Turbo Levo with no power assist

[mtbdreamin]

This is more of a FYI of something I came across, but fixed and thought I would share. Yesterday I took my 2018 Specialized Turbo Levo Carbon Comp out and it decided not to give me any peddle assist power. I am like NOOOOOOOOOO! I just pulled it out of the garage and it was plugged in so I know it was full power AND my Specialized app showed full power plus it was on Turbo. It turns out the cap that covers the charging port was out. All I had to do is plug it into place and suddenly I had power, and off I went for more fun riding. So this is a lesson for me and I am impressed Specialized pays attention to detail like this because say if you went on a muddy ride and the expensive electronics is messed up just because you forgot to put the charging cap back in? Not good. There is one other thing I would love Specialized to do and since they can determine if the cap is not on and prevent power going to the motor, it would be cool if they included an alarm. Having an alarm would even be better plus the app could isolate what the problem is. So I hope this helps anyone that comes across this and even better Specialized add some alert features.

 

[Mart S]

This is more of a FYI of something I came across, but fixed and thought I would share. Yesterday I took my 2018 Specialized Turbo Levo Carbon Comp out and it decided not to give me any peddle assist power. I am like NOOOOOOOOOO! I just pulled it out of the garage and it was plugged in so I know it was full power AND my Specialized app showed full power plus it was on Turbo. It turns out the cap that covers the charging port was out. All I had to do is plug it into place and suddenly I had power, and off I went for more fun riding. So this is a lesson for me and I am impressed Specialized pays attention to detail like this because say if you went on a muddy ride and the expensive electronics is messed up just because you forgot to put the charging cap back in? Not good. There is one other thing I would love Specialized to do and since they can determine if the cap is not on and prevent power going to the motor, it would be cool if they included an alarm. Having an alarm would even be better plus the app could isolate what the problem is. So I hope this helps anyone that comes across this and even better Specialized add some alert features.

Yes,I have done the same and my first thought it was the sub zero conditions.

 

[ccrdave]

Good heads up but i should say that “cap” is the main power plug that feeds battery voltage and data transfer to and from the motor, if you dont plug it in it doesnt work because there is no. battery voltage going to the motor
I would reccomend that after every ride you unplug the battery and make sure the plug and battery socket is clean and dry

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

I always remove the battery to charge it indoors, I guess if you always charge on the bike then you’d not notice?

Hold on though... isn’t that cap where we also charge the battery? ?‍

 

[ccrdave]

Yes it is and i charge my battery inside in the winter but in the summer i charge it on the bike. My point was its not just a cap its a rosenburg plug which transfers power and data to the motor and if left without care and attention you will be walking home. I speak from experience,

 

[mtbdreamin]

I always remove the battery to charge it indoors, I guess if you always charge on the bike then you’d not notice?

Hold on though... isn’t that cap where we also charge the battery? ?‍

Yep, I leave my battery on the bike so one reason I forgot about it.

 

[outerlimits]

It’s the plug that provides power from the battery to the bike. I use a very thin smear of dielectric grease on mine to stop corrosion and have full power transfer at all times.
The 2 big silver center pins provide the power, and the 4 tiny gold ones provide data transfer.
If you ever ride in the mud or wet the dielectric grease provides a barrrier to all the crap and moisture and allows the power to flow.
Never use just any old grease, make sure it’s special dielectric grease.
Wipe the plug area clean after every charge and reapply the dielectric grease.
Pic of my bike after a wet muddy ride yesterday. No problems using dielectric grease. Only use a very thin smear. Too much attracts the dirt.

 

[ccrdave]

Good advice but as said above be very carefull how much grease you use, its interesting to note that the 2018 models only use two of the small pins anybody know why?

 

[outerlimits]

Good advice but as said above be very carefull how much grease you use, its interesting to note that the 2018 models only use two of the small pins anybody know why?

Yeah, you think there is basically no grease on there, but there is, so that’s about the right amount. Tube of the stuff should last you 10years.
As for the pins the 2 big silver ones transfer the power.
I know one of the tiny gold pins is for the 2018 bar remote, as when mine stopped working good it was a dirty gold contact. The others may be for the battery to tell the motor what power mode it is in. Another may be for transfer of of ant+ Bluetooth hard wire information. One will have something to do with the wall charger talking to the battery to tell when charged ect. You’ll notice only one gold pin in the wall charger socket.

 

[kcarbon]

LBS just told me to put dielectric grease around the plug to work like an o ring.

 

[James Hinton]

Has anybody else experienced intermittent power loss which is not associated with the connection between battery and motor (the cap)? It has happened to me a few times and I can't work out why. I sent the motor to the distributor but they couldn't find a problem. Also tried replacing the harness. The bike in question is a 2017 Men's Turbo Levo FSR Comp 6Fattie.

 

[RobbieJay]

No intermittent power loss, but I genuinely find the bike very difficult to ride without the assist.

Yesterday I tried to do a full around town with the battery turned off, my legs were ruined and i was unable to complete the uphill section, mine feels like I'm riding through treacle.

When riding and increasing my gears (up to 11th gear) on a flat surface, the bike actually seems to progressively get slower and fight against you?

It takes quite a bit of getting used to.

The cutoff you mention could be speed related or perhaps heat related which is an issue in the 2017 models. You can check the temp when riding in mission control.

 

[James Hinton]

Thanks Robbie. I don't believe the problem is associated with heat as I have experienced a period when the bike would not switch on at all for nearly a week and then all of a sudden it worked again.

Nevertheless I'll try check the temp in mission control if it happens again.... however, I believe that the connection to the motor is lost when the problem occurs... the serial number is replaced with a whole lot of ????? when it happens. Connection from the app to the battery does not seem to be affected.

 

[RobbieJay]

You could try cleaning the connector between the battery and the bike. I usually use a cotton bud and a small amount of WD40 / GT85 and clean the area.

I also use a high grade cleaning alcohol to clean dirt off the connectors (certified for cleaning high end server internals CPU etc) so it's perfectly safe to use with a cotton bud and clean the connector.

Depending on where you live, it could be related to heat as the 2017 models do/did have serious issues where they wound not work above a certain temp, if you live in a hot country and the motor is not sufficiently cooled and is being used heavily, it may very well have a limited window / range of use.

It's worth checking the connector, connection, cleaning the contacts (correctly) and keeping an eye on the temp because the motor could be overheating or malfunctioning and turning its self off.

The ??????? Is unusual though. When ita not connected properly my motor just leaves this entry blank... for it to report ????? Is unusual. Perhaps a visit to the store may be worthwhile when it's doing that again?

 

[James Hinton]

Thanks Robbie. I do live in a hot country... do you know if the heating problem was resolved? Unfortunately the level of after sales service in this country does not seem great.

Thanks once again for your advice/concern - much appreciated.

 

[RobbieJay]

To the best of my knowledge I don't think it was ever resolved in the 2017 models, but it was resolved for the 2018 models.

It's a "known issue" on the 2017 1.2 Brose T motor.

Brose went on to update and create the new 1.3 Brose S motor for the 2018 models which addressed all of these issues.

The 1.3 S motor came with improved parts (even going as far as changing the matierals used in the internal screws etc) adding heat sinks to the motor, increasing power and also utilising the frame of the bike itself to assist / aid in cooling

The 2018 aluminium range of bikes actually act like a huge heatsink for the motor.

They talk about these issues here in this direct comparison between the motors:

Exclusive Review: Brose Drive S – Just how much better is the newest motor? | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine

And here:

First Ride Review: Specialized Turbo 1.3 – The new motor in detail, upgrades for current owners possible! | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine

Hopefully that will help you pin point if it is heat related or not.

 

[mtbdreamin]

To the best of my knowledge I don't think it was ever resolved in the 2017 models, but it was resolved for the 2018 models.

It's a "known issue" on the 2017 1.2 Brose T motor.

Brose went on to update and create the new 1.3 Brose S motor for the 2018 models which addressed all of these issues.

The 1.3 S motor came with improved parts (even going as far as changing the matierals used in the internal screws etc) adding heat sinks to the motor, increasing power and also utilising the frame of the bike itself to assist / aid in cooling

The 2018 aluminium range of bikes actually act like a huge heatsink for the motor.

They talk about these issues here in this direct comparison between the motors:

Exclusive Review: Brose Drive S – Just how much better is the newest motor? | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine

And here:

First Ride Review: Specialized Turbo 1.3 – The new motor in detail, upgrades for current owners possible! | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine

Hopefully that will help you pin point if it is heat related or not.

I have a 2018 model, but is there a way to verify that without doubt? Recently my dealer said they have a firmware update. I asked what they had for release notes, changes, etc., but they did not have anything. I called support at Specialized and they literally told me they do not give that information out. Isn't that crazy? I mean you get any update on your device and they have a list of what bug fixes there were, but Specialize treats it like some military secret.

 

[RobbieJay]

I have a 2018 model, but is there a way to verify that without doubt? Recently my dealer said they have a firmware update. I asked what they had for release notes, changes, etc., but they did not have anything. I called support at Specialized and they literally told me they do not give that information out. Isn't that crazy? I mean you get any update on your device and they have a list of what bug fixes there were, but Specialize treats it like some military secret.

Yea it's very easy to verify what bike you have, there are a few ways.
First (and most definite) is to...
Power on the bike.
Make sure battery eyepatch is fully connected to the motor.
Open up mission control app.
Navigate to diaganose.
Navigate to motor.
Serial number should begin with "C97272"

(2017 models begin C911)

This is absolute proof that your bike is using the upgraded 2018 Brose 1.3S Motor.

It should also be running Firmware 5.0.4 (currently) as that's the most recent motor firmware as of this post date.

 

[mtbdreamin]

Yea it's very easy to verify what bike you have, there are a few ways.
First (and most definite) is to...
Power on the bike.
Make sure battery eyepatch is fully connected to the motor.
Open up mission control app.
Navigate to diaganose.
Navigate to motor.
Serial number should begin with "C97272"

(2017 models begin C911)

This is absolute proof that your bike is using the upgraded 2018 Brose 1.3S Motor.

It should also be running Firmware 5.0.4 (currently) as that's the most recent motor firmware as of this post date.

Serial starts with C97272- and firmware is 5.0.0, so I should run it into the shop to get an update. I really wish I could get a list of what is fixed. I don't understand why Specialized makes it a huge secret.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Thanks Robbie. I do live in a hot country... do you know if the heating problem was resolved? Unfortunately the level of after sales service in this country does not seem great.

Thanks once again for your advice/concern - much appreciated.

Hi James, Welcome to the forum.

There is a released ‘fix’ for the heat problem on the 2017 models. That is if your problem is in fact a heat problem. If it is the problem then you need to purchase and insert a heat pad. I believe the 2018 model comes with the heat pads already inserted. Check out the photo below. It shows the heat pad in place. The red outline attempts to show you the size of the pad. Your Specialized dealer should be able to order one and fit it for you.

Regarding your issue...I see you checked and replaced the harness, was there any moisture present in the plug that connected to the motor? I had an issue with water and mud ingress which sounds similar to the fault you are describing. It may not be this as you have much better weather in SA but it is worth checking.

 

[James Hinton]

Hi Robbie,

Thanks for the response. My Levo is definitely 2018. The cut-out problem hasn't occurred for a while now (last 6 rides) however, the remote assist switch stopped working on the weekend. Aaargh!!! Really worried about reliability issues.

 

[Mike Smith]

Leaving it unplugged will also make it hard for some twonk pedaling off on it !!!

 

[Surge]

Just picked up my Turbo Levo on Saturday. The cap / power connector that covers the charger port doesn’t seem to fit flush with the surrounding frame parts. Is that how it’s supposs to be? The cap makes electrical content, as I can turn the bike on, but the connector is not flush with the frame.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Just picked up my Turbo Levo on Saturday. The cap / power connector that covers the charger port doesn’t seem to fit flush with the surrounding frame parts. Is that how it’s supposs to be? The cap makes electrical content, as I can turn the bike on, but the connector is not flush with the frame.

Hi @Surge Can you post some photos of the issue please?

 

[kcarbon]

Leaving it unplugged will also make it hard for some twonk pedaling off on it !!!

if unplugged then turned on with plug close, if try to ride could arc. a friend had that happen. he took plug out while was turned on, then replugged it. bike would not power motor. took to LBS they fitted a new plug & no trouble since. 2017 HT 29".
myself on my 2018 Levo FSR never a problem 4000km up going good. in that time replaced one chain replaced one rear tyre replaced one front brake pad. I'm happy.
about plug not being a flush, fit, I don't even look at mine plug it in turn on, if it goes it's right.

 

[Surge]

Hi @Surge Can you post some photos of the issue please?

Sure, thank you. You can see looking at it from above that the cover shape is almost nothing like the surrounding material shape?!

 

[ccrdave]

that "cap" is the main power supply to the motor and it has an o-ring seal to keep moisture out, if its not fitting properly it will leak when you ride in the wet and cause you problems.
if its not fitting properly the usual cause if the cable clamp under the lower cover is either holding the cable too long or too short.
However, the "cap" does not fit completely flush you need a lip to grt you finger under to unplug it

 

[ccrdave]

yep that looks like cable not positioned properly

 

[Surge]

Thank you. Yeah, I guess it’s fine. It’s just that given the sealing issues that some have experienced, it doesn’t seem like a good design to leave those gaps around the cap.

 

[ccrdave]

if you are capable remove the non drive side crank
remove the lower cover
half way along the big cable you will see a P clamp, loosen it and gently pull the cable either in or out until the plug sits properly on the battery(its magnetic and you should hear a nice click when it seats) once its lined up properly just very gently nip the clamp back up and reassemble
If you dont get the plug sitting properly It will give trouble in the long run