YT Decoy strange noise (no, not the known shimano noise ;-) )

[elvis_mtb]

Hey folks. I need your help/expirience please. I can't figure out, where those anoying, cracking noise is coming from (i can also feel it a bit through the pedals). I own the bike for about 5 weeks now and have 900 km on it. It starts 2 weeks ago on a trip in the swiss alps. I uploaded two video files, where you can hear it. The noise comes mostly , but not allways, when i'm riding uphill (very rarely in flat terrain). I checked every bolt and screw and tightened with right torque. The chain still looks (measured with a chain gauge) good enough. Maybe it's nevertheless the chain!? In the worst case it could be the Shimano Motor or the CF rear frame!? It's my first e-bike, but not my first CF bike. I never had similar noises on any bike.

Any ideas what else i missed to check?

After paddeling backwards, the noise sometimes is gone
https://drive.google.com/open?id=11mH14AAMcP3kKa-k4LoiMLqaqOSCBAc9

The noise is still there after turning the engine off
https://drive.google.com/open?id=11nBMZGyETJbGexf-W0doHmJm2ZFq5_yv

 

[Sorinok]

Hello, i think the sound came from casette e13.

 

[elvis_mtb]

Hello, i think the sound came from casette e13.

Thanks for the quick reply.
So, you think there is anything wrong with the cassette? Any known issues and tips for that model?

 

[Zimmerframe]

related :

Decoy Cassette Problem - EMTB Forums

 

[elvis_mtb]

related :

Decoy Cassette Problem - EMTB Forums

Hello and thank you.

I also read this thread. The problem actually exists with me too. But I could not read anything of any strange noises there. That's why I have another topic open.

 

[Zimmerframe]

I've got no sound on this PC so I can't check your mp4's ..

You could ask on that thread if anyone with that problem experienced a sound like you have ? Just incase it is related.

 

[Jamsxr]

@Gary is the oracle of all things e8000 related so I’m sure he might help diagnose if it’s motor related..

 

[Gary]

Can't really tell much from you video. sorry.
if you're going to try and diagnose it while riding the bike choose a smooth surface with little to no background noise.
and also make sure to test whether the noise is present seated and standing, pedalling and/or freewheeling. weighting the pedals/cranks individually.

to diagnose exactly where a noise is coming from you need to isolate each component (or component group) individually so you can gradually eliminate the places it's NOT coming from one at a time. until you've narrowed it down to where it definitely IS coming from

eg. remove your chain completely and seeing if you can still force the bike to make horrible sounds while loading the cranks/suspension/saddle weighting/unweighting the bike in all planes .

also...
Do you have a repair stand you can put the bike in?
A sturdy workstand is handy when trying to isolate where creaks/noises are coming from.
If not. putting the bike upside down with a helper to hold the frame etc. while you try to flex various parts can work.

Carbon is horrible for making creaks/noises sound like they're coming from an area it's not.

You say you've checked ever bolt and screw is torqued properly
Does this def include absolutely EVERYTHING?
ie. E8000 spider lockring
chainring bolts
E8000 crank pinchbolts
Pedal axles
cassette lockring
hub thru axle
Mech hanger bolts
mech pivot bolt
seatpost collar
saddle clamp
caliper mounting bolts
spokes

Also check for play/tightness absolutely everywhere. hubs/ BB axle, headset, freehub

Your bike is new to you. But i assume you're not new to bikes?
But if you are, find a good local bike shop with a good workshop and good mechanics. Even though it is an Ebike a good bike shop mechanic should be able to find the soiurce of your noise issue

 

[Gary]

Hold on

E13 cassettte?

Check that thoroughly as well.

 

[elvis_mtb]

Can't really tell much from you video. sorry.
if you're going to try and diagnose it while riding the bike choose a smooth surface with little to no background noise.
and also make sure to test whether the noise is present seated and standing, pedalling and/or freewheeling. weighting the pedals/cranks individually.

to diagnose exactly where a noise is coming from you need to isolate each component (or component group) individually so you can gradually eliminate the places it's NOT coming from one at a time. until you've narrowed it down to where it definitely IS coming from

eg. remove your chain completely and seeing if you can still force the bike to make horrible sounds while loading the cranks/suspension/saddle weighting/unweighting the bike in all planes .

also...
Do you have a repair stand you can put the bike in?
A sturdy workstand is handy when trying to isolate where creaks/noises are coming from.
If not. putting the bike upside down with a helper to hold the frame etc. while you try to flex various parts can work.

Carbon is horrible for making creaks/noises sound like they're coming from an area it's not.

You say you've checked ever bolt and screw is torqued properly
Does this def include absolutely EVERYTHING?
ie. E8000 spider lockring
chainring bolts
E8000 crank pinchbolts
Pedal axles
cassette lockring
hub thru axle
Mech hanger bolts
mech pivot bolt
seatpost collar
saddle clamp
caliper mounting bolts
spokes

Also check for play/tightness absolutely everywhere. hubs/ BB axle, headset, freehub

Your bike is new to you. But i assume you're not new to bikes?
But if you are, find a good local bike shop with a good workshop and good mechanics. Even though it is an Ebike a good bike shop mechanic should be able to find the soiurce of your noise issue

Wow! thanks for telling me all that stuff, what can be a reason for cracking noises. So, i have to check some more parts. For that i have to order some tools that i dont own. I also wrote a mail to YT support and explained my problem and thoughts of the e13 cassette.

What i can say about the noise production, is the same:
- allmost only when i ride uphill
- when it starts, it dosen't matter how much i weighting the pedals, or which gear i am riding, or whichs support mode is active
- i can't force the bike in other positions to make that sound

I will try to figure out the most stuff you listed.
I very apericate your help!

 

[MoWind]

I’m guessing hub, not cassette; but that’s only a guess...

 

[YTDecoyOwner]

I'm having the same issue with my YT Decoy Pro Race. You described the issue perfectly. Noise isn't consistent and happening when climbing hills. It's not the cassette. I've taken to a shop and they went through the bike checking everything, but noise is still happening. Very frustrating.

 

[squeegee]

I would look at the hub first based on those videos earlier in this thread but I doubt the cassette is the problem. Also look at this thread that I posted because after about 3-4 weeks of owning my decoy I got a sound I isolated to pivot axles that only needed grease, the sounds I had would mostly happen climbing or under more heavy pedaling force. See the diagram I posted to know the exact place my problem came from, easy fix.

Knocking sound from within the Decoy frame - EMTB Forums

 

[nativeracer]

It’s the rear hub. My buddies made the same noise and even stopped at one point. We disassembled his and couldn’t find anything wrong with it. Call ethirteen and they should take care of you.

 

[TransAmMan]

Agree with above .. likely the hub.

E13 easily has the BEST customer service in the bike business (that I have ever experienced). They will definitely look after you.

 

[BlackSheep]

I am also having this issue with a YT Decoy Pro. This afternoon I followed squeegee's recommendation and greased the pivot axles. Unfortunately, I went for a ride this afternoon and the sound is still there. Super frustrating. Instead of folks saying nice bike, I get what is that noise.

Seems to only happen when climbing and with heavy pedaling force. I also noticed on my normal ride it almost always starts when shifting into the second lowest gear. Any thoughts on how to troubleshoot the rear hub? I would feel better if I could somehow isolate the hub as the issue. Or do I just call E13 and see what they say.

Here is a video of the noise.

 

[Sapientiea]

Well, see if yu can get hold of another 27,5 rear wheel and try it out. Sounds to me the E13 cassette/hub is the problem. Did you check if it is installed correctly?

 

[elvis_mtb]

Agree with above .. likely the hub.

E13 easily has the BEST customer service in the bike business (that I have ever experienced). They will definitely look after you.

I Agree. They were very helpful and send me an new casette. Unfortunally, the noise is still there.

 

[elvis_mtb]

I would look at the hub first based on those videos earlier in this thread but I doubt the cassette is the problem. Also look at this thread that I posted because after about 3-4 weeks of owning my decoy I got a sound I isolated to pivot axles that only needed grease, the sounds I had would mostly happen climbing or under more heavy pedaling force. See the diagram I posted to know the exact place my problem came from, easy fix.

Knocking sound from within the Decoy frame - EMTB Forums

I followed the hint for the pivot axle earlyer in your post...cleaned and greased everything perfect. The noise is still there...
But when i did that, i recognized another frustrating fact.
Maybe this could also be the reason!?
In my opinion, there is heavy friction/rub off on the connection from main triangle to rear triangle, in the area of the main pivot axle. I could imagine, that the sound comes from that friction...CF on CF, on heavy load (force from weigh, motor)!?
The following pics can not discribe perfectly how it looks. In reality it is worse.
The paint on the rear trinangle is gone and the CF is rubbed.

Decoy Hinterbau - Google Drive

Whats your thougts?
I didn't have this on any bike before and in this short ammount of time.

 

[squeegee]

It has been a while since I've had the axles out but in your pictures it looks to me like you've been riding in a lot of wet and muddy conditions, am I right?

If you have, then I'd assume that wear is from grime and dirt acting like sandpaper as you ride. I've only done about 5 really sloppy/muddy rides since I got the bike and make sure to clean it after anything bad which is an unfortunate downside to winter riding. More gear, more time cleaning and prepping just to go out in the cold.

One suggestion, after the next cleaning, try turning the bike upside down and remove the battery and motor cover/sponge insert and clean it out really well, no water just rags and maybe a bit of WD40 or other evaporating lubricant and use compressed air if available.

On a super muddy day I got a bunch of thumping/clicking noises coming from the motor area. I was worried something was wrong with the motor but the noises were simply a load of junk around the chainring/tensioner/motor spindle. After a good cleaning sounds went away.

I've not heard any noise from my rear hub but I have seen a couple of people with an internal hub issue, on same model Decoy Pro as mine with E13 espec rear hub.

 

[elvis_mtb]

It has been a while since I've had the axles out but in your pictures it looks to me like you've been riding in a lot of wet and muddy conditions, am I right?

Thanks for the reply.
Sorry, nearly no ride in wet or muddy conditions. I received the bike in high summer time ?
I also cleaned the bike often but carefully in the best way.
Next i will try to proof the hub solution.
But YT should also have look at the frame. This wear is really not normal.

 

[BlackSheep]

Next i will try to proof the hub solution.

Listening to your video and mine, it sure seems like the same noise. My local bike shop (California Bike & Snowboard Alamo CA) disassembled the cassette and then reassembled greasing and torquing per spec. They did not see any smoking gun and the noise still exists. They do feel the noise is coming from the hub and worked with E13 to get a new rear wheel. The wheel should arrive today. So hopefully within the next few days I can eliminate the hub as being the issue or not.

I did notice when greasing the lower rear pivot axle that it did not exit or insert smoothly at all. Very rough compared the to upper axle. I didn't notice any rubbing on the carbon. That being said, I have about 130 miles on the Decoy and almost all road riding with the wet weather here in NorCal.

California Bike & Snowboard and E13 have been great to work. Excellent customer service from both companies. I will post an update after the shop gets everything put back together.

 

[elvis_mtb]

Listening to your video and mine, it sure seems like the same noise. My local bike shop (California Bike & Snowboard Alamo CA) disassembled the cassette and then reassembled greasing and torquing per spec. They did not see any smoking gun and the noise still exists. They do feel the noise is coming from the hub and worked with E13 to get a new rear wheel. The wheel should arrive today. So hopefully within the next few days I can eliminate the hub as being the issue or not.

I did notice when greasing the lower rear pivot axle that it did not exit or insert smoothly at all. Very rough compared the to upper axle. I didn't notice any rubbing on the carbon. That being said, I have about 130 miles on the Decoy and almost all road riding with the wet weather here in NorCal.

California Bike & Snowboard and E13 have been great to work. Excellent customer service from both companies. I will post an update after the shop gets everything put back together.

Great, i can't wait for your update! ?

 

[Mikerb]

On your 2 original videos it seems to me that the noise directly corresponds to the rotation of the crank. You are in different gears in those 2 videos and as far as I can tell the noise in both directly corresponds to the crank rotation...….and from what I can tell on the drive side. My guess would be pedal bearing, loose crank, chain wheel or spider ( possibly chain guide). Worth changing pedals ( even to cheapos) to eliminate the pedal.

 

[squeegee]

Thanks for the reply.
Sorry, nearly no ride in wet or muddy conditions. I received the bike in high summer time ?
I also cleaned the bike often but carefully in the best way.
Next i will try to proof the hub solution.
But YT should also have look at the frame. This wear is really not normal.

You have me wondering if my frame has wear like that too, next time I have it apart I'll respond back if I'm seeing the same damage as you have which is substantial. I just can't see how that much scratching would happen without all kinds of dirt and debris being in there when you're riding.

Will reply later.

 

[Sand0kan]

Having the same noises on my pro race....lubed the hell out of the axles.....still noise......reassembled and lubed cassette.....same noise.

Tomorrow i will try another backwheel to rule out the hub.

 

[khorn]

A long shot but have you tried to take out the bolts holding the motor, give them a light grease coating and retorque to spec?

It does sounds like a noice from that area.

Karsten

 

[BlackSheep]

Great, i can't wait for your update! ?

My local shop swapped out the new wheel and it seems like the noise is gone. I am a little hesitant to say it is solved after only 9 miles but it was a noise free 9 miles. That would have been impossible before.

I am getting much more jumping between cogs in higher gears but I think that is a known problem. My local shop tried everything to resolve that with no luck. I will contact E13 for a fix.

 

[Fatdog]

I had a similar noise and took the wheel off, removed cassette, and took the axle out off the hub, cleaned and regreased everything and also greased the end caps up as seen on other forums e13 recommend doing the end caps (so far) everything running smoothly....

 

[Sand0kan]

I had a similar noise and took the wheel off, removed cassette, and took the axle out off the hub, cleaned and regreased everything and also greased the end caps up as seen on other forums e13 recommend doing the end caps (so far) everything running smoothly....

this worked for me to...at least on the road have to hit the trails with it