Petition to raise UK ebike limit to match the USA 20mph.

[Jamm13dodger]

My petition to raise the limit on ebikes in the UK to match the USA 20mph limit is published. Please sign and share.

Archived Petition: Petition to increase the 25kmh limit on electric bikes in the UK.

All electric bikes in the UK are subject to an assisted speed limit of 25Kmh. After this speed the bike can be ridden quicker, but the rider will no longer receive assistance from the motor. We would like the government to consider adjusting the limits to be in line with US legislation of 20Mph.

petition.parliament.uk

 

[congerball]

Bump

 

[Stihldog]

I really hope you have success with this. The emtb Peddle assist limit is 32kmh (20mph) here (cdn). That seems to be a suitable and safe speed.

 

[maynard]

Since when do petitions do anything? De restricted works .

 

[wepn]

My petition to raise the limit on ebikes in the UK to match the USA 20mph limit is published. Please sign and share.

Archived Petition: Petition to increase the 25kmh limit on electric bikes in the UK.

All electric bikes in the UK are subject to an assisted speed limit of 25Kmh. After this speed the bike can be ridden quicker, but the rider will no longer receive assistance from the motor. We would like the government to consider adjusting the limits to be in line with US legislation of 20Mph.

petition.parliament.uk

It just makes sense. There has to be one silver lining to the Brexit foot shooting & I hope this, at least, is it. Can't think of any other positive.

I'm a dual citizen but not a resident so not sure I'll be able to sign.

 

[KeithR]

Since when do petitions do anything?

Good reason to keep trying then, eh?

De restricted works .

And is illegal, a state of play some of us would like to see changed.

Things don't change unless someone tries to change them...

 

[KeithR]

My petition to raise the limit on ebikes in the UK to match the USA 20mph limit is published. Please sign and share.

Archived Petition: Petition to increase the 25kmh limit on electric bikes in the UK.

All electric bikes in the UK are subject to an assisted speed limit of 25Kmh. After this speed the bike can be ridden quicker, but the rider will no longer receive assistance from the motor. We would like the government to consider adjusting the limits to be in line with US legislation of 20Mph.

petition.parliament.uk

Are you able to edit the wording of the petition?

If you are, I strongly suggest removing the section referring to riders already breaking the law around the restriction: the legislature doesn't respond well to arguments that effectively say that they may as well change the law, as we're breaking it anyway.

That's how it will be read, I promise. I've got twenty-odd years as a policy maker and legal professional in a large UK government department under my belt - I've driven changes in law and have been heavily involved in their drafting - and I can tell you that as a matter of established principle, it's not a pattern of argument that works.

If you can I'd suggest replacing it with something along the lines that the current cut-off speed is not based on any established safety research - it's an arbitrary value - and that in any event e-bikes - and unpowered bikes - can exceed this speed with little difficulty; so in reality it serves no useful purpose.

FWIW. And I have signed the petition.

 

[KeithR]

It just makes sense. There has to be one silver lining to the Brexit foot shooting & I hope this, at least, is it. Can't think of any other positive.

The day it happened - literally the day it happened - my first thought was "at least this shitshow might allow the UK to come up with its own, sensible, e-bike cut-off speed..."

 

[Jamm13dodger]

Are you able to edit the wording of the petition?

If you are, I strongly suggest removing the section referring to riders already breaking the law around the restriction: the legislature doesn't respond well to arguments that effectively say that they may as well change the law, as we're breaking it anyway.

That's how it will be read, I promise. I've got twenty-odd years as a policy maker and legal professional in a large UK government department under my belt - I've driven changes in law and have been heavily involved in their drafting - and I can tell you that as a matter of established principle, it's not a pattern of argument that works.

If you can I'd suggest replacing it with something along the lines that the current cut-off speed is not based on any established safety research - it's an arbitrary value - and that in any event e-bikes - and unpowered bikes - can exceed this speed with little difficulty; so in reality it serves no useful purpose.

FWIW. And I have signed the petition.

Thanks Keith, unfortunately I cant change the wording, I did seek advice on the emtb groups over on facebook about the wording but didnt get any feedback beyond "go for it" type comments.

 

[KeithR]

Thanks Keith, unfortunately I cant change the wording, I did seek advice on the emtb groups over on facebook about the wording but didnt get any feedback beyond "go for it" type comments.

I avoid FB like the plague when I can, or I'd have been happy to help.

Not to worry, you're doing something, and that puts you streets ahead of the majority of us, so thanks.

 

[Doomanic]

Given the sheer number of signatures required to even get a consideration for a debate in parliament you'd better hope all the Levo riders sign it...

On a more serious note, petitioning your MP may be more effective, especially at the moment with the new cycling initiatives in place.

 

[Jamy]

signed

 

[Darren66]

Good reason to keep trying then, eh?

And is illegal, a state of play some of us would like to see changed.

Things don't change unless someone tries to change them...

If it was changed (unlikely) derestricted bikes would still be tearing round at 25mph+

 

[KeithR]

If it was changed (unlikely) derestricted bikes would still be tearing round at 25mph+

So? We can all ride at 25+ mph anyway. I've just got back from my maiden flight on on my new (restricted) SL comp, and I was hitting 28 mph at one point.

The current UK cut-off serves no useful purpose, does not reflect Real World ebike usage, and is therefore bad law. Bad laws should be challenged, and - hopefully - revoked.

At least we should try.

The fact that in any given scenario some people will always be arseholes, is irrelevant.

 

[#lazy]

Only need another 99860 signature

 

[Zoot Allures]

Thanks for setting this up ?. Signed

 

[Darren66]

So? We can all ride at 25+ mph anyway. I've just got back from my maiden flight on on my new (restricted) SL comp, and I was hitting 28 mph at one point.

The current UK cut-off serves no useful purpose, does not reflect Real World ebike usage, and is therefore bad law. Bad laws should be challenged, and - hopefully - revoked.

At least we should try.

The fact that in any given scenario some people will always be arseholes, is irrelevant.

Yes, that was my point...
On my non-e road bike, I tend to cruise between 17-20mph, the max speed like all bikes, including (pedal assist) ebikes is dictated by gearing and the riders ability to push a high gear, I personally don't believe there should be any speed limit on pedal assisted ebikes. The problem seems to be with those that can be controlled via a throttle, which are already illegal in this country, various YouTube videos showing riders exceeding 40-50mph, these are the people that spoil it for everyone else, then all ebikes get tared with the same brush.

 

[SquireRides]

Why that speed? Why not more? Why not more than now, but a bit less than US? Why not [random number]?

It is what it is. Some people will never be happy with a restriction.

 

[#lazy]

Why that speed? Why not more? Why not more than now, but a bit less than US? Why not [random number]?

It is what it is. Some people will never be happy with a restriction.

I don’t think they were invented to just go 16mph , it’s like owning a Scooby that cuts out at 70 !

 

[maynard]

Yes, that was my point...
On my non-e road bike, I tend to cruise between 17-20mph, the max speed like all bikes, including (pedal assist) ebikes is dictated by gearing and the riders ability to push a high gear, I personally don't believe there should be any speed limit on pedal assisted ebikes. The problem seems to be with those that can be controlled via a throttle, which are already illegal in this country, various YouTube videos showing riders exceeding 40-50mph, these are the people that spoil it for everyone else, then all ebikes get tared with the same brush.

I 2nd What this guy says .

 

[KeithR]

The problem seems to be with those that can be controlled via a throttle

Aye, but we know they're a different animal entirely, and we need to make a point of distancing ourselves from the muppets who use - and push - them.

It doesn't mean that there's no point in trying to get the restriction that affects us amended though - in fact not to try is tantamount to admitting we're the same as them, in my opinion - we just need to control the conversation where those electric motorbikes are concerned.

 

[congerball]

.

 

[Pivot]

Thanks for setting this up . Signed

Ditto!

 

[#lazy]

Aye, but we know they're a different animal entirely, and we need to make a point of distancing ourselves from the muppets who use - and push - them.

It doesn't mean that there's no point in trying to get the restriction that affects us amended though - in fact not to try is tantamount to admitting we're the same as them, in my opinion - we just need to control the conversation where those electric motorbikes are concerned.

i doubt boris reads this !

 

[KeithR]

Why that speed? Why not more? Why not more than now, but a bit less than US? Why not [random number]?

It is what it is. Some people will never be happy with a restriction.

Sigh... This isn't rocket science.

It needs to reflect some kind of reality, and be based on something other than arbitrariness.

It's perfectly possible to come up with a cut-off speed that reflects reality, and which is based on actual safety and usage evidence.

And I'll bet anything you like that a cut-off which is derived from what the Real World looks like, will be higher than the current one.

Some of us think that's something worth aspiring to...

 

[Gary]

It's perfectly possible to come up with a cut-off speed that reflects reality, and which is based on actual safety and usage evidence.

So why choose 20mph when it's not actually difficult to pedal a normal bike upto and beyond 30mph?

not to try is tantamount to admitting we're the same as them, in my opinion

That's quite a bizarre opinion.

 

[KeithR]

So why choose 20mph when it's not actually difficult to pedal a normal bike up to and beyond 30mph?

I didn't. I just want a cut-off speed that's got reason behind it. But I still appreciate the petition as a positive step, so I signed it.

That's quite a bizarre opinion.

Not in context: what I'm saying is that if we accept the Status quo for ebikes while actively espousing the idea of derestriction kits, what's the practical difference (to the layman) between our bikes and something like a Stealth?

It's a presentational thing: by seeking legitimacy for a higher - but reasonable - cut-off speed, we separate ourselves from these electric motorbikes, which will never be able legally to ride "our" trails, and which the existence of is a big part of our problem..

 

[Gary]

I personally don't believe there should be any speed limit on pedal assisted ebikes.

There's already no speed limit for them. UK road speed limits don't apply to normal bikes or class 3 Ebikes.
The 25kph limit on Ebikes only pertains to what speed the bike can be assisted to in public. So feel free to legally pedal (or simply tuck and freewheel) up to whatever speed you can manage. I hit 40mph unassisted on the road on mine every morning on my way to work, Hills are pretty good for helping with that sort of thing though.

 

[Gary]

Not in context: what I'm saying is that if we accept the Status quo for ebikes while actively espousing the idea of derestriction kits, what's the practical difference (to the layman) between our bikes and something like a Stealth?

Yeah. That is bizarre. Why do you even care what the "layman" thinks?
YOU know the difference. and that's all that matters really. (but incase you don't the difference is somewhere around 5500W)

It's a presentational thing: by seeking legitimacy for a higher - but reasonable - cut-off speed, we separate ourselves from these electric motorbikes, which will never be able legally to ride "our" trails, and which the existence of is a big part of our problem..

Personally I don't have any problem with riding a derestricted calss 3 pedalec illegally. I don't have a problem with breaking any laws that don't impact or harm others though. I never have. Especially when there are plenty perfectly legal things in the world that are far far worse and just accepted by the Status quo .

Anyone who's ridden an Emtb that's derestricted to 32mph will know fine how difficult the effort to maintain 30mph assisted on the flat or uphill actually is. IMO it requires around the same human effort as drafting at the same speed in a decent sized fast efficient road bunch (peleton). For this reason alone I'd have no problem with the assistance cut off being legislated to 30mph on roads. Wind and rolling resistance are already there to keep top speeds sensible with paltry 80NM 250w nominal motors
I don't for one minute thing this petition is going to get anywhere. But I don't actually have any faith in our current legal or government system/structure and never have. But good luck anyway.

Ps. in certain US states the legal road assistance limit is 28mph. so please add that to your list of "sensible" demands

I honestly can't believe we're using the word "sensible" and "laws" together when talking about a country that has more guns stashed in residential homes than human inhabitants

 

[Goughy75]

Signed