Levo / Kenevo (gen1) Range Extender thread

[RichP]

I asked Specialized this question back in April, see below for their answer! Not the happy news I was hoping for. Please feel free to follow suit!

Good evening,

I own a Turbo Levo and my friend owns a Focus Jam^2…he has the option of adding a range extender battery to his down tube on a custom rail, but I do not! This inevitably means that he can ride his e-bike for longer and cover a greater distance.

Could you advise if Specialized plan to add this feature to their Turbo Levo range? I have canvased the opinion of many Levo riders and all agree that this option would be one that would be considered.

I would suggest that it would be pretty simple to design a rail that fits into the bottle cage mounting holes and a range extending battery could be fitted, by using a double sided battery plug, allowing the original battery to plug onto the outer side of the range extender battery, effectively charging the integrated battery whilst the ride is in progress.


Please consider this to be an option in the very near future!



Hi Richard,

Thanks for your feedback, always appreciated.
Focus has considerably smaller capacity battery, therefore they have developed the system of adding a 'piggyback' battery to extend the range.
Our design was always focused on making an e-bike that looks clean and resembles a non-motor powered MTB as much as possible. Adding an external battery not only adds more weight to the bike, it also compromises the look, which for some riders is an important factor.
As for future product, I'm sure the technology will get better making our bikes lighter and go further!

Regards,

Adam Wroz
Service Centre


Specialized UK Ltd
29 Barwell Business Park,
Leatherhead Road,
Chessington, KT9 2NY
United Kingdom

Tel: +44 (0)20 8391 3502

 

[R120]

Compromises the look - and there in lies the problem with bike design and bike buying choices!

 

[Doomanic]

I saw a few Focuses (focii?) with the Tec Pac at the FoD today, didn't look too bad.

 

[R120]

Yeahs I see a few and pretty much everyone has a tec pac - kind of makes you question how successfull the wholes smaller battery thing is in the real world.

 

[Doomanic]

I was going to post something similar but didn't want to get labelled as argumentative...

 

[R120]

It’s an odd one as it depends how you use the bike - if you mainly ride in Eco not a problem (and I find the longer I have an EMTB the more my main riding mode is eco, and pretty much never use boost) then the concept works, however if you use trail the whole time with a fair bit of boost you ain’t going far without the tec pack.

 

[Doomanic]

We did a couple of climbs today that were a struggle in Boost, never mind Trail...

 

[R120]

I am also not that’s fussed about weight, sure I wouldn’t mind my bike being a couple of KG lighter, but there are benefits to the extra weight in terms of descending, and stability/feeling super planted.

I like the idea of the Fazua motor, but don’t like the battery size, as for me the one advancement I want more than anything else is better range. If you could combine a 600 + why battery with the Fazua then that would be interesting.

I don’t really care either about the bike looking as close to a normal bike, it’s an E-Mtb and I want a bike that’s designed to be the best E-Mtb, not one that’s designed primarily to not look like an e-mtb at the expense of performance.

When you look at the likes of the Merida, Ghost, Vitus and Commencal, and even the Pivot, by using the external battery pack they get the center of the weight much closer to the B.B., whereas most integrated batteries have the weight extending further up the down tube.

I actually think the seat tube is probably the best place for the battery, but this obviously would interfere with a dropper on an MTB. It’s interesting to see that that’s where BMC have put it on the new Alpencross Amp, which weighs sub 14kg with the steps system.

 

[R120]

We did a couple of climbs today that were a struggle in Boost, never mind Trail...

Ha - for me on the steps system I find how the trail mode reacts to your inputs actually is easier to maintain a steady rate up anything steep, I find with boost it has a sweet spot of cadence that if you don’t maintain (sometimes difficult when off road!) it becomes a pain to use

 

[Mabman]

Still raises the issue of suspension performance with the extra weight aboard as compared to stock. Not really an issue if you choose to ride with the extender battery on all the time you can just re-adjust the suspension to suit. But switching back and forth, while doable, would be kind of a PITA.

Also why Box is not using 21700 cells is a mystery to me. Even though the cells are different they would still plug and play with the 18650's and make for a battery with fewer cells to achieve the same watt hours. Also providing a higher C rate.

An interesting concept though and it seems like there are two camps forming, those that want as light a weight as possible and are willing to sacrifice range as they only use the bike for shorter rides, add another battery such as Focus does or carry an extra battery in their pack both of which can affect suspension performance unless as mentioned accounted for. Or you can get a bike that has a 700wh or so battery to begin with and be able to do both short and long rides without dealing with the suspension issues as they would be set correctly with no need for additional tuning and deal with the extra weight all the time, which on an eBike is not as big of an issue I feel especially if the bike is set up correctly for it's and your weight.

Voiding of the warranty is something that is already in play with the dongle thing going on. Your choice I suppose as a warranty means more to some than others and you do mods at your own risk to jeopardize it.

 

[Levorunner]

Compromises the look - and there in lies the problem with bike design and bike buying choices!

That is the only reason I bought the Turbo Levo to begin with! I hate the humpback battery look! The Levos built in battery in the downtube is so sweet looking.? Oh by the way,I received my spare 504wh from my lbs on Saturday! Wahoo, no more range anxiety! Hehehe!

 

[Philip]

That is the only reason I bought the Turbo Levo to begin with! I hate the humpback battery look! The Levos built in battery in the downtube is so sweet looking.? Oh by the way,I received my spare 504wh from my lbs on Saturday! Wahoo, no more range anxiety! Hehehe!

What bag do you use to carry the spare?

 

[Levorunner]

What bag do you use to carry the spare?

I use this pack. My 504wh battery fits perfect!

Plan-C™

 

[idahoskiguy]

Waiting to see the 650 watt-hour battery when the 2019 bikes roll out! All indications are that the new battery will be backward compatible with the prior Levo and Kenevo bikes.

Very cool if this happens!

 

[Doomanic]

What indications? Where have seen this? Links please.

 

[Al Boneta]

That is the only reason I bought the Turbo Levo to begin with! I hate the humpback battery look! The Levos built in battery in the downtube is so sweet looking.? Oh by the way,I received my spare 504wh from my lbs on Saturday! Wahoo, no more range anxiety! Hehehe!

Exactly, I didn’t want a bike that looked like it had a tumor

 

[Al Boneta]

Still raises the issue of suspension performance with the extra weight aboard as compared to stock. Not really an issue if you choose to ride with the extender battery on all the time you can just re-adjust the suspension to suit. But switching back and forth, while doable, would be kind of a PITA.

Also why Box is not using 21700 cells is a mystery to me. Even though the cells are different they would still plug and play with the 18650's and make for a battery with fewer cells to achieve the same watt hours. Also providing a higher C rate.

An interesting concept though and it seems like there are two camps forming, those that want as light a weight as possible and are willing to sacrifice range as they only use the bike for shorter rides, add another battery such as Focus does or carry an extra battery in their pack both of which can affect suspension performance unless as mentioned accounted for. Or you can get a bike that has a 700wh or so battery to begin with and be able to do both short and long rides without dealing with the suspension issues as they would be set correctly with no need for additional tuning and deal with the extra weight all the time, which on an eBike is not as big of an issue I feel especially if the bike is set up correctly for it's and your weight.

Voiding of the warranty is something that is already in play with the dongle thing going on. Your choice I suppose as a warranty means more to some than others and you do mods at your own risk to jeopardize it.

I just straight up asked him about not using 21700 cells. He said the cost and the rarity of the cells. But he had a new solution for the Kenevo.
The 21700 don’t seem all that hard to find here in the US and they aren’t that much more expensive than 18650s or 20700s
Maybe I just discovered a side business for myself.

 

[Mabman]

I just straight up asked him about not using 21700 cells. He said the cost and the rarity of the cells. But he had a new solution for the Kenevo.
The 21700 don’t seem all that hard to find here in the US and they aren’t that much more expensive than 18650s or 20700s
Maybe I just discovered a side business for myself.

Problem is not getting the cells, as you say they are available, it is getting the right ones and getting a pack made that will fit your situation. I guess you could make a pack using common you tube building practices. We did that and it works but it is a bit like a ticking time bomb.

Using the right BMS is a biggie. BMS's are pre-programmed to the limits of the cell voltage/amperage and if you use just any old one you are in for potentially having a fire on your hands. The 2170 5A cells, while there are lesser A cells why not shoot for the moon, are not all that readily available as the bulk of their global production is going towards EV's at a rate of 2500-5000 per car. Although a 15ah 48v battery only takes 39 it is hard to get anyone that has the right cells to even listen unless you are doing a minimum order of 20,000 or so.

I suppose you could find 2170 cells online or visit your local Vape shop as they are popular for that use. But quality of the cells is key as well as their output ability. It is going to take a few years for this to sort out and battery production to raise to a level to meet the demand. At this time there is no way I would use a 2170 cell not branded by a major player in the battery world.

 

[Al Boneta]

Problem is not getting the cells, as you say they are available, it is getting the right ones and getting a pack made that will fit your situation. I guess you could make a pack using common you tube building practices. We did that and it works but it is a bit like a ticking time bomb.

Using the right BMS is a biggie. BMS's are pre-programmed to the limits of the cell voltage/amperage and if you use just any old one you are in for potentially having a fire on your hands. The 2170 5A cells, while there are lesser A cells why not shoot for the moon, are not all that readily available as the bulk of their global production is going towards EV's at a rate of 2500-5000 per car. Although a 15ah 48v battery only takes 39 it is hard to get anyone that has the right cells to even listen unless you are doing a minimum order of 20,000 or so.

I suppose you could find 2170 cells online or visit your local Vape shop as they are popular for that use. But quality of the cells is key as well as their output ability. It is going to take a few years for this to sort out and battery production to raise to a level to meet the demand. At this time there is no way I would use a 2170 cell not branded by a major player in the battery world.

I found plenty of Samsung and Sanyo 21700 cells in 4800Mah 4.8A.
There is a battery distributor locally that has them in 3500mah up to 5000mah. I could probably use the BMS in dead Levo battery cases I have in the shop.

 

[Tori]

I use this pack. My 504wh battery fits perfect!

Plan-C™

Looks good! Great to see alternative solutions for carrying the Levo battery. It's great having a 2nd battery hey

 

[Mabman]

I found plenty of Samsung and Sanyo 21700 cells in 4800Mah 4.8A.
There is a battery distributor locally that has them in 3500mah up to 5000mah. I could probably use the BMS in dead Levo battery cases I have in the shop.

Just in case here are the BMS spec's for a 48v 5A battery:

I would check this against the spec's for a Levo BMS, which is 36v granted but the parameters should be the same in regards to charging/discharging. The Levo BMS is set for a 18650 cell and I don't think that they would be compatible.

Batteries are available for sure. Just be careful building a pack as it is not rocket science but will go off like a rocket if not done just right.

Then the only problem is fitting it into the down tube I guess.

 

[Levorunner]

Looks good! Great to see alternative solutions for carrying the Levo battery. It's great having a 2nd battery hey

Yes it is very nice having a second battery! It comes in very handy when I go on extended rides! 35kms+

 

[Al Boneta]

There is a company here in California that are making batteries for custom Ebike applications.

Going to give them a call when I get to the shop and see what’s possible

 

[Mhugdoc]

Any news on how to get one of these in the US?

 

[StuR]

Does the small bottle range extender fit a medium frame with a piggy back shock ?

 

[ccrdave]

dont know but my guess is not, with a piggyback shock on a large frame I have to squash a small bottle in

 

[jsalas2]

following

 

[HKP57]

Just ordered my big bottle from Danny.

 

[Stumpy]

Just ordered my big bottle from Danny.

View attachment 5407

You won't be disappointed

 

[Dusty]

You won't be disappointed

What's the range of extender approx....or size of battery?
Any pics of it on a bike