Supercaliber Gen1 | AXS "Shramano" or T-Type?

[t_and]

Hi all, greetings from an Andorran living in Switzerland.

I landed on this forum as I found a few posts discussing the topic. I allowed myself to ask my specific questions in this extra post, and also to know your opinion after some time using SRAM's AXS transmissions.

I got the chance to buy a brand-new Trek Supercaliber Gen1 9.6 (I hope I'm allowed to talk/ask about a non e-bike ) for a really, really attractive price. Components of the bike though aren't super top, this is why I am already planing some upgrades. The most important one would be the transmission. Since I switched to electronic shifting on my roadbike I can't go back, this is why I'm considering the now the AXS for my new MTB.

After watching many online videos and readings posts - lots in this forum, reason why I am here - I see two possible options:

Option 1 | "SHRAMANO" GX AXS | Mixed and upgradable​

I was surprised to see that many people managed to mix the "old" GX AXS with Shimano components and read many good feedbacks. From what i read:​

+ Electronic shifting. No more cables, thanks.​

+ Cheaper: Upgrade Kit ≈350€​

+ Upgradable step by step without having to change the entire transmission at once​

+ Can keep many Shimano parts from the bike​

+ Can keep Hyperglide​

- Mixed solution​

- Already an "old system"​

- Probably harder to adjust than option 2​

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Option 2 | T-Type GX AXS | All-in​

And then I found out that my frame is also compatible with the "newer" system. Then I started wondering if maybe a "clean new system" without mixing would be a better option.​

+ Electronic shifting. No more cables, thanks.​

+ Shifting under load (not sure if it's my thing, never tried it, but seems like a big deal!)​

+ Newer system​

+ Looks much sexier (as an architect, apart from functionality, I do really appreciate a nice design)​

+ No more H/L/B screws and having to readjust with time​

- Cassetes are much more expensive than Shimanos (when/if trying to save some weight with the top models, XTR ≈240€ / XX SL ≈420€)​

- More expensive, even though I found the entire Transmission Set for ≈700€, which is as much as double, but still has many more and newer parts.​

- Also need to change Freehub + BB too. Add ≈150€.​

- Slower (?). I read everywhere that the shifting is apparently appreciable slower than the previous AXS, in order for the chain to properly slide in in the next gear. This might be the thing that might bother me at most. Is that so? Really appreciable? According to @Stihldog, it's quite fast ​

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What do you think? 1 vs 2?
My would choose option 1, my option 2

Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Looking forward to hearing from you.

Salutacions/Grüsse
Tonet

 

[Koban]

Had SRAM XX1 AXS with Shimano XTR cassette, chain, chainring. Worked very nice together. When I compare it with SRAM Transmission on my two eMTB's. Then I will chose the Transmission above all. Easy to install especially on bikes with a rear chock. Also no issues any more with bend or broken derailleur hangers ;-) I find it better shifting under load. especially on a ebike.

Setting up SRAM AXS with Shimano 10-51 cassette was quit easy. I used the SRAM B gap tool. (white tool) When having rear shock set it in the sag.

 

[Stihldog]

It was when my original chainring started to develop chain-suck that I decided to try the GX AXS derailer. I had read about a hack transmission that included a sram-shimano blend of components. The GX AXS, Shimano XT 12 speed cassette, Shimano Hyper Glide chain, ethirteen 34t chainring, microspline free hub, and a 13tooth lower shimano jockey wheel. (Axle screw must fit but may not be necessary).

I don’t “crunch” my shifting, but I can if I need too without much worry. The “B” screw adjustment was slightly different but once the high-low screws were set it’s been set-it and forget-it. The new app allows for some very fine tuning (mine is 14 in the app).

The ethirteen chainring has a built in “O” ring so the brass or alloy “O” ring must be removed for proper alignment. The narrow/wide configuration is the only consideration I have when I install a new HG chain.

So basically that’s my setup for the past three+ years. I still replace cassettes, chains and chainring as needed but the the GX AXS derailer is the same. I’ve since added ERA 60mm Cranks.

 

[TommyC]

I went through this dilemma a few months back and opted to buy a used AXS upgrade kit from eBay. Matched with my Shimano HG components it works great and was a breeze to install and set up.

No doubt the transmission is better. I just couldn’t justify the cost.

 

[Koban]

No doubt the transmission is better. I just couldn’t justify the cost.

I had the same thing when I did hear the introduction prices. I did get the Transmission begining of januari for testing. Just before the introduction and after a few rides I did found a few reasons for my self. That wanne switch to the new Transmission.

Especially shifting under load did feel much beter and relax. Then the old AXS XX1, Easy installation and had a few times a heavy impact on the derailleur. Small scratch and that was it.

I ride the SRAM Transmission on two eMTB's now. (Spectral ON CFR LTD & Torque ON CF) On one of the bikes I have over 5500km with the first chain. The Chain checker says still good enough. Last week I did exchange it for new chain. The old one going to use when the cassette is almost done ;-)

 

[t_and]

Hi all, thanks for all the replies!

Looks like both option seem possible according to you experiences.

The trick about changing the pulleys on the "old" gx axs looks like makes a difference (read it a few times on other places too). Something like these would do the job @Stihldog ?

If I am able to sell the entire groupset that comes with the bike for a couple hundred, i might be able to bring down the price of the T-Type quite close to the "old" gx axs. I've found the entire T-Type groupset for "just" 700€.

The only "concern" I have, is the shifting speed. For those of you who have the T-Type, how would you rate the speed?

Thank you all!

 

[Stihldog]

Hi all, thanks for all the replies!

Looks like both option seem possible according to you experiences.

The trick about changing the pulleys on the "old" gx axs looks like makes a difference (read it a few times on other places too). Something like these would do the job @Stihldog ?

View attachment 130092

If I am able to sell the entire groupset that comes with the bike for a couple hundred, i might be able to bring down the price of the T-Type quite close to the "old" gx axs. I've found the entire T-Type groupset for "just" 700€.

The only "concern" I have, is the shifting speed. For those of you who have the T-Type, how would you rate the speed?

Thank you all!

The only reason, that I can think of, for a Shimano lower jockey wheel, is the fit to a hyper glide chain. The change also reduces friction and some noise after this “hack” install.

Sram AXS lower jockey wheel- 14t. narrow-wide.
Shimano lower jockey wheel - 13t.

On another GX AXS derailer that I installed for a friend, the axle/screw was not the correct diameter for a Shimano jockey wheel. So I kept the original sram jockey wheel (lower) but there was some slight noise as the Shimano HG chain rotated around. It took a few rides and a few weeks for the plastic Sram lower jockey wheel to “wear” in for a proper and quiet fit.

There was only one GX AXS derailer that I had this issue with, albeit minor.

So like I said, I read and followed the suggested “hack” instructions for this setup. I think it’s the best of both worlds.

I haven’t tried the T type yet and I don’t even know if it will fit my 2020 Rail 9.7. The derailer hanger has not bent or gone out of alignment.…yet

 

[t_and]

The only reason, that I can think of, for a Shimano lower jockey wheel, is the fit to a hyper glide chain. The change also reduces friction and some noise after this “hack” install.

Sram AXS lower jockey wheel- 14t. narrow-wide.
Shimano lower jockey wheel - 13t.

On another GX AXS derailer that I installed for a friend, the axle/screw was not the correct diameter for a Shimano jockey wheel. So I kept the original sram jockey wheel (lower) but there was some slight noise as the Shimano HG chain rotated around. It took a few rides and a few weeks for the plastic Sram lower jockey wheel to “wear” in for a proper and quiet fit.

There was only one GX AXS derailer that I had this issue with, albeit minor.

So like I said, I read and followed the suggested “hack” instructions for this setup. I think it’s the best of both worlds.

I haven’t tried the T type yet and I don’t even know if it will fit my 2020 Rail 9.7. The derailer hanger has not bent or gone out of alignment.…yet

Hi @Stihldog , thanks a lot for your reply, and sorry for the late reply (tough weeks going on).

As you properly say, the idea was to fit a hyper glide chain indeed. That would be the main reason to stay with Shimano, keep the hyper glide option open. If I understand properly, not all Shimano jockey / screws will fit? Do you know which one would?
Good to know that the original SRAM can also be kept and that it will wear down with time.

Yes it sounds really good to be honest, if you can have the best of both.
I was wondering that maybe after selling all the parts coming with the bike, the difference of price between the "old" and "news" AXS would be really relative. And I usually prefer investing on "newer" things, and even more if no mix max is needed (in this case is tough confirmed by many, that it does indeed work!)

I guess the best would be for me to, somehow, get the chance to try both. Would really like to test "how slow" the "new" is.

Thanks all for your help!

 

[Stihldog]

…not all Shimano jockey / screws will fit? Do you know which one would?
Good to know that the original SRAM can also be kept and that it will wear down with time.

I’m not sure of the different size axles screws required, for the lower jockey wheel, but there can be a difference.

You’re correct though, over time the original sram wheel will wear down to fit the hyper glide chain. Regardless there are a few of us that use the Sramano hack derailer/cassette combo with really good results.