Upgrade Trance Pro 3 to a 29” front wheel and fork

[Shifty]

Has anybody attempted this? I ride a Small sized frame. But I think the bike would ride better with a larger front, bringing the weight back a little?
What’s your thoughts?

 

[ggx]

Could bee an expensive no return experience !

 

[DrStupid]

I'm toying with the idea as well. I have a Speedfox that I could swap the front over to the trance as a test. It has very similar crown height so the swap would be a decent test. The problem I have with the whole test, and why I lack proper motivation to do it, is that the Trance is so dam good as it sits.

 

[Wernher]

The Trance-E comes with forks that are eBike optimized. Their internals are stronger at least on the Fox shocks on the 2 and above. A longer shock is a possibility and the Fox can even internally be upgraded to 160mm from 150mm. Two of my friends upgraded to Ohlins 160mm shocks and coils at the back for a plusher suspension with more travel. This allows them to go 29"in the front. Of course that means new rims and a rebuild of your existing wheel or a complete new wheel and tyre. Neither has done that yet. We all have the luxury of riding other bikes with a mullet setup ie 27,5 in the back and 29 in the front. We all agree the steering becomes lazier whilst the bigger wheel rides obstacles marginally better. Neither of us likes the bigger wheel and shower steering. That is however a personal choice and different people like different solutions. I kept my stock Fox Float Rythm 36 with 150 mm and took one volume spacer out as it comes standard with 4, which is ridiculous. Now my bike is plush with lots of travel and I really do not feel that any upgrade is required. On the 3 with the Suntour fork it might be a different story. My advice is to first ensure that you've adjusted and setup your shock as best you can. Get assistance if needed. If you then require an upgrade go for it, but in my experience the standard kit is really good and capable of much more than most of us can throw at it. A lot of people spend a lot of money on bling, just to find that they don't really get the benefit that they expected. My only criticism of the Stance-E is the low front end and that I've addressed with a slightly raised handlebar. The bike has improved my riding infinitely because of the confidence that it instills. Even the max speed support here in South Africa is perfect as we are limited to 32km/h vs 25 in Europe which in tests with other bikes are just too slow. So what I'm saying is: If you want to go for a longer shock and/or bigger tyre, first give it a try. Most good suspension shops will be able to do a test fit for you where you can sample it before you go for it. Give it a good try and be honest with yourself. If you then still feels it's what you want, you can make an informed decision in stead of guessing and spending unnecessary money chasing something that won't satisfy you. Then again, some people just can't help themselves and will do it regardless because they just have to ?. If you can afford it and it makes you happy just do it. You only live once.

 

[Shifty]

I'm toying with the idea as well. I have a Speedfox that I could swap the front over to the trance as a test. It has very similar crown height so the swap would be a decent test. The problem I have with the whole test, and why I lack proper motivation to do it, is that the Trance is so dam good as it sits.

Let me know how it goes if you do. I genuinely feel the geometry would suit it. As the bike is very front heavy. Tipping the centre of gravity back a couple of centimetres and bringing the whole bike leaning back a couple of cm’s would be good.
Just need to know what shocks and wheel would be a good option without breaking the bank.

The Trance-E comes with forks that are eBike optimized. Their internals are stronger at least on the Fox shocks on the 2 and above. A longer shock is a possibility and the Fox can even internally be upgraded to 160mm from 150mm. Two of my friends upgraded to Ohlins 160mm shocks and coils at the back for a plusher suspension with more travel. This allows them to go 29"in the front. Of course that means new rims and a rebuild of your existing wheel or a complete new wheel and tyre. Neither has done that yet. We all have the luxury of riding other bikes with a mullet setup ie 27,5 in the back and 29 in the front. We all agree the steering becomes lazier whilst the bigger wheel rides obstacles marginally better. Neither of us likes the bigger wheel and shower steering. That is however a personal choice and different people like different solutions. I kept my stock Fox Float Rythm 36 with 150 mm and took one volume spacer out as it comes standard with 4, which is ridiculous. Now my bike is plush with lots of travel and I really do not feel that any upgrade is required. On the 3 with the Suntour fork it might be a different story. My advice is to first ensure that you've adjusted and setup your shock as best you can. Get assistance if needed. If you then require an upgrade go for it, but in my experience the standard kit is really good and capable of much more than most of us can throw at it. A lot of people spend a lot of money on bling, just to find that they don't really get the benefit that they expected. My only criticism of the Stance-E is the low front end and that I've addressed with a slightly raised handlebar. The bike has improved my riding infinitely because of the confidence that it instills. Even the max speed support here in South Africa is perfect as we are limited to 32km/h vs 25 in Europe which in tests with other bikes are just too slow. So what I'm saying is: If you want to go for a longer shock and/or bigger tyre, first give it a try. Most good suspension shops will be able to do a test fit for you where you can sample it before you go for it. Give it a good try and be honest with yourself. If you then still feels it's what you want, you can make an informed decision in stead of guessing and spending unnecessary money chasing something that won't satisfy you. Then again, some people just can't help themselves and will do it regardless because they just have to ?. If you can afford it and it makes you happy just do it. You only live once.

Your points are spot on. Your feedback on the ride of a 29” front being only marginally better but lazier etc I think makes my mind up. Ive looked at the upgrade costs and it’s not worth it for my leisure riding.

The only thing I really would like to improve is the bikes ability to soak up the really small bumps better. Make the damping more progressive. Eg that it’s really quick and loose for a cm to ride the little bumps out smoother. But I suppose I have champagne tastes and beer money. I should have paid more if that’s what I wanted eh!

Cheers

 

[Wernher]

Let me know how it goes if you do. I genuinely feel the geometry would suit it. As the bike is very front heavy. Tipping the centre of gravity back a couple of centimetres and bringing the whole bike leaning back a couple of cm’s would be good.
Just need to know what shocks and wheel would be a good option without breaking the bank.


Your points are spot on. Your feedback on the ride of a 29” front being only marginally better but lazier etc I think makes my mind up. Ive looked at the upgrade costs and it’s not worth it for my leisure riding.

The only thing I really would like to improve is the bikes ability to soak up the really small bumps better. Make the damping more progressive. Eg that it’s really quick and loose for a cm to ride the little bumps out smoother. But I suppose I have champagne tastes and beer money. I should have paid more if that’s what I wanted eh!

Cheers

I got mine a lot better by removing a volume spacer. It's easy to do and I never even thought of trying it until my brother did it on his Merida and I realised it is so quick and easy. I used to ride with less air in my shock than prescribed because I realised that I didn't use up all my travel. Now I ride with a bit more air and one less volume spacer. Benefit less sag and I can take really hard hits without bottoming out and the suspension still feels plush enough. Of course I've got the 2 with the Fox Rythm. I don't think the the with the Suntour fork has volume spacers. But regardless play around with your air pressure because most people ride with shocks that are easy too hard and unless you are in the habit of doing really big jumps, you'll never need such a hard suspension. Check your o-ring after your ride and see how much travel you've got left. If its substantial you can consider to let some air out for a more comfortable ride. My brother believed in a very hard suspension because he thought the bike will dive and throw him over the bars. After going softer he is now a convert. As a last resort of you really want to do an upgrade a good option is to go for another fork. In South Africa Ohlins forks are very affordable and its among the best you can go for. If you put the new shock on you pick a 160mm travel with the option of a 29er wheel. You can then stay on the standard wheel but the suspension will be very good and very adjustable with good small bump. DT Swiss also has a great shock and I think the price is similar. They use a little coil spring specifically for small bump absorption. Essentially if you replaced your fork/shock brakes and gears you upgrade your bike to a to spec and you can do it bit by bit as the money becomes available. I've got to say the 2 seems to be about the best value/spec combination and apart from the tyres and low front end I've got no issues with it

 

[Shifty]

@Wernher Thank you, really good advice. I will first let some air out as the shock only ever uses 2/3rds of travel maximum.

 

[The Flying Dutchman]

@Wernher I'm very curious about the Ohlins rear shock upgrade! I thought rear travel was mechanically limited by the bikes geometry so hearing this isn't the case is music to my ears.

Do you know what shock size/dimensions is required to get 160mm of rear travel? And are they as simple as 'bolt in and go'?

 

[Wernher]

@Wernher I'm very curious about the Ohlins rear shock upgrade! I thought rear travel was mechanically limited by the bikes geometry so hearing this isn't the case is music to my ears.

Do you know what shock size/dimensions is required to get 160mm of rear travel? And are they as simple as 'bolt in and go'?

I don't think the Ohlins rear shock has more travel, but I'll check with the guys and let you know. The front is 160. What I've heard is that you get shocks with more travel within the same length, but I need to verify that.

 

[Wernher]

@Wernher I'm very curious about the Ohlins rear shock upgrade! I thought rear travel was mechanically limited by the bikes geometry so hearing this isn't the case is music to my ears.

Do you know what shock size/dimensions is required to get 160mm of rear travel? And are they as simple as 'bolt in and go'?

I've checked with my friend. His Ohlins shock upgrade is 160 in the front with enough clearance to fit a 29" wheel. The rear is a coil with 140mm. We ride some very gnarly trails and believe me 140 on the rear is not a problem. If you want more travel in the rear you'll have to look at the a reign.

 

[The Flying Dutchman]

I've checked with my friend. His Ohlins shock upgrade is 160 in the front with enough clearance to fit a 29" wheel. The rear is a coil with 140mm. We ride some very gnarly trails and believe me 140 on the rear is not a problem. If you want more travel in the rear you'll have to look at the a reign.

Thanks @Wernher for investigating!

I did some of my own research too. Technically I can increase my rear travel by having a shock with a longer stroke, the standard shock has a stroke of 52.5mm which equals 140mm of travel at the rear axle. If I swap in a shock with a stroke of 60mm, I'll roughly have 150mm of rear travel. But 185mm x 60mm is a rare size but there a few options at 185mm x 55mm but that will only bump the travel to 147mm, not a leap in travel but the plushness of a shock would be nice. I think for now, my money will stay in my pocket.

 

[Wernher]

Thanks @Wernher for investigating!

I did some of my own research too. Technically I can increase my rear travel by having a shock with a longer stroke, the standard shock has a stroke of 52.5mm which equals 140mm of travel at the rear axle. If I swap in a shock with a stroke of 60mm, I'll roughly have 150mm of rear travel. But 185mm x 60mm is a rare size but there a few options at 185mm x 55mm but that will only bump the travel to 147mm, not a leap in travel but the plushness of a shock would be nice. I think for now, my money will stay in my pocket.

Thanks for the info. Yes I agree no need to go for the upgrade unless you want to really push the boundaries. There's a lot that can be achieved by playing with volume spacers and air pressure. Interestingly on some shocks you can actually increase the stroke internally. I've seen some info on Rockshox, but not from what I can see on a Fox. My brother is buying the new Merida e140 that has the exact same frame as the e160 apart from the travel and the length of the stem. To get it to 160 spec he needs to internally modify (remove two spacers) the shock and replace the fork. The only reason you'll buy the e140 and convert is that the e160 isn't available in South Africa. In all our riding we found that a will tuned 150 front 140 rear is a sweet spot. If you are heavy and do high jumps a 160/150 suspension becomes viable but you pay the price in more power saying when pedaling, so unless you only do downhill and use uplifts it makes no real sense because that's the point of an eBike. Ride up and race down or just do natural trails. The harder, the better and throw in some roots and rocks and just enjoy the ride. I've spent some time on my front suspension and removed 2 volume spacers to make it more plush even with a little bit more pressure. The rear is stock and I just set sag and damping. I now have a firm but not harsh suspension that gives me great confidence riding any kind of trail without punishing my wrists. I do drops and climb obstacles but I don't do jumps. (I'm 63, so don't want to take that risk. ?)

We have a very good suspension tuner here in Port Elizabeth and he can tune our convert any suspension and also sells other brands. My friend went the a Ohlins way and they are happy. But the tuner told me the Rhythm is a really good fork and there is no need to change to another form. You can also replace the internals and make it 160 mm at a very good price. He told me if you really want to make a change, that's the most affordable option. The only issue is that you are still restricted to 27,5 x 2,8 max tyre size if you considered going 29 inch in front. The only reason I'd consider 160 in the front is to get my riding position more upright and a raiser stem should achieve the same result.

 

[Stretch40]

Hi I've got the 3 and the suntour does have spacers it's comes with 3 in I've just changed the negative spring as I'm only 85kgs and the standard one is for over 90kgs I've also changed it to 160mm by u clipping a spacer easy ? also got new damper on order rc2pcs with high and low comp and rebound £100 delivered from Germany its a good fork just to many people are brand snobs and won't use suntour as standard its OK but harsh few cheap changes and it's great way better than my yari not sure it's a lyric but my ability can't use a lyrik to the full and tbh neither can most people! A 29x2. 3 will fit in but its tight the fox maybe different?

 

[Wernher]

Hi I've got the 3 and the suntour does have spacers it's comes with 3 in I've just changed the negative spring as I'm only 85kgs and the standard one is for over 90kgs I've also changed it to 160mm by u clipping a spacer easy ? also got new damper on order rc2pcs with high and low comp and rebound £100 delivered from Germany its a good fork just to many people are brand snobs and won't use suntour as standard its OK but harsh few cheap changes and it's great way better than my yari not sure it's a lyric but my ability can't use a lyrik to the full and tbh neither can most people! A 29x2. 3 will fit in but its tight the fox maybe different?

Most people don't need the high end shocks and could benefit from a bit of tuning, making sure the air and spacer ratios are optimised. Also tyre pressure makes a massive difference in how plush your bike feels and how much control you have. As far as 29 inch is concerned, a 2,3 will probably fit in most but then you negate the benefit, because a 27,6 x 2,6 or bigger will give you a bigger benefit in terms of absorption and is about the same size as a 29er in any case. We're not talking a lot. Some people believe a narrower tyre will give you better grip on certain conditions but I ride a lot in loose sand, so I won't even consider a narrower tyre. Again that's personal choice and for me the only reason to go for a larger tyre would be to raise the front end and there are much cheaper options like a raised stem or handlebars or both.

 

[Rusty]

I did some of my own research too. Technically I can increase my rear travel by having a shock with a longer stroke, the standard shock has a stroke of 52.5mm which equals 140mm of travel at the rear axle. If I swap in a shock with a stroke of 60mm, I'll roughly have 150mm of rear travel. But 185mm x 60mm is a rare size but there a few options at 185mm x 55mm but that will only bump the travel to 147mm, not a leap in travel but the plushness of a shock would be nice. I think for now, my money will stay in my pocket.

Have to watch that. Know of a couple that have changed to a 55mm and reckon they would have gone to the 60mm but were talked out of that for various reasons. Will try to catch up with one of them over the weekend and find out why.

 

[Stretch40]

I agree I've fitted renthal 40mm rise bar upped my fork to 160mm and I've got the renthal stem on order as it rises 6degrees aswell I'm 6ft6 so seated my 170 drop post is along way out which makes the drop to the bars alot! Tbh there's lads in our group with full face, all padded up 10,000 bike and I'm miles quicker but just the same there's lads on 5yr old kit that was cheap to start with and they blow me away I'd say 95% person 5% bike? In performance

 

[Rusty]

Would love to find someone to make a flip-chip for the Giant suspension to see if it makes as much difference as it does on some other brands.

 

[Stretch40]

You could fit offset bushings would do the same or angle headset? But tbh all this geometry stuff longer lower slacker thing I'm not convinced really it def works for balls out racing but for normal people ie me and trail riding I think find a bike that fits u and u r comfortable on? Tbh I fo miss my 29er for big edge hits but I love the way the 27.5 turns so plus and minus ?

 

[Evolution Stu]

Hi I've got the 3 and the suntour does have spacers it's comes with 3 in I've just changed the negative spring as I'm only 85kgs and the standard one is for over 90kgs I've also changed it to 160mm by u clipping a spacer easy ? also got new damper on order rc2pcs with high and low comp and rebound £100 delivered from Germany its a good fork just to many people are brand snobs and won't use suntour as standard its OK but harsh few cheap changes and it's great

Would love to know more details on these tweaks and upgrades if you can spare the time pal?

 

[Stretch40]

Hi tbh there isn't much I ordered the lighter negative spring for £15.00 it fits on the left leg where the air cap is thats where the volume spacers are and the travel spacer for 150mm standard it has one spacer remove it and u have 160 mm well more like 165 actually I'm going to try first then fit a damper if it's still bit harsh? My rear wheel is in shop at the min with hub problems ? so no riding this weekend doh

 

[Evolution Stu]

Hi tbh there isn't much I ordered the lighter negative spring for £15.00 it fits on the left leg where the air cap is thats where the volume spacers are and the travel spacer for 150mm standard it has one spacer remove it and u have 160 mm well more like 165 actually I'm going to try first then fit a damper if it's still bit harsh? My rear wheel is in shop at the min with hub problems ? so no riding this weekend doh

Thanks, will investigate these options.

 

[Stretch40]

Hi mate if u want the part no for any just shout I've got them all ?

 

[Evolution Stu]

Hi mate if u want the part no for any just shout I've got them all ?

Well since you are offering I certainly wouldn’t say no mate, will save me some time and potentially pain... ?

 

[Wernher]

Recently I spent some time changing a couple of things on my Trance-E +2 to improve the front heavy low front end. Here's what happened.

First thing I did was to move my seat backwards as far as I could go. This gave my a lighter front end and strangely enough the bike is now much easier to ride no-handed. Previously it would feel nervous and like it would fall over when you moved your balance left to right. Stability therefore is now much improved.

Previously I replaced my standard handlebars with a Raceface carbon bar which gained me about 15mm. That lightened the weight on my hands marginally but not much more. I wanted to put a raiser stem on but couldn't find 37mm available everytime I looked and quite frankly I didn't look too hard.

After previously spending some time on tuning the Fox Rythm I felt that it would benefit the bike if I could lengthen the stroke to 160mm, so I decided to buy a longer air spring for the extra 10mm as in the SX Pro. Now it is important to note that many of the 150mm Rhythms don't actually have 150mm travel because they sag into some of their travel on their own weight. I did everything I could but just couldn't get my fork to stop sagging into it's initial travel on the weight of the bike alone even after burping the shock to get air out of the negative chamber. It looked like I'd have to strip down and remove some excess ghrease (a common reason for forks to behave like this). As I planned to increase the stroke anyway I decided to buy the longer airspring and do it in one go. This is where things got interesting. While looking for the right part number, I saw a Suntour Duramlux boost 29 for a really good price. I mean this price was so good I just had to buy it and based on reviews of the fork it compares very well with the Fox factory and Rockshox Lyrik in performance. It turns out to be the best upgrade ever. I gained 30mm height because of the increased axle to crown height alone and this changed the playfulness of the bike tremendously. I have much less weight on my wrists, more control on the steering and the bike feels generally more precise to handle with lighter steering. I've also gained the ability to increase travel all the way up to 170 if I wanted to without buying parts, all internally adjustable. The fork itself may not be a Fox Factory or a Rockshox Lyrik but performance wise it is amazing and the adjustability is awesome with high and low speed compression damping as well as high and low speed rebound damping. After fitting the fork I found the bike to be a beast going over and through obstacles like butter and the jarring ride over choppy terrain is history. I also have the option to fit a 29er on the front if I want to. I still maintain however that the 27,5 feels better for me personally, so I don't think at this stage that I'll consider it.

The change in the fork lightened the front so much that I now consider moving my seat forward a little again as I found that when riding no handed my bike feels a little nervous but it becomes very stable when I move my weight forward just a little. That is my next change weather permitting today.

The bike also looks much better and more aggressive now and it is very confidence inspiring. I'm adding some pictures.

 

[Wernher]

And I forgot to mention it comes with a built in front fender ?

 

[DrStupid]

NSMB.com - Suntour Durolux RC2 29'er Fork Reviewed

Is this the one you got (RC2)?

It's a nice value being able to swap from a 27.5 to a 29 and back, and easily adjust travel?

 

[Wernher]

NSMB.com - Suntour Durolux RC2 29'er Fork Reviewed

Is this the one you got (RC2)?

It's a nice value being able to swap from a 27.5 to a 29 and back, and easily adjust travel?

Mine is the latest reworked one. Mine's got the R2C2. I noticed in some of the reviews done in 2016 that they didn't like the R2C2 and preferred the simpler RC2.

Nico Quero uses the one that I've got on his Reign-E, so it comes with a very good reference ?

 

[DrStupid]

Mine is the latest reworked one. Mine's got the R2C2. I noticed in some of the reviews done in 2016 that they didn't like the R2C2 and preferred the simpler RC2.

Nico Quero uses the one that I've got on his Reign-E, so it comes with a very good reference ?

Awesome, good to hear they fixed it. Thanks for the write up. Its good to know there are excellent and affordable options.

 

[Wernher]

NSMB.com - Suntour Durolux RC2 29'er Fork Reviewed

Is this the one you got (RC2)?

It's a nice value being able to swap from a 27.5 to a 29 and back, and easily adjust travel?

Here is a review for you:
SR Suntour Durolux 29 Fork

 

[Wernher]

@MrTeno2U I think you need to do a bit of work to get the settings perfect on the R2C2 and perhaps in the test they haven't spent enough time getting it just right. In my own experience as a heavier rider currently weighing in at around 111 kilos (multiply by 2,2 for pounds) I found the shock to perform exceptional with 110 psi air. I then opened all the dampers fully and once the from wheel stopped jumping into the air on the high speed rebound setting I played with the slow rebound until I was happy.

The next step was to look at the compression damping where I started from the opposite side and worked my way back until the reaction became softer.

Next step was taking it out on the trail. The damping on compression and rebound was noisy as the test says with a hissing sound every time the fork was compressed or relaxed. I then relaxed the compression while riding until I was happy with the small bump absorption and found that the hissing went away.

The rebound is still making the hissing noise but it is not irritating or too loud and more of a subdued hiss and to me sort of reassuring that the for is doing its work.

The fork now has a very smooth action over choppy surfaces, which previously would have worked my wrists very hard. I also find that the fork absorbs big hits very well and ramps up very well towards the end of the stroke. I will experiment with it over time and if need be I can remove a volume spacer to provide a bit more travel although I don't feel currently that I need that. I also have the options to increase that travel with an additional 20 mm. I don't believe I will increase the travel at this stage as it will take any hit as is without bottoming out and with the higher axle to crown height addresses the only criticism that I've got on my Trance-E.

Tomorrow, weather permitting, I'll be riding a series of three trails that will include climbing, some moderate downhill, drop-offs and a gnarly rooty, rocky section with serious climbs through tree roots and over rocks. Based on my feeling after a good local test yesterday morning it's going to fly through there.

One particular stretch I did yesterday where I normally go through at speed pedalling hard with bad undulations left me gob-smacked with admiration for the performance of the fork. With my Rythm I would be almost out of control and at the speeds I was able to reach through there yesterday my feet would be off the pedals even standing up.

Another huge advantage is the lift I got on the BB with the pedals now not coming close to hitting anything.

The slacker fork angle means I will take my seat forward marginally again as the steering and front wheel is now considerable lighter. My angle of steering is also much better now which gives me more confidence.

I am highly recommending the fork and I will now also do some experiments with a 29 inch wheel if my brother will lend me one as my previous tests with 29 inch wheels were on other brands of bikes where the feeling was a bit too vague for my liking. Once I've tested that I'll give some feedback on what I think on the mullet conversion for the Trance-E.

In summary, I think that the longer axle to crown height of this fork that is seen as a criticism is actually what I like most as it changes the geometry favourably and lightens the load on the front wheel and lifts the pedals at the same time. I know that they build bikes these days with low BBs to get a lower centre of gravity but the low BBs are in some cases becoming a bit silly and is only okay for downhill riding where you don't have to pedal. While I got used to that, It still caught me out many times and the lift these forks give is very reassuring. I also don't find that the handling is affected adversely as the improved steering actually makes it feeling more nimble and controlled than before.