how did you kill it in 29km
Levo Gen 2 Does the stock Rockshox Deluxe just completely suck?
- Thread starter 1rider
- Start date
how did you kill it in 29km
I did nothing special, really))
I didn’t even jumped on it, some small drops.
But I’m 116 kg with gear and I assume that my shock is from the first batch as it has “250 psi maximum” sticker and now they can take up to 300 psi max. I’ll bring it to the official service next week, hope that it’s just a bad unit from the beginning, cause it was AWESOME! Much better that Fox X2 I’ve tried on a Levo, so I want it to be brought from the dead ??
He fitted it to a Levohow did you kill it in 29km
kbass24emtp
Member
I had a Deluxe select on my Cannondale Moterra Neo similar linkage to your bike and I tried different air pressure spacer and even a MegNeg can and finally ended up with a Ohlins TTX22M coil shock. It’s well worth the cost.
No offense ?
Year, I was aware of the huge side load and that why I went with TTX Air as it is as meaty as Deluxe, but the problem lies within damper itself. I’ll order spherical ball bearing in the top eyelet when it will be repaired or replaced.
does that cascade components link address this or is it unavoidable?
No idea Dobbie
thought I better research my own question, seems not, it changes the leverage ratio and adds a small amount of travel
Spherical bearing in the eyelet address this issue for both air and coil shocks. Ohlins does offer them as a spare part (compatible with almost all modern shocks). Torsional flex doesn't affect air shocks due to large OD of shaft, but can break coil shock shaft due to small shaft OD (there are some threads mentioning Fox coil shock shaft been cracked).
Some people can define the moment when shock freezes for a second between compression to rebound motion during huge side compressions, but most of us mortal can't feel it, especially in the air shock movement due to trying to survive at that particular moment =))
I have seen the numerous snapped (aftermarket) shock shafts and this irritates me greatly. I really struggle to see how someone as switched on and experienced as Spesh can design a linkage which adds such excessive side loads. At best its gonna cause unnecessary stiction. At worst...well we know what happens.
It upsets me cos I love Spesh to bits but my engineering head says 'what were they thinking?' I still feel like I need to give the benefit of doubt - maybe an excessive side load is an unfortunate by-product to get an amazing suspension system?
it's far from "amazing"
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Specialized makes a lot of at least strange engineering "decisions" =))
But the suspension works great, I appreciate how it works even with basic Deluxe. That's why I prefer to stay away from the coil shocks due to their small shaft OD, especially for a heavy guy like me.
I hope my TTX Air will get repaired and it'll continue to perform as it did on the first ride before it broke. If it'll break again, I'll have two options: force my dealer to swap it to TTX Coil or make a refund and I'll try something like Intend BC Hover. Other options doesn't encourage me at all, maybe Fox X2, but I've seen some troubles with them too.
Some interesting fact regarding TTX Air.
I have Lyrik Ultimate RC2.1 and DSD Runt installed. Recent trip to the mountains with stoke Deluxe just revealed how brilliant my Lyrik performed. But after trying TTX Air it became clear how crappy my fork performs, so now I'm thinking of trading Lyrik for something like EXT Era, Intend BC Ebonit or similar.
That's how rear shock should perform.
I have Lyrik Ultimate RC2.1 and DSD Runt installed. Recent trip to the mountains with stoke Deluxe just revealed how brilliant my Lyrik performed. But after trying TTX Air it became clear how crappy my fork performs, so now I'm thinking of trading Lyrik for something like EXT Era, Intend BC Ebonit or similar.
That's how rear shock should perform.
Indeed. Which is why I have to question those who (omitting racetrack time savings) decide to leave it in situ. How much effort does it take to remove 2 bolts and do it properly.
- Thread starter
- #47
I removed the two red bottomless tokens And set the PSI for 30% sag. I am riding my normal bike tomorrow, so I won’t be able to test out the Levo on a real ride until Monday. I am really hoping this improves the performance because I don’t want to buy a shock right now even if I could find one to buy. Keeping my fingers crossed this makes a positive difference.
- Thread starter
- #48
After getting some rides with the red tokens removed I can confirm that the ride is marginally better. The bike is slightly less harsh through the small bump chattery stuff. Given how well suspension design and shocks are capable of performing nowadays, the poor performance is a real disappointment.
To close out this thread and answer my own question about the Rockshox Deluxe sucking, it does. At least it sucks with the Specialized FSR suspension on the Levo, maybe it performs well on other frames. Maybe this bike is geared for groomed flow trails and fire road climbs, I cannot say. If it is the geometry and travel numbers are contradictory to that end.
The bike is still fun because when the motor works, hell its a bike with a motor!! However, if this were my daily go to normal pedal bike I would be having a fire sale to get out of it and get a bike that can perform. Yea, I could throw another $600-800+ at it and buy an aftermarket and get much better performance. I don’t think I will, instead I will start looking into other brand alternatives.
To close out this thread and answer my own question about the Rockshox Deluxe sucking, it does. At least it sucks with the Specialized FSR suspension on the Levo, maybe it performs well on other frames. Maybe this bike is geared for groomed flow trails and fire road climbs, I cannot say. If it is the geometry and travel numbers are contradictory to that end.
The bike is still fun because when the motor works, hell its a bike with a motor!! However, if this were my daily go to normal pedal bike I would be having a fire sale to get out of it and get a bike that can perform. Yea, I could throw another $600-800+ at it and buy an aftermarket and get much better performance. I don’t think I will, instead I will start looking into other brand alternatives.
It's not that it adds side loads, that's a fallacy which people presume because of the asymmetric frame design.
Because of the FSR suspension design, the shock is effectively lengthened by the "shock extender" - the linkage bar which attaches to the bottom of the shock.
Manufacturers generally make shocks as light (only as strong as necessary) as possible as that's what the market demands.
When the shock is compressed - it resists, the force has to go somewhere and when the shock isn't designed for having an extra 11cm's of leverage bar working against it's bottom mount, it bends/snaps at the bottom where the shock extender joins the tiny puny skinny shock shaft.
Most manufacturers will state if the shock is or isn't suitable for use with a Levo/Shock Extender.
If a bike is applying enough perpendicular force to a shock shaft that it snaps clean off, thats a side load however it's termed.
You could have a shock 3 feet long, if there was no side load the force would simply travel up the shock for the can/spring to do it's job. There shouldn't be any excessive leverage (side load) anywhere.
I accept that the thick shafts of air cans can deal with it better, I am just surprised at the amount of side load there is present in the Levo setup, whether it's caused by the yoke, the (non) offset symmetry or whatever else is contributing to it.
Sorry, my bad. I thought you meant side as in horizontal , rather than side - well, any lateral force
Still, it's only the same design as canyon's, orbea rise's, commencal and many others. It's quite common to extend the shock with a "shock extender". You're trying to build the optimum suspension setup, if you tie yourself to linking just to the shock length, you're limited to specific suspension layouts.
If you try to compress anything the forces will also try to go sideways, making it longer adds more leverage to it. If the shocks not designed for that kind of installation, it will fail. It's not a fault of the design, it's a fault of using the wrong shock with the design.
Stand on a coke can straight, it won't collapse. Lean to the side slightly, it will .. Same thing. Your leg is the shock extender.
I do get what you are saying. But my bad too, I assumed that the yoke would have a bush or bearing in the end where it connects to the shock. It appears it does, but only in the horizontal plane. So yes, I understand what you are saying now. The vertical plane is effectively extended by the yoke and the joint doesn't give anywhere. Still surprised that theres enough force to snap the shafts though, just from a little extra length. Clearly thicker shafts are needed for this application
steve_sordy
Wedding Crasher
The tendency of a column to bend sideways under load is well known to structural engineers. If the column is fixed at one end, it can withstand higher loads before deflecting. If it is fixed at both ends it can withstand even more. The stiffness of the column matters of course. But for a fixed stiffness the longer it is the more likely it is to deflect. I used to do calculations on this stuff, but that was almost 50 years ago and I can no longer remember the formulae with enough certainty to quote them here. But trust me on this, there are precise formulae that predict exactly what will happen.
A shock is constrained at each end (not fixed). Then if you add a yoke it is not only longer but even less constrained (the connection to the yolk is a weakness). This should have been taken into account by the designer, but any wear in the joints will reduce the amount of constraint and lead to an earlier failure.
A shock is constrained at each end (not fixed). Then if you add a yoke it is not only longer but even less constrained (the connection to the yolk is a weakness). This should have been taken into account by the designer, but any wear in the joints will reduce the amount of constraint and lead to an earlier failure.
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