Levo SL Gen 1 What I don't like about SL power delivery

[jimslade]

At higher support/peak settings, I find the on'off power delivery unnatural. If I'm scaling a steep technical trail section that tops out and I stop peddling, the SL keeps delivering power for a second/split-second, occasionally sending me into a boulder or something. I realize the job of a Spesch engineer is tough.... cut power too quickly and riders will complain delivery is abrupt. Trail power off too slowly and the bike will feel unnatural like what I'm experiencing. I'm imagining there's a goldilocks middle where power trails off quickly but not abruptly... does anyone know how Specialized handles power on/off? can it be tuned by Spesch?

I don't feel this way in 'eco' or 'trail'... those are totally natural and a dream, so I've started walking back my turbo settings every ride or two (now at 70/100) to see if I can find a setup where this is minimized. Anybody else feel this way? or do I just not know how to ride?

 

[Gary]

You're complaining BOOST doesn't feel natural enough?

You maybe want to have a wee think about that for a moment

or do I just not know how to ride?

This. (to some extent)

Plan ahead, Emtb motor overrun is actually really really useful in certain circumstances.

 

[jimslade]

@Gary I had a 19 Levo Comp, and I just don't remember its overrun as much. I've had the SL a month now... maybe i've totally forgotten my Levo already! btw I moved from the Levo to the SL in part because the SL feels like like a super-human me vs a super-powered bike. how do you use overrun?

@BAMBAMODA I run 20/30, 45/60, and 70/100. I was thinking dialing back support as a workaround... eco and trail are AMAZING. I'm trying to minimize the 'overrun' feeling while keeping as much power as possible. I'm mostly running eco and trail and happy there. I'll try lower support and max.

 

[Gary]

how do you use overrun?

among other reasons...
to maintain momentum while keeping your pedals out of the way of technical terrain/trail objects.
RATHER THAN BUYING STUPID CLOWN CRANKS
For acceleration surge in short throw/ratchetting pedal input situations
Once you learn overrun timing it's also handy for gear shifting smoothly under minimal load.

 

[TomH79]

I mostly use settings like :
*30/40
*45/55
*100/100

Or:
*30/100(works everywhere)
*40/50
*100/100

On technical, i use eco or trail. For me turbo is for braaping stages or when climbing and want to save leg for descending.

 

[maynard]

Turn down accelerate %

 

[boBE]

I rarely use Turbo but tried mine today to see the issue: it cuts out almost instantly in Eco and Trail and maybe 1/2 second after stopping pedaling in Turbo. Don't know why Specialized programmed it that way but it doesn't bother me.

 

[maynard]

Or just use the brakes .

 

[MrBrownstone]

Or just use the brakes .

This. Works amazing where it’s techy and steep while in boost/turbo especially. Let off on brakes for quick accelerations like clutching a dirt bike.

 

[Rosemount]

This. Works amazing where it’s techy and steep while in boost/turbo especially. Let off on brakes for quick accelerations like clutching a dirt bike.

Finger on the rear brake .
Keep pedaling , regulate power with back brake . I learnt this intuitively . When using Turbo on tight trails . Now use EMTB mode but still use the back brake to regulate power delivery .

 

[Rosemount]

among other reasons...
to maintain momentum while keeping your pedals out of the way of technical terrain/trail objects.
RATHER THAN BUYING STUPID CLOWN CRANKS
For acceleration surge in short throw/ratchetting pedal input situations
Once you learn overrun timing it's also handy for gear shifting smoothly under minimal load.

I use this technique at times .
In a rut or where keeping the pedals level is a must . Learning to govern with the back brake is a skill to use in tight or techy stuff . Or riding very close to another riders [esp regular MTN bikes ] back tire on a climb .

 

[Gary]

One other thing you can do on a climb on an Ebike that's a lot more difficult to manage on a normal mtb is climb seated with the saddle fully dropped to gain more traction and stability from the lower COG and better weighted tyres.
I totally get that it can be useful but I rarely ever use the back brake on a climb. though that's probably more because I just don't really care about the climbs and can't think of a single difficult uphill section I've done in the two years+ I've had Eebs that I haven't done at least once on a normal bike. The Eeb just makes them far easier. especially if/when conditions are soft/wet.

 

[jwrx]

I had 2 levos, and now on a SL. The lack of belt in the SL makes the power delivery slightly chunkier, kinda like a cheap DCT. I only use 100/100 on smooth uphills where i can power tru, and keep my cadence smooth, then u dont feel the 'power jerk"

For technical slower uphills, at most 60% assist, this reduces the overun alot

 

[wepn]

among other reasons...
to maintain momentum while keeping your pedals out of the way of technical terrain/trail objects.
RATHER THAN BUYING STUPID CLOWN CRANKS
For acceleration surge in short throw/ratchetting pedal input situations
Once you learn overrun timing it's also handy for gear shifting smoothly under minimal load.

Great list of advantages Gary. It's become part of the discipline but it does bring to mind the usefulness of a throttle for precise application of torque - independent of crank orientation - in the most challenging terrain.

For technical slower uphills, at most 60% assist, this reduces the overun alot

Exactly! I don't feel much overrun in Eco mode.

 

[jimslade]

Finger on the rear brake .
Keep pedaling , regulate power with back brake . I learnt this intuitively . When using Turbo on tight trails . Now use EMTB mode but still use the back brake to regulate power delivery .

Brilliant, thank you. Will give that a try this week.

 

[jimslade]

I had 2 levos, and now on a SL. The lack of belt in the SL makes the power delivery slightly chunkier, kinda like a cheap DCT. I only use 100/100 on smooth uphills where i can power tru, and keep my cadence smooth, then u dont feel the 'power jerk"

For technical slower uphills, at most 60% assist, this reduces the overun alot

I think this could be what I'm experiencing, without really knowing how to articulate it well.
There is a fairly technical rocky climb nearby (the ridge is just a huge moraine) that I'm now doing mostly in Eco, with some 'Trail' for the steepest parts. It's fantastic on the SL.

 

[jwrx]

I think this could be what I'm experiencing, without really knowing how to articulate it well.
There is a fairly technical rocky climb nearby (the ridge is just a huge moraine) that I'm now doing mostly in Eco, with some 'Trail' for the steepest parts. It's fantastic on the SL.

actually if its a slow, long technical rocky section...have you ever consided turning off all power? I can ride the SL like a normal manual, i dont feel the weight, and there is no crank resistance. Use the power on the mega climbs

 

[jimslade]

actually if its a slow, long technical rocky section...have you ever consided turning off all power? I can ride the SL like a normal manual, i dont feel the weight, and there is no crank resistance. Use the power on the mega climbs

I have been turning off power on stretches of this trail!
The problem with THAT is then it's abundantly clear how noisy the motor is!
Motor noise is probably the one big disappointment for me... otherwise I'm in love with the SL. (assuming I can upskill as this thread is pointing out! I have some new techniques to try out...)
My SL is definitely louder than my old full Levo... a quieter motor is the one thing I wish I could have back from the Levo. Other than the quieter motor, i'm happy with the switch to the SL.

 

[jwrx]

I have been turning off power on stretches of this trail!
The problem with THAT is then it's abundantly clear how noisy the motor is!
Motor noise is probably the one big disappointment for me... otherwise I'm in love with the SL. (assuming I can upskill as this thread is pointing out! I have some new techniques to try out...)
My SL is definitely louder than my old full Levo... a quieter motor is the one thing I wish I could have back from the Levo. Other than the quieter motor, i'm happy with the switch to the SL.

the funny thing about the SL noise..its loud to the RIDER...but if u ride next to a SL..its alot quieter than a Levo

 

[jimslade]

the funny thing about the SL noise..its loud to the RIDER...but if u ride next to a SL..its alot quieter than a Levo

THAT is interesting. I'll have to have a friend ride my bike to experience that, tho I don't have a Levo anymore to compare the SL to.
The other day I was cresting a climb and as the hill moderated I was picking up speed and naturally shifting up... the whine reminded me of watching an F1 race.

 

[Zimmerframe]

the whine reminded me of watching an F1 race.

The SL must be way louder than I ever I ever imagined .

 

[MrBrownstone]

Noisy motor is fine and fun on a FF bike but on a low power bike? All bark, no bite.?

 

[jimslade]

The SL must be way louder than I ever I ever imagined .

I’m obv exaggerating but it is whinier than my old Levo. I haven’t compared to other ebikes so what do I know... it could be relatively quiet !

 

[CjP]

the whine reminded me of watching an F1 race.

It’s all I hear when I ride mine. I absolutely love it! The Alu is louder then the carbon though.
Benefit is are people think your flying up to them so they promptly move out of the way. Win win!

 

[55plusmxinsanity]

I like 40-60% as my sweet assist. Noise is a bit loud compared to my Levo on start up, but seems non-existent when constantly pedaling on the trail.

 

[KeithR]

Noisy motor is fine and fun on a FF bike but on a low power bike? All bark, no bite.?

It's not noisy - it's just at a frequency that our ears are more tuned to notice.

 

[MrBrownstone]

It's not noisy - it's just at a frequency that our ears are more tuned to notice.

When I rode the SL I didn’t find it offensively noisy at all. I could deal with lotsa noise knowing that I’m not gonna blow a belt every 300 miles haha.

 

[KeithR]

During my brief SL test ride yesterday - admittedly with a fair bit of road traffic about - I literally couldn't hear the motor unless I was mashing the pedals in the areas of the ride away from the roads, and even then it was definitely quieter than the Bosch Performance motor in my Cube (I've been riding that one for over 3 years now - very familiar with its noise characteristics in all sorts of conditions, including traffic).

They're at about the same pitch, too. And this is on the Aluminium framed Comp, which has less of a damping effect on the sound than the carbon frames.

I have to admit that with either bike, I mind neither the sound nor the idea of the sound: these are bikes with motors, I don't expect them to be silent.

In fact the freehub on the Cube is noisier than the motor.

 

[boBE]

On a paved greenway (away from traffic) I can easily hear the noise, a whine like straight-cut gears. It doesn't bother me, I don't tune it out but after 600 miles I am used to it. I ride with Vados and Comos, they are just about silent and they can easily hear my bike. On gravel the motor noise is mostly drowned out. I sure wouldn't turn down the SL because of the minor noise!

 

[MrBrownstone]

I love hearing my Shimano motor. It’s a constant reminder that for every pedal stroke I’m being rewarded for my efforts. And then there’s that pull out of corners....?