Feeling overbiked on a longer travel eMTB?

[kafkastan]

Hey -

Newbie here, having found the site while researching my first eMTB purchase and hoping for your collective sage wisdom on a particular query.

Now, were I buying another manual full-sus, I’d likely get a trail bike with 130-150mm travel. Realistically, given my questionable skills & limited bravery, I’d be overbiked on anything more and likely curse it on every climb.

However, the combination of cost and reviews has me tempted towards a Vitus e-Sommet VR, which at 170mm is much more enduro than I need – but looks like a lot of fun. (I realise they’re sold out for the year, but this will officially be an Xmas present from the wife, so I’ve both been dropping heavy hints to herself and quietly nursing my Wiggle discount ahead of the 2020 release.)

Anyhows, my query is, given climbing is so much easier, do you ever really feel overbiked on a longer-travel eMTB? Should I stick with the length of travel I’d opt for on a manual?

I’ve hired/ borrowed a few eMTBs, but none with more than 140mm travel as yet.

Ta muchly,

david

 

[33red]

Choosing is personal so i can only offer my view.
The lighter = more bike feeling even more for a small rider like me. I got lucky i found for my first Ebike a 47 pounds. 120 mm HT and i love it. It has 40 mm rims so lots of traction. I would not see me on anything over 50 pounds. Also the price is better and it has very good components. The Enduro are designed for speed going down wich is not my focus. Do you enjoy climbing? technical sections? flowy sections? Do not buy the hype and do not trust the supposed review. Hopefully you get a real try, not just a quicky. Happy shopping.

 

[kafkastan]

Cheers for the persepctive. I'm fine climbing my manual XC bike, but really don't enjoy climbing my trail bike, which is just a Bossnut. I enjoy both technical and flowy sections. However, I'm actually not that aggressive going downhill, so am starting to think 170mm of travel will be wasted on me. I visited BikePark Wales for the first time last year, and was generally fine on the Bossnut (aside from the dork disc evaporating to nothingness at some stage and the occasional chain drop).

 

[Zimmerframe]

Now, were I buying another manual full-sus, I’d likely get a trail bike with 130-150mm travel. Realistically, given my questionable skills & limited bravery, I’d be overbiked on anything more and likely curse it on every climb.

There are a few people on here with the E-sommet and it's well praised by all. Ultimately, I don't think you'll go far wrong with it. Spec/price, unless you find some amazing pre-2020 release offer, it's by far the best value.

The E8000 climbs well, I have a 22.5kg hardtail, so similar I think to the e-sommet in weight and there's absolutely no time when you think there's a power/weight trade off so don't worry about that.

The e-sommet is regularly described as playful on the descents , here's a couple of on board videos :

Still a sceptic but.... :) - EMTB Forums - Thats "Gary", not me. My riding style is very similar - for the last few seconds of the second video.

I've just being going through the process of searching for an FS bike to upgrade from the hardtail. Last week I ordered a Kenevo, mainly because it was a stunning deal. I'd initially discounted it as too expensive and too much bike.. but what is too much bike !? Reading through old threads generally it means you have more suspension, so if you do mess up and take a crap line, it's more likely to get you out of trouble. So I wouldn't worry about that either. I did consider a sommet but as you say, they're out of stock.

Everything we think of as extreme now will probably considered a shopping bike in 5 years time.

I'm sure you'll make your wife very happy with her fantastic choice of gift !

 

[Stormy 107]

The biggest difference I found when trying out emtb was the wheel size. 150 to 170mm on the front won't make a big difference is about how well the bike fits and feels. If you can't wait for an e sommet have a look at the commencal site. I went for 27.5 wheel size same motor as esommet

 

[Brendog78]

E bikes climb better than anything anyway, I have climbed up trails I would struggle to push up on my Kenevo (180mm). Get in the right gear, get the right body position and have a crack, saying that these tech steep climbs are probably a very small % of my ride, so I don't mind going a little slower at some points. The rest of the ride I'm using the berms on the switchbacks on the way up and have a way more forgiving bike on the way down that gives me confidence to ride any line I choose. I'm not racing for sheep stations, don't need the latest in tech or performance, I just need a solid bike under me. I have never felt that more travel makes a bike to much, my view is quite opposite. Smaller travel bikes force better line selection, more cautious riding and if it all goes wrong you hit the limits harder and faster. Set up wise I find short travel has more limitations, where Long travel i can be low and slack or hard and fast . let's be honest you don't have to use all of the travel so if you have it you can use it, if you don't ?

If you are racing for sheep stations though up mountains that you can't climb even on your hands and knees. Then disregard my comments ?

All emtbs these days are fun and extremely capable. Pick one you like and get out and enjoy it.

 

[kafkastan]

.. but what is too much bike !?

Now that was my thinking, for a bike with a motor anyhows, 'til a few days ago. But then I started wondering, and then I posted here!

I'm sure you'll make your wife very happy with her fantastic choice of gift !

I'm still engaged in a long-game process of making her happy about it. Up to a couple of years ago, I'd never bought a new bike, nor spent more than £500 on one. Then there was the Bossnut and a similarly priced XC. Then I mentioned the possibility of an eMTB. She's not yet 100% down with what she sees as rather rapid bike-cost inflation, but I've been slowly chipping away ever since I first hired an eMTB. I think I may have finally broken her resistance - there have, of late, been signs of resigned acceptance!

 

[Paul Mac]

E bikes don't negate suspension travel, yes they do allow you to have more than you really need without too much sacrifice, however a shorter travel does feel different on the trail, it is more direct and does feel livelier.
It depends what most of your riding consists of though, I find for typical British trails 150 - 160mm is the sweet spot, but more of less travel also works but depends on how you like your bike to handle.

 

[Zimmerframe]

I've been down the same route .. but she's seen it makes me happy (bruised and broken often, but still happy).... I've tip toed down the e-bike route and the Kenevo will be e-bike no.3 this year as I've continued to convince myself that the less capable/cheaper option will suffice for my needs and desires .... I was going for a 140/150mm bike, but the Kenevo on offer was cheaper.

Choosing the right bike is always going to be difficult and consist of endless compromises and doubt. I'm sure I'll be ecstatic whenever I'm riding it and that's what matters. I'm equally sure I'd have been ecstatic on the 140/150mm Thok -which was the bike of my dreams. In my mind the longer travel and bulkier compromises of a longer travel bike are significantly reduced on an e-bike. I'm not saying there won't still be compromises, but then there will be different compromises with a shorter travel bike.

Just been informed it's "SHIPPED" .. so the joy continues ..

 

[miPbiP]

I ride my ebike faster, up and down, than my bio bike, so I appreciate the 20mm extra travel and bigger tyres. Add to that that weight-weenyism is a bit pointless (within reason) on a 50lb bike.

To a point, comparing an e- to a bio is apples and oranges as you'll ride the differently.

Also bear in mind ride profiles change because the big time reduction is on climbs, you'll do more vertical, so proportionally you'll spend more time of your rides descending. (This changes the physicality too, it's some less uphill cardio and some more downhill manhandling).

 

[kafkastan]

If you can't wait for an e sommet have a look at the commencal site. I went for 27.5 wheel size same motor as esommet

I'll be waiting 'til Xmas/ January one way or another. The wife - who is awesome, in case I'm giving the opposite impression - is something of an Xmas fascist. There's no random buying of such expensive toys for myself permitted around these parts!

I will have a look at Commencal though. Ta for the pointer.

 

[miPbiP]

bit more on ride profiles: I also find I take on gnarly climbs that I'd ride the long way around on my bio bike, or ride those I'd otherwise walk. so route making, and what the bike has to do, changes too.

 

[Zimmerframe]

The wife - who is awesome, in case I'm giving the opposite impression - is something of an Xmas fascist.

If she's even slightly contemplating you having a stupidly expensive bike for xmas, then you're a very lucky guy ! Just keep in mind that she probably won't be very happy if you buy her a water bottle for xmas which she can keep on your new bike.

 

[33red]

Going shorter is lighter. For what you enjoy 120 is plenty. I could go to 130 in 2 months when the maintenance is done. I have fun in expert trails it is about proper tires, proper PSI and proper technique. Ask people where you ride for proper tires.

 

[P580C]

Oh damn the Vitus looks great. Another one to add to the list to think about.

 

[Lee]

Anyhows, my query is, given climbing is so much easier, do you ever really feel overbiked on a longer-travel eMTB? Should I stick with the length of travel I’d opt for on a manual?

Hi David
I wouldn't let it having more travel than you require put you off; whereas having too much travel on a manual bike can be a burden, meaning you may turn to an alternative bike, that burden doesn't really materialise the same with an e-mtb, you'll just really enjoy the climbing (and riding) regardless. Even if there are a few inefficiencies in the spec the assistance overcomes it.
Lee

 

[Zimmerframe]

Even if there are a few inefficiencies in the spec the assistance overcomes it.

Worryingly sounds like he's trying to justify a threesome .. Zimmer Freud.

 

[kafkastan]

I ride my ebike faster, up and down, than my bio bike, so I appreciate the 20mm extra travel and bigger tyres. ... Also bear in mind ride profiles change because the big time reduction is on climbs, you'll do more vertical, so proportionally you'll spend more time of your rides descending.

Interesting you raise this. I do feel more confident descending on an ebike and go faster downhill as a result. I was barrelling down my local trails the other day on a borrowed Trek Powerfly 5 - an XC-oriented HT, with only a 100mm fork and nigh-on grip-free tyres - and I'm convinced I was going at least as fast down as on my 130mm full-sus Bossnut.

I can't figure out why I feel more conifdent. Current theories include: I'm less tired from climbs, knowing I have that extra 'push' for obstacles, or knowing I'll be doing twice as much DH as just settling into it more. Or a combination of all of the above.

It does suggest I might yet utilise the longer travel on an enduro EMTB though ...

 

[kafkastan]

I wouldn't let it having more travel than you require put you off; whereas having too much travel on a manual bike can be a burden, meaning you may turn to an alternative bike, that burden doesn't really materialise the same with an e-mtb

Cheers Lee -

I think I'm coming to that conclusion. I'll want to do pretty much anything with this bike, and I only got my first full-sus eighteen months ago, so perhaps I'll be a bit less of a wuss in another eighteen months and be regularly bottoming out 170mm. (Disclaimer: Unlikely!)

 

[Fivetones]

Posted in another thread but some good thoughts re the future.

I think with ebikes the motor allows you to run more capable travel with little penalty (within reason).

 

[Mikerb]

Bit of a fixation with suspension travel methinks! Overall geometry makes far more difference than a few mm of travel. It does seem that most brands are migrating to a fairly common geometry on their Emtbs ( at least their full sus E mtbs.) and there is little surprise in that given the continued research each brand does to find the ideal chain stay length, ideal head angle and seat angle etc. The game changes in terms of Geometry and overall capability as soon as a motor is involved. Even with a relatively slack head angle and shorter chainstays an Emtb will climb ( skill level dependant!) virtually anything, its weight makes it stable at speed whether pedalled or gravity driven, the motor assist makes it easier to maintain fast flow. I personally think 29 wheels and full sus are natural fits for an Emtb and I doubt you would notice any difference between 150 and 160 travel other things being equal.

 

[Rusty]

Both my Scott Genius eRide and my Levo Comp are 150mm front & rear but feel different due to overall geometry. The slightly slacker Scott feels marginally more stable on long, fast chutes and does seem to climb slightly better - probably due to longer chainstays (plus is 12sp with a 50 as low). The Levo feels more nimble which is partly due to its lighter weight but also the geometry. Not only more nimble in the tight switchbacks but also in the air.
Rode a 170mm bike a month or two ago and felt it was just too long & slack for me.

 

[JoeBlow]

I have a Trek Powerfly 4 FS which I bought about 5 months ago. If I was in the market now I would go for something with a little more travel and better brakes as most of my riding is done at trail centres. I'm not an out and out down-hiller but I do ride some very gnarly trails and I venture onto the down hill tracks now and again. The bike is fine but knowing what I know now?

Al

 

[33red]

I have a Trek Powerfly 4 FS which I bought about 5 months ago. If I was in the market now I would go for something with a little more travel and better brakes as most of my riding is done at trail centres. I'm not an out and out down-hiller but I do ride some very gnarly trails and I venture onto the down hill tracks now and again. The bike is fine but knowing what I know now?

Al

Often it is about personalizing. Maybe add 10 mm front? Maybe tokens? It obviously depends on our weight, where we ride, how we ride. I started with 120 front, at maintenance i will try 130 mm, just curious. Different brake pads?

 

[JoeBlow]

Often it is about personalizing. Maybe add 10 mm front? Maybe tokens? It obviously depends on our weight, where we ride, how we ride. I started with 120 front, at maintenance i will try 130 mm, just curious. Different brake pads?

Absolutely but on another thread on this forum I was trying to get a feel for when it would be more cost effective to buy another bike. I've fitted better tyres and a dropper post but when you start looking at new forks, wider wheels, better brakes and discs etc. etc. you start to approach the cost of a new bike.

Al

 

[33red]

Absolutely but on another thread on this forum I was trying to get a feel for when it would be more cost effective to buy another bike. I've fitted better tyres and a dropper post but when you start looking at new forks, wider wheels, better brakes and discs etc. etc. you start to approach the cost of a new bike.

Al

Obviously i was adressing my post at the OP. From my 120 MM it is real affordable to go to 130 mm. I did not liked the tires, i put an add and simply traded no expense. Throwing more money is not allways needed. For me part of the fun is learning my limits, the limits of my bike and slowly improving my skills. I know some use their 2 wheels for adrenaline and extreme sport/activity but we can ride everyday trying not to brake the bike nor the rider to ride tomorrow.

 

[Tonytank]

Hey -

Newbie here, having found the site while researching my first eMTB purchase and hoping for your collective sage wisdom on a particular query.

Now, were I buying another manual full-sus, I’d likely get a trail bike with 130-150mm travel. Realistically, given my questionable skills & limited bravery, I’d be overbiked on anything more and likely curse it on every climb.

However, the combination of cost and reviews has me tempted towards a Vitus e-Sommet VR, which at 170mm is much more enduro than I need – but looks like a lot of fun. (I realise they’re sold out for the year, but this will officially be an Xmas present from the wife, so I’ve both been dropping heavy hints to herself and quietly nursing my Wiggle discount ahead of the 2020 release.)

Anyhows, my query is, given climbing is so much easier, do you ever really feel overbiked on a longer-travel eMTB? Should I stick with the length of travel I’d opt for on a manual?

I’ve hired/ borrowed a few eMTBs, but none with more than 140mm travel as yet.

Ta muchly,

david

Hi mate
I bought the VR in may and couldn't be happier. I thought long and hard on choice between the VR and Levo. (I have a 2014 stump jumper evo)
My riding is probably more xcountry than anything else but with the VR its given me confidence to tackle much more difficult routes. I can't jump, cant bunnyhop, cant manual but I have some great fun on the bike.
The 170mm travel is not 'overbiked' whatever that is.
Some of the routes I have tackled on it in the brecon beacons are classed as black routes but the bike gave me the confidence to have a go.
Bang for buck you would not be disappointed.
Just follow the advice on the vitus section with regards to adjustments to prevent failure.

 

[Mikerb]

Just a point on the rating for various trails...……..I see very little consistency. Certainly if to negotiate a trail at all you have to be capable of jumping big gaps, or tackling near vertical descents etc it certainly warrants an expert only ( black diamond..whatever), and family friendly trails ( Green) are pretty consistent. But blue/red etc......well you have to ride them to see, and that also applies to trails rated as Black very often. How difficult a trail is often only depends on how hard or how fast you hit it.
I also do not understand why anyone only riding bike parks or downhill trails in trail centres would use a E-MTB...…..there is no real benefit to justify the additional cost and additional weight.
For me at least an E MTB wins the day if you do a mix of riding...…….natural trails, adventure rides etc. That essentially means ( for me) the best E MTB is a trail/all mountain bike.

 

[R120]

I actually think Whyte might have created the perfect EMTB for UK trail with the new E150 - I say that as an E-Sommett owner. The E-Sommett is definitely over suspended for most of my riding in the Surrey Hills, its an amazing bike, but at its best when going full tilt boogie down gnarly trails, when things get a bit more technical, its still great, but if find myself wanting something a little bit more fling able from time to time.

Far more important on an EMTB than total travel, is weight distribution - one of the reasons the E-Sommett gets such good reviews, is that the weight is distributed nice and low down, and the relatively long and low BB geometry on it (though a lot of the new 2020 bikes have similar geometry) also means the mass is further back towards the BB.

I like the way that on the Whyte they have angled the motor, allowing them to get the battery super low. I know 3 people who have ridden it, who love it, 2 of whom are coming off 2019 Levo's as their regular rides.

 

[HikerDave]

Hey -

Newbie here, having found the site while researching my first eMTB purchase and hoping for your collective sage wisdom on a particular query.

Now, were I buying another manual full-sus, I’d likely get a trail bike with 130-150mm travel. Realistically, given my questionable skills & limited bravery, I’d be overbiked on anything more and likely curse it on every climb.

However, the combination of cost and reviews has me tempted towards a Vitus e-Sommet VR, which at 170mm is much more enduro than I need – but looks like a lot of fun. (I realise they’re sold out for the year, but this will officially be an Xmas present from the wife, so I’ve both been dropping heavy hints to herself and quietly nursing my Wiggle discount ahead of the 2020 release.)

Anyhows, my query is, given climbing is so much easier, do you ever really feel overbiked on a longer-travel eMTB? Should I stick with the length of travel I’d opt for on a manual?

I’ve hired/ borrowed a few eMTBs, but none with more than 140mm travel as yet.

Ta muchly,

david

I really liked my 160 x 160 Fuji Auric, slackened head angle with 1.5 degree angleset; I never wanted less travel and usually used most of it on every ride, once I got the suspension tuned.

You may like the 160 rear by x 170 front of the bike’s suspension travel.

Your concern should be whether you’ll like the handling on a bike that has more steering trail than you’re used to. At first you’ll be wandering all over the trail, until your muscle memory adapts to the higher steering feel and greater tendency of the front wheel to self-center in the direction of travel. You might want to rent an Enduro bike to see how that feels on your local trails before you commit.