Rocky Mountain Instinct Powerplay 2021

[naharris212]

That’s great to hear. Likewise I think the BC comes with the new fox factory 38’s. Beyond fresh, but if you feel they’re to much I’m sure you can trade or sell for lighter and smaller factory no problem as those 38’s will be in high demand. Not sure if it matters to you. But I swapped the lowers on my C90 to the black instead of bright orange. I think they’re a little to bold. Was quite easy and didn’t cost anything.

the ebikemotion app is interesting. I actually spent a while looking at their developer docs and which APIs they expose. I really like dyname’s model. They created a Motor consisting of hardware and firmware that pairs with Mahle’s software. It’s both on the motor, user facing (ebikemotion) and admin facing via a Web portal. if I wanted to I could write my own app/web/raspberry pi, whatever to my bike. I love open systems. Take the Bosch. Completely closed and they control everything. Being able to push my own firmware updates is something I want the power and priveledge to do. I.e. Bosch you need to find a dealer, get in line and wait for them. Not even mentioning how they don’t support and app. I do like how Brose is open but I had to buy a $200 dongle that allowed me to connect to the motor to pull basic stats. Specialized wrote they’re own layer for Brose and it’s slick looking but is limited to what they offer. My guess someone eventually writes a sick app for rocky and could prob sell it for a buck or two.
Typically companies that open up their systems and allow the community to tinker you get an explosion of creativity. It just takes people to do so.

 

[thbo]

How did you switch lowers without it costing anything? Via Rocky? Fox?

I’m on the heavy side at 93 kg (205 lbs) so would think the 38 is alright, if not over the top. I don’t know what the weight penalty is.

I wholeheartedly agree about open systems. Didn’t know Mahle was that open about it. That’s a big plus again. I have a pi based home automation system for zigbee, KNX-RF, etc. and look at stuff like that all the time.

I’m in if anybody wants to make a Rocky Powerplay app with Nativescript.

For Levos there’s the very good but equally design-impaired 3rd party Blevo app of course, but to make it the author had to hack/reverse-engineer the Bluetooth signals.

 

[naharris212]

Yeah I’m like 145/150 so totally makes sense for the 38’s for you. I ended up getting my wife the altitude last week bc there are zero 2020’s or 2021’s left! So crazy.

I bought the bike through a dealer. He called fox and had them ship out the lowers and just resold the orange pair to someone else.
Have you seen the firmware hack a couple German engineers made? It’s expensive but allows you to reprogram your firmware to set any top speed and add a fair amount of assist power. I think it’s up to about 50%. With a max torque of 127.

 

[thbo]

I’m also 193cm or 6 ft 4 inches btw. Still heavy, but a bit more context. It also means I always ride size XL. So although it fits my body better it’s still a lot to handle. I think it’s harder for me to be nimble (if we were equally fit). Especially with a Levo.

It’s the same in Europe, at least northern and middle Europe. Both Levos and Powerplays are few and far apart. They start taking orders for next years editions earlier and earlier as the market continues to explode.

My wife is far from my height and weight but she enjoys my XL Levo (dropped post) for short scoots and I’m still working on talking her into a fitting emtb. We bought a cabin this year where there are 110km (and going) of top of the mountains marked full-suspension MTB trails including hanging bridges for bikes and stuff, so I think we will end up on Rockies both of us.

I think I saw a tool of some sort called MTT or something like that? Which sold for EUR 180 or something? Is that it? Do you think it would be a problem in case of warranty issues? That’s what everybody says of the electronic derestrictors for the levos.

 

[naharris212]

I’m also 193cm or 6 ft 4 inches btw. Still heavy, but a bit more context. It also means I always ride size XL. So although it fits my body better it’s still a lot to handle. I think it’s harder for me to be nimble (if we were equally fit). Especially with a Levo.

It’s the same in Europe, at least northern and middle Europe. Both Levos and Powerplays are few and far apart. They start taking orders for next years editions earlier and earlier as the market continues to explode.

My wife is far from my height and weight but she enjoys my XL Levo (dropped post) for short scoots and I’m still working on talking her into a fitting emtb. We bought a cabin this year where there are 110km (and going) of top of the mountains marked full-suspension MTB trails including hanging bridges for bikes and stuff, so I think we will end up on Rockies both of us.

I think I saw a tool of some sort called MTT or something like that? Which sold for EUR 180 or something? Is that it? Do you think it would be a problem in case of warranty issues? That’s what everybody says of the electronic derestrictors for the levos.

Yeah 100% would break warranty. I derestricted my bulls and would pull it out before I brought it into the shop. If you can 100% reset the firmware back (which is says you can) then shouldn’t be an issue. Have you messed with the stack offset? I put a 35mm stack on my head tube to bring the bars in closer. But if your 6’ 4” subs feel squished you could try and 65mm - 85mm offset to open it up some.

 

[thbo]

I don’t get my 2021 Instinct BC C90 before they decide to send a container for all preordered Norwegian customers all together over New Years I think. Some M and L sizes of some models come sooner for bike events at resorts and shop floors.

I haven’t done anything to my Levo’s stack or stem, it’s all right, but there are lots of other undefined things that kills nimbleness for me. Mostly not the motor though. Although I do hate the “after-firing” when in technical terrain.

Will look at the stack first of all on my Instinct though. And check the possibility of getting a black fork (lowers).

I don’t know but I think I will need to derestrict my Powerplay to ensure that I beat my friends on Levos with “shuttle” settings on the motors on very long trail rides.


EDIT: Seems the 2021 BCs come with the black lowers on the fork..(?)

 

[thbo]

This is supposedly the geometry of the 2021 Instinct PP BC editions. Thoughts?

 

[naharris212]

Where did you find that? Also waiting on the colors and any new specs for the 2021 PP's. My guess is they put out a Slayer PP this year.

I stated up above somewhere but a great takeaway being the only e-mtb on the market that maintains its original geometry. You can look at any acoustic version review of the BC and still get a great idea of the differences. i.e. Instinct and BC. If you've watched any of the Crankworkx summer series which is happening right now, a few of the riders are running their "Enduro" bikes as DH rigs, this past week Jesse Meladed won the DH race on his Enduro RM. They add more suspension, similar to the BC and are placing podium with Enduro's. Here are a few links for Altitude and Instinct almost out of the box winning heavy hitting races.

Altitude

WINNING BIKE - Jesse Melamed's Rocky Mountain Altitude

Jesse Melamed finally gets an Enduro World Series win and he does it aboard Rocky Mountain's trail bike, despite the race being one of the most abusive and technical of the year.

www.vitalmtb.com

NSMB.com - Jesse Melamed's Winning EWS Bike

We don't normally do the winning bike thing but today we got lucky and we bring you the 1st and 5th place bikes...

nsmb.com

Air vs Coil

Air vs Coil: Jesse Melamed and Remi Gauvin's Shock Options - Crankworx Whistler 2017 - Pinkbike

We take a closer look at Jesse and Remi's shock setups for the Whistler Enduro World Series.

www.pinkbike.com

Instinct

Bike Check: Jesse Melamed's Rocky Mountain Instinct - EWS Petzen-Jamnica 2018 - Pinkbike

The Canadian's bike is set up to help ease his recovery from injury and return to race speed.

www.pinkbike.com

Most of this is on an Instinct
Vae Verbeeck

It's pretty unreal to me that riders can crank at the level they do on these bikes with little change / modification. Most seem to run in chip setting 9 (slack) from what I see.

 

[thbo]

The image was removed again from the Norwegian importer’s site but I found it in Google’s cached version. I think the 2021 Powerplay bikes are publicly launched later in august. The image is denoted as “21” but it’s suspiciously similar to last years though.

Inspirational links! Thx! I haven’t paid much attention to racing (although I know RM has a racing heritage). But every time I do happen to read about an enduro race it seems the winner had a RM. I may be biased in my memory because they have been such fascinating “simple” dream bikes to me, but still

 

[thbo]

The 2021s are public on Instinct Powerplay BC Edition now! Nothing super-exciting but after the Drive specification it now says “Upgraded High Cadence Boost & Power Extension Firmware”....

The latter part is probably related to the Overtimepack extra battery(?), but does anyone know anything about the former part?

I love the photos of the BC C90 in volcano though

 

[naharris212]

The 2021s are public on Instinct Powerplay BC Edition now! Nothing super-exciting but after the Drive specification it now says “Upgraded High Cadence Boost & Power Extension Firmware”....

The latter part is probably related to the Overtimepack extra battery(?), but does anyone know anything about the former part?

I love the photos of the BC C90 in volcano though

Wow! man I hope that "cadence boost" is just firmware and will be available for 2020's. Looks amazing.

 

[thbo]

I wrote a support ticket asking what and to which. I’m not that eloquent in American-English but that ampersand in between makes it sound to me at least that both is firmware. Would seem you still have done a very good choice (and from your Strava live a very nice MTB-place but that’s another matter I have to drive for hours to get to a bike park in the mountains although there’s no shortage of natural trails anywhere else).

 

[CavMan]

My understanding is the 2020 models are supported for the new Overtimepack . Therefore I assume any firmware update would also be applied to the 2020 models.

https://www.bikes.com/en/bikes/instinct-powerplay/2020?tid=419

Quite clearly says Overtimepack

 

[thbo]

=My understanding is the 202 models are supported for the new Overtimepack . Therefore I assume any firmware update would also be applied to the 2020 models.

Yes, probably.

There was however a question whether the part before the ampersand (High Cadence Boost) also was firmware or physical change. I would guess firmware though.

 

[Eddy Current]

Yes, probably.

There was however a question whether the part before the ampersand (High Cadence Boost) also was firmware or physical change. I would guess firmware though.

It’s firmware and it can be loaded on previous models motors. Better support from 55 to 104 cadence whereas now 75 to 90 rpm is the optimum range.

 

[CavMan]

Any word on when the Firmware is coming out?

 

[Eddy Current]

Any word on when the Firmware is coming out?

No idea my friend but it’s just few days since the news, too soon

 

[Jackson-Lewis]

First of all, appreciate the reply!

Second of all, I actually appreciate the minimal cockpit. The same on my Levo. Just to get that out of the way

I am also an XL person, in euro terms, 193cm.

The benefit of that size is that the new Overtimepack (330Wh extender) will actually fit on the 2021 BC Edition (doesn’t fit on any of the other sizes of the BC Editions).

So I’m looking at the A70 BC Edition. I think. Or regular C70? I’m a bit torn but I also think the 160mm travel and the Fox Float 38 will be nice. And I’m used to alu frames anyway. I feel I can go harder with them (probably all psychologically). So alu BC...?

I haven’t delved into it too much but wouldn’t be surprised if the geo is old school, I kinda like that general retro look of it, but I’ve tried a 2020 Instinct A50 (not BC) and felt it was just as capable as my Levo Comp in those lowland woods circumstances at least. The Ride9 thingy is nice though!

It does not have “shuttle” (rpm based support) as the Levo, only pedal pressure based, but I *really* like the delivery of that.

I’m not considering any other bikes this year as I’ve just had it with motors with integrated crank for a while. I’m specifically looking to run the Dyname 3.0 setup.

But I understand the Bosch CX Gen4 got a very nice firmware update to 85Nm recently, and that Shimano has something up their sleeves.

but the site says no to the 2021 bc ed holding powerpack?

 

[thbo]

In general that’s true because of the suspension I believe, but there’s a fitment chart showing it fits on the XL sizes of the Instinct BC Alloys. https://www.bikes.com/sites/default/files/resources/Fitment_Chart_Overtimepack.pdf

I have since changed my order from BC A70 to a BC C90, and somehow the overtimepack will only fit on the BC C90 if the Fox X2 is “pre-2021”, so I guess have to make do with 672Wh.

 

[Jackson-Lewis]

Ok interesting.

 

[naharris212]

If anyone goes through with updating their 2020 RM firmware to that higher boost cadence thing... I'd love to hear about it. Is it noticeable? How long does it take? Can you go to any dealer to get it done?

Heres a link of my Altitude at the bike park last week.

 

[Eddy Current]

If anyone goes through with updating their 2020 RM firmware to that higher boost cadence thing... I'd love to hear about it. Is it noticeable? How long does it take? Can you go to any dealer to get it done?

Heres a link of my Altitude at the bike park last week.

Join the RM owners facebook group, we are few here with the Rockys. Exotic bike.

 

[thbo]

I would I love to be part of a community of RM riders, but I’m not on Facebook, so for me it would be great if Rob would add an RM specific sub forum here.

I use Tapatalk on my iPhone to interact with forums and I guess that makes the user experience somewhat like the Facebook app.

 

[Eddy Current]

I would I love to be part of a community of RM riders, but I’m not on Facebook, so for me it would be great if Rob would add an RM specific sub forum here.

I use Tapatalk on my iPhone to interact with forums and I guess that makes the user experience somewhat like the Facebook app.

I dont use facebook either. I just made an account for that. Is like take registration in any other forum

 

[naharris212]

Good idea guys. I just emailed Rob requesting a RM channel.

 

[garypalmer]

Hi mates,

I have two doubts...

I am 6'0" and I am hesitating between size L and XL, BC C90. I have now a Moterra 2020 Large size, the L BC C90 is about the same size as the M size Moterra, and the L Moterra si about the same size as the XL BC C90. I never had a XL bike, I am very surprised how small they are. What do you think about the size?

And on the other hand, could any of you compare the range of the Rocky 672 with the Brose 700 and the Bosch 625?

Many thanks, and sorry about my bad English, I am from Spain...

 

[CavMan]

Hola,

I'm 6'5" and ride the XL and the size is good, I rode a Specialized Levo XL and they are similar in size.

The difference between the L and XL in the RM is 30mm longer on the Top Tube. 38mm longer on the Seat Tube, 27mm on the Reach, 9mm on the Stack, 32mm longer in Wheelbase.

Your Motera L fits in between the RM Instinct L and XL.

Here are some basic sizes in the XL and L range. Based on what your'e riding the XL might be the better option. Unless your current Motera L feels large.

	Levo XL	Instinct XL	Instinct L	Motera L
Reach	480	487	460	470
Top Tube	664	654	624	638
Stack	647	626	617	629
WB	1266	1244	1212	1247
ChainStay	455	442	442	450

This thread explains my experience on battery compared the Levo.

Rocky Mountain Instinct Alloy 50 Power Play... my impressions

I recently bought a 2020 Rocky Mountain Instinct Alloy 50 and have done a few rides. My first ride on an EMTB was a Specialized Levo Comp with Brose 90Nm motor and 700 Wh battery which we rented for the day and that convinced me to get an EMTB. Being 196cm and 105kg I was concerned about the...

www.emtbforums.com

Basically, I found the RM to be faster and more efficient on the battery over the same ride. The reason I went with the RM is the 108nm motor and certified weight limit. As a bigger guy, I wanted to ensure the bike would carry me up the big hills without straining the motor and battery, and support my weight. It does all of that and some.

Not all bikes are certified above an all up weight (rider, bike and gear) above 120kg. The RM is one the those bike models that does ... by a long shot. Oh, and the bike looks freak'n awesome.

The Dyname™ 3.0 drive motor is adjustable via the Ebikemotion app. I adjusted the power outputs for Eco, Trail and Ludicrous to suit me and my riding style. The bike uses Ant+ to communicate with my Wahoo Elment so I can see battery level and ride mode.

 

[thbo]

Thanks for the info on the battery! I too was wondering if the 108Nm peak would suck out battery juice.

I am 6’3” (193cm) and actually *hoping* the BC C90 XL I have ordered *feels* a bit smaller and more agile than my Levo XL (have only tried an Instinct Powerplay a year ago and I felt it did). Shorter wheelbase though. I need the XL anyway.

 

[buzbyjnr]

"The bike uses Ant+ to communicate with my Wahoo Elment so I can see battery level and ride mode." - is this only on the 21 model? i've a 19' Altitiude PP, and would love to get it to talk to my garmin. Anyone manged this?

 

[CavMan]

"The bike uses Ant+ to communicate with my Wahoo Elment so I can see battery level and ride mode." - is this only on the 21 model? i've a 19' Altitiude PP, and would love to get it to talk to my garmin. Anyone manged this?

I have the 2020 model. There were a bunch of changes between 2019 and 2020 models including upping the battery from 504wH to 670wH.