Levo Gen 2 Is there anything that will make my Levo not ride like a hard tail?

[1rider]

I’m pissed. Pissed at Specialized for taking my money in exchange for what was supposed to be a full suspension bike.
I have tried everything with the Rockshox on my 2020 Levo and the ride just simply SUCKS.

The bike should not require me to spend more money to get it to work as it should. I am in a corner though and need it to work right, at least better.

Is there a shock out there that someone has tried that gives this suspension some life and progression? I see Fox speced on the more expensive builds, are they working better?

If you have real world experience with a shock or any other fix to get the Levo to perform, please share.

Thanks.

 

[1rider]

Could you elaborate please on your experience with the shock and the changes it provided by switching to it?

 

[Gary]

Upgrade the rider.

 

[1rider]

Not sure what you mean Gary. Thanks for the contribution though.

 

[Bigtuna00]

You may want to actually describe what's wrong with it and what your current setup is. Personally I think a coil is the best upgrade for Levo but since you mention progression I assume you're jumping/doing drops so that wouldn't be a good idea...

 

[1rider]

Thanks Tuna. I described it as a hard tail thinking that would summarize, at least generally the poor performance of it. In more detail, the bike is terrible on chatter sections like roots and small rocky stretches, additionally it does nothing good on bigger hits In the trail. I know I am not alone with this experience because I have seen other threads where folks are looking for similar answers or solutions to this problem. This is all highlighted further by the Lyrik fork being a solid performer through most everything.

I would prefer not to make it a could or an air type of conversation and welcome suggestions from first hand experience with either type of shock.

 

[RebornRider]

I installed an EXT Arma because I was so tired of getting bounced around by chatter. My regular trails in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park are all hardpack with tons of washboard. The Arma made a significant difference. I hit small drops regularly, about 3 feet, and so far I have not used all of the shock travel. I installed a kit that adds a "ruler" and marker o-ring to the shock so I can check max used travel after each ride.

 

[Bigtuna00]

Thanks Tuna. I described it as a hard tail thinking that would summarize, at least generally the poor performance of it. In more detail, the bike is terrible on chatter sections like roots and small rocky stretches, additionally it does nothing good on bigger hits In the trail. I know I am not alone with this experience because I have seen other threads where folks are looking for similar answers or solutions to this problem. This is all highlighted further by the Lyrik fork being a solid performer through most everything.

I would prefer not to make it a could or an air type of conversation and welcome suggestions from first hand experience with either type of shock.

What's your sag at? What air pressure? How many tokens? What damper settings? (That's what I mean by "setup"). Which shock is it?

What is "nothing good on bigger hits"? Is it bottoming? Or not using travel? Or bucking?

I've ridden the Levo with a Deluxe RT3 and DPX2. Neither one of them "rode like a hard tail". I've also used a Cane Creek DB Coil and EXT Arma. It's a night and day difference, coil vs air. Air is "ok". Coil is "butter". But I'm a smooth rider to begin with so the lack of progression is not an issue.

 

[Mikerb]

My 2019 Levo Comp came with a RS Deluxe RT. It was OK but I could not find a set up that combined a plush initial stroke with sufficient ramp up in the mid stroke. I changed to a Fox DPS Performance and found that to be a great improvement. The Fox shock was brand new taken off a Levo SL before being used. It delivered what I was missing, i.e. plush but good progression/ramp up; and better still the 3 position compression lever (soft medium hard) enables me to vary its response according to the type of trail I am riding. On a natural forest trail I use the soft ( plush) position. On a trail a little more like a bike park run..........manicured surface or just pretty smooth hard pack.........plus some jumps and drops, I use the medium position. I also use either medium or hard for flat gravel or tarmac transition sections which makes pedalling more efficient.
Note however one of the key differences with the Fox was the factory tune compared to the RS Deluxe. Both compression and rebound factory settings were lighter on the Fox. I think this is one of the problems with shocks specced by the brands for EMTBS....they tend to go for the hardest factory tune. Because the Fox I bought came off the much lighter Levo SL the factory tune was lighter as well.

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

I had issues with mine, the lockout adjustment would rotate as I was riding and it would feel like a hardtail when it rotated to the locked out position of course. Test it by cable tying the lever in place.
I sent mine to the shop who got it sorted for me and it’s much better than it was but it’s still a pretty basic shock and on the really rocky stuff where I am, it can’t keep up.

 

[1rider]

What's your sag at? What air pressure? How many tokens? What damper settings? (That's what I mean by "setup"). Which shock is it?

What is "nothing good on bigger hits"? Is it bottoming? Or not using travel? Or bucking?

I've ridden the Levo with a Deluxe RT3 and DPX2. Neither one of them "rode like a hard tail". I've also used a Cane Creek DB Coil and EXT Arma. It's a night and day difference, coil vs air. Air is "ok". Coil is "butter". But I'm a smooth rider to begin with so the lack of progression is not an issue.

At the moment, a little more than 30% sag with the two red tokens removed In the stock RS deluxe that came on the bike. I have tried every configuration that made any sense to try and it made no positive difference.

“like a hard tail” was my original statement, meaning bigger hits you just get kicked.

Thanks, I am versed in coil and air shock performance difference, just looking for some solid recommendations in either type. Riding smooth or not doesn’t matter when the trail is nothing but rock and root.

 

[1rider]

My 2019 Levo Comp came with a RS Deluxe RT. It was OK but I could not find a set up that combined a plush initial stroke with sufficient ramp up in the mid stroke. I changed to a Fox DPS Performance and found that to be a great improvement. The Fox shock was brand new taken off a Levo SL before being used. It delivered what I was missing, i.e. plush but good progression/ramp up; and better still the 3 position compression lever (soft medium hard) enables me to vary its response according to the type of trail I am riding. On a natural forest trail I use the soft ( plush) position. On a trail a little more like a bike park run..........manicured surface or just pretty smooth hard pack.........plus some jumps and drops, I use the medium position. I also use either medium or hard for flat gravel or tarmac transition sections which makes pedalling more efficient.
Note however one of the key differences with the Fox was the factory tune compared to the RS Deluxe. Both compression and rebound factory settings were lighter on the Fox. I think this is one of the problems with shocks specced by the brands for EMTBS....they tend to go for the hardest factory tune. Because the Fox I bought came off the much lighter Levo SL the factory tune was lighter as well.

Mike, this is exactly the helpful feedback I was hoping for. Thank you. A softer tune can be more easily adapted than something that is to firm I think. I have no commitment to air or coil, just to getting the bike to perform better. I am fortunate that I get to ride trail to and from work five days a week so I get my time in on the bike. But that’s all the more reason I want it dialed in better than what can be achieved with the stock setup.

 

[1rider]

I installed an EXT Arma because I was so tired of getting bounced around by chatter.

Reborn, the Arma shock seems to be a popular choice. How much ride time do you have on it? Bounced is a good description, I have described it as having your fillings rattled out.

it’s just a shame with suspension technology being what it is today that Specialized would put out something like this. My Yeti and Santa Cruz pedal bikes are a dream to ride.

 

[RebornRider]

Reborn, the Arma shock seems to be a popular choice. How much ride time do you have on it? Bounced is a good description, I have described it as having your fillings rattled out.

I've got about 4 months and somewhere near 1000 miles on the Arma. I'm headed to Mammoth Mountain bike park at the end of June (Pipeline!), which will be a test of bottoming resistance.

Pipeline at Mammoth Mountain Edit: I'm not as good as this guy. Not even close.

 

[lumpy]

Turbo Levo Link (2019-2021)

The Turbo Levo link brings the descending performance found in our Stumpjumper and SL links to the Levo. By increasing the progressivity, it helps prevent harsh bottom outs while maintaining small bump sensitivity and offering more mid-stroke support. What does this translate to on the trail...

cascadecomponents.bike

 

[Ripping g]

Turbo Levo Link (2019-2021)

The Turbo Levo link brings the descending performance found in our Stumpjumper and SL links to the Levo. By increasing the progressivity, it helps prevent harsh bottom outs while maintaining small bump sensitivity and offering more mid-stroke support. What does this translate to on the trail...

cascadecomponents.bike

I’ve just got 1 of those yet to fit and try very good reviews I run ohlins rear and zeb ultimate front not sure how it would work with entry level shocks

 

[Snrbrtsn]

are you running tubless ?
I found the lower tyre pressures has made significant difference

 

[Zimmerframe]

I’m pissed. Pissed at Specialized for taking my money in exchange for what was supposed to be a full suspension bike.
I have tried everything with the Rockshox on my 2020 Levo and the ride just simply SUCKS.

The bike should not require me to spend more money to get it to work as it should.

If you have real world experience with a shock or any other fix to get the Levo to perform, please share.

I think your approach isn't really going to net you the best results. You're blaming the bike and manufacturer for starters rather than exploring solutions before hand. This generally means someone's not actually open to fixing the problem.

You've also avoided answering the questions people have asked in order to actually help you, both with what you actually mean and with your settings.

Lets assume this isn't the case, so for instance.

What type of levo ? what size levo, what's your height, what's your weight. What's your shock pressure and damping settings.

What kind of riding do you do, what type of rider are you ?

Does it bottom out on 1 meter drops, 2 meters drops , 3 meter drops ? Only drops to flat ? Is it when landing jumps, is it just on the bends ?

Is it kicking on take off's ? Is it kicking as you hit jumps ? is it kicking on drops ?

How does it react if you press down on the saddle - could it be a fault shock ?

 

[1rider]

are you running tubless ?
I found the lower tyre pressures has made significant difference

I am running tubeless with Cush core and it would be worse if I had tubes for sure.

 

[1rider]

I think your approach isn't really going to net you the best results. You're blaming the bike and manufacturer for starters rather than exploring solutions before hand. This generally means someone's not actually open to fixing the problem.

You've also avoided answering the questions people have asked in order to actually help you, both with what you actually mean and with your settings.

Lets assume this isn't the case, so for instance.

What type of levo ? what size levo, what's your height, what's your weight. What's your shock pressure and damping settings.

What kind of riding do you do, what type of rider are you ?

Does it bottom out on 1 meter drops, 2 meters drops , 3 meter drops ? Only drops to flat ? Is it when landing jumps, is it just on the bends ?

Is it kicking on take off's ? Is it kicking as you hit jumps ? is it kicking on drops ?

How does it react if you press down on the saddle - could it be a fault shock ?

Zimmerframe, there are many threads/questions on this forum and elsewhere about getting better performance out of the suspension on these bikes. This “generally means” that something is inherently wrong with the bike design of component marriage chosen by the manufacture.

This, in part with my experience with other bikes working beautifully after setting them up properly points back to the manufacturer. If I were not open to fixing the problem why am asking obout a fix on an open forum?

I haven’t avoided answering any questions if you read the posts above. How about, let’s assume that I have taken the time to exhaust all avenues with setting up the shock in anyway conceivable that is appropriate for my fit, size, bIke, riding type/style. The Levo is a comp.

With that assumption maybe you can offer something to my original question; “Is there a shock out there that someone has tried that gives this suspension some life and progression? I see Fox speced on the more expensive builds, are they working better?”

If not, have a good day.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Within your original question was :

If you have real world experience with a shock or any other fix to get the Levo to perform, please share.

Not trying to be difficult, just trying to get the information to get you the best answer/answers - be that the alternative propositions or to get the Levo to perform - which maybe down to setup and if not, the other questions which have been asked will also help people with recommendations.

 

[Levo Laland]

My Levo Comp Carbon has the Fox DPS performance fitted with the Specialized TX tune and the orange volume spacer as standard. I have invested time and money (shockwhiz hire) in setting it up just so, and it's absolutely fine and displays none of the bad characteristics that you have experienced. Twice the internal shaft has snapped requiring a warranty repair, but that's for another thread. If you want to try one of these shocks they are literally always for sale on eBay UK for around £100 as they seem to be unloved and one of the first upgrades that Levo owners make. If you search for DPS 210 x 52.5, most will be from Levo's and look for the TX tune which is a Specialised specific tune. If it's better then sell the stock one on, if it's not then sell on the Fox, either way, you won't be out of pocket.

 

[boBE]

There is nothing inherently wrong with the bike design or component selection chosen by the manufacturer. Specialized and others make the bike to suit a large cross-section of riders and terrain and in most cases it works just fine. In your case with your riding style and your trails it does not. This forum is probably less than 5% of all bike riders so even if there are many posts on this forum regarding this issue it still has little reflection on the design and suitability of the bike.

I see the same on a Ford Mustang forum, the car suits 95% of the owners while the rest make modifications to suit their own special requirements. It would be good if the manufacturer could make something that suits all users but it is not feasible nor profitable. I hope you find the combination that works for you, if not it may be another bike.

 

[Darkyhs]

To be honest, once you ask about suspension setup. You need to give details, not just random "I saw multiple posts on forums". You're asking questions and assume people are reading and keeping up with hundreds of pages. Additionally, what you might not like, is exactly what somebody else is looking for. If I jump on a mate's bike, his setup is full-on rebound, as he likes the feeling of dirt jump hardtails. When he jumps on mine, he hates it.

So the fact that people asked you for information is rather normal in my opinion. If you have very specific questions I would advise you to go to a suspension specialist. They can fine-tune the suspension to your liking, also the Cascade links work really well.

 

[kwolfkill]

Like others, I don’t believe there’s an inherent design flaw with the stock suspension setup. If your bike is working as badly as you describe, it sounds like there could be something wrong with the shock. Having it checked out by a specialist might be the next logical step.

That said, I don't have any experience with the shock that came stock on the 2020 Levo. I've got a 2021 Levo Comp that I initially rode with the stock Fox DPS shock and 36 Rhythm fork. I was immediately impressed with its control and traction in a wide variety of conditions. My typical ride usually includes 4000-5000’ of descending on trails in the Pacific Northwest (US) full of tech, steeps, roots, and speed, or all of the above, often in the wet. I’m a former (older) DH and enduro racer and yet I honestly would have been perfectly happy with the stock suspension if no alternatives existed.

However, alternatives do exist, so I upgraded to a 2021 Fox X2 in back and a 38E up front (along with more robust wheels, tires, brake rotors, etc.). Overall, the character of the bike didn’t change dramatically, it just became more capable across the board. I can now charge harder, maintain more control and enjoy an increased level of composure no matter the terrain. And to answer your original question, despite being a big fan of coils on other bikes, I went with the X2 because it was recommended by people I respect, it’s highly adjustable, it delivers near coil-like sensitivity (but not quite) and its progressive character suits the linear nature of the Levo’s rear suspension. After minor clicker fiddling and adding two volume spacers to the shock I’m extremely happy with its performance. It delivers excellent small-bump compliance, good mid-stroke control, and retains a satisfying level of poppy playfulness. Or at least as playful as a 50lb. bike can be…

 

[TPEHAK]

Your rear shocks should have a modes switch. Turn that switch from stiff mode to soft mode.

 

[Mikerb]

I earlier recounted my experience changing from the Deluxe RT to a Fox DPS. The Deluxe with Spesh "Trail" tune which is a harder factory tune than the DPS which being from an SL had a softer factory tune. I should add that part of my decision to buy the DPS was that the RS Deluxe had done a lot more hours than its required service schedule so the DPS ( second hand but unused) cost very little more than a service cost on the RS Deluxe...and I would to be time without a rear shock waiting for that to be done.....and it means I have a spare so can swop shocks when either needs servicing. I am quite happy to put the RS Deluxe back on the bike in those circumstances since it was completely reliable and really only lacked a nice plush reaction at the top of its stroke. I should add as well that whilst I love my Levo and credit it with a wide range of capability it is not an Enduro bike and I do not expect it to be................I have a another bike for those conditions/uses.
So my experience of the RS Deluxe was that a pressure setting that enabled some reasonable drops and small jumps would be a little harsh on rough ground. It could be set fairly soft but that limited the bottom out. I knew 2 pressure/reound settings, one that would work for general natural forest trails and another for rather more gnarly descents and it took 2 minutes to change based on what I expected from any ride. That I guess is the limitation of pretty basic shock. On neither setting would I descibe it as anywhere near approaching the feeling of a hard tail so can only assume the OPs shock is faulty......or maybe he is a really light rider? ( I am 78kg).

 

[RebornRider]

One thing to add regarding the EXT Arma - the US distributor includes 2 coils in the price of the shock. To Mikerb's point about plush vs. jumps, I run the lighter coil for my regular rides that include only small drops. I can switch to the heavier coil if needed at Mammoth Mountain, which has some pretty big jumps. Yeah, it takes longer than getting out the shock pump, but it's really only a 10 to 15 minute job to change the spring.

The other option is to nail the landings rather than casing.

 

[R120]

Problem is perception of shock performance is a truly personal thing and so dependent on understanding of how to correctly set it up and secondly doing so.

Having said that from what you are describing and if you are confident in your knowledge and ability to correctly set up the shock the. It sounds like there is something wrong with it.

In this day and age even the more basic shocks from reputable brands are very capable bits of kit, and whilst expensive stuff might work a bit better a well tuned and set up “regular” shock should still offer a pretty good ride.

One other option of course could be an issue with the rear linkage/frame itself preventing the shock working ?

 

[Mikerb]

Problem is perception of shock performance is a truly personal thing and so dependent on understanding of how to correctly set it up and secondly doing so.

Having said that from what you are describing and if you are confident in your knowledge and ability to correctly set up the shock the. It sounds like there is something wrong with it.

In this day and age even the more basic shocks from reputable brands are very capable bits of kit, and whilst expensive stuff might work a bit better a well tuned and set up “regular” shock should still offer a pretty good ride.

One other option of course could be an issue with the rear linkage/frame itself preventing the shock working ?

Logically if SAG can be set at say 30% meaning the shock is initially activated by the rear linkage merely under rider weight plus a proportion of bike weight, but then the back end feels like a hardtail once riding, it suggests the shock is packing. So much more likely the shock is at fault that any linkages problem.