Trek Rail 5 - Daily Driver - Mods for longevity/reliability

[k.cestrada]

Good morning all!

I joined the EMTB community a few months back with the purchase of my Rail 5. I relocated from FL to NH and my town has a great trail network for getting around and connects all my relatives homes easily. With that in mind we ditched one of the cars, and upgraded the bikes to get around town and bought a nice rack for adventures with the Jeep.

Before this i was and still am a novice rider and came from a specialized hybrid bike, this was quite the change/upgrade for me. With that being said I am super green to modding bikes but have it in my blood as everything i get into becomes a labor of love and a project. The last being my M4 which was the aforementioned car we ditched before moving to New Hampshire.

As this is my daily get around, have fun piece of gear now what should i be looking at upgrading from a reliability and functionality standpoint? I see folks mentioning switching from the SX to GX Eagle, upgrading dropper to one components v2, brakes seem to be a bit of a week point.

Where do i start? hit me with model numbers and links if possible since i still learning what goes with what and what measurements are applicable.

Is the GX Eagle shifter and Derailleur a good spot to move away from some of the plastic feel ? if i do the brakes am i looking BR-520 4 Piston? what size rotors? I know i could have started with a higher spec'd model to begin with and had i been more patient probably would have, so I have a good bit of budget to work with for upgrades and am open to hearing what the group here would go with to keep me on the road, having fun, safe and for the long run.

I did use the search before i wrote this up lol, thats where i found the buzz words above haha, some cosigning or other recommendations would be cool!

thanks again, glad i found this board!

 

[k.cestrada]

Still new so hopefully don’t get flamed but i came across a good price on an xx1 drive train set up. Will this work on my Rail 5 before i even explore picking it up?

 

[BrentD]

XX1 is a great groupset (I run it on my acoustic bike) but overkill for an EMTB in my opinion. It's really designed to be lightweight, high performance race gruppo. You would probably have to upgrade your freehub to the SRAM XD driver to run it as well. All the Eagle kit is interoperable according to SRAM so if you wanted better shifting, upgrading just the shifter will have the biggest difference and then maybe the derailleur. Running GX on my Rail 9.8 and XX1 on my S-Works Enduro and the XX1 is only very marginally better performing but is a lot lighter which matters more on a regular bike.

If you feel you need a longer dropper post then the One Up is a great place to start as the Rail 5 standard dropper is only 130mm.

Brakes you could do if you weren't happy with the performance or reliability of the Tektro brakes. 200 or 203 rotors definitely, Shimano SLX can be found at a great price online and work well, Shimano Saint if you want the ultimate in power (but maybe lack a bit of modulation).

Does the Rail 5 have a 500wh or 625wh battery? If it is the former, I'd go for a bigger battery above almost everything.

One more thing, and FREE as well so the price is right, is get the motor software updated to the latest version once this becomes available later this month for an extra 10Nm of torque as well as some programming changes to the various modes.

Apart from the software upgrade, I'd just ride it and see what you personally don't like and take it from there as you learn more.

 

[k.cestrada]

XX1 is a great groupset (I run it on my acoustic bike) but overkill for an EMTB in my opinion. It's really designed to be lightweight, high performance race gruppo. You would probably have to upgrade your freehub to the SRAM XD driver to run it as well. All the Eagle kit is interoperable according to SRAM so if you wanted better shifting, upgrading just the shifter will have the biggest difference and then maybe the derailleur. Running GX on my Rail 9.8 and XX1 on my S-Works Enduro and the XX1 is only very marginally better performing but is a lot lighter which matters more on a regular bike.

If you feel you need a longer dropper post then the One Up is a great place to start as the Rail 5 standard dropper is only 130mm.

Brakes you could do if you weren't happy with the performance or reliability of the Tektro brakes. 200 or 203 rotors definitely, Shimano SLX can be found at a great price online and work well, Shimano Saint if you want the ultimate in power (but maybe lack a bit of modulation).

Does the Rail 5 have a 500wh or 625wh battery? If it is the former, I'd go for a bigger battery above almost everything.

One more thing, and FREE as well so the price is right, is get the motor software updated to the latest version once this becomes available later this month for an extra 10Nm of torque as well as some programming changes to the various modes.

Apart from the software upgrade, I'd just ride it and see what you personally don't like and take it from there as you learn more.

Thank you!! This helps a lot. I think of all the things mentioned I’m probably mostly ok with the dropper at the moment. Am I able to just swap out the lever there for something less plastic feeling ?

For the group set I’ve seen that the general consensus is that the GX to XX1 jump is somewhat marginal in noticeable performance upgrade. I am however a bit of a sucker for colorways and may pull the trigger on the XX1 kit for that alone, guess we all have a skewed priority somewhere in life lol. I do believe that the free hub has to be the XD, that’s where my newness wasn’t sure of what I had. As to the weight savings I am a heavier rider who’s been dropping lbs but running the top end of the weight bracket. As I’m losing weight through dieting and riding any parts I can save in however marginal is not a bad thing lol.

Brakes again are one of those things that I’m feeling after several months of riding could/should Probably feel better. Again my size hovering around 250lbs probably isn’t helping here.

Lastly the battery and firmware update are tops in the list but I haven’t seen where I can source the larger 625W battery as I am running the 500W. Does my LBS have to order that along with the have to perform the FW update?

Thanks again! Hope my reply isn’t to long winded haha.

 

[k.cestrada]

So I think I am settled on crying once here and going with an XX1 AXS Kit, GX Cassette and Chain. I need help finding the XD driver that i would use with my stock wheels. Can any of you hook me up with a link to what i would need here to make it all work ? I am still researching brakes. I want to get this all done in one shot.

 

[Hamina]

I changed the GX Eagle derailleur and shifter and I could say that it made a difference. I would have drove with SX if it wouldn't had broken when branch got stuck into it. I think you are wasting your money on XX1 because after updating the derailleur to GX the gears are not that bikes weakest link.

Tektro brakes may not be the highest end but I've not found any real reason to change them. Pad choices seem to be limited. Check that your brakes don't have air in.

I would follow how your front fork works and save your euros there if problems occur. Derestricting is also 150 euros minimum if that's something you want to consider.

As a novice I find no problem with the dropper or I don't know what could be better. Sizing is one that you could change but that's dependent on what frame you have.

 

[k.cestrada]

I had a minor bail/fall yesterday the SX survived it but it just doesn't feel like it can take much more, and I really didn't lay it down that hard.

When I really think about it, the gears themselves I have little to remark on. That being said I'm still pretty set on the XX1 AXS set up however, the wireless appeals to the tech junky in me.

Maybe ill give just upgrading to that controller and derailleur a shot and play with the cassette, xd driver, and chain down the road. If the shiny gold idgaf I like the way it look bits don't get the best of my wallet lol. Needed or not, I'm not spending supper money on the toy lol. The wife and I budget for the nonsense just for fun things. We've been blessed that the worlds state of affairs hasn't hit us as hard as others, and we've been able to support those close to use as well.

The dropper is also pretty unremarkable for me at this point other than the lever feels kinda chinsy.

I should have started with a higher spec bike as I had the budget and I know how my have to mod brain works, but I went with what was in stock and started riding rather than being a good boy and patiently waiting (wouldn't have been able to ride in the mean time).

Now I will pay the price of convenience to change out some of bits I can. While I will never have all the benefits of the lighter and just all around better rail models, 7/9/etc, I can still get to a place where I'm happy. I had considered selling and just ordering up, but the area I live in doesn't really support the market and i'd lose more going that route than ill spend just buying the pieces of kit.

If i do still want to swap that cassette, still trying to figure out what XD driver I need for the stock wheels.

 

[Manicm]

With my bikes regardless of use I just upgrade when something wears out or until I break something...

 

[k.cestrada]

Right on! Efficient way of doing things and getting your moneys worth out of each piece or gear, popular method.

I'm in the mod to mod/test different/gear acquisition syndrome/tinker camp. Its becomes part of the hobby, but never the hobby. I see that line and know people that cross it and I never let it take over.

I get excited to get some new gear or a mod worked out and then get out there and test it! Applies to all my hobbies. Guitars, Video/Audiophile, PC Gear, and now cycling.

I did it in a very minor way with my last bike, a specialized sirrus elite, but relocating to New Hampshire and trading my main vehicle, 2017 M4, for a bike and using a trail network to go everywhere had really ignited adventure/commuter/trail riding hobby, and subsequently the modding that can come along with it!

I'm excited as hell to get all of the bits mentioned here over time, or all at once, or some not at all. Just trying to make the most educated and thought out decisions as i go along so i understand better what i'm doing rather than just shot gunning parts.

 

[BrentD]

I'd add that upgrading your existing rims to tubeless (as simple as taping them and adding tubeless valves, Stans No Tubes do kits) is a relatively cheap and very cost effective upgrade. Your tyres will roll with less resistance (giving you more range) and be much less prone to punctures.

 

[k.cestrada]

Going tubeless Is on the menu for sure, considering running an insert like a cushcore as well, thinking that could be beneficial while I’m losing weight to add some durability to the the rim and ride. My thinking correct?

 

[BrentD]

Going tubeless Is on the menu for sure, considering running an insert like a cushcore as well, thinking that could be beneficial while I’m losing weight to add some durability to the the rim and ride. My thinking correct?

The stock Trek rims do have a bit of a reputation for being easily dinged. An insert won't hurt and has not really been noticeable in a negative way on my Rail, quite the opposite in fact. I'm a lightweight at 75kg sopping wet so like to run my tyre pressures low and Cushcore allows me to do that while reducing the risk of denting a rim as well as providing more sidewall stability to the tyre too.

 

[speedkills]

I can't quite tell, but are you looking to modify things for reliability, or just for fun? For fun if you have money to burn, go AXS, but for reliability, stay with cable I'd say. I have the AXS shifter and dropper. The dropper I think is an actual improvement, the shifter, can't say it's any better but I do get a kick out of the clean cabling and hearing the tiny motor shift for me. The change to SLX cassette improved my shifting, but not the derailleur, it's just a neat gadget, and I like those too. Pretty sure it is less reliable long term though, certainly not something you can trail-side fix like you might be able to do with an old school derailleur.

 

[k.cestrada]

overall i'd say a balance of the two. I'm hoping any of the parts i'm looking at will take more of a beating than whats on the bike stock and should aid in fun factor. I do however agree, between the high end choices the cable flavors probably would run longer and be more field serviceable. The engineer and gadget nerd in me will probably get the best of me...I'm determined to place some orders today so that i can have whatever work that im not going to do myself done at the LBS while im on vacation next week and come home to new toys haha.

 

[k.cestrada]

So i've decided!

The xx1 axs kit for the derailleur and controller, along with xx1 cassette and chain. Opinions on rainbow/oilstain or gold? I think they will both look killer against the olive drab green of the rail 5.

Yes some of my nerdy and flashy sides are driving atm, however knowing myself I know i wont have buyers remorse as bad as i would have going with the mid tier, and eventually selling for a loss and getting what i really wanted to begin with.

I do however need to figure out what XD driver I need. Can any one you help me or have an idea what XD Driver will work with my stock wheels? ( switching to tubeless, maybe with a cushcore too, but not swapping wheels, yet) Even with the google machine i'm still not certain which offering is the right piece of kit for the job.

Lastly, for now, I am switching to magura brakes from their e-bike lineup. Currently have the 203mm in my cart but am wondering what it would take to mount up the 220mm that they offer. Any ideas there as well?

Oh yeah, going to try and shoot for that motor FW update as well!

Thanks for the help this far all! ordering parts so I can cry once. ill take pics of the progress to share!

 

[BrentD]

The driver you are after will be listed on the Trek web site here:

Bike hubs & hub parts - Trek Bikes

www.trekbikes.com

It's probably best to talk to your bike shop about which one will suit.

If you want to run the bigger Magura (or any other brand for that matter) rotor you need to purchase a disk mount adaptor (not an expensive part) to space the caliper out enough to match the bigger rotor.

Oh, and my $0.02 on the colour: go for the gold, I can't help but think that the oil slick colourway is getting a little overdone, kind of like anodised purple parts did in the '90s.

 

[speedkills]

For larger disks, don't forget longer bolts when you buy the disk mount adapter. They may not come with them.

 

[k.cestrada]

I pulled the trigger on the XX1 AXS while I am still sorting out the XDdriver. My LBS wasn’t sure which flavor of the few that are listed on the Trek site was the right move so they are reaching out to find out what to go with.

I’m thinking it might be this one. Just want to make sure that this is a thing before i pick up the cassette just to find out I need new wheels or something stupid. I called three shops within 30 miles of me and none of them could confirm. Really weird. All were trek dealers as well...

Bontrager Rapid Drive 11/12-Speed XD Driver Body - Trek Bikes

Enhance your cycling experience with Bontrager Rapid Drive 108 Freehub Bodies. Find the best gear at trekbikes.com and your local Trek retailer. Shop now!

www.trekbikes.com

I‘m also thinking that I am going to go with gold.

For the brakes I may stick with 203s but am going to ride out the stocks just a little longer or at least until I get the group set fully sorted.

I will keep y’all posted as I move along and get parts mounted up.