commencal 2021

[Yazid Yakub]

Hey guys, thanks for sharing these documents.

I’ve just received my meta sx race in feb and have had a few rides with it this past few weeks. It is absolutely brilliant on the ascents and man, the downs are so much fun!!! So stable, so plush such a plougher! Haha!

Anyways, back to the documents, early in the TSB 156 document, it mentions to remove the inner seal as it takes up a 1mm space in between crank’s inner face and the spindle.

That’s rather interesting! Has anyone done so to their assembly?

On a side note, as a precaution, I just ordered a 165mm Shimano ep8 crank set from bike-discount.de and i believe they have the whole range (160mm - 175mm). Coming from a 170mm, I’m still not used to the shorter crank arm length.

Guys, we have an employee from E 13 active on this forum, that has answered our questions regarding this issue. They have written up a document on this and also discussed with us on this forum what their current recommendations are. If you have any questions you can try and ask them on that thread and tag their user. See the links below:

Their official documentation for this product/issue:

TSB #156 - e*spec Shimano™ alloy crank tech update

TECHNICAL SERVICE BULLETIN #156.2 e*spec Shimano™ alloy crank tech update Product(s) included: e*thirteen e*spec Shimano EP8 alloy cranks. Abstract e*spec Shimano EP8/EP800 alloy cranks were dev...

support.ethirteen.com

The thread on this forum related to this topic:

Cranks for EP8 motor

Hi all, I recently had my E*13 crank arm fail on me and it needs to be replaced. My first thought was to get a Shimano one, but my local bike shop said they were on back order until late August. I have since reached out to E*13 and Commencal to see if they can be of any help, but not getting...

www.emtbforums.com

 

[NCeMTB]

I have not removed the inner face seal. Honestly I didn’t see this directive until after I (over) torqued and marked the caps and pinch bolts as described above.

Since seeing the e13 notice, I have sent them a request to get caps with the recommended thread locker patch (mine have none). I’ve not heard back from e13 yet.

 

[Yazid Yakub]

Was the request to get caps directly to the e13 by email? Would you have a contact address you could share? I seemed to have damaged the 5mm hex hole while tightening the cap with the hex key.

I have not removed the inner face seal. Honestly I didn’t see this directive until after I (over) torqued and marked the caps and pinch bolts as described above.

Since seeing the e13 notice, I have sent them a request to get caps with the recommended thread locker patch (mine have none). I’ve not heard back from e13 yet.

 

[NCeMTB]

I went to the e13 website and used the “contact” form - that said, still no response (3 days)

 

[azzwethinkweiz]

Was the request to get caps directly to the e13 by email? Would you have a contact address you could share? I seemed to have damaged the 5mm hex hole while tightening the cap with the hex key.

I mentioned this in another thread but shimano style hollowtech caps fit. Bike shops should have plenty of those in stock. This is what I used after my cranks fell off the first time.

 

[Yazid Yakub]

Cheers NCeMTB & azzwethinkweiz

 

[TEE]

• Updated torque spec: Preload cap 2Nm / Pinch bolts: 14Nm.*

This is what i did. I mean the Cap for shimano cranks in most cases is tightened with only 0.5 NM so idk why you would have to use 8NM. Btw, i think that the threads of the shimano motor for the Preload caps is made out of aluminum by using numbers that high you might run danger to break those threads resulting in a motor with no preload caps at all.
14NM on the bolts is what i used on my cranks and i did not have any issues. Maybe you did not tighten the bolts before your FIRST ride and that caused some damage to the cranks or the part of the motor where the cranks are beeing mounted on. - I forgot the word for it im not from england. ^^

However, it really sounds very strange for me that so many of you are complaining about falling off crank arms. If its really the case than it might be some bad production whatsoever but i doubt it.
I think the link wich darkyHS posted should fix your problems.

Like mentioned in other threads commencal does not assemble the bike in a way a normal bike store does. These bikes are getting shipped to customers and like pretty much all shipping companys they expect you to do that work. I dont know about any brand which doesnt do it that way.
We get a lot of bike which were bougth online , never correctly assembled with loose cranks tires which are not true etc. Just an advice from my side. ^^
Let them true the wheels check motor bolts etc. Shouldnt be too expensive maybe 80€ but then you can be sure that the bike is ready to ride.

 

[mks568]

The second ride on my new 2021 Meta Power TR the crank fell off, luckily while pedaling up hill and not while decending at speed. I reassembled it using thread locker but knowing this, I will now do both side as described. I did not look to see if there was a seal or not.

 

[azzwethinkweiz]

• Updated torque spec: Preload cap 2Nm / Pinch bolts: 14Nm.*

This is what i did. I mean the Cap for shimano cranks in most cases is tightened with only 0.5 NM so idk why you would have to use 8NM. Btw, i think that the threads of the shimano motor for the Preload caps is made out of aluminum by using numbers that high you might run danger to break those threads resulting in a motor with no preload caps at all.
14NM on the bolts is what i used on my cranks and i did not have any issues. Maybe you did not tighten the bolts before your FIRST ride and that caused some damage to the cranks or the part of the motor where the cranks are beeing mounted on. - I forgot the word for it im not from england. ^^

However, it really sounds very strange for me that so many of you are complaining about falling off crank arms. If its really the case than it might be some bad production whatsoever but i doubt it.
I think the link wich darkyHS posted should fix your problems.

Like mentioned in other threads commencal does not assemble the bike in a way a normal bike store does. These bikes are getting shipped to customers and like pretty much all shipping companys they expect you to do that work. I dont know about any brand which doesnt do it that way.
We get a lot of bike which were bougth online , never correctly assembled with loose cranks tires which are not true etc. Just an advice from my side. ^^
Let them true the wheels check motor bolts etc. Shouldnt be too expensive maybe 80€ but then you can be sure that the bike is ready to ride.

The only real issue I had with the crank ordeal was that my cranks where basically where they where supposed to be torque wise according to the torque listed on the crank itself. To be clear they where slightly low but I torqued then up to spec and applied some thread lock for good measure. The problem is this torque is not high enough for many. I did all this before I even sat on the bike. Retorquing at the original spec I would not trust in any way. I tested this and applied torque stripe and after a few miles I had movement again. Retorquing it a bit over the suggested retorque spec has resulted in them not budging after another 200 miles. Everyone's results may vary but it's definitely not just an issue of people not checking torques before the first ride (although this may contribute to the problem), rather the original recommended torque from e13 being too low. Just my thoughts though.

I suppose they're in as big of a hurry to ship out the bikes as we are to receive them; but you would think there would be a bit of test riding a sample bike from each trim done up from the factory (as a bike shop would assemble it) to check for any final issues before shipping the bikes out to customer. I do think Commencal has handled it well enough however and it is clear that e13 just made a simple mistake and it seems like they're doing ok replacing parts and paying for bike shop service to fix the issues. It sucks if anyone is getting hurt over it though. I was lucky enough to get away with only a limp and a goose egg on my ankle for a couple days.

At the end of the day, the bike is an absolute blast to ride.

 

[mks568]

azzwethinkweiz

• Updated torque spec: Preload cap 2Nm / Pinch bolts: 14Nm.*

This is what i did. I mean the Cap for shimano cranks in most cases is tightened with only 0.5 NM so idk why you would have to use 8NM. Btw, i think that the threads of the shimano motor for the Preload caps is made out of aluminum by using numbers that high you might run danger to break those threads resulting in a motor with no preload caps at all.
14NM on the bolts is what i used on my cranks and i did not have any issues. Maybe you did not tighten the bolts before your FIRST ride and that caused some damage to the cranks or the part of the motor where the cranks are beeing mounted on. - I forgot the word for it im not from england. ^^

However, it really sounds very strange for me that so many of you are complaining about falling off crank arms. If its really the case than it might be some bad production whatsoever but i doubt it.
I think the link wich darkyHS posted should fix your problems.

Like mentioned in other threads commencal does not assemble the bike in a way a normal bike store does. These bikes are getting shipped to customers and like pretty much all shipping companys they expect you to do that work. I dont know about any brand which doesnt do it that way.
We get a lot of bike which were bougth online , never correctly assembled with loose cranks tires which are not true etc. Just an advice from my side. ^^
Let them true the wheels check motor bolts etc. Shouldnt be too expensive maybe 80€ but then you can be sure that the bike is ready to ride.

I would question the integrity of any company that sells a product online as mostly assembled but does not put the effort into assembling that product correctly. If Commencal is assembling the bike almost fully, why would they not torque the parts that they assembled correctly.

I believe that azzwethinkweiz is correct and that the specs that E 13 has posted are too light. Anyway, I will probably just switch to a better brand of cranks to eliminate any further issues.

 

[duplex]

• Updated torque spec: Preload cap 2Nm / Pinch bolts: 14Nm.*

However, it really sounds very strange for me that so many of you are complaining about falling off crank arms. If its really the case than it might be some bad production whatsoever but i doubt it.
I think the link wich darkyHS posted should fix your problems..

Because the torque values provided by the manufacturer of the defective product were by their own admission incorrect. And in addition, they are updating the instructions now suggesting you remove the seal from their crank arms. It appears that Commencal and e13 overlooked the issue in their first wave of deliveries rather than perform the correct assembly themselves prior to shipping it or provide documentation to the owner with the updated recommendations. Their own service bulletin states, "This situation has been misinterpreted by some to mean there is a failure of one or more system components." In a way, that is the system failure for which they claim some misinterpret.

 

[azzwethinkweiz]

Just got my Shimano cranks on (after they came all the way from Italy!) A few notes when installing them; The little rubber/metal gaskets fit into the Shimano cranks the same way they fit into the e13 ones. Although the Shimano cranks did not come with them, I reused the old ones. (these gaskets seem like they would be optional though I am not sure) The cranks came with plastic caps and thread into the crank-axle more snugly/closer tolerance feeling then the metal e13 ones that fit more loose. I couldn't locate my Shimano tool but was able to use a large star bit that worked fine to snug these down gently. These cranks also have the little locking style clip that is held on with the two pinch bolts (torque to 12-14nm alternating) so if the issue arises again at least I can feel a bit more secure that the crank won't completely eject itself from the bike before I come to a stop. (hopefully) Because the way the clip fits into the hole on the axle, I had to mount my cranks 180 from how the e13 ones where to line up with the holes.

The large plastic cover/seal piece on the drive side does not work with the Shimano cranks and the e13 crank boots unfortunately did not fit the new cranks either. I tried to force one on but ended up snapping it since it is really hard plastic and doesn't want to stretch. (Guess I'll order up some new ones off of Amazon at some point) I ordered these cranks in the same size as the stock e13 cranks (160mm) and they also appear to be identical (dimension wise) as far as the distance the pedal ends up from the frame is concerned (took some measurements before and after)

I marked my caps to keep an eye on possible movement. Hopefully I'll have a chance to ride this week and test them out.

 

[NCeMTB]

I went to the e13 website and used the “contact” form - that said, still no response (3 days)

Follow-up: Did hear back from e13 (after completing warranty form). They are sending new caps with loctite patch on them. Still going to install the Shimano XT cranks when they come later this week.

 

[bazmacdonald]

Just wondering what sort of elevation and distance yous have been getting, 2nd outing on bike using trail mode, just a few times on boost for small hill, I was just down to the last bar of the battery,

 

[rb.]

Just wondering what sort of elevation and distance yous have been getting, 2nd outing on bike using trail mode, just a few times on boost for small hill, I was just down to the last bar of the battery,

View attachment 56918

I can usually get 20 miles and 5k’ elevation in mainly trail mode.

 

[MTB565]

Anyone found some good comparisons of the SX and the Meta POWER? I'm leaning towards the SX due to the geometry numbers but while i do prefer the steep downhill i dont live near any actual mountains but shorter downhill sections mixed up with some flatter singeltrack. I think the Meta Power is probably more suitable to my riding but the recommended size for my length (M) have shorter reach than chainstays which feels wierd and the reach is 24mm shorter then my normal bike (YT Jeffsy Large). Just looking at the numbers the SX feels somewhat more balanced but that does not always translate to real world experience and kinda worried that the SX would the to sluggish to pedal around on the flatter sections of trail riding. I would never buy a normal 180mm bike for my local trails but i reason that with the motor helps with that and the bike would see some bikepark use from time to time,

 

[Dirtysouth]

How’s everyone’s battery health I’m at 20 cycles and have just dropped from 98% to 96%

 

[NCeMTB]

How’s everyone’s battery health I’m at 20 cycles and have just dropped from 98% to 96%

I’m not sure how to get that data...

 

[ShaneBean]

Well, you guys warned me. The big top cap bolt fell of and then the threads inside the crank arm stripped. Going to look for something better to replace the e13 stuff with, but not sure what is compatible or even in stock.

And unfortunately this happened right before a sizable double which I cased super bad and severely bent my handlebars.
View attachment 55006

Oof sorry my guy.

 

[leftside]

I already have a YT Decoy, which I absolutely love, but today I preordered a Meta Power SX. It used to be great when YT were just up the road in Squamish, but they are no longer here, and Commencal are.

The lack of response from YT customer support, lack of spare parts/extremely long waits for spare parts and lack of bikes was another deciding factor that made me go look elsewhere. I'm starting to get a little paranoid that a bike specific part will break and I won't be able to ride for a long time.

I've taken a look at a lot of other bikes, and I don't think anything comes close to the Decoy or Meta when it comes to specs and price. Commencal gets my cash for the next bike as my friend has the previous years model and loves it, and also said customer support are excellent, and having the store in Squamish is great. We can pay an extra $50 to have the bike assembled.

I'll keep following this thread until my bike arrives in the summer and I'm a proper member of the club. ETA July.

 

[rb.]

We can pay an extra $50 to have the bike assembled.

All you have to do to “build” it is install the wheels and handlebars. The longest part of the process is removing it from the packaging.

 

[NCeMTB]

All you have to do to “build” it is install the wheels and handlebars. The longest part of the process is removing it from the packaging.

Was thinking same - pretty easy. Also check ALL TORQUES especially those e13 cranks(!). Did note on mine that both axles were dry (no grease) and rear was way too tight. I did torque and re-grease headset after about 10 rides. Basically - go through bike just to make sure all is good to SEND.

 

[leftside]

Was thinking same - pretty easy. Also check ALL TORQUES especially those e13 cranks(!). Did note on mine that both axles were dry (no grease) and rear was way too tight. I did torque and re-grease headset after about 10 rides. Basically - go through bike just to make sure all is good to SEND.

Ok good to know thanks. Commencal are also going to RideWrap the bike for me and also assemble. This will be very convenient for me, as I'll drive 1 hour to Squamish, check all torques as you guys recommend, and then take the bike for a ride in Squamish.

 

[Darkyhs]

Guys, had the most epic weekend as of yet on this beast! Did around 1000 meters of vertical and 25Kms horizontally. Most of it in Trail, but also a bit in boost, due to very technical terrain. Had 3 bars left. Pretty impressed.

Share your epic weekend warrior pics!

 

[dropbear14]

is there any others out there who are around 178cm (5'8") who ride either the medium or large Meta Power SX? I have always rode medium frames, although after my last bike (2020 Commencal Clash medium) I told myself I would be buying a large frame size for my next bike. but then I realise that the 2021 Commencal's appear to have gone a little larger again, and so now I'm stuckl on my decision between large and medium. I was hoping to hear from some others around the same height and what they're riding and their opinion on sizes. Thanks

 

[leftside]

is there any others out there who are around 178cm (5'8") who ride either the medium or large Meta Power SX? I have always rode medium frames, although after my last bike (2020 Commencal Clash medium) I told myself I would be buying a large frame size for my next bike. but then I realise that the 2021 Commencal's appear to have gone a little larger again, and so now I'm stuckl on my decision between large and medium. I was hoping to hear from some others around the same height and what they're riding and their opinion on sizes. Thanks

If you are 178cm, then you are actually 5'10". 178cm converts to 5.8 feet which is 5'10". Just in case there are some people out there who use feet and inches and may be able to help

 

[dropbear14]

If you are 178cm, then you are actually 5'10". 178cm converts to 5.8 feet which is 5'10". Just in case there are some people out there who use feet and inches and may be able to help

ahhh thank you you're correct. i did a quick google translation and neglected the fact the translation was still in increments of 10, not 12.

 

[rb.]

is there any others out there who are around 178cm (5'8") who ride either the medium or large Meta Power SX? I have always rode medium frames, although after my last bike (2020 Commencal Clash medium) I told myself I would be buying a large frame size for my next bike. but then I realise that the 2021 Commencal's appear to have gone a little larger again, and so now I'm stuckl on my decision between large and medium. I was hoping to hear from some others around the same height and what they're riding and their opinion on sizes. Thanks

Since the seat tube is fairly steep, the reach doesn’t feel as big when sitting on the bike as it looks on paper. (At least compared to my other bikes). I think large would fit fine if you are comfortable with a big bike. But in my opinion, on ebikes I think it’s best to size down if you are on the fence. An ebike is naturally stable due to the extra weight, so having a bike that’s a bit smaller and more nimble might be nice.

 

[NCeMTB]

is there any others out there who are around 178cm (5'8") who ride either the medium or large Meta Power SX? I have always rode medium frames, although after my last bike (2020 Commencal Clash medium) I told myself I would be buying a large frame size for my next bike. but then I realise that the 2021 Commencal's appear to have gone a little larger again, and so now I'm stuckl on my decision between large and medium. I was hoping to hear from some others around the same height and what they're riding and their opinion on sizes. Thanks

I’m same size - riding a large meta27 sig (485mm reach). Feels great. Definitely long wheel base (slack headset angle) so not super agile on tight single track - but holy moly does it rail downhill and through the gnar... so, as everyone’s mentioned - kind of depends on what type of riding you are buying for.

 

[melmark]

I’m same size - riding a large meta27 sig (485mm reach). Feels great. Definitely long wheel base (slack headset angle) so not super agile on tight single track - but holy moly does it rail downhill and through the gnar... so, as everyone’s mentioned - kind of depends on what type of riding you are buying for.

Totally agree. I am no flyboy and this is a monster on the downhills