Rocky Mountain Instinct Powerplay 2021

[thbo]

I am wondering about ditching my Specialized Levo Comp 2020 after a lot of funny business. And playing with the thought of ordering the Instinct Powerplay I originally wanted.

Can’t decide if I should get the 2021 Instinct PP C70 or the 2021 Instinct BC Edt PP A70? The former is carbon but the latter has 160mm+better components.

New for 2021 is ant+ connection to these bikes as well (same as Levo).

Any help brainstorming?

 

[bluewater87]

I don't have any experience with the Levo.
The BC PP A50 is on my short list. I think the extra travel of the BC edition would be useful.
I'm 6'2" and looking at the XL. The geo on the BC edition at least seems a bit dated; slack ST, steep HT, high STL and standover.
Do you have any more info on the 2021 powerplay models? I'm hoping for an updated model for 2021 as i think the geo is a little too dated for me. The dyname motor requires a lot more pedal power for the motor to provide support, compared to the Bosch and shimano.
I'm probably gonna hold out for the 2021 models (rail, sight vlt and meta power) and see what they offer. They're all getting announced in August. Commencal will have new shimano, and hopefully sight will as well. IMO the Bosch motor is amazing and the E8000 is terrible.
The rail 7 (unchanged for 2021 i believe) is probably what i'll end up with unless commencal or norco surprise me for 2021.
I've heard about too many people getting their motors replaced for me to consider specialized at this time.

Also, i personally like having a display, something the BC PP A50 doesn't have AFAIK.

 

[thbo]

First of all, appreciate the reply!

Second of all, I actually appreciate the minimal cockpit. The same on my Levo. Just to get that out of the way

I am also an XL person, in euro terms, 193cm.

The benefit of that size is that the new Overtimepack (330Wh extender) will actually fit on the 2021 BC Edition (doesn’t fit on any of the other sizes of the BC Editions).

So I’m looking at the A70 BC Edition. I think. Or regular C70? I’m a bit torn but I also think the 160mm travel and the Fox Float 38 will be nice. And I’m used to alu frames anyway. I feel I can go harder with them (probably all psychologically). So alu BC...?

I haven’t delved into it too much but wouldn’t be surprised if the geo is old school, I kinda like that general retro look of it, but I’ve tried a 2020 Instinct A50 (not BC) and felt it was just as capable as my Levo Comp in those lowland woods circumstances at least. The Ride9 thingy is nice though!

It does not have “shuttle” (rpm based support) as the Levo, only pedal pressure based, but I *really* like the delivery of that.

I’m not considering any other bikes this year as I’ve just had it with motors with integrated crank for a while. I’m specifically looking to run the Dyname 3.0 setup.

But I understand the Bosch CX Gen4 got a very nice firmware update to 85Nm recently, and that Shimano has something up their sleeves.

 

[Dan63]

The Instinct A70 BC is 25kg, very heavy in the alloy frame

 

[Dirtnvert]

A70 bc is a pretty good deal. Most bikes id buy would end uo near that weight. I think my decoy is atleast 52lbs now after a coil, tires, inserts, pedals,
I like that rocky put on 4 piston shimanos to go with the race face stuff and dd casing tires.. Great warrantee. I think the bb is seperate from the motor? If so that sounds like a big plus.Aluminium supposedly keeps the motor/battery cooler than carbon, cheaper to crash replace, better to ding than crack, more compliant generally. Rocky's standover is the thing that steers me away but i have a short inseam. If i was xl itd be no problem. I dont hear many issues with the rocky motor, maybe i've just missed it. Bonus if the new one '21 accepts the battery extender.
Id make the yari 170, add a coil , -1.5 degree works components headset and have a 27.5 rear wheel for the majority of my rides. Done deal
I may have to sit on one . They measure their standover on the top tube 200mm in front of the bb center, so it should be a bit lower in comparison to other companies

 

[thbo]

The Instinct A70 BC is 25kg, very heavy in the alloy frame

I talked to several dealers and it’s the components of the BC mostly, as there is about 0.5kg difference between the carbon and alu frames.

 

[thbo]

A70 bc is a pretty good deal. Most bikes id buy would end uo near that weight. I think my decoy is atleast 52lbs now after a coil, tires, inserts, pedals,
I like that rocky put on 4 piston shimanos to go with the race face stuff and dd casing tires.. Great warrantee. I think the bb is seperate from the motor? If so that sounds like a big plus.Aluminium supposedly keeps the motor/battery cooler than carbon, cheaper to crash replace, better to ding than crack, more compliant generally. Rocky's standover is the thing that steers me away but i have a short inseam. If i was xl itd be no problem. I dont hear many issues with the rocky motor, maybe i've just missed it. Bonus if the new one '21 accepts the battery extender.
Id make the yari 170, add a coil , -1.5 degree works components headset and have a 27.5 rear wheel for the majority of my rides. Done deal
I may have to sit on one . They measure their standover on the top tube 200mm in front of the bb center, so it should be a bit lower in comparison to other companies

The BB is a standard bike BB and separate from the motor. I’m so tired of crank motors you can’t open yourself without losing the warranty. And I feel there is so much more wear on those motors, at least the kinds I have had (and replaced). The separated Dyname setup (I guess) should theoretically be slightly less efficient but I don’t see it in real world usage.

 

[Dirtnvert]

The BB is a standard bike BB and separate from the motor. I’m so tired of crank motors you can’t open yourself without losing the warranty. And I feel there is so much more wear on those motors, at least the kinds I have had (and replaced). The separated Dyname setup (I guess) should theoretically be slightly less efficient but I don’t see it in real world usage.

Ok cool, i wasnt sure if that was the case. I didnt think they were that inexpensive too. Some shop in qhebec has a bunch of 2020 rockys in the buy n sell on pinkbike and theyre asking more than the price rocky gas listed them at. Maybe im missing something but rocky lists the instinct a70 bc at 6999cad and yhat shopz ad is ttying to sell them for 8095cad. I suspect its one of those shpps thatll still be selling new 2020"s in 2022

 

[Woody1975]

First of all, appreciate the reply!

Second of all, I actually appreciate the minimal cockpit. The same on my Levo. Just to get that out of the way

I am also an XL person, in euro terms, 193cm.

The benefit of that size is that the new Overtimepack (330Wh extender) will actually fit on the 2021 BC Edition (doesn’t fit on any of the other sizes of the BC Editions).

So I’m looking at the A70 BC Edition. I think. Or regular C70? I’m a bit torn but I also think the 160mm travel and the Fox Float 38 will be nice. And I’m used to alu frames anyway. I feel I can go harder with them (probably all psychologically). So alu BC...?

I haven’t delved into it too much but wouldn’t be surprised if the geo is old school, I kinda like that general retro look of it, but I’ve tried a 2020 Instinct A50 (not BC) and felt it was just as capable as my Levo Comp in those lowland woods circumstances at least. The Ride9 thingy is nice though!

It does not have “shuttle” (rpm based support) as the Levo, only pedal pressure based, but I *really* like the delivery of that.

I’m not considering any other bikes this year as I’ve just had it with motors with integrated crank for a while. I’m specifically looking to run the Dyname 3.0 setup.

But I understand the Bosch CX Gen4 got a very nice firmware update to 85Nm recently, and that Shimano has something up their sleeves.

Shimano has shown the new motor at a Mondraker 21’ presentation
2.5 kg mag housing 85NM and a bigger battery at i think was 635w

 

[Rocky47]

I have a 2020 rocky altitude a70. Can’t comment on the instinct but the rocky dynamie motor is great I’ve had no issues at all in 1000miles. The iwocs are prone to break but I’ve had no issues with mine. The torque arms on the motor drive chain can snap if you have a had pedal strike. The motor is super quiet but there is a lot of chain noise due to all of the jockey wheels and chain tensioners

 

[Four Flusher]

Ok here it goes, all info from personal experience, but everyone's different. I'm 70 years old and last June I bought a Levo Comp, not knowing if I'd hit the dirt since I had not been on a mountain bike in 30 years.. My brother is a huge mountain biker but had just had a knee replaced so he and his girl friend and his shop owner friend (they are all over 65) all got '19 Rocky powerplays, two Altitudes and he got an Instinct. In five months last year I rode 1000 miles of single track on my Levo and had the most fun I've had in the last twenty years.

Now to your question. In January, I decided I was going to sell my Levo Comp, and get a '20 for the better brakes, better forks and the 700 watt battery. I sold my Levo in a day, which was ok since it was ski season. In February, I started riding my brother A50 instinct and really dug it. I find the power delivery to be awesome.

The local specialized dealers kind of suck so It was a pretty easy decision to switch to Rocky. I'm super happy with my '20 A70 Instinct.
My Rocky dealer buddy says there will be no big changes for '21 but you know how that goes.

When it was time to buy, I just asked him what model I should buy. He suggested the A70, you don't need carbon, and the spec level on the A70 is great. We considered the BC, but he felt the A70 spec was better, and the BC with not be able to add a extra 350 Watt battery, which I doubt i'll never add. He changed the fork charger to 150 mil travel for $250 bucks.

The only thing I miss is the Specialized App but the Rocky App is not bad. As far as the display, My Levo had the optional display and at first I missed it, but in time, I got used to not having a display since the Rocky Ewok gives plenty of info.

Final thoughts, Rocky has a three year warranty. As far as the '21 Levo there are some nice upgrades (brakes, forks) but I think '21 is likely the last year for the Brose drive. My plan is to swap bike every year of two, because I can. Not sure what's next, but for now I'm a Rocky guy.

 

[Four Flusher]

I have a 2020 rocky altitude a70. Can’t comment on the instinct but the rocky dynamie motor is great I’ve had no issues at all in 1000miles. The iwocs are prone to break but I’ve had no issues with mine. The torque arms on the motor drive chain can snap if you have a had pedal strike. The motor is super quiet but there is a lot of chain noise due to all of the jockey wheels and chain tensioners

You're probably like me and got last years IWOK, I'm still waiting on a new one (damn Covid), old one works fine though. As far as chain noise, if I keep my chain and wheels clean after every ride and dry lube, it is as quiet as my Levo .

 

[thbo]

Ok here it goes, all info from personal experience, but everyone's different. I'm 70 years old and last June I bought a Levo Comp, not knowing if I'd hit the dirt since I had not been on a mountain bike in 30 years.. My brother is a huge mountain biker but had just had a knee replaced so he and his girl friend and his shop owner friend (they are all over 65) all got '19 Rocky powerplays, two Altitudes and he got an Instinct. In five months last year I rode 1000 miles of single track on my Levo and had the most fun I've had in the last twenty years.

Now to your question. In January, I decided I was going to sell my Levo Comp, and get a '20 for the better brakes, better forks and the 700 watt battery. I sold my Levo in a day, which was ok since it was ski season. In February, I started riding my brother A50 instinct and really dug it. I find the power delivery to be awesome.

The local specialized dealers kind of suck so It was a pretty easy decision to switch to Rocky. I'm super happy with my '20 A70 Instinct.
My Rocky dealer buddy says there will be no big changes for '21 but you know how that goes.

When it was time to buy, I just asked him what model I should buy. He suggested the A70, you don't need carbon, and the spec level on the A70 is great. We considered the BC, but he felt the A70 spec was better, and the BC with not be able to add a extra 350 Watt battery, which I doubt i'll never add. He changed the fork charger to 150 mil travel for $250 bucks.

The only thing I miss is the Specialized App but the Rocky App is not bad. As far as the display, My Levo had the optional display and at first I missed it, but in time, I got used to not having a display since the Rocky Ewok gives plenty of info.

Final thoughts, Rocky has a three year warranty. As far as the '21 Levo there are some nice upgrades (brakes, forks) but I think '21 is likely the last year for the Brose drive. My plan is to swap bike every year of two, because I can. Not sure what's next, but for now I'm a Rocky guy.

Thanks to all, really appreciate it, but especially [mention]Four Flusher [/mention]’s write up, as I am also coming from a Levo Comp 2020. I’m 45 and actually had my first ride on it again today after a motor replacement (after only 500km). Got a very new June 2020 Brose motor which actually felt a bit different. Could just be because it’s new. The dealer said Specialized just the last weeks totally stopped replacing motors with relatively older manufacturing date, which made replacement back up a bit the last week as Brose changed the inventory with very new ones. The same the 2021 Levos get. There’s supposed to be changes to the Kevlar band and some other things. Felt good on the ride. Hope it keeps up with that. Maybe they have fixed things.

But, I still have ordered the 2021 BC A70. I know there’s no shuttle, the app looks horrible (got Apple Watch app though!), that some people call it a coffee grinder, and that it’s not modern enough geo, but I have fond memories from testing a Dyname powered bike last year. And this one gets the Fox 38 fork. It’s a heavy but lively bike which I think suits me well. No shuttle means I get an even better workout. Even though my Levo Comp 2020 was awesome today for a 6 hour mixed ride ! It’s going to be easy to find buyers but hard to sell

I don’t know if it’s common other places but in Scandinavia people often order next years bikes during the summer and get them in March when the season starts again (well, in april), for a slight discount. During fall-winter bike shops turn into ski shops.

 

[Rocky47]

You're probably like me and got last years IWOK, I'm still waiting on a new one (damn Covid), old one works fine though. As far as chain noise, if I keep my chain and wheels clean after every ride and dry lube, it is as quiet as my Levo .

Ye mine is due the upgraded iWok
But haven’t done anything about it yet as my current one is working fine. Will be nice to get rid of the box under the stem though.

 

[thbo]

Ye mine is due the upgraded iWok
But haven’t done anything about it yet as my current one is working fine. Will be nice to get rid of the box under the stem though.

Thanks for the info on the iWoks.

What’s that? “Box under the stem”?

 

[Four Flusher]

Thanks for the info on the iWoks.

What’s that? “Box under the stem”?

old iwok has a component that's zip tied under stem, new one going from the unit into the frame, I'm not sure if there's anytime new, just is a cleaner set up

 

[thbo]

old iwok has a component that's zip tied under stem, new one going from the unit into the frame, I'm not sure if there's anytime new, just is a cleaner set up

Haven’t noticed, but yes cleaner is better. That’s why I am very happy both Levo and Powerplays run with minimal dashboards. I know, how can it hurt with more info, and I am such a nerd about all the data afterwards, but I strive to forget all the tech and be in the moment when on the trails. I appreciate that other people can manage that anyway.

Just noticed the Instinct Powerplay runs with what I would consider thin tires compared to other players in this field. Will be interesting but could be what makes them a bit lively.

 

[Dan63]

I talked to several dealers and it’s the components of the BC mostly, as there is about 0.5kg difference between the carbon and alu frames.

Comparing the Altitude recently i found that the same spec level models had a difference of roughly 1.5kg, ie A70 24.8kg, C70 23.3kg

 

[Flatslide]

My Altitude C50 XL weighs 24.5kg with pedals. I've no idea what the alloy version weighs, but from personal experience I think the whole weight thing is overrated. I bought the carbon bike based on spec, not weight. The newer iWoc uses the stem mounted block too.

 

[thbo]

Comparing the Altitude recently i found that the same spec level models had a difference of roughly 1.5kg, ie A70 24.8kg, C70 23.3kg

Oops. That was more significant than what I was told (it’s hard to find the correct numbers myself for the 2021 models still).

Still, as [mention]Flatslide [/mention] says, I don’t think I care enough about that extra weight to pay EUR 2000 more for the BC C90. Most extra weight is still on my belly and free to shave off biking anything

 

[Four Flusher]

My Altitude C50 XL weighs 24.5kg with pedals. I've no idea what the alloy version weighs, but from personal experience I think the whole weight thing is overrated. I bought the carbon bike based on spec, not weight. The newer iWoc uses the stem mounted block too.

My early '20 has the iwoc mounted under the stem. Bikes built later have the new internal iwoc, running change. My dealer's had new unit on order for months.

 

[Dan63]

My Altitude C50 XL weighs 24.5kg with pedals. I've no idea what the alloy version weighs, but from personal experience I think the whole weight thing is overrated. I bought the carbon bike based on spec, not weight. The newer iWoc uses the stem mounted block too.

That sounds about right. 2020 C50 is listed at 23.53kg, which is probably a medium, without pedals.

 

[thbo]

Guys, it seems RM didn’t bother to make the C70 as a BC Edition. What does this point to? Are there benefits to a hydroformed alu frame for the BC use case?

I have friends who only look at carbon frames no matter what. To me it’s of course a price question but also the impression that characters and data points of a carbon and hydroformed alu frame are not that different at this point in time. And that in some cases alu might be preferable. Like in actually being possible to ride home after a crash. Also I would think the more vibration in such an alu frame is negated by better and better forks and shocks.

 

[Four Flusher]

Guys, it seems RM didn’t bother to make the C70 as a BC Edition. What does this point to? Are there benefits to a hydroformed alu frame for the BC use case?

I have friends who only look at carbon frames no matter what. To me it’s of course a price question but also the impression that characters and data points of a carbon and hydroformed alu frame are not that different at this point in time. And that in some cases alu might be preferable. Like in actually being possible to ride home after a crash. Also I would think the more vibration in such an alu frame is negated by better and better forks and shocks.

After kicking around this forum for a year, it's seems like for a full fat bike, Alu is the way to go. That said of course if you're going for light weight, like a Levo SL, carbon would be the right choice.

 

[thbo]

I like that an emtb is more forgiving when it comes to frame weight, assuming the weight difference between alu and carbon is meaningful in 2020.

But, maybe unpopular opinion, I think the slightly “old school” geometry of Rocky Mountain and the like is more efficient and “correct” for a general emtb. It seems all new top emtbs converge to a geometry more like traditional downhill or even motocrossers because of the forgivingness of having a motor. The general sounding “All-mountain” moniker everybody looks for these days is actually enduro edging on downhill. And that the most extreme of these geometries, while being more stable at straight high speeds and looking more “red bull downhill cool”, actually make it a less efficient e-bike where you are persuaded to sit on your ass and pedal like a grandma to put it bluntly. And your battery goes away rather quickly.

They are more electric *vehicles* than bikes if that makes sense.

 

[Dan63]

I like that an emtb is more forgiving when it comes to frame weight, assuming the weight difference between alu and carbon is meaningful in 2020.

But, maybe unpopular opinion, I think the slightly “old school” geometry of Rocky Mountain and the like is more efficient and “correct” for a general emtb. It seems all new top emtbs converge to a geometry more like traditional downhill or even motocrossers because of the forgivingness of having a motor. The general sounding “All-mountain” moniker everybody looks for these days is actually enduro edging on downhill. And that the most extreme of these geometries, while being more stable at straight high speeds and looking more “red bull downhill cool”, actually make it a less efficient e-bike where you are persuaded to sit on your ass and pedal like a grandma to put it bluntly. And your battery goes away rather quickly.

They are more electric *vehicles* than bikes if that makes sense.

I agree with this, if you're looking for a trail bike then a lot of the new emtbs are very gravity focused.

 

[naharris212]

Hey @thbo, this might seem like a data dump but I went through the same thing your going through about 9 months ago and maybe some of this can help. I'm 5'7 150lbs....



My twin brother and my dad both have the Levo Comp. I just bought an Altitude PP C90 and have a Bulls AM3 which has the same motor as the Levo Comp (Brose Mag S). My Bulls needed solid shop work and they let me borrow two different Haibikes for about a month with the Bosch Gen 3. I have some buddies with bikes, Cube Gen4 so i feel like I have a solid grasp of those motors and what they offer.



I'll start with the problems.



Every bike except the Rocky Mountains have integrated BB's into the motor. For example, my buddy has a haibike and a simple bearing that would take place in a standard bottom bracket collapsed and his bike has been in the shop pushing 3 months now (he's basically losing his mind). I would say Bosch has been very very slow to fix. It likes a high cadence to power band ratio and lacks power on uphills. And yes, def has a loud whirring sound, me personally I don't really mind sound but some people seem to.



Brose Mag S -> My bulls, and my brother and dad all have this motor. Motor is awesome, powerful, quiet and gives power at every cadence. Its prob the best motor for all types of riders and/or people that want free rides. What I mean by this is you can have a 20rpm cadence and be blasting 20mph with no effort. It tends to give power for half a second sometimes after peddaling, both my brothers and my bulls have this function. Lots of times coming tight into a berm or corner you gotta hover the brake or ride slightly different to watch for this.



The big negative is that dang belt. I have had to replace mine twice. i.e. my bulls is currently in the shop getting its second belt. My dads went 3 weeks in to buying a brand new levo comp and my brothers went about 3 months in. I'm 150lbs so I feel like these things really should last longer, Its almost like they make em out of silly putty. Now we all are just waiting for these things to go at any moment. I will have to say the service work for all of us is decent compared to the bosch. Most in under 2 weeks. Although if you've seen online at all, my buddy found a how-to link on replacing the belt and it takes about 5 mins.



Dyname 3.0 on the Rocky Mountain. I've had my Rocky Mountain Altitude C90 for 2/3 months and love love the thing. I've kinda learned over the past year at least for me the motor really should be a second class citizen next to the actual bike it geometry / componentry and where/how you ride. With that said. Three things really stick out. The power is amazing when you need it. I've made it up sections that I was not able to on my Brose, I raced my brother on his levo and beat him up a hill by about 5 feet so it def pulls with the 108nM when it needs to. However if your looking for that "free ride" its not the setup for you, meaning if you want to barely pedal at a low cadence it gives you what you put in. For me I really only use the motor for shuttling and cruising until i wanna go for it. And when you go it absolutely bombs. I've beat every one of my KOM's out from under the Bulls. How they separated the bottom bracket from the motor is really cool, so all normal parts really can be serviced with the motor as a single unit. The motor basically has a cog that spins and an arm that moves slightly when the chain is tightened which tells it to deliver the power is spot on. I can hold wheelies with it no problem where on the bulls it blasted power and was hard to control.



The instinct looks like a great all around bike and am buying my wife one now, a bit better on the uphills then the altitude. I get the whole older non-modern geometry thing but thats exactly why I ended up purchasing the altitude, it has the shortest chainstay on the ebike market and is solely why it whips off jumps, down hills and around switchbacks like a normal bike. Jesse Meladed and Remi have both collectively won EWS on their Instincts and Altitudes so at some point fighting over a half degree head angle vs another bikes you prob wouldn't ever notice the difference, and if you could then you no doubt wouldn't be posting to this site asking .



As for weight. I feel like a lot of people get caught up on weight also. Most people carry over 5lbs of water on their backs and don't thing twice about it. What i've noticed really matters is the geometry and suspension setup. Shorter bikes and proper suspension will make your bike pop all around, the added weight actually helps keep the bike stable in the air on actual jumps. Another example is my bulls. It was very unbalanced. Really heavy in the front and make the bike glued to the ground, it is also a longer bike. My Altitude couldn't be different, its only 3 pounds lighter which is a drop in the bucket but is really short and perfectly balanced and flies off everything, holds corners extremely well and still plows over rock gardens with no problem. Lastly I think everything has a balance to it, the Levo small is 49.5 lbs but comes with smaller stansions, <-- I think 34's, wherein a heavier bike like my Altitude comes with traditional Fox 36's but are much more rigid and gives you better control from flex when bombing downhill. So would you take 3 lbs lighter or stiffer forks? Everything has pro's and cons.



I will have to say get better suspension, if its between the carbon or alu and you get a full suspension step up go with that. Its the arms and legs of your bike and i've seen what you get with the Levo base model and just how bad the RockShox Deluxe really is.



Anyways, I know this is a lot of gibberish but been living and breathing this stuff lately so thought i'd pass some along.



I don't think there is a better designed bike both mechanically and aesthetically then the rocky mountains. Remember, its the actual geometry of the non motored instinct and altitudes, so all that knowledge went straight into the Powerplays.


Cheers,
Neil

Neil Harris | Strava Cyclist Profile

Neil Harris is a cyclist from United States. Join Strava to track your activities, analyze your performance, and follow friends. Strava members can plan routes, participate in motivating challenges, and join clubs. Get started by signing up for free.

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Iv'e attached a pic from my first ride on the Altitude

 

[thbo]

That was an awesome write up of your experience. I followed you on Strava too for more of those Altitude pics.

You know what, you guys in this thread made me go bigger than I thought. I pre-ordered the bike with the amazing name of Rocky Mountain Instinct British Columbia Edition C90 Powerplay For use in Norwegian trails and mountains. It will be very interesting to compare with my Levo Comp 2020 (which was my first ever emtb).

 

[Four Flusher]

Big tip, unless your over 200lb, remove the fork spacer, also set the air in the rear according to what feels correct not as recommended

I clean and lube before every ride. I just had to replace the chain after 650 miles. 12 speed chains are hard to come by so I'm ordering a back up.

The only thing I miss on my '20 A70 is the Specialized mission control app.

 

[thbo]

Thanks for all tips!

Yeah... the app thing.... the ebikemotion app from Mahle (which, for new readers, Rocky Mountain relies on) looks incredibly sad and 10 years old designwise. Only plus is that there’s also an Apple Watch app.

It amazes me that Rocky Mountain dares to «outsource» it all like that. Mahle even writes on their website that they offer customised apps for customers of iWoc Trio (the controller, for new readers) and the brains.