Orbea Urrun EP801 and XT Di2 with auto shift headache

[lunatik]

Hi all, new to the forum and new to e-bikes but been biking for many years. So I bought the 2023 Urrun as it had the EP801 (albeit the RS version) which is compatible with the new Di2 XT auto shift drive train or so I thought. I purchased all the components as an upgrade which included the SW-M8150-R (right shifter switch) and the RD-M8150-11 (derailleur).

I then turned on the bike and I get an E903 error which means "An abnormality due to different settings, etc. between units was detected".

Does this mean this will simply not work with the Urrun or can something be done at a Shimano service centre to get it to work? It's all supposed to be compatible according to Shimano.

Any help greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Jonathan Guy

Hi Jon_boy,

Can you give us an update on your situation?
I got the same bike / same situation. XT Di2 is installed. Error code e903 is shown.

How did you manage to configure the electical gear shifting functionality in the end?

I left my bike at 2 different shimano certified dealers, the 2nd one also being an orbea dealer. They really don't know what they are doing so I guess I have to take measures in my own hand.

Greetings from Germany

Lunatik

 

[Backflip]

Hi Jon_boy,

Can you give us an update on your situation?
I got the same bike / same situation. XT Di2 is installed. Error code e903 is shown.

How did you manage to configure the electical gear shifting functionality in the end?

I left my bike at 2 different shimano certified dealers, the 2nd one also being an orbea dealer. They really don't know what they are doing so I guess I have to take measures in my own hand.

Greetings from Germany

Lunatik

You need a Windows computer and a SM-PCE02 interface from Shimano. Then you can download the miniMax - program from eMax-Tuning (German engineering ) and can use this tool already in the licence key free (and so free of charge) mode to configure your bike with the new Di2 derailleur correctly. Very easy...
You cannot configure the correct configuration of your Di2 derailleur via Bluetooth, so the interface is a must have!
Maybe this post may also help.

 

[lunatik]

You need a Windows computer and a SM-PCE02 interface from Shimano. Then you can download the miniMax - program from eMax-Tuning (German engineering ) and can use this tool already in the licence key free (and so free of charge) mode to configure your bike with the new Di2 derailleur correctly. Very easy...
You cannot configure the correct configuration of your Di2 derailleur via Bluetooth, so the interface is a must have!
Maybe this post may also help.

Thanks Backflip,

I already read this thread and by now I know the procedure.

Does anyone know how a certified dealer can configure this with official shimano software? My dealer wasn't able to find the setting

Best regards,

Lunatik

 

[Backflip]

Thanks Backflip,

I already read this thread and by now I know the procedure.

Does anyone know how a certified dealer can configure this with official shimano software? My dealer wasn't able to find the setting

Best regards,

Lunatik

Your dealer is not allowed to change this setting, because for this official configuration change in the E-Tube-Project-Professional software you need special privileges which only a few Shimano employees have.
So only if such a Shimano employee will remotely log in to your dealers computer with attached PCE interface and bike, this guy can do the cange for you, but normally will not do if you have changed the derailleur by yourself due to legal reasons which I have explained in the other post already.
So, the easiest way is to convince your dealer to borrow his interface to you or that the dealer will use the miniMax program instead going the mostly never ending official way...
But it is up to you if you want to go the easy or the hard way.

 

[lunatik]

Your dealer is not allowed to change this setting, because for this official configuration change in the E-Tube-Project-Professional software you need special privileges which only a few Shimano employees have.
So only if such a Shimano employee will remotely log in to your dealers computer with attached PCE interface and bike, this guy can do the cange for you, but normally will not do if you have changed the derailleur by yourself due to legal reasons which I have explained in the other post already.
So, the easiest way is to convince your dealer to borrow his interface to you or that the dealer will use the miniMax program instead going the mostly never ending official way...
But it is up to you if you want to go the easy or the hard way.

Thanks for the info,

btw, I usually always chose the easiest path

The Di2 set was mounted at a certified dealer. However the dealer wasn't able to configure this setting.
Both dealers told me that they think that they would be able to configure this but it certainly doesn't look like it.

I will do it by myself.
Do you know by chance if e-max will work with the firmware that's currently installed on the bike (4.2.3)?

Best regards,
Lunatik

 

[Backflip]

Thanks for the info,

btw, I usually always chose the easiest path

The Di2 set was mounted at a certified dealer. However the dealer wasn't able to configure this setting.
Both dealers told me that they think that they would be able to configure this but it certainly doesn't look like it.

I will do it by myself.
Do you know by chance if e-max will work with the firmware that's currently installed on the bike (4.2.3)?

Best regards,
Lunatik

So most probably these dealers are certified for talking "blabla", but not for Shimano issues.
But this is a common attitude of bike dealers...
I´m quite sure miniMax will work also with motor firmware 4.2.3, because these guys already have found a solution for the latest 4.3.0, see here. So best will be to get in direct contact with them via email.

 

[Astro66]

I will do it by myself.
Do you know by chance if e-max will work with the firmware that's currently installed on the bike (4.2.3)?

You should be able to change your shifter to electronic with current version of MiniMax 2.5. But do not attempt the derestriction till they update the firmware upgrade. About 3-4 weeks they are saying.

Below in the highlighted areas is what you need to change to set up the electronic shifting.

That is.

1) Mechanical or Electronic Shifting.
2) Number of gears
3) Chainring teeth
4) Smallest rear sproket.

You will need the programming cable. The LBS where I bought the ebike lent me the cable. I have subsequently bought the cable, as I want to stay with the latest updates.

 

[lunatik]

You should be able to change your shifter to electronic with current version of MiniMax 2.5. But do not attempt the derestriction till they update the firmware upgrade. About 3-4 weeks they are saying.

Below in the highlighted areas is what you need to change to set up the electronic shifting.

That is.

1) Mechanical or Electronic Shifting.
2) Number of gears
3) Chainring teeth
4) Smallest rear sproket.

View attachment 143119
You will need the programming cable. The LBS where I bought the ebike lent me the cable. I have subsequently bought the cable, as I want to stay with the latest updates.

Alright, I brought my bike back from the shop and was able to enable the di2 setting in 10 minutes without any issues.

Thanks for your help!

Lunatik

 

[DKari]

!!Updated with correct Interface Box part number!!

Hello all, I appreciate all the good discussions and I'd like to add my own experience with this problem for whatever it's worth.

The first thing I'd like to say is that eMax definitely have the solution that works easily and they provide remarkably fast response to questions. But overall it's quite a large expense in total. For me in the U.S. it was nearly $1000 as I decided to purchase the SM-PCE02 Interface for $191 on ebay form a seller in Japan (I received it in less than a week!).

I only changed to "Electronical" shifting. I did nothing with motor power output or assist speed.

The bike I have is a 2023 Orbea Rise M10. I purchased the following bits:

Once you have all the hardware in hand Contact eMax for detailed instructions. The devil is in the details, as is said, so I wouldn't even attempt it without eMax detailed instructions. But at a high level the process includes:
- Download and install the Windows based Shimano E-Tube-Project-Professional program (necessary to be sure the correct drivers are installed before attempting to run miniMax)
- Download and install the Windows based miniMax program from eMax which is Free of charge (additional steps are described in the eMax instructions should miniMax refuse to start on your PC which is a step I had to take, and the solution works)
- connect the PCE02 interface to the 4-way connector or disconnect the wire to your electronic shifter and connect the SD300 lead to that using the same connector removed from the motor control wire during the upgrade to the electronic shifting hardware. Or connect it thru your display if you have one.
- Turn the bike on and then let it rip.

It took me a couple of hours but someone more tech. savvy could probably get it done faster.

 

[Backflip]

Nice post, thanks.
However, take care, there is a major typo in your "bucketlist":
EW-SD300 is the component name of the SD300 extension cable (the ones you also have used in 700mm and 1000mm lengths), however the PC linkage device is called SM-PCE02 (not EW-SD300)!

Maybe you can change this, so there will be no misunderstanding for others.

Also there is to mention that even if the components for the electronic derailleur and accessories are quite pricey, however, the functionality to change the derailleur type is free of charge from the EMAX guys.
So there is no additional cost for the software which enables this great feature and is preventing you from going through the service nightmare with local bikes shops and Shimano.

 

[DKari]

Nice post, thanks.
However, take care, there is a major typo in your "bucketlist":
EW-SD300 is the component name of the SD300 extension cable (the ones you also have used in 700mm and 1000mm lengths), however the PC linkage device is called SM-PCE02 (not EW-SD300)!
View attachment 143542
Maybe you can change this, so there will be no misunderstanding for others.

Also there is to mention that even if the components for the electronic derailleur and accessories are quite pricey, however, the functionality to change the derailleur type is free of charge from the EMAX guys.
So there is no additional cost for the software which enables this great feature and is preventing you from going through the service nightmare with local bikes shops and Shimano.

Thank you for pointing that out. The correction is made.

 

[DKari]

Yes. If you currently have a 12 speed Shimano cassette, which the 2023 ORB M20 has, it will have a Microspline Freehub, whilst the 11 speed needs a HG Freehub, and you cannot just change the freehub. You have to change the whole hub, which means re-spoking the wheel. So it's probably easier to just get a new rear wheel with a HG hub.

Don't forget you need to reprogramme the motor from Manual Shifting to Electronic Shifting, which needs the PCE02 cable. Or you can ask a local Shimano Agent to do it, but they may not want to. In which case you'll need to do it yourself, and that cable is expensive.

My 2023 Orbea M10 has a DT Swiss rear hub and I was able to replace the Microspline with this HD freehub. Would this work for you or do you have a different rear hub?

 

[Astro66]

My 2023 Orbea M10 has a DT Swiss rear hub and I was able to replace the Microspline with this HD freehub. Would this work for you or do you have a different rear hub?
View attachment 143545

Thanks for the advice. But I have a Shimano SLX hub. Unfortunately the freehub is different.

 

[Astro66]

Oh BTW. Unless Shimano do bring out a 12 speed Linkglide cassette. I have decided I'll live without Autoshift. The Manual shifting whilst coasting is the automatic feature I use the most. I also use Freeshift when on a cruisy ride. But when I'm attacking terrain. I prefer to select the gears manually.

But being able to shift without pedalling, but coasting, is very handy. Just in those situations where you are trying to remain balanced, or you'll rock or ground strike if you pedal. (Like in a corner)

The 12 speed Hyperglide+ cassette, with electronic shifting is super fast to shift gears, and really handy when you need to shift several gears quickly. I'm using the Deore CS-M6100-12 cassette. As it's the longest wearing. And I can get it for $AUD80. (About $USD60). So I'll just replace it every 1200km, regardless of wear, with my chain.

I had the 11 speed Linkglide cassette on a previous bike, with cable shifting, and I did notice it was slower changing gears. Only really a problem when in that situation when you need to apply power quickly, but are 2 or 3 gears from the correct gear.

So I would try the 12 speed Linkglide, if it comes out. But only if all I needed to change was the cassette. Because I could see myself going back to the Hyperglide+ cassette, if I found Linkglide shifting too slow.

 

[Cell4soul]

I am looking to purchase an Orbea Rise M10. It comes with the Shimano CS-M7100 10-51t 12-Speed cassette. Will this work with the Shimano DI2 8150 12 speed derailleur? I don’t care if I have auto shift, I am just looking to use the free shift function. I think it should work because both are Linkglide. What would I need to purchase, just the DI2 shifter, derailleur and power cable? My dealer would do the install. Thank you.

 

[Astro66]

It comes with the Shimano CS-M7100 10-51t 12-Speed cassette. Will this work with the Shimano DI2 8150 12 speed derailleur?

Yes. I had the same CS-M7100-12 cassette and bought that derailleur. RD-M8150-12 This is the derailleur you need.

I think it should work because both are Linkglide.

No. The cassette is Hyperglide+ CS-M7100-12. But the Di2 12 speed RD-M8150-12 derailleur is the correct derailleur for that cassette. There is no 12 speed Linkglide Cassette. Only 9, 10 and 11 speed.

What would I need to purchase, just the DI2 shifter, derailleur and power cable? My dealer would do the install. Thank you.

You will also need the SW-M8150-R shifter. And 2 X SD300 cables to plug the shifter and derailleur into the motor.

And don't forget you'll need reprogramme the motor from mechanical to electronic shifting with the SM-PCE02 cable.

 

[Cell4soul]

Yes. I had the same CS-M7100-12 cassette and bought that derailleur. RD-M8150-12 This is the derailleur you need.

No. The cassette is Hyperglide+ CS-M7100-12. But the Di2 12 speed RD-M8150-12 derailleur is the correct derailleur for that cassette. There is no 12 speed Linkglide Cassette. Only 9, 10 and 11 speed.

You will also need the SW-M8150-R shifter. And 2 X SD300 cables to plug the shifter and derailleur into the motor.

And don't forget you'll need reprogramme the motor from mechanical to electronic shifting with the SM-PCE02 cable.

Awesome, thank you for the info. My Orbea dealer should be able to reprogram the motor, correct?

 

[Backflip]

Awesome, thank you for the info. My Orbea dealer should be able to reprogram the motor, correct?

Most probably not... (because your dealer needs special privileges which only some few Shimano employees have) to do this configuration change with the official Shimano software tool.
However, if you have access to a PCE02 interface and a Windows computer you (or also your dealer) can set the correct derailleur configuration with the minimax program (no extra costs) by yourself as written before in many post already.

 

[Astro66]

Awesome, thank you for the info. My Orbea dealer should be able to reprogram the motor, correct?

As Backflip says. They may not be able to do it, or want to do it. But you can ask.

My LBS where I bought the EMTB didn't have the software to do it. But they did have the cable. So they allowed me to bring the bike to the shop, with my own laptop, and make the changes myself at the shop.

It is very easy to do. I have written how to do it above. Below is a link to that post.

Orbea Urrun EP801 and XT Di2 with auto shift headache

Hi all, new to the forum and new to e-bikes but been biking for many years. So I bought the 2023 Urrun as it had the EP801 (albeit the RS version) which is compatible with the new Di2 XT auto shift drive train or so I thought. I purchased all the components as an upgrade which included the...

www.emtbforums.com

 

[Astro66]

Oh BTW. Shimano have just released the Di2 Shifter in Wireless.

 

[Cell4soul]

Oh BTW. Shimano have just released the Di2 Shifter in Wireless.

View attachment 144327

I don’t see this for sale anywhere. Does anyone know if this is available yet?

 

[markloch]

For those who have upgraded to di2 rear derailleur, any hints, gotchas, recommendations on fitting the wire?

‘23 Orbea Urrun. I will be running a 700mm sd300 cable from the motor following the route of the derailleur cable, and I’m wondering if anyone has used a rubber grommet or some such for where the cable exits the chainstay, or just leave it loose (the sd300 being a lot thinner than a cable housing).

Also best route from that exit point to the derailleur’s cable port?

Also, when autoshift enabled, does it (via freeshift) change gears while your coasting in anticipation of you starting to pedal at some faster or slower speed?

 

[Astro66]

For those who have upgraded to di2 rear derailleur, any hints, gotchas, recommendations on fitting the wire?

‘23 Orbea Urrun. I will be running a 700mm sd300 cable from the motor following the route of the derailleur cable, and I’m wondering if anyone has used a rubber grommet or some such for where the cable exits the chainstay, or just leave it loose (the sd300 being a lot thinner than a cable housing).

Grommet and cable tie used on my Merida. No issues to date. Keep in mind. The part where the cable goes into the derailleur, is fixed. It does not move, when changing gears. There would only be movement if the derailleur was impacted, or when you adjust the B screw.

Also, when autoshift enabled, does it (via freeshift) change gears while your coasting in anticipation of you starting to pedal at some faster or slower speed?

Freeshift when coasting works this way. It changes gear based on the bike's actual speed and the cadence you selected you want to pedal at. So it doing a calculation of the gear required based on present actual speed.

So if you are coasting at 20kph, and have chosen in the menu, that you want to pedal at 70rpm. It will put the bike in the gear that if you start pedalling. You will need to pedal at 70rpm.

 

[markloch]

You should be able to change your shifter to electronic with current version of MiniMax 2.5. But do not attempt the derestriction till they update the firmware upgrade. About 3-4 weeks they are saying.

Below in the highlighted areas is what you need to change to set up the electronic shifting.

That is.

1) Mechanical or Electronic Shifting.
2) Number of gears
3) Chainring teeth
4) Smallest rear sproket.

View attachment 143119
You will need the programming cable. The LBS where I bought the ebike lent me the cable. I have subsequently bought the cable, as I want to stay with the latest updates.

Question: the SC-EN600 display has three ports; currently two are in use, one to the motor, another to the SW-EN600-L. In the past I’ve used the free port to connect to the SM-PCE02.

Once I’ve got the SW-M8150 Shift Switch connected, I wont have any free ports … does it matter which component - left or right switch - is disconnected when I do the programming? In other words, should I do the programming before I connect the SW-M8150 Shift Switch? Or do I need a splitter of some sort?

Also, once connected, is it just a matter selecting the “electronical switching” radio button, then picking the correct # of gears, chainring size, and smallest sprocket?

 

[Backflip]

Best is to (temporarily) disconnect the right hand side SW-M8150 shifter for the gears when changing the correct gear mode setting with the miniMax - program, because this way you still have the left hand side SW-EN600-L remote to power on the bike. The shifter is not needed to program the correct electronic derailleur type to the drive unit.
And "yes", select the appropriate correct setting for “electronical switching”, the correct number of gears, chainring size, and smallest as well as largest sprocket size in miniMax and then finally press the related button to program these new settings to the bike (drive unit).
If your derailleur then does not work after power off and power on the bike like expected, you most probably have forgotten to insert the cable from the SW-M8150 shifter back to the display.

 

[SebastianK]

Some other notes is the 12 speed derailleur will only give you FREE SHFT and not AUTO SHIFT, because there is no 12 speed Linkglide Cassette. But a trade secret I've heard is that Shimano may be bringing out a 12 speed Linkglide Cassette in August. After which, a firmware update will allow AUTO SHIFT to be turned on for the 12 Speed Derailleur.

This is why I have gone for the 12 speed derailleur, rather than replace the rear wheel to get a HG Hub, and put an 11 speed Linkglide, and Electronic Derailleur system in. Hopefully my contacts in Shimano haven't let me down.

Any new updates on new Linkglide cassette or another hardware upgrade for allowing Autoshift on 12-speed?

 

[Astro66]

Any new updates on new Linkglide cassette or another hardware upgrade for allowing Autoshift on 12-speed?

I think the new firmware release was to make the EP801 comparable to the Bosch CX. I think the 12 speed Auto Shift may be a future release.

Thing is. SRAM have it. So Shimano will need to get it done.

 

[a_double]

Are there any precautions with firmware updates on an EP801 modified using Emax?

I only enabled Autoshift with it.

It’s been great all season.

 

[Astro66]

Are there any precautions with firmware updates on an EP801 modified using Emax?

I only enabled Autoshift with it.

It’s been great all season.

As long as the speed limit is set to no more than 25kph. It should be fine.

 

[markloch]

As long as the speed limit is set to no more than 25kph. It should be fine.

As a precaution I backed out of my max power mod before updating.

The blazing fast 32kph we reckless yanks enjoy is plenty quick for me on my emtb, though Orbea runs some of their shimano-powered urban bikes at 45kph.