weight as me. I had a Levo with a 500 and could get up to 26 miles around here with around 4000ft of climbing, all in eco. around 18 miles in turbo and 23'ish with a mix of modes. I have another levo now with a 700 battery and can easily do a 20 mile ride in turbo and 4000ft of climbing, in the wet with maxxgrip downhill tyres. I can get 30-40 miles if I am in eco and 'trail riding' or if I am hitting the Beacons with the battery sucking grassland, I can get 25 ish. weather conditions and ground condition contribute a lot to battery life but yea, you can expect that kind of mileage until you fettle the settings to your kind of riding.

 

[Gary]

Ride slower uphill and in Eco if you want more range.
Your average speed is probably DOUBLE what you'd manage on a normal bike meaning the motor is working HARDER than you were.

 

[Cockersaurus]

Hi old bloke
Thank for the reply very helpful, if not disappointing hoping to hear better numbers.
Yes 540 battery
think I will arrange another demo stay out of boost and see how it gose.

 

[Cockersaurus]

Your average speed is probably DOUBLE what you'd manage on a normal bike meaning the motor is working HARDER than you were.

I thought that was the point of these things.
Guess I need to reassess my expectations, might not be for me after all
My electric skateboard dose 25 miles @20/30mph on a charge I don't push it at all

 

[Gary]

My electric skateboard dose 25 miles @20/30mph on a charge I don't push it at all

is that on smooth flat roads? or hills though?

Terrain and gradient makes a huge difference too. gradient is obvious but dry fireroads are way less battery consuming than natural damp/wet muddy singletrack.
on the Eeb if you want to ride more just chill on the climbs and rip on the descents. They have their place but unless you carry multiple batteries they can't match the range of a fit rider on a normal bike.

Can you post about your skateboard?
I got passed by a guy on an electric longboard while commuting the other day (guy must've been doing 25mph) and thought it was cool AF

 

[The Hodge]

Similar distance and height gain from my ride on Monday ( Bosch gen 4 motor) ..mainly on emtb mode / didn't use turbo at all ..being on my own my average speed was a bit lower than yours ..but I had two bars still showing on my return ( out of 5) ..probably 1.5 in reality ..The discrepancy between ascent and descent is because I forgot to start recording straight away

 

[Cockersaurus]

is that on smooth flat roads? or hills though?

Terrain and gradient makes a huge difference too. gradient is obvious but dry fireroads are way less battery consuming than natural damp/wet muddy singletrack.
on the Eeb if you want to ride more just chill on the climbs and rip on the descents. They have their place but unless you carry multiple batteries they can't match the range of a fit rider on a normal bike.

Can you post about your skateboard?
I got passed by a guy on an electric longboard while commuting the other day (guy must've been doing 25mph) and thought it was cool AF

We had a lot of fun in the pouring rain caked in mud I appreciate not good for range, was hoping for more will have another demo ride and be a little more sensible, maybe they will sort out the long talked about 700w battery

As for the electric skate board it's my favourite thing, I'm a snowboarder and wanted a summer carving toy it's that and soo much more ? great community.

As for range that's smooth surface with about 1000ft of hills, my board is a Trampa urban carver, the mountain boards have a larger battery capacity check out Trampa Boards Ltd, Mountainboard, Mountain Boards, Mountainboards, Kite boards, Kiteboarding, Urban Carveboard, Street Carve Board, Mountain Boarding, Skate Boarding, Long Boarding, Electric Skateboards, Electric Boards, E-Boards, Electric Mountainboards, E-MTB, Electric Longboard, VESC SIX, VESC 6 UK company best boards bang for buck in my opinion.
Depending on wheel size gearing 25 to 40 +mph if your crazy enough

Pic of the board and Saturdays ride feel free to ask any questions

 

[Cockersaurus]

Thanks very Interesting, keen to demo a bike with the Bosch system

 

[RickBullotta]

Ride slower uphill and in Eco if you want more range.
Your average speed is probably DOUBLE what you'd manage on a normal bike meaning the motor is working HARDER than you were.

Interesting. My experience on the average ride (typically 12-25 miles, 1400-3000 ft of climbing, technical enduro-style terrain) is about 25% faster on the eMTB.

 

[Cabby.]

Interesting. My experience on the average ride (typically 12-25 miles, 1400-3000 ft of climbing, technical enduro-style terrain) is about 25% faster on the eMTB.

Something must be seriously wrong if you are travelling upwards at only 25% faster.

I did a brutal climb today that I've only ever done three times before, usually takes around 45 minutes, reckon it took me 15 may be 20 minutes max today.

 

[Clubby]

Sounds right to be fair. I’m the same weight and ride a Whyte e150 with 625wh Bosch gen 4. Range very much depends on what level of assistance.
Trail centre stuff where you’re all up or all down eats battery. Last visit to Glentress I got 24 miles out of the battery before the battery died. Had been using eMTB mode a lot as the climbs are pretty steep up the off piste stuff. Was nearly 3000ft of climbing. Comrie Croft I got 20miles and 3500 ft with 1 mile range when I got back to car.
More xc loop at a Dunkeld where I kept it in tour all day, I did 26 miles and only dropped to 2 bars left on final climb back to car. Projected range that day was 45 miles. Much steadier climbs there though.

Just need practice to judge mode use better. For me I’m happy to burn through battery quickly if it gets me more laps in the same time. I’ve a young son and riding time is limited. With the eeb I can do more riding in the same time.

 

[RickBullotta]

Something must be seriously wrong if you are travelling upwards at only 25% faster.

I did a brutal climb today that I've only ever done three times before, usually takes around 45 minutes, reckon it took me 15 may be 20 minutes max today.

Ha. I didn't say upwards. I meant for an entire ride. If I really hammer (as in an eMTB race) I can probably average 80% faster for an hour. But for a typical ride, on technical terrain with twists and turns, 25-30% is the normal differential for an entire ride.

 

[Cabby.]

No I siad upwards cause downwards or flat would be the same so all time gain would be upwards, which would be generally at least 50% quicker, afterall that is where most time is taken on a normal bike.

 

[RickBullotta]

No I siad upwards cause downwards or flat would be the same so all time gain would be upwards, which would be generally at least 50% quicker, afterall that is where most time is taken on a normal bike.

Right. So that works out to about 25-30% faster for the total ride. We are in violent agreement. ;-) Cheers.

 

[Gary]

Interesting. My experience on the average ride (typically 12-25 miles, 1400-3000 ft of climbing, technical enduro-style terrain) is about 25% faster on the eMTB.

Sorry. My hungover to hell self meant average climbing speed.

 

[Mteam]

As everyone else above has said ,the range varies significantly with the mode you use . I have the bosch gen 4 and 625wh battery and I reckon I could flatten it in about 3000 feet and around 15 miles if I used it in a combination of turbo or emtb mode for the whole ride, but if I use eco on the down/flat and easier uphills, switching to tour for the harder uphills and saving emtb/turbo for the uphills where you'd be walking on a normal bike, I can probably get 5500-6000 feet and 30 miles .Taking this approach my uphill speed would still be loads faster than the normal bike, and It would still be a lot less effort than a normal bike.

If you want to be out all day and blasting up every hill in turbo/boost (whatever the top mode is called on your chosen motor system) then you probably need to carry a second battery to swap over to , which aside from the cost of a second battery is not that much of a hardship.

This is obvious - but I find I use way more battery when everyone I'm riding with is on ebikes because everyone is just blasting uphill in turbo, if its a ride with some people on normal bikes then my battery lasts forever .

 

[R120]

We had a lot of fun in the pouring rain caked in mud I appreciate not good for range, was hoping for more will have another demo ride and be a little more sensible, maybe they will sort out the long talked about 700w battery

As for the electric skate board it's my favourite thing, I'm a snowboarder and wanted a summer carving toy it's that and soo much more ? great community.

As for range that's smooth surface with about 1000ft of hills, my board is a Trampa urban carver, the mountain boards have a larger battery capacity check out Trampa Boards Ltd, Mountainboard, Mountain Boards, Mountainboards, Kite boards, Kiteboarding, Urban Carveboard, Street Carve Board, Mountain Boarding, Skate Boarding, Long Boarding, Electric Skateboards, Electric Boards, E-Boards, Electric Mountainboards, E-MTB, Electric Longboard, VESC SIX, VESC 6 UK company best boards bang for buck in my opinion.
Depending on wheel size gearing 25 to 40 +mph if your crazy enough

Pic of the board and Saturdays ride feel free to ask any questions
View attachment 42321
View attachment 42320

Thats my neck of the world, some ok trails in Nower Wood/Tyrells wood

 

[Cockersaurus]

So I did the same route on my hard tail plus bike yesterday, I'm very surprised at the results forgot to start the tracking till on the first decent and paused the ride by accident for a shot time.
I would say total elevation closer to 2000ft
and riding time 2:30
14.5 / 15 miles
= 1/2 a lap more on the ebike 30mins quicker ... I expected this to be a bigger difference, I'm not super fit by any means 100kgs but I'm not sold on the ebike at this point very surprised at this outcome.
I did enjoy the ebike very much but less than 2 hours of battery life for my riding style for 5k+ is not happening

 

[R120]

What mode are you running it in, I ride pretty locally to you and I can basically do a 25 mile loop with about 2500ft of elevation from reigate to stepping stones, via Hedley, Tyrells Wood, up Juniper to box hill, then down the trails to Stepping stones and back again, thought its a route that takes in the better trails in the area, I would say 80% in trail, the rest eco, battery dead by the end

 

[R120]

Similar ride to this, 504wh battery

 

[R120]

I never rid in boost though, its fun for the first 30mins you have the bike then you realise its not very good for actual trail riding!

 

[Cockersaurus]

Did the first climb in boost for fun as you do then trail on the decent as advised trail with a cheeky bit of boost for the first return then realised the battery is not going to last at this place so trail and bit of eco for the 2nd decent and eco from then on.

Look and sound like a couple of good routes there, I'm in Dorking moved down about a year ago still finding routes have been heading westcot lieth hill not tried your route direction yet, I feel an explore coming on

 

[R120]

Well if you are in Dorking I wouldn’t bother heading east of there! I make the most of the local riding but is not a patch on the stuff west of you, Ranmore, Redlands, Leith Hill, Peaslake etc etc.

I tend to head over that way once a week for a proper ride, really the stuff round me is XC and pretty boring, though we did revitalise some fo the trails off Reigate Hill during lockdown, but there not worth a trip over given where you live.

you have some of the best trails in the UK pretty much on your doorstep in Dorking.

 

[Cockersaurus]

Thanks for the advise, a random visit to one of the local bike shops got me back into MTB after many years when was told, (quote) you some of the best trails in the UK pretty much on your doorstep in Dorking.

Can not wait for the next big change in battery tech that will mean some serious riding on a single charge will be all over a E bike then.

Thank you for you input and feedback re my question

 

[Gary]

thanks for the Skateboard info

forgot to start the tracking till on the first decent and paused the ride by accident for a shot time.

I'm not sure why you're bothering sharing and comparing your strava stats then?
Had you included the first climb your true average speed for the normal plusbike ride wouldn't have been much faster than 5mph
This means ALL your climbing was twice as fast on the Ebike.
Emtbs aren't any faster at all downhill. On the flat they're only notably quicker if conditions are hard going or you're not fit enough to ride a normalbike on the flat at 15mph.

 

[Cockersaurus]

I'm not sure why you're bothering sharing and comparing your strava stats then?

I included the starva info Because I find the results if off a little as I stated to be surprising personally, did not think I could do the ride I did on my plus bike in time I did and expected a bigger difference, Strava ruff evidence of my experience

Did not expect the ebike to be faster downhill in any major respect, I don't belive there is much of a speed difference on climbs from the Shimano motor in eco and my plus bike as eco seams to just counter the extra weight of the bike.
Tho I do remember eco on the turbo levo being surprisingly powerful.

So my conclusion from my original question regarding expected range with thanks to the input received. Is that E bikes are lots of fun and I would love one but do not have the battery life / range for my riding style needs.
Two hours on the ebike I was ready and wanting 2 more bike dead, two and a half hours on my plus bike I was done ! pass me the beer and cake

when I can have a ebike that will give me 4 hours of hard riding on a single charge without having to mess about with battery's, I will buy it

waiting with baited breath

 

[Gary]

I included the starva info Because I find the results if off a little as I stated to be surprising personally, did not think I could do the ride I did on my plus bike in time I did and expected a bigger difference, Strava ruff evidence of my experience

Except it's completely irellevant if you haven't done the same ride each time.

check your STRAVA routes again and compare just your climb times on specific climbing segments between the two bikes. That's the only place you're likely to see any big differences.

Eco on a shimano E8000 is adjustable between high, med and Low (no idea which your bike was set to) But even using eco in LOW a 55lb Ebike is a lot easier to climb at a set speed than a normal bike. One thing you are maybe not taking into account though is tyre rolling resistance. I've no idea which tyres your plus bike or the eeb had but there could easily be as much as 80w of difference if the Eeb has soft compound agressively treaded heavy DH casing tyres (a lot of Eebs do come spec'd this way) and your plus tyres are light, thin casing fast rolling dry tread (not very many plus tyres aren't)
I purposely run lightweight exo casing harder compound tyres on my Ebike for this reason. With an agressive dry conditions tread up front Minion DHF and a fast semi slick rear (Minion SS).
I genuinely think Ebikes are pretty horrible to ride anywhere but DH with heavy soft compound tyres.

I actually prefer normal bikes though. I'm just in a position where I can have as many bikes as I'd like. So an Emtb is one of them.

Which leads us to...

So my conclusion from my original question regarding expected range with thanks to the input received. Is that E bikes are lots of fun and I would love one but do not have the battery life / range for my riding style needs.
Two hours on the ebike I was ready and wanting 2 more bike dead, two and a half hours on my plus bike I was done ! pass me the beer and cake

when I can have a ebike that will give me 4 hours of hard riding on a single charge without having to mess about with battery's, I will buy it

waiting with baited breath

Yeah. you're gonna have a bloody long wait... But... Would it help if I explained to you that you could continue to ride BOTH bikes. "hrs on an Ebike in higher assistance modes really isn't tiring for someone used to 4 hours riding normal bikes so could allow you to also ride your normal bike the same day?

You don't live anywhere very hilly but for me I can use my Emtb to get 4000ft of climbing (and technical descending) in around a 1 hr blast . and still be fresh enough to go out and do similar again (albeit 2.5times slower) on my normal bike. Or ride back to back days when you'd normally need a rest day.

Don't think of Ebikes as a replacement for normal bikes. They aren't.

 

[Cockersaurus]

Thanks for your input Gary and for starting the obvious.
I believe we could go back and forth till the cows come home I have no need or desire to do so.
Happy with my conclusions looking forward to when I can get a ebike that will do what I want.

 

[Velociraptor]

I have a SC Heckler with a 504 battery and I weigh 88 kilos. I ride with lighter guys all on 700wh Turbo Levos. They kill me on battery life. I did one ride where I was chasing a friend up 3,000ish feet. He was in trail on his levo and I had to go boost a lot to keep up. At the top I had 20% battery left. I did the same on another ride with 4,000 feet of climbing mostly in trail mode. Going uphill for heavier riders is a battery killer. Now I always carry an extra battery. None of my friends on 700wh Levos have come close to running out of battery.