Internal Power Cable Failure, Levo 2019

[Stephen]

Hard to believe
Have you had internal foam and swing arm rubber seal fitted?

The foam , yes , before the motor change , but they have just shoved it in , see foto . The swing arm has a cover copied from the forum .

 

[Paul Mac]

That cable failure with the split is par for the course.
6 of us have bought Levos and everyone has failed in this way, some of us are on our second and third lead!

 

[Stephen]

It would be interesting to hear what Specialized rider care thinks of this catastrophic botch job !

 

[Paul Carruthers]

The foam , yes , before the motor change , but they have just shoved it in , see foto . The swing arm has a cover copied from the forum .

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[Paul Carruthers]

They should fit the Specialized one also an extended metal fork on rear shock link that prevents stones getting trapped

 

[Paul Mac]

It would be interesting to hear what Specialized rider care thinks of this catastrophic botch job !

I heard how Specialized are aware and are working on a fix, but that was a year ago.
Surely cant take a year to design a new lead?

 

[Paul Carruthers]

I heard how Specialized are aware and are working on a fix, but that was a year ago.
Surely cant take a year to design a new lead?

Be interesting to see the plug in the just released kenevo if anyone has one

 

[Paul Mac]

Be interesting to see the plug in the just released kenevo if anyone has one

It's the same!

 

[Paul Carruthers]

It's the same!

Hard to believe

 

[Paceman]

ACF50 was checked and approved by Brose, we like it a lot. Vaseline around the outside of the O-rings is also good. This is essentially what we do in bike production.

Not had any problems yet after 1000km on my Levo, much of it on very wet trails over the last two months. I'm very diligent with cleaning / maintenance. However, i'm going to try and preempt issues arising by getting some ACF50 Spray or similar.

A quick Google search suggests a few products that might fit the bill, such as a product called Corrosion-X, or the new Muc-Off E-Bike Corrosion Defence spray.

Anyone used ACF50 or similar?

 

[gipsy]

Not had any problems yet after 1000km on my Levo, much of it on very wet trails over the last two months. I'm very diligent with cleaning / maintenance. However, i'm going to try and preempt issues arising by getting some ACF50 Spray or similar.

A quick Google search suggests a few products that might fit the bill, such as a product called Corrosion-X, or the new Muc-Off E-Bike Corrosion Defence spray.

Anyone used ACF50 or similar?

I have tested ACF50, it is dielectric, it leaves oily film which is very hard to remove so use it wisely. I use stab to apply only on male connector to keep track on any dust sticking to it and to be able to clean it. It is good as rust prevention but I would not use it as spray on connectors.
Another thing, I first clean with isoprop and then apply, with stab again, small amount of silicon compound around gasket.
After wet trails I clean bike from below with sponge and some water and air it with air line properly with low pressure not to force any water in connectors or bearings.

 

[Mikerb]

Looking at pics of the split 90 degree plug end of the lead it does not look to me that the outer sheath of the cable was ever an integral part of the plug end and would therefore not be any sort of water barrier for the cables inside the sheath as they enter the plug end. I would like to see how those cables are fixed to the terminals inside the plug end and whether that connection block is set in a wax or plastic block. If that is indeed the case, the split in the plug end is not the cause of any failure. Indeed even if the cables are not terminated within a wax/plastic block the split in the plug end still has nothing to do with the cable failing. If you think how a vehicle spark plug end cap is fitted onto the HT lead, it is soft rubber and a tight fit over the HT lead.....the bike cable arrangement is nothing like that. The failure can only be at the connection block assuming no individual cable has broken ( very unlikely).

 

[Mikerb]

That's what mine did, after a wash (gentle - compare to how I pressure jet washed my Haibike!) bike would not turn on. After drying out in the sun it worked days until next wash or rainy run.


cable/water related problems give "battery errors" not the engine one, so maybe the problem is still there.

Not so. The various faults codes relate to what part of the startup procedure failed. All of the signals from the various components are carried to the TCU on individual cables. A moter error does not necessarily mean the motor is faulty. It could mean the signal required from the motor is not being received via the cable ( e.g. because it is shorted out).

 

[ScottWest]

Not had any problems yet after 1000km on my Levo, much of it on very wet trails over the last two months. I'm very diligent with cleaning / maintenance. However, i'm going to try and preempt issues arising by getting some ACF50 Spray or similar.

A quick Google search suggests a few products that might fit the bill, such as a product called Corrosion-X, or the new Muc-Off E-Bike Corrosion Defence spray.

Anyone used ACF50 or similar?

I am also curious about the use of "Corrosion-X" as a solution. I believe this product is used to waterproof aviation electronics.

 

[Mikerb]

I can see how it would help protect electrical connections that are "made"...ie connected but I would not be sure about using it on the actual connection pins since it is essentially a wax. For a connection that is permanently made except for maintenance...for example the electrical connections inside the motor casing it looks a good idea to use it after connecting everything up. Similarly the connections on the TCU. It would not be any good on the charging port however given it is regularly disconnected. For a particularly wet ride some gaffer tape over the charging port is one way to provide extra protection.

 

[Paceman]

I can see how it would help protect electrical connections that are "made"...ie connected but I would not be sure about using it on the actual connection pins since it is essentially a wax. For a connection that is permanently made except for maintenance...for example the electrical connections inside the motor casing it looks a good idea to use it after connecting everything up. Similarly the connections on the TCU. It would not be any good on the charging port however given it is regularly disconnected. For a particularly wet ride some gaffer tape over the charging port is one way to provide extra protection.

Specialized Rider Care say that Brose have tested and recommend ACF50 spray, so that might be the better option for the connectors.

 

[KennyB]

Specialized Rider Care say that Brose have tested and recommend ACF50 spray, so that might be the better option for the connectors.

Can we please have advice from Specialized Rider Care on how to use it?

 

[gipsy]

Can we please have advice from Specialized Rider Care on how to use it?

After wet ride, it may be good idea, after some time, to lift the bike, front wheel up to let drain the water which is resting in engine bay. I did it with mine aftet one hour back home and some 1 small cup of water leaked out.

 

[nobbyq]

my bike died tonight with same problem , why is it still happening a year later ?

 

[Stephen]

re post nr. 209 -happy to report , that it took only three days to receive the new cable and the missing plugs . My bike is back on the trails . This picture suggests that the plus cable has seen a lot of water and muck as it shows signs of oxidation and is covered with muck . The minus cable is also dirty , so it has also been wet . Plus + minus + water = problems .

 

[Mikerb]

re post nr. 209 -happy to report , that it took only three days to receive the new cable and the missing plugs . My bike is back on the trails . This picture suggests that the plus cable has seen a lot of water and muck as it shows signs of oxidation and is covered with muck . The minus cable is also dirty , so it has also been wet . Plus + minus + water = problems .

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Great....err not great that it broke.....but great that we can finally see that if that outer plug cracks there is no further seal beyond where the outer sheath of the cable enters the plug. So now I agree there should be a general recall so that all plugs can be inspected for damage. That leaves the question of why it cracks. Is the specified method of installing it wrong or is it not being installed correctly? Neither the battery or motor moves so as to cause the cable to flex.....does it? Does the way in which the cable is fixed allow a natural angle into the plug? Is the plug becoming brittle due to heat? Seems to me there could be some simple preventative measures like adding heat shrink to the area where the cable goes into the plug. I would also be tempted to use liquid gasket when replacing the motor cover.

 

[Mikerb]

It also shows a poor standard of termination. There should be no area of exposed cable outside the connector point and I also do not like the fact that the low voltage signal wires are sandwiched between the pos and neg high voltage wires.

 

[Mikerb]

So the question is how does this forum transfer information and a request for action from Specialised.... not in the form of a complaint but as a genuine offer of help to improve their outstanding product.

 

[galaga187]

2019 s-works , had a new motor installed after 1500 km a month ago . Today went for another ride and it rained , which is unusual for us im Mallorca . After 30 minutes of riding the motor turned off and would not turn on again . Once back at home I removed the motor cover and found the following . No plugs on the three electrical connectors ! Motor cable and plug full of water ! And have a look at the cable ! Tomorrow I'm going to have a serious talk with the shop . Unbelievable !!

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Looks like the binding plugs are missing

 

[Paul Mac]

So the question is how does this forum transfer information and a request for action from Specialised.... not in the form of a complaint but as a genuine offer of help to improve their outstanding product.

The thing is, I've actually spoken to Specialized employees, and they are well aware of this issue.
I am absolutely confounded as to why they are not addressing it. Let's face it, it's an easy and relatively cheap fix
I can only think they had a large number of these leads made and are happy to run down the stock before redesigning it. ?

 

[Mikerb]

Ok so today I called Specialized UK in London and spoke to a guy called Duane. I expressed my concern about the numbers of people on this forum that have experienced a failure of the motor to battery cable due to the motor plug end splitting. Firstly he said that Specialized are aware but it is not a huge problem since only a small number of owners have experienced that problem. Nevertheless he said that work is ongoing to modify the cable to make it more waterproof and he expects the modified cable to be available by mid December. Asked whether Specialized thought a general recall was necessary he said that it would be a voluntary recall...that is, if someone wants their cable changed they can take the bike to the lbs to get it done, or the cable can be sent to them. I asked if they knew what was causing the plug to split and he replied that they suspected extremes of temperature, both hot and cold ( or both). I suggested they consider completely sealing the connection block within the plug with a wax ( or similar) block and he agreed to pass on the suggestion. I further suggested that the motor covers should have a solid or liquid gasket ( he had never heard of liquid gasket which is often used in motor vehicle applications) and he also agreed to pass that on.
So lets see what they come up with. Meanwhile I can see a few DIY hacks if you want to give yourself some insurance and are happy to remove the covers and cable.

 

[Mikerb]

I also sent this to the "Rider Care" contact form on their website...….not sure if it ends up in the same place!!......…......……………..
"Hi,
I am a member of the EMTB forum and have become concerned with the number of Levo owners who have experienced problems apparently due to water/dirt ingress into the plug connector at the motor end of the motor to battery cable. Indeed a number of owners have posted photos of that plug split close to the point where the cable enters it. It is clear from photos posted that the only seal for the connections inside the plug at the cable end is between the cable sheath and the plug. That split therefore fully exposes the plug to dirt/water ingress when any dirt/water gets inside the motor outer covers. I have personally not experienced any faults ( other than the Rev forks) on my Levo Comp which I have owned since April and I love the bike but I am now concerned with much wetter and muddier weather now on us, that my bike may also be vulnerable. Given the number of owners who have experienced this problem should not all bikes now be recalled to check and if necessary rectify this problem? No one seems to now exactly why the plug should suffer this damage but regardless it does seem to me that since the plug itself is not able to be disassembled why the connection block within it is not permanently sealed in a wax block ( or similar). It does appear that the motor plug end needs a new design but meanwhile a simple preventative fix might be to use some shrink wrap to prevent water/dirt ingress should the plug material split. At the same time would it not be a good idea to use solid or liquid gaskets on the motor covers to help prevent water/dirt ingress? I am happy to have my bike used as a test bike for any "fix" you may want to try out."

 

[galaga187]

I had my motor replaced and the new rubber/plastic flap but it looks like the foam is no longer fitted - should it be? There is still a large gap where water could get in.

 

[Mikerb]

its just a piece of "moto foam". Easy enough to stuff a piece in or put a flap over the gap..or both.

 

[wepn]

Seems to be an issue only with the newer 90° connectors. Does beg the question, why the change to the new and then unproven, now proven dubious connector in the first place?