Levo Gen 2 How long can the bike be stored with battery at 100%

[Grannyjones]

Before it starts to cause problems ?

My bike has been at Leisure Lakes for a month for repairs and the battery was at 100% before it went in

 

[salko]

There is no defenitive answer on this ... Li-ion batteries just doesn't enjoy being fully charged or (almost) empty. After a month you probably won't notice any significant negative effect short term, but long term you might get quite a bit less total cycles out of the battery ...
Personally I will never leave fully charged battery for longer than about a day ...

 

[GrandPaBrogan]

There is no defenitive answer on this ... Li-ion batteries just doesn't enjoy being fully charged or (almost) empty. After a month you probably won't notice any significant negative effect short term, but long term you might get quite a bit less total cycles out of the battery ...
Personally I will never leave fully charged battery for longer than about a day ...

I never used to pay any attention to my battery charge condition. I just charge it fully every time so that I'm ready to go at a moments notice. (Same regimen I've been using for my cordless power tools). But since I've read about this in our forum, I've stopped doing this on my eBikes.

My charger (Giant not Spesh) happens to have a button that will limit the battery charge to 60% which is the storage level according to the manual. So that's what I do now after every ride. I only top it up to 100% the night before when I know we're going for a big ride. If there's an unplanned impromptu ride, 60% battery charge almost always is more than enough for those kind of outings.

But my question now is... is it harmful to keep trickle charging the battery without allowing it to get closer to empty?

 

[MrSimmo]

Before it starts to cause problems ?

My bike has been at Leisure Lakes for a month for repairs and the battery was at 100% before it went in

Wouldn't worry, they've probably been using it as a shop demo bike for the month ?

 

[chrismechmaster]

There is no defenitive answer on this ... Li-ion batteries just doesn't enjoy being fully charged or (almost) empty. After a month you probably won't notice any significant negative effect short term, but long term you might get quite a bit less total cycles out of the battery ...
Personally I will never leave fully charged battery for longer than about a day ...

Wow I genuinely never new this !!

So Myself i only use the bike say once a week , should I only charge to 80 % then on the day top up to full charge

Or

Would it be better to not charge after the ride to leave it fairly empty and then just charge it to full just before I go out on the day

 

[steve_sordy]

If mine is low when I return from a ride, I give it an hour to take it into the 60-80% zone. Then I leave it until the night before my next ride to go to 100%, sometimes even as late as the morning of the ride depending upon departure time. My spare battery gets stored at three bars out of five.

 

[escrs]

Mine gets charged to 100% after every ride no matter how much charge is left on the battery then left till the next ride which could be 1-2 weeks later

Done this with my 2017 Levo, 2018 Kenevo and 2020 Levo

All were fine and the 2017 Levo and Kenevo are still going strong on their original batteries

 

[yorkshire89]

Some useful info here

11 questions about the eBike battery

www.bosch-ebike.com

I seem to remember seeing a graph which showed how leaving the battery at 100% would affect the amount of full cycles you got out of a battery, but can't find it now...

ETA - Page 25

https://www.bosch-ebike.com/fileadmin/EBC/Service/Downloads/Akku_Guide/Akku_Guide_MY20_2/Bosch-eBike-Battery-Guide-MY2020-EN.pdf?_=1559630936

 

[Konanige]

When battery manufacturers say don't store your battery at 100 percent for long periods they mean 3 months or so, if you ride regular just charge up to 100 percent every time!!!

 

[chrismechmaster]

Cheers Steve ?

 

[JimBo]

I had a 2017 Motobecane eMTB w/Shimano e8000 system, and the eTube report told me the battery's remaining capacity. I sold it in 2019 after about 60 "full" charge cycles, with 97% of its battery's original capacity left.

With that bike, I charged to 100% more or less after every ride (per the guys at EMBN), until I learned that lithium ion batteries are stressed at full charge. I ride several times a week year-round, but because I have multiple ebikes, the Motobecane's battery would sometimes sit at 100% for a week or more.

Then I got my Commencal, with the same Shimano system and battery, in early 2019, and have never left its battery at a full charge for longer than a day. After nearly 60 full charge cycles on its battery, it remains at 100% original capacity, according to the eTube report.

To me, that says that leaving the battery at full charge for more than a day might reduce its capacity, but only by a small amount. Much worse, however, is leaving a battery at a low state of charge (especially cheap/generic batteries), which I learned the hard way with my first ebike, a 2015 Sondors.

Its original generic battery is a brick now, while my 2015 iZip Sumo's battery - with higher quality cells - still has ~90% of its original capacity remaining...

Addendum: all my bike's batteries have always been stored in my basement, away from extreme temps.

 

[Grannyjones]

Damn, I sometimes miss the days when I used to just hire E Bikes for the week and just thrash them and not give a stuff about maintenance

 

[Goodmango13]

Mine gets charged to 100% after every ride no matter how much charge is left on the battery then left till the next ride which could be 1-2 weeks later

Done this with my 2017 Levo, 2018 Kenevo and 2020 Levo

All were fine and the 2017 Levo and Kenevo are still going strong on their original batteries

I'll double that statement!

 

[Utah Rider]

I don't pay any attention to charging mumbo jumbo. If your on a Spesh, ride'm hard, ride'm till there dead. I always charge right after a ride whether it's middle of summer or dead if winter. I carry a spare battery and always ride the first one dead. Of course dead on a Spesh is not really dead. They shut off at around 32 volts. The battery warranty is two years. No sense in "saving" it by pussy footing around. Run it hard, you'll soon know if you got a bad one and warranty will replace it. The earlier ebike batteries were not that good. The new ones are much better. It's important to remember that an ebike battery is not one battery. It is 40 or more batteries. They are grouped into cells packs. If one cell drops voltage the tcm can't turn it off. It will not allow full charging or full discharge on the remaining cells. Best to just work it. Follow me for other great advice like throw your chain gauge away. Run SRAM chains. RUN, DON'T WALK YOUR KMC CHAIN TO THE GARBAGE CAN! Use quality lube like Maxima chain wax for motorcycles.

 

[WaXed]

Manufacturers choose to store the cells at around 3.65V
The higher the cell voltage the more the SEI layer will build up over time
This effect is magnified at higher temperatures
as SEI layer increases in thickness the cell Internal resistance increases thus reducing capacity and increasing the cell temperatures at higher currents, the total pack degradation over time will increase

So charging a pack fully and leaving it for a long period can have a negative effect on cell lifespan and performance
The temperature it is subjected to while it is left fully charged will also have a bearing


The trade off with our Lithium Cells capacity potential is with the charge voltage
you can over charge lithium cells to 4.25V or 4.3V and get more capacity but lower lifespan (cycles)
or you can under charge your cells to 4.1V and get reduced capacity and more lifespan /cycles


As already mentioned a good strategy can be to charge your cell to 80% and store them at that
If you go for a ride and don't need a full pack you are good to go
If you need a full pack it can be fully charged in a not too much time

 

[Beekeeper]

I set a timer at night to reach 100% no more than an hour before I intend to ride.
when I get back from ride I wait 30 mins for it to cool down and then charge to 50%

 

[Forever Wild]

When battery manufacturers say don't store your battery at 100 percent for long periods they mean 3 months or so, if you ride regular just charge up to 100 percent every time!!!

This!

I plan to do what’s easy for me and simply enjoy riding the bike. I don’t want to worry about such things.

 

[JimBo]

A riding buddy bought my 2015 Haibike FS RX in 2017 (2016 pic below). His attitude toward battery charging has been to leave it full after every ride, even though he sometimes goes a few weeks or more between rides. How he can go that long, I can't fathom, but I digress...

I remember asking him if he wanted to get several years of useful life from his battery, or maybe just a few. He said the trade-off of constantly having to be mindful of his battery's state wasn't worth it. OK, but to me, it is.

A few weeks ago, we did a familiar, extended trail loop together with some serious climbs. I noticed he was lagging, and when I asked if he was feelin' alright, he said he had to stay in Eco mode because he didn't think his battery would make the whole loop otherwise. The bike only has maybe 1200 miles on it! (He really needs to ride more.)

He later fessed up that his casual batter-itude (Trademark JimBo) caused premature and substantial reduction of his battery's capacity... classic "told ya so" moment ?‍

I'm convinced that well cared for Bosch, Yamaha, Shimano and other high-quality brand ebike batteries can provide upwards of 10 years of useful life (80%+ of original capacity), unless you deplete and recharge them more or less daily.

(Edit: If that's the case. you'll actually reach 1000+ charges in a few years.)

Time will tell...

 

[Grannyjones]

This!

I plan to do what’s easy for me and simply enjoy riding the bike. I don’t want to worry about such things.

Me as well!
In future I might charge it to just 80% if it's going to be out out use for more than a few weeks but if it's just a few days between rides then it's got to be 100%. Really don't want the faff, it would just put me off.
There becomes a point when I would rather ride an analogue bike than an E Bike if there is too much extra hassle - at least in the Winter when rides are less frequent.

 

[Beekeeper]

My laptop battery gave me a few years service before I ordered another battery for £20
I leave it fully charged and don’t care about battery health.

However, my bike battery costs £700 to replace so I’m considerably more carefully with it for that reason.

 

[Grannyjones]

Or over £1000 is it for the 700 WH Battery ?

 

[Jline2020]

I set a timer at night to reach 100% no more than an hour before I intend to ride.
when I get back from ride I wait 30 mins for it to cool down and then charge to 50%

Is there a way to set the charging system to a specific target, such as 80%? Many electric cars have this feature and allow you to charge to a certain percentage to increase battery longevity. Given that the TCU is disconnected during charging, I'm assuming this cannot be set using the app. My wife has an electric moped called an UBCO, the UBCO charger has a switch that allows you to charge to 100% or to 90%. 90% is recommended unless you need maximum range.

Another thing that may be going on is that the Specialized charger may shut off before 100% even though the TCU and the app show 100%, it might be more like 95%. Just as a fully depleted battery is not truly dead, the software shuts down the motor to prevent damage to the battery.

Specialized, can you chime in here?

 

[JimBo]

Is there a way to set the charging system to a specific target, such as 80%? Many electric cars have this feature and allow you to charge to a certain percentage to increase battery longevity. Given that the TCU is disconnected during charging, I'm assuming this cannot be set using the app. My wife has an electric moped called an UBCO, the UBCO charger has a switch that allows you to charge to 100% or to 90%. 90% is recommended unless you need maximum range.

Another thing that may be going on is that the Specialized charger may shut off before 100% even though the TCU and the app show 100%, it might be more like 95%. Just as a fully depleted battery is not truly dead, the software shuts down the motor to prevent damage to the battery.

Specialized, can you chime in here?

I'm not Specialized, but I do know that some people use a timer to shut off the charger after however much time they estimate gets them to around 80%.

I use a kill-a-watt meter to tell me how many watts have been added, and manually shut it off when I think it's around 80%. At 80%, the charger's amperage starts to drop off, so I monitor that too.

Unless I'm charging for a long ride, then I let it go all the way.

 

[Jline2020]

I'm not Specialized, but I do know that some people use a timer to shut off the charger after however much time they estimate gets them to around 80%.

I use a kill-a-watt meter to tell me how many watts have been added, and manually shut it off when I think it's around 80%. At 80%, the charger's amperage starts to drop off, so I monitor that too.

Unless I'm charging for a long ride, then I let it go all the way.

Good idea on using the Kill-a-Watt meter, I have one of them but never thought to use it in this fashion. I will try it next time. ?

 

[Grannyjones]

I got the bike back. Battery health is showing 100%. Did a ride straight out of Leisure Lakes from full charge.
2 hrs 55 minutes of riding. The 700 watt hour battery was down to 10% by the end of it. Whether this is poor or not I don't know.