Dengfu E10v1 vs E10v2?

[Karamba!]

Does anyone know what are the differences between the old and new versions of this frame?
From pictures, it seems that the shock mount at the frame seems smaller in the new version, but I've not found anything else.

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

I've been meaning to go into detail about the differences between the v1 and v2 frame differences. So apologies for the delay if you're still looking for information on this topic @Karamba!

Their are more differences however, the 3 main differences are as follows.

1. Onboard charger location - the v1 is located above the motor mount, in front of the seat tube. The v2 is located on the non drive side, above the motor. This was done to match the E22/E23s battery charger position for aesthetic consistency.
2. Lower battery mount cradle - working with Dengfu, they ensured that the v2 frames use the newer lower battery mount to reduce the intermittent power loss and water ingress issue.
3. Coil compatible - When Dengfu gifted me the v2 frame to build, they asked that I run the bike with a coil shock (but not overstroke it compared to my v1). This is because the 8mm upper shock mount position has slightly changed in triangle strut which protrudes on the downtube. Dengfu explained that this was done to cope with suspension actuated forces when using a coil shock, without the need of applying more material which would increase the weight. You can still run the v2 with an air shock but Dengfu confirms that the v2 frame is coil compatible.

I'll take pics and update this thread so others can see

 

[mikenet]

sorry so this is versio 1 or 2? View attachment foto1.jpg

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

sorry so this is versio 1 or 2? View attachment 117441

Because the charger location is on the top of the motor, you have a version 2

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

V1 frame charging port locations are on top of the motor

V2 frames have the charger port location on the left (none drive side), above the motor on the seat tube. Similar to the E22.

 

[mikenet]

ok, Thank you

 

[Ben Rides]

Actually, they are all 1.0 versions of E10. The adjustment of the charging port can be calculated based on the E10 1.1 version at most. Optimize local details. We will be testing the E10 V2 version recently, with optimized frame design and battery level. Perhaps there will be a new model. Currently, it is known that the battery can be strengthened to 48V 21A 1008WH

 

[AlexRus]

Actually, they are all 1.0 versions of E10. The adjustment of the charging port can be calculated based on the E10 1.1 version at most. Optimize local details. We will be testing the E10 V2 version recently, with optimized frame design and battery level. Perhaps there will be a new model. Currently, it is known that the battery can be strengthened to 48V 21A 1008WH

Please make a normal battery cover that is waterproof. The current version is just awful and leaks water (

 

[Ben Rides]

Please make a normal battery cover that is waterproof. The current version is just awful and leaks water (

Received, I will inform the R&D department. In fact, many old customers have also provided us with suggestions for improving E10 on Facebook..

 

[Karamba!]

Thank you all, particularly you Neeko for your detailed answer.
I've recently pulled the trigger for one through Fieldebikes. I still wonder what I'm going to get. Dealers are somewhat loose when it comes to specifying what version they are offering.
I plan to make a build thread if time permits.
Regarding the battery cradle you mentioned Neeko, what exactly do you mean? Is it that the cradle is currently placed on top, hence gravity pushes the battery away from it? If it's so, how have you dealt with it?
Regarding waterproof-ness of the battery cover: from what I gather from you Ben, this will unlikely be fixed in my soon to come frame, even if it is a v2. What have you guys been doing to solve this?
One last question (for now ): I've seen a hole next to the battery key lock which it's said to be for the power button. What would be the purpose for it when you normally will switch the bike on through the controller's handlebar buttons? Does it come in all versions?

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

Thank you all, particularly you Neeko for your detailed answer.
I've recently pulled the trigger for one through Fieldebikes. I still wonder what I'm going to get. Dealers are somewhat loose when it comes to specifying what version they are offering.
I plan to make a build thread if time permits.
Regarding the battery cradle you mentioned Neeko, what exactly do you mean? Is it that the cradle is currently placed on top, hence gravity pushes the battery away from it? If it's so, how have you dealt with it?
Regarding waterproof-ness of the battery cover: from what I gather from you Ben, this will unlikely be fixed in my soon to come frame, even if it is a v2. What have you guys been doing to solve this?
One last question (for now ): I've seen a hole next to the battery key lock which it's said to be for the power button. What would be the purpose for it when you normally will switch the bike on through the controller's handlebar buttons? Does it come in all versions?

I'm thankful I've still got these pics
Anywho, the lower mount on the left is the oldest version of the battery mount. The one on the right is a newer version.

The exterior dimensions are the same. However, internally where the battery rests has been revised.

The plate which holds the contacts, protrudes out to ensure a more snug fit for the battery. As well as the gap underneath the plate to allow moisture to escape.

So far, the revised mount has improved the E10s performance. The intermittent power loss/water ingress issue has decreased from users I've spoken too. It hasn't fully illuminated the problem, which is why we reccomend using a strip of neoprene on sided tape on the inside of the battery lid.

The power button is required to form the circuit for the battery to discharge. I have played around with aftermarket power switches and have retrofitted them to my E10 (for experimental purposes of course).

You might be able to see my custom power switch on my 2nd E10 above.

Here's a pic I've just taken.

Wiring in the switch to work with the molex connector wasn't too difficult. Although, it's not something I'd recommend if you don't know how to solder. Notwithstanding, performing these modifications "could" void your frame warranty. But I have seen members on the Facebook community group who have gone one step further than myself and have used the power switch/cut out area for other uses

 

[Karamba!]

Thanks again Neeko.
Shamefully I have to admit that I hard-pressed myself to visually distinguish differences between both cradles but could not find any. Anyway, your explanation makes sense to me.
Regarding the on-off switch, Luna is suggesting to bypass it altogether, and many posters have agreed that it has been a solution for the bump related disconnections. One thing I'm not clear about is the relationship between this switch and the one incorporated in the controller's remote. Let me explain what I mean, and from my understanding of things:
This switch engages the battery with the motor when in on position, so bypassing it causes the battery to be permanently engaged to it.
What is the problem with the latter scenario, when you can switch the system on and off through the remote?
What's the downside of having the battery permanently engaged to the motor?

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

Thanks again Neeko.
Shamefully I have to admit that I hard-pressed myself to visually distinguish differences between both cradles but could not find any. Anyway, your explanation makes sense to me.
Regarding the on-off switch, Luna is suggesting to bypass it altogether, and many posters have agreed that it has been a solution for the bump related disconnections. One thing I'm not clear about is the relationship between this switch and the one incorporated in the controller's remote. Let me explain what I mean, and from my understanding of things:
This switch engages the battery with the motor when in on position, so bypassing it causes the battery to be permanently engaged to it.
What is the problem with the latter scenario, when you can switch the system on and off through the remote?
What's the downside of having the battery permanently engaged to the motor?

Good question.

I have performed this hack myself (using the battery from my first E10 for experimental purposes). It has yielded promising results whereby the power loss issue/water ingress issue no longer occurs. As for the lifespan of the battery (or the rate the battery discharging without being used), that remains unclear.
I have seen numerous variations of this battery. Variations include cells, cable colours etc.

The BMS trigger switch in my E10s battery is represented by the above two red cables. However, other batteries I've seen use either a red and black cable or two white cables (and their might be other batteries which use other colours which I'm not aware of).
Because of the different variations of batteries, it's difficult to verify whether the hack would impact the battery's health overall. Comparatively, other aspects (heavy discharging, charge cycles, battery storage) could equally impact the battery's health as well.
I will say that this hack voids the one year battery warranty.

And naturally, if you cut the wrong cable, you open up a new can of worms.

 

[Karamba!]

Regarding warranty void, are you positive or is it a guess? I ask because the product is oriented to the DYI community, and AFAIK it does not come with detailed instructions either. Moreover, it would also be strange or unwise that a reseller such as Luna is selling their bikes with this mod incorporated, and they are even publicly suggesting and tutoring their customers on how to do it on their own.

Anyway, since you did it, care to share your experience so far? Have you noticed anything?

 

[Ben Rides]

Thank you all, particularly you Neeko for your detailed answer.
I've recently pulled the trigger for one through Fieldebikes. I still wonder what I'm going to get. Dealers are somewhat loose when it comes to specifying what version they are offering.
I plan to make a build thread if time permits.
Regarding the battery cradle you mentioned Neeko, what exactly do you mean? Is it that the cradle is currently placed on top, hence gravity pushes the battery away from it? If it's so, how have you dealt with it?
Regarding waterproof-ness of the battery cover: from what I gather from you Ben, this will unlikely be fixed in my soon to come frame, even if it is a v2. What have you guys been doing to solve this?
One last question (for now ): I've seen a hole next to the battery key lock which it's said to be for the power button. What would be the purpose for it when you normally will switch the bike on through the controller's handlebar buttons? Does it come in all versions?

The on/off button of the battery is used in conjunction with the battery's sleep function. Without it, the battery must be charged to wake up. Of course, the sleep function of the battery can also be turned off, so there is no need for this switch; The issue of waterproofing needs to be comprehensively considered from the aspects of design and technology. Previously, a customer had feedback that we had made drainage holes for the battery bracket, which we have achieved; At present, I have not received any news that this part has been improved. I can only provide feedback to the technical department on the customer's needs, hoping that they can come up with more professional solutions and make improvements in the new model.

 

[Ben Rides]

In the new model, we will cancel the battery power switch and the sleep function. This is the latest response received, and several new models have already done so.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Ben, I have one of the very original frames that doesn't have the lid opener, just screws. It probably has the least water ingress protection of all the versions. Despite that considering that I do ride throughout the British winter and often in standing water, how little water ingress I get. all things considering I don't think I get anymore than other commercial brands such as the Rail my friends have.

Key has to be to have decent mudguards to prevent a high pressure spray around that area off the front wheel. Also you will never defend water getting in there, there are just too many openings, so make sure there is a channel for the water to drain, I think there is a few pictures of this mod already.

The Bafang engine plugs all have water resistant plugs, the motor highly sealed, it should be the battery water protection rather than trying to defend water getting into that frame cavity as the main concern ( please do take your battery out and put it in a warm area on occassion ).

All you as manufacturers need to do is to minimise as best you can any openings by good moulds getting as near to interference fits as possible along any openings. Any unused frame holes then simply rubber grommets are good enough.

 

[Karamba!]

Thanks Ben. What happens with warranty, if current owners decide to bypass the switch?

 

[Ben Rides]

Thanks Ben. What happens with warranty, if current owners decide to bypass the switch?

Bypassing the switch will result in the inability to quickly wake up the dormant battery, which is only a modification of the external circuit of the battery and does not affect the battery's warranty.
And the battery warranty is only half a year, with a very low failure rate. Almost no customers will use it.. Compared to warranty, charging the motor every time it starts is more troublesome..
The suggestion is to replace the battery with a new one without sleep function after cycling for a few years, and then skip this switch.
Users with strong hands-on skills can create batteries without sleep function and skip the switch directly. This approach carries certain risks,

 

[Karamba!]

Bypassing the switch will result in the inability to quickly wake up the dormant battery, which is only a modification of the external circuit of the battery and does not affect the battery's warranty.
And the battery warranty is only half a year, with a very low failure rate. Almost no customers will use it.. Compared to warranty, charging the motor every time it starts is more troublesome..
The suggestion is to replace the battery with a new one without sleep function after cycling for a few years, and then skip this switch.
Users with strong hands-on skills can create batteries without sleep function and skip the switch directly. This approach carries certain risks,

Thanks again Ben for your input.
I ignore how the battery that I will receive is in this regard. I have asked for clarification to Fieldebikes.
What I fail to understand is what you said about returning the battery from sleep state. I'm a newbie in regards to emtbs ownership. I have only test-drove them. What I expected in terms of regular procedure is to just switch the bike on by means of the remote controller and that's it, as it is with other established brands.
What I don't understand, after reading you, is what would be the procedure to turn on the dengfu/bafang bike in order to ride it:
1) if the battery comes with the on-off switch: Turn on the switch and then turn on the motor through the remote control?
2) if the switch is bypassed: Connect the charger to the mounted battery, and then switch on the motor through the remote?
Can you clarify?

 

[Ben Rides]

Thanks again Ben for your input.
I ignore how the battery that I will receive is in this regard. I have asked for clarification to Fieldebikes.
What I fail to understand is what you said about returning the battery from sleep state. I'm a newbie in regards to emtbs ownership. I have only test-drove them. What I expected in terms of regular procedure is to just switch the bike on by means of the remote controller and that's it, as it is with other established brands.
What I don't understand, after reading you, is what would be the procedure to turn on the dengfu/bafang bike in order to ride it:
1) if the battery comes with the on-off switch: Turn on the switch and then turn on the motor through the remote control?
2) if the switch is bypassed: Connect the charger to the mounted battery, and then switch on the motor through the remote?
Can you clarify?

You understand correctly, but our ebike currently does not have a remote control. For models with battery switches, the startup sequence is to first turn on the battery switch, and then use the motor controller button to start the machine. For models without the need to turn on the battery switch and remove the sleep function, simply use the controller button of the motor to turn on the machine.

 

[Karamba!]

Understood. However you lost me when you said your bikes do not have a remote control. With remote I refer to the buttons that come with the Bafang motor that you place on the handlebar, where you control the HMI. What do you mean?

 

[Ben Rides]

Oh, okay. That's naturally there. It should be a translation error. My excessive reliance on translation resulted in misunderstandings. It's better to read the original text directly.