E-bike speed restrictions (agree or disagree )

[Jamsxr]

This is the “silly thing to say”.

You can ride as fast as your fitnesses allows.

Isn't this and eMTB forum? I thought the idea is that our bikes provide motor assistance to help us go further and faster?

I swim, cycle and run so fitness is not a problem. The U.K. limit is rubbish, my eMTB is much more fun now it’s been removed. It’s that simple.

 

[Expidia]

yet i have had my bike with a dongle since 2014 no one gives a shit pmsl

Says it all . . . Haibike
From watching Youtubes I'm seeing many of the people that buy these cheap Chinese online e-bikes drive them like a menace. Just watch a few vids on the Sur-Ron crowd. These are driven by what were the former drugged out skate boarders of years ago IMO.

 

[LeftItLancs]

15.5 MPH is too low.

I plod along, far from the fittest, more for the enjoyment of the ride than what speed I can reach, and even I find it too slow.

The problem is, the higher it is raised, the more people will abuse it. More accidents will happen and eventually more draconian state legislation will be introduced as a direct consequence. Road insurance, etc. The taxman loves tapping new revenue streams.

Clearly, belting along a cycle path or bridleway shared with pedestrians and dog walkers etc at 30 MPH, is inappropriate, and unfortunately some people just don't care.

In my area, tryhards often belt around blind corners/hills etc on shared cycle/pedestrian paths, well above 15.5 MPH, and without warning. I ride with my dog on an attachment, it startles the dog, and they are a pain in the arse. This isn't kids on cheap imports, but rather adults on expensive brand bikes and wearing all the gear.

Being competitive on a specific eMtb trail is all well and good, but the problem is they also think they are entitled to do it in other shared spaces as well.

 

[Hardtail]

Says it all . . . Haibike
From watching Youtubes I'm seeing many of the people that buy these cheap Chinese online e-bikes drive them like a menace. Just watch a few vids on the Sur-Ron crowd. These are driven by what were the former drugged out skate boarders of years ago IMO.

What sort of backhanded comment is that? Haibike is built and manufactured in Germany! Then Sur-Ron and drugged-out skateboarders. So much prejudice, racism and ignorance in that post...

 

[Overkillit]

US opinion here. So many good points are being made in this debate. Personally, I find the 19 mph limit to be too soon - the anchor dropping. I tend to ride my Levo to the trails as opposed to car transport and being able to comfortably do 25 or 30 on my way to the dirt is nice but only when I'm not near others. Passing by people at that speed would be wrong and trail riding is not the place for those speeds unless you are blasting down a gravity run - not using assist. I didn't get through all of the comments but did anyone compare the speed limits of highways to the speed limits of today's cars? 55-65 mph is typical on most US highways but most cars can and do 80 mph on all of those roads in my area. It's against the law and considered dangerous but it must be the preferred speed since most are doing that. The limiter on my car is 140 mph. Is it really needed? Maybe in Germany. So I'm against the ebike limiter and encourage the districting as long as it is used responsibly. We have rail trails around my area that I ride every once in a while. I've been passed while doing maybe 20mph by guys on non "e" road bikes that must be doing 30+. Those guys don't care at all and rarely move over for anyone so limiting just seems odd since road bikes can obviously be ridden at high speeds with ease. Like others have said, bottom line is that we all need to ride responsibly when others are around.

 

[Overkillit]

15.5 MPH is too low.

I plod along, far from the fittest, more for the enjoyment of the ride than what speed I can reach, and even I find it too slow.

The problem is, the higher it is raised, the more people will abuse it. More accidents will happen and eventually more draconian state legislation will be introduced as a direct consequence. Road insurance, etc. The taxman loves tapping new revenue streams.

Clearly, belting along a cycle path or bridleway shared with pedestrians and dog walkers etc at 30 MPH, is inappropriate, and unfortunately some people just don't care.

In my area, tryhards often belt around blind corners/hills etc on shared cycle/pedestrian paths, well above 15.5 MPH, and without warning. I ride with my dog on an attachment, it startles the dog, and they are a pain in the arse. This isn't kids on cheap imports, but rather adults on expensive brand bikes and wearing all the gear.

Being competitive on a specific eMtb trail is all well and good, but the problem is they also think they are entitled to do it in other shared spaces as well.

Agree - I've seen this on shared trails and it's scary for those on foot or climbing up the hills on blind turns. I don't get that kind of bombing.

 

[Jamsxr]

To be fair the current system works for me. I’ve been able to have my bikes de restricted and it hasn’t effected the warranty.

It doesn’t change my speed much compared to my normal bikes, I just don’t have to pedal through the limiter

The irony is that my eMTB has far better traction and stopping power compaired to my normal gravel bike, so when I’m pootling down my local canal I’m in a much better position to avoid an accident.

 

[KnollyBro]

I agree with some of what your saying but the assist cut threshold is there so we dont get classed as low powered mopeds (UK)
As a cyclist we have free access to everything at least in the UK they will not alter it to go higher theres to many aresholes and do-gooders that dont like it as it is ,
Next it will be a License ,insurance ,log book with registration plate and approved helmets at minimum will be required if it went higher
Potentially Mots and lights horns etc where does it end
Also you will only be allowed to cycle on the road No where else a cyclist can go including trail centres, bike parks , bike lanes etc
I could go on but we all no this and the 15.5mph isnt going to change if anything they will knock it back down at least here in the UK to where it was it doesnt matter how much we go on about
And dare i say its the idiot element that will stuff it up for everyone as per usual anyway .

I know we come from various countries and ride in different areas but I can't help but think that the term emtb means electric mountain bikes with the intention of being able to pedal up a mountain with some motor assist. At least, that is why I bought one. I have never noticed the limiter on my bikes as I don't really pedal going down hill and need any extra assist. I think riders who blast by anyone at full speed going up a hill/along the flats/past walkers and hikers will only continue to make us emtb'r look bad. Ride responsibly so we can all continue to ride where we like to ride.

 

[RustyMTB]

Yeah, cool story.

 

[Expidia]

What sort of backhanded comment is that? Haibike is built and manufactured in Germany! Then Sur-Ron and drugged-out skateboarders. So much prejudice, racism and ignorance in that post...

Thanks. I try

And BTW my apologies as I was confusing Haibike with Heybike. A check on Google shows there are over 182 ebike companies .
The average Joe who wants to get into ebike'ing sits done and watches Youtubes where their reviews are mostly on all these cheap Chinese knock offs. Spend $1,000 to say $3,000 and you get a bike that no local bike shop would touch to repair. Let alone try and order parts for one. So basically they are throwing out their $1,000 to $3,000.

What most people who watch these reviews don't realize is they are getting these cheap Chinese bikes for free. Most get to keep them. They keep getting them, throw up a review and then sell them.

Also, even if a reviewer disclaims upfront that they got the bike for free (some get two bikes one for them and one for their wife etc)
I've only heard a few admit that if they are an affliated Amazon reviewer (they usually have links to Amazon to get a comission if you buy from those links) some will admit they get a commisson, but their goal is also to make a long vid 30 min or so long to keep you watching the commercials because I'm told they get 60% of the revenue generated from Youtube from these ads and Youtube gets the other 40%.

So other then a few reputable reviewers you are not getting an unbaised review. You are getting glowing reviews of mostly cheap Chinese knock offs. This just shows you if these companies can give them free bikes (and some only have like 500 subscribers) that how cheap they are to build.

So far I've found it's forums and especially EMTB (thanks Rob) like this one where you can get better info on a bike brand or components because we are talking directly with and getting opinions from the actual bike owners themselves.

P.S. the kids who fly around the streets, neighborhoods and trails on these unlicensed SurRons etc in the Youtube vids look like crack head burn outs to me . . . YMMV. These electric motorcycles are only going to serve to toughen the Ebike/ETMB laws for the rest of us.

 

[Zed]

I think for single track trail riding a 25kph limit is plenty fast enough.

Disagree. On my local trails there's gap jumps that are comfortable at 30+. It shouldn't be harder for me to do those on an ebike. 32km/h is where I think it should be, it's perfectly achievable on a non-e ebike so should definitely be fine on a meaty-tired emtb with a lot of traction and stopping power. 32km/h is where my cut out will always be.

I'm not in the US though. So don't have all that whinging to deal with/care about/make allowances for.

If you want to go really fact just buy a motor bike and stay off the mountain bike trails. EMTBs are for enjoying the mountain biking you would normally do but just make the climbing less of a chore.

No thanks. Moto is totally different - used to do it. And EMTBs aren't for the mountain biking I'd normally do. They are for the mountain biking I'd do if I was 20 again, 68kg and really fit. That's what they're for. And I'd definitely be over 25km/h.

 

[Zed]

If you are riding dedicated mountain bike trails then you would rarely hit the speed cut except on descents, and then you have gravity to assist you. I only ever hit the 25kph limit on flat going on flat fire roads and you wouldn't be going that much faster on a normal bike anyway.

Nah, on my local trails I hit a 25kph limit often on sections that are relatively flat and need pedal speed to attack jumps.

 

[Zed]

i regularly go 60-80km/hr on my ebike on city bike paths, and i hate the fact that most ebikes are restricted.

however, that being said,

i use Downhill 220mm/200mm quad piston brakes, and i can stop on a dime. i always have my brake levers covered. i will slow down to 30-40km/hr when passing people and i will give them plenty of space, sometimes even riding on the grass to give them 2m+ of distance from me. same thing with crossing streets, ill slow down to 20km/hr and look both ways 3 to 4 times. and if there are kids involved ill go even slower, just to be sure.

the only 2 exceptions to this i have is passing pregnant and/or old person, ill slow right down to 10km/hr. or when passing those road biking fa#$@@$#ts with the skin tight racing suits, i blow past those c$%ks at 90km/hr sometimes, cuz they have no friends and no souls.

Well, yeah, this is a clear example of why we have enforced limits - and I agree with enforcing some sort of limit as this behaviour is both ridiculous and ignorant/idiotic.

But 25km/h is too low. 32km/h please.

 

[Zed]

Sorry its your fitness holding you back not the assistance level there is no speed restrictions just human input restrictions .

This isn't Pinkbike. We're people who bought an ebike with assist because we don't want to do training programs full time so we can ride trails fast. We spent our $ to avoid that crap. And we're riding eMtbs - many with lots of drag when over the assist limit, on top of the extra 10kg of weight to push, on a squishy long travel back end with zero pedalling platform. It isn't fun above the limiter, if it is for you then wow you're amazing, go you. Not sure why you'd be on an ebike though.

Sigh...

 

[Landy Andy]

This isn't Pinkbike. We're people who bought an ebike with assist because we don't want to do training programs full time so we can ride trails fast. We spent our $ to avoid that crap. And we're riding eMtbs - many with lots of drag when over the assist limit, on top of the extra 10kg of weight to push, on a squishy long travel back end with zero pedalling platform. It isn't fun above the limiter, if it is for you then wow you're amazing, go you. Not sure why you'd be on an ebike though.

Sigh...

Not sure why you are on an eBike. Reads like your $ should have got you a motorbike if you don’t want to put any effort in.

 

[KnollyBro]

Nah, on my local trails I hit a 25kph limit often on sections that are relatively flat and need pedal speed to attack jumps.

I must be missing something here as when I am descending, at trail speed on trails like ALine at Whistler, I am sure I am going over 25kph when I hit some of the longer jumps. I guess I just don't notice the speed limit cutting off the assist on my Kenevo SL/Levo SL as I am used to pedaling to hit the largest jumps when I mess up a pre berm or jump. Are you not able to make the jumps with trail speed without pedaling?

 

[KnollyBro]

This isn't Pinkbike. We're people who bought an ebike with assist because we don't want to do training programs full time so we can ride trails fast. We spent our $ to avoid that crap. And we're riding eMtbs - many with lots of drag when over the assist limit, on top of the extra 10kg of weight to push, on a squishy long travel back end with zero pedalling platform. It isn't fun above the limiter, if it is for you then wow you're amazing, go you. Not sure why you'd be on an ebike though.

Sigh...

I bought an emtb to ride up a climbing trail or FSR so that I wasn't so tired when I got to the top but I appreciate the exercise (I am 60 and in not bad shape). I like to enjoy the DH part of riding as much as the next person but sometimes you have to "earn it" , to enjoy it (I still prefer to shuttle or take a chair lift ). I chose an emtb that performs well on the way down. I prefer technical trails over flow trails and I don't need any addition power riding DH.

 

[Zed]

....on trails like ALine at Whistler, I am sure I am going over 25kph
....you not able to make the jumps with trail speed without pedaling?

No that's the point we're talking about jumps not in a big descent and straight after rocky/rooty corners. Some pedalling is required. I've been riding these trails and jumps since long before ebikes.

It's certainly not even vaguely like A line at Whistler lol

But I'm only talking about one instance. We have a lot of trails here that are basically technical XC on undulating trail and there is a real noticeable difference in fun factor between 25 and 32km/h limit. I've ridden plenty with both. To me, it's the fun factor that matters.

If you're on serious trails in Canada your experience is going to be markedly different. Our trails are literally and figuratively worlds apart. We have windy rocky rooty tracks through undulating forest, most of which were created in the days of 26" hard tails. I wouldn't tell you what speed restriction you should run over there. How would I know?

 

[Zed]

I bought an emtb to ride up a climbing trail or FSR so that I wasn't so tired when I got to the top but I appreciate the exercise (I am 60 and in not bad shape). I like to enjoy the DH part of riding as much as the next person but sometimes you have to "earn it" , to enjoy it (I still prefer to shuttle or take a chair lift ). I chose an emtb that performs well on the way down. I prefer technical trails over flow trails and I don't need any addition power riding DH.

That's all great. My reply wasn't even to you, I dunno maybe you missed that.

My heart rate averages around 160 out of 185 over a 2 hour ride. I don't mind earning it either. The effort a person puts in has nothing to with speed cut off or even assistance level, of course.

 

[Zed]

Not sure why you are on an eBike. Reads like your $ should have got you a motorbike if you don’t want to put any effort in.

Honestly, this doesn't make sense you're just arcing up because you're offended. You really could put some more effort in before you hit send.

But let's play:

• I wasn't saying I don't want to put ANY effort in. I was saying I don't want to pedal a heavy full fat ebike over the limiter (and implying pedalling it enough to get from 25 to 32km/h on flat/mild incline). These are clearly completely different statements.
• As per post I replied to above, my average heart rate ~160 through a 2 hour ride, 185 max. I put effort in.
• I can't ride a motorbike around my local woods in the morning before work.
• I can't ride a motorbike around the various MTB trail centres I like to frequent.
• Even if I could ride a motorbike around those trails, I think it'd suck, far too heavy, trails too tight and twisty, wouldn't really work.
• I like the mountain bike feel more than the moto. And yes, I'm proposing an ebike feels a lot more like a regular mountain bike than like a motorbike.
• Motorbikes around here go to MX tracks, or a few hours out into the bush. Massive inconvenience.
• Moto has much higher price to pay with accidents. I'm not up for it these days.
• A motorbike is really hard to lift onto the rack by myself.
• Btw have you done any Enduro moto riding? It's a really serious work out, very far from zero effort.

Be a pal and post up some Stravas with your average heart rate over a few hours far exceeding my ~89% MHR, if you want to say I don't put in the effort in. I'll offer you a sincere "well done mate, you're somewhat better at putting in pedalling effort than me..." and I'm just fine with that being the case.

 

[Hardtail]

I bet if we had the 32km/h cut-off here in Europe & UK there would be a lot less derestricted bikes, a lot less…
Some people kicking off in this debate live in the states and don’t know what it is like to have the much lower cut-off.
Although given the population density difference, particularly in cities, between Europe and the States I can understand why.

 

[mcboab]

A UK specific post.
I ride a short road section to get to/from my local trails and occasionally ride my bike from the Car garage (22 miles) When the Car is in for service on cycle network. My experience of that road network is 1 think we should be granted the up lift to 20mph assist to help avoid being road kill as the number of times I get buzzed in 20mph (& higher( speed section as cars try to race past to the next width restriction is feking ridiculously. One did a close flyby as a Plod car was going the other way, those fekkers deliberately looked away to be able to "claim" they hadn't seen it, bet they heard me cursing after them as they drove away , If my cheapo vid camera hadn't a flat battery I'd have dropped that snippet off at the head of shed commissioners orifice .
If people really want to raise the UK pedalling assist limit they need to write to their local MPs and insist its on safety grounds to keep up with road traffic flows & not because its not fun having to pedal harder, else it wont be picked up as it will probably appear as a negative to public safety, & if it wont attract enough support for one of those petition parliament activities it likely wont get sniffed at, I'm not sure there's the requisite 100K+ signatures for that on this forum?! or across E-MTB use in the UK, & given that we aren't in the EU anymore so a change in EU regs wont necessarily be picked up in Blighty nor be seen as a positive by current UK government (referencing license plates/insurance hairbrained proposals for pushbikes- which probably appeals to the outrage of blue rinse party members)

 

[irie]

On highways, for example, people are generally responsible about the speeds they drive. However, frequently speed limits are in place to try to deter an irresponsible minority from acting in a potentially dangerous manner.

This thread has convinced me that eMTB motor cut off limits should remain low if only for this reason.

 

[Landy Andy]

Be a pal and post up some Stravas with your average heart rate over a few hours far exceeding my ~89% MHR, if you want to say I don't put in the effort in. I'll offer you a sincere "well done mate, you're somewhat better at putting in pedalling effort than me..." and I'm just fine with that being the case.

Sorry can’t post any Stravas, as I don’t record any of my rides, as I’m not in a fictional completion with people I’ve never met, or myself. I just go out ride around in the countryside, enjoy the exercise and being out on the bike. I’m not offended I just can’t see the point of needing more power, more speed. Eventually they will be EMotorbikes if they just keep making more and more and more.

 

[Zed]

...I don’t record any of my rides, as I’m not in a fictional completion with people I’ve never met, or myself...

Wouldn't really be a fictional competition. It'd be an actual competition.

I just go out ride around in the countryside

Well some of us like to ride purpose built singletrack as fast as we can, in competition with ourselves and friends, and being able to power to 32km/h instead of 25km/h is preferable to me for this purpose.

You should give it a whirl. It's much more intense exercise than just riding around in the countryside.

Eventually they will be EMotorbikes if they just keep making more and more and more.

The standard has been ~90nm for a while now. And I certainly don't desire more. I was talking only about the limiter, and wanting it in line with other countries like NZ which is just next door.

 

[Zed]

On highways, for example, people are generally responsible about the speeds they drive. However, frequently speed limits are in place to try to deter an irresponsible minority from acting in a potentially dangerous manner.

This thread has convinced me that eMTB motor cut off limits should remain low if only for this reason.

Fact remains if it was 32km/h, I wouldn't derestrict. I really think a lot of people will derestrict to much higher than 32 because they're having to bother desrestricting. The people who are abusing it, aren't stopped by the limiter.

If the manufacturer left the door open so I could switch to NZ or US mode and get 32, that would suit me. My bike with the original E8000 let me do that with my phone. Good enough.

But of course, there's absolutely no chance they'll lift the speed limit here in AUS, the nanny state. We can't even legally ride to the corner shop without a helmet.

 

[stiv674]

Wouldn't really be a fictional competition. It'd be an actual competition.

Well some of us like to ride purpose built singletrack as fast as we can, in competition with ourselves and friends, and being able to power to 32km/h instead of 25km/h is preferable to me for this purpose.

You should give it a whirl. It's much more intense exercise than just riding around in the countryside.

The standard has been ~90nm for a while now. And I certainly don't desire more. I was talking only about the limiter, and wanting it in line with other countries like NZ which is just next door.

BIB... What did you do before you got your e-mtb? You knew the assist limit was 25kph before you bought it I presume...

 

[michael.kozera]

Well, yeah, this is a clear example of why we have enforced limits - and I agree with enforcing some sort of limit as this behaviour is both ridiculous and ignorant/idiotic.

But 25km/h is too low. 32km/h please.

did u not read the whole post? or are u trying to start s#$#@ on purpose? or are u one of those skin tight wearing road bikers haha? because if u are one of those road bikers, you guys are literally the reason ppl hate bikers.

please be aware I live in Canada alberta where almost no one uses the bike paths. unlike Europe which have very busy paths. here in Calgary. city of 1.3million. I can ride home from down town , mid day and sometimes not even see a single person on the path for the entire 30km's

 

[thewrx]

Its the wrong solution to the problem. The limiter should be the output of the drive unit, period. I love ebikes and we need to get these dumb laws changed, by letting our government reps know that there are better ways to address these concerns; and change these wacked out laws.

I feel sorry for those of you that have the 15mph limit across the atlantic, in the US 20mph is still too slow; but my commuter (mid-power) vado that tops out at 28mph would probably be acceptable to me 90% of the time.

On one of my unrestricted emtb's I top out at just above 30mph, think fastest recorded on flat road was 35mph/56kph. Thats still slower than an analog road bike can top out at any day, and barely faster than I can do on my analog mtb; also that is short sprint its not a constant pace.

Interesting note: I saw for the first time a speed trap on the local paved bike trail, with an ebike cop using a radar gun; which I think is honestly a better way to address the concerns that every ebike is just like a hayabusa with pedals.

 

[irie]

Fact remains if it was 32km/h, I wouldn't derestrict. I really think a lot of people will derestrict to much higher than 32 because they're having to bother desrestricting. The people who are abusing it, aren't stopped by the limiter.

If the manufacturer left the door open so I could switch to NZ or US mode and get 32, that would suit me. My bike with the original E8000 let me do that with my phone. Good enough.

But of course, there's absolutely no chance they'll lift the speed limit here in AUS, the nanny state. We can't even legally ride to the corner shop without a helmet.

If 32kph (20mph) rather than 25kph (15.6mph), less than 5mph difference, I'm surprised that's a deal breaker