Levo Gen 2 Brose 1.3 Motor Failure not covered by warranty

[Tmack1960]

Hi

I have a 2018 Turbo Levo FSR Comp that I bought secondhand in June 2019. The original owner purchased this through a Levo dealership and I have the sales receipt which shows he bought my bike and one for his wife on the 25/1/2018. I was riding the bike home two days ago and the motor stopped assisting and started making funny noises. I got it home and took it to my LSB who are also Specialized dealers. Unfortunately they have told me that the motor is not covered by warranty and it will be a $NZ2.5k cost to replace it. I am very disappointed that a 3 year old motor can fail and that there is no option to repair this - only to replace it. It is like having a three year old car and the manufacturer saying there is a fault with the motor and you have to replace the whole thing - it just doesn't happen - the faulty part is replaced but it seems there is no option with an e-bike motor. In fact, the dealer told me they can't even open the motor to look inside! The bike has done about 4,300kms and I have always had it serviced at my LBS.

I have seen comments on forums about the fact that e-bikes are an evolving technology and that there is an inherent risk in buying one but that doesn't wash with me. We have a Consumer's Guarantee Act here in NZ that says a customer should have a reasonable expectation of the life of something they buy and I would have said three years is not reasonable. I am unsure what to do about this as I really don't want to have to pay $2.5k for a new motor. Any advice from would be gratefully received. Has anyone had an acceptable outcome to such an issue or is this common across e-bikes?

 

[escrs]

Unfortunately the motor warranty is only 2 years, so there isnt much you can do, some car warranties are only 3 years like AUDI, BMW. etc...

Specialized are not allowed to open up the motors, all they can do is remove them and return to Brose and fit a replacement one

In the UK we have companies that can refurb damaged motors for £250 is there anyone in New Zealand repairing them?

The Brose motor is used in other bikes but without the Specialized Tune on them, see if you can source one of them cheaper?

 

[Tmack1960]

Thanks for the response - I have an email in with Performance Line Bearings to see what they recommend. Totally understand warranty & more than prepared to pay for a repair but replacement? Audi doesn’t replace the motor when something goes wrong they have service agents who fix the problem. I don’t understand why this doesn’t happen for e-bikes.

 

[escrs]

Thanks for the response - I have an email in with Performance Line Bearings to see what they recommend. Totally understand warranty & more than prepared to pay for a repair but replacement? Audi doesn’t replace the motor when something goes wrong they have service agents who fix the problem. I don’t understand why this doesn’t happen for e-bikes.

Audi are notorious for trying to get out of fixing problems!

The 2006-2012 2.0 petrol A4's had a known oil consumption issue (out of spec piston rings fitted) Audi didnt consider it an issue unless you were burning through a 0.5 litres of oil in 600 miles and if you were getting more than 600 miles to 0.5 litrs then they didnt want to know

The people who were getting less than 600 mile to 0.5 litres had to fight to get Audi to stump up for repairs in the UK

Have you tried the Specialized replacement assistance program? you basically get a discount on a new motor depending on how old the bike is, under 3 years you get a 35% discount, 3-4 years is a 25% discount

More info here

Global Warranty | Specialized.com

www.specialized.com

 

[Tmack1960]

Thanks - I know about this but it still means forking out $2k after the discount! Will see what Performance Line Bearings have to say. Frustrating to have to pay for what could be a repairable issue ?.

 

[escrs]

So $2k is roughly £1054

A friend recenly had his 1.3 motor replaced out of warranty and it cost him £800 via Berkshire cycles

Wonder if it would be worth speaking to Chris@Berkshire Cycles and see how much including shipping it would be to have a new motor sent to you and fit it yourself (pretty easy to do i used to remove my 17 Levo and 18 Kenevo motors to clean them)

 

[Tmack1960]

That was the quoted price - will see what my dealer comes back with. Might be worth sourcing a motor myself - do the UK versions come with only the 25km limit? We can do 32km here. Interesting you think 4300kms is a lot - the motors are supposed to do many more kms than that I thought?

 

[Zimmerframe]

Audi doesn’t replace the motor when something goes wrong they have service agents who fix the problem. I don’t understand why this doesn’t happen for e-bikes.

You say that, but a can engine is constructed from many thousands of components. Invariably, if one of those fails, the individual component isn't swapped out. A bike motor is a motor with various bits around it and if you start with something like the Brose, the base of which started as a power steering motor, it ends up like many sealed components which are swapped out.

I just had a bearing pulley go, but I had to change the bearing, pulley, automatic tensioner assembly. If your starter motor goes, they don't take it apart and change the bushes. Most parts on a car engine which you would imagine could be repaired are just swapped out for new parts - at €1000's of euro's a go. A mate just had to change to computer on his Merc, probably just needed one component changing to fix it, but it's a swap out and I won't say how much because literally no one would believe it.

There's a good chance you qualify for Specialized assisted Purchase, so whilst you're outside of warranty, they subsidise many parts on a sliding scale over 5 years :

What is the Assisted Replacement Program?

support.specialized.com

.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Interesting you think 4300kms is a lot - the motors are supposed to do many more kms than that I thought?

They all vary, much depends on the conditions the motor is used in, how it's ridden, how it's cleaned, how it's dried, has it had pedal strikes - think of a spinning mass suddenly potentially being jarred to a stop. Has it spent most of it's life with someone pedalling with a really slow cadence, so the motor's trying as hard as it can all the time, but the riders pedal rate is so low it never gets to spin up properly and it just gets HOT ! Has it had firmware upgrades through it's life - these are constantly making the motors smoother, more resilient, more reliable. Some people seem to destroy them in a few hundred km's , others get 20,000 km's and more.

 

[humber44]

Hi...I have a similar problem with my ebike..its a Haibike fullseven with the Yamaha pwx motor..I purchased it in 2018 and it's just stopped working with a motor fault..the bearings are still good but it's an electrical fault..I contacted Yamaha and Haibike but got nowhere with it..no spares are available..that's ridiculous!.. it needs to be changed..I have sent mine to Performance line bearings for them to see if they can do anything..but looks like it's a new motor...its not been in any water or pressure washed..so I'd say there not fit for purpose really..this makes me think twice about spending £4000 again..its bad press for these companies..Chinese companies have loads of spares for there cheap so its possible..we need a mass complaint system to pressure these companies..

 

[humber44]

Yes...I've tried that..contacted retailer...manufacturers..importer...they pass the book to each other...retailer was told too far out of warranty! So he told me to try Haibike direct as they often treat customers better which I did..they told go though retailer..lol..you get nowhere..I even tried Yamaha they offered no help....better with cheap Chinese gear as the so called Top notch gear is no better just about four times the cost..

 

[humber44]

Threaten the retailer with small claims court. thats your only option.

 

[humber44]

The shop I purchased it off has tried 3 times but because its 8 months out of warranty got nowhere...I think it should be Yamaha that cough up as they make and test these motors ..I don't think small claims would solve anything if it's out of it crappy 2 year warranty lol

 

[humber44]

I sent my motor to Performance line bearings..excellent guys..had a detailed report and photos..brought a new motor from them..you can see water line in the motor which had corroded the Pcb...maybe they need a drain plug to check for water periodically lol...I think it will be a dry weather bike now...trusty old cross bike out in the rain!

 

[Tmack1960]

I sent my motor to Performance line bearings..excellent guys..had a detailed report and photos..brought a new motor from them..you can see water line in the motor which had corroded the Pcb...maybe they need a drain plug to check for water periodically lol...I think it will be a dry weather bike now...trusty old cross bike out in the rain!

Have emailed them also & debating what I will do once I get the options from Specialized. Thinking it is still more cost effective to get them to repair or replace rather than a new motor even sending from NZ.

 

[Ddc6284]

I have a 2019 with around 4300 miles. I'm on my third motor. Made my day when I found out that, Specialized was extending the warranty to 4yrs... Can't put a price on peace of mind!

 

[GDAS]

for a new motor at a more competitive price, you could try contacting this seller on ebay 4mybike_de on eBay
I read on one of the Facebook groups that they are very helpful.
Alternatively, if NZ doesn't yet have anyone servicing/repairing ebike motors, maybe you could identify someone who would be interested in starting up. As I understand it, the majority of Performance Line Bearings' business is in shipping parts overseas, to people who either repair their own motors, or who are doing it as a business for customers.

 

[kenevonaive]

Hi

I have a 2018 Turbo Levo FSR Comp that I bought secondhand in June 2019. The original owner purchased this through a Levo dealership and I have the sales receipt which shows he bought my bike and one for his wife on the 25/1/2018. I was riding the bike home two days ago and the motor stopped assisting and started making funny noises. I got it home and took it to my LSB who are also Specialized dealers. Unfortunately they have told me that the motor is not covered by warranty and it will be a $NZ2.5k cost to replace it. I am very disappointed that a 3 year old motor can fail and that there is no option to repair this - only to replace it. It is like having a three year old car and the manufacturer saying there is a fault with the motor and you have to replace the whole thing - it just doesn't happen - the faulty part is replaced but it seems there is no option with an e-bike motor. In fact, the dealer told me they can't even open the motor to look inside! The bike has done about 4,300kms and I have always had it serviced at my LBS.

I have seen comments on forums about the fact that e-bikes are an evolving technology and that there is an inherent risk in buying one but that doesn't wash with me. We have a Consumer's Guarantee Act here in NZ that says a customer should have a reasonable expectation of the life of something they buy and I would have said three years is not reasonable. I am unsure what to do about this as I really don't want to have to pay $2.5k for a new motor. Any advice from would be gratefully received. Has anyone had an acceptable outcome to such an issue or is this common across e-bikes?

I would open motor, could just be a belt failure you can purchase the belt for a $100.00 from Germany.https://youtu.be/DkK7mkNRfdI {} Hope this works out!

 

[rafaellop]

Yes, the replacement kit is the way to go and it's available between $100-$200 and the replacements is quite easy I think. Here's a photo of the kit. Guys who offer this can also replace the parts if you send them the engine.

 

[Loamranger]

Thanks guys some useful information here. I have a friend who had his motor replaced under warranty but still had problems. Eventually they found that it was nothing more than a worn cable. So it would be worth checking all the cabling and connections first before replacing the motor, which may be ok. His is a Brose motor.

 

[Matthew SA]

Hi

I have a 2018 Turbo Levo FSR Comp that I bought secondhand in June 2019. The original owner purchased this through a Levo dealership and I have the sales receipt which shows he bought my bike and one for his wife on the 25/1/2018. I was riding the bike home two days ago and the motor stopped assisting and started making funny noises. I got it home and took it to my LSB who are also Specialized dealers. Unfortunately they have told me that the motor is not covered by warranty and it will be a $NZ2.5k cost to replace it. I am very disappointed that a 3 year old motor can fail and that there is no option to repair this - only to replace it. It is like having a three year old car and the manufacturer saying there is a fault with the motor and you have to replace the whole thing - it just doesn't happen - the faulty part is replaced but it seems there is no option with an e-bike motor. In fact, the dealer told me they can't even open the motor to look inside! The bike has done about 4,300kms and I have always had it serviced at my LBS.

I have seen comments on forums about the fact that e-bikes are an evolving technology and that there is an inherent risk in buying one but that doesn't wash with me. We have a Consumer's Guarantee Act here in NZ that says a customer should have a reasonable expectation of the life of something they buy and I would have said three years is not reasonable. I am unsure what to do about this as I really don't want to have to pay $2.5k for a new motor. Any advice from would be gratefully received. Has anyone had an acceptable outcome to such an issue or is this common across e-bikes?

Snap. My wife's Levo went in 4 times from October to January because the power delivery was erratic. Each time it was returned as fixed. Then suddenly the clutch slipped within 10km of riding. Well, l was then told that the motor needed replacing. A 20% discount was offered with no labor charges but l heard a week later that Brose supply a repair kit for 25% of the cost. Of course the Specialized dealer and South African Specialized agent did not seem to know of this option. We immediately had other problems so lam not a Specialized fan.

 

[Gyro]

Hi

I have a 2018 Turbo Levo FSR Comp that I bought secondhand in June 2019. The original owner purchased this through a Levo dealership and I have the sales receipt which shows he bought my bike and one for his wife on the 25/1/2018. I was riding the bike home two days ago and the motor stopped assisting and started making funny noises. I got it home and took it to my LSB who are also Specialized dealers. Unfortunately they have told me that the motor is not covered by warranty and it will be a $NZ2.5k cost to replace it. I am very disappointed that a 3 year old motor can fail and that there is no option to repair this - only to replace it. It is like having a three year old car and the manufacturer saying there is a fault with the motor and you have to replace the whole thing - it just doesn't happen - the faulty part is replaced but it seems there is no option with an e-bike motor. In fact, the dealer told me they can't even open the motor to look inside! The bike has done about 4,300kms and I have always had it serviced at my LBS.

I have seen comments on forums about the fact that e-bikes are an evolving technology and that there is an inherent risk in buying one but that doesn't wash with me. We have a Consumer's Guarantee Act here in NZ that says a customer should have a reasonable expectation of the life of something they buy and I would have said three years is not reasonable. I am unsure what to do about this as I really don't want to have to pay $2.5k for a new motor. Any advice from would be gratefully received. Has anyone had an acceptable outcome to such an issue or is this common across e-bikes?

I've just collected my bike now on it's 4th motor they should be replaced "no questions asked", the warranty has been extended from 2 to 4yrs due to motor issues.

 

[chamaruco]

Yes, the replacement kit is the way to go and it's available between $100-$200 and the replacements is quite easy I think. Here's a photo of the kit. Guys who offer this can also replace the parts if you send them the engine.

View attachment 51585

easier to bring an new one from decathlon (if you leave in a country covered by them) and restart a new warranty

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/36v-c91143-100-brose-motor/_/R-p-200075?mc=8530762

 

[Zimmerframe]

easier to bring an new one from decathlon (if you leave in a country covered by them) and restart a new warranty

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/36v-c91143-100-brose-motor/_/R-p-200075?mc=8530762

I think the Decathlon bikes (and supplied spare motors) are Brose Drive T motors (1.2) , rather than Brose Drive S motors (1.3).

The two motors have quite a few different internal parts and power characteristics as the 1.3 was an evolution of the 1.2.

Drive T (1.2) motors, generally start with a serial number of C911

Drive S (1.3) motors, generally start with a serial number of C972

I say generally as there are the odd ones (very rare) with some other numbers.

 

[chamaruco]

i think is just a different setup. t model drains less battery but is rated 70nm. i'm using it and i move my setup from eco+ to eco. nevertheless you have two set up more: standard and boost.

 

[Zimmerframe]

No. There was the "1.2". It had over heating problems. So they made the 1.2e (Drive T) and then the Drive S (1.3).

The Drive T was a de-tuned 1.2 to avoid the heating issues which caused reliability problems (many of which still come back now with 2.1 motors and people using a cadence too low - so the motor tries as hard as it can but most power is converted to heat rather than motion leading to early belt and clutch failure).

The Drive S had significant internal re-workings to deal with the overheating issues and at the same time, a power boost (which was then increased again on Specialized bikes with the Drive S via a firmware update from 16A to 20A maximum).

Just to give you an idea of how significant the internal changes were, the Drive T weighs 3.9kg and the Drive S weighs 3.4kg.

Just for Info .. the "T" stands for "Trekking/Touring" and the "S" stands for "Sport".

 

[chamaruco]

No. There was the "1.2". It had over heating problems. So they made the 1.2e (Drive T) and then the Drive S (1.3).

The Drive T was a de-tuned 1.2 to avoid the heating issues which caused reliability problems (many of which still come back now with 2.1 motors and people using a cadence too low - so the motor tries as hard as it can but most power is converted to heat rather than motion leading to early belt and clutch failure).

The Drive S had significant internal re-workings to deal with the overheating issues and at the same time, a power boost (which was then increased again on Specialized bikes with the Drive S via a firmware update from 16A to 20A maximum).

Just to give you an idea of how significant the internal changes were, the Drive T weighs 3.9kg and the Drive S weighs 3.4kg.

Just for Info .. the "T" stands for "Trekking/Touring" and the "S" stands for "Sport".

With all this “culture” did you solve the issue for the owner of the thread?

 

[Zimmerframe]

With all this “culture” did you solve the issue for the owner of the thread?

LOL .. Sorry, I didn't realise it was my job to solve everyone's problems.

But it did seam reasonable to provide more information for anyone reading about how to identify what motor they have and what motor they might be buying if they search the internet for a replacement. I'm sorry if you took offence to me pointing anyone in the right direction rather than playing a fun game of lucky dip or "well, it looks the same on the outside, so it must be the same on the inside" and then wasting several hundred euro's on the wrong item.

As for the OP. Sadly I don't work for Specialized and I'm not a billionaire so I can't intervene or just offer to buy him a new motor or bike because the one he has is a year outside of warranty. I feel for him and it must be gutting, but at some point it could happen to any of us. We don't live in a world of self healing nano bot e-bike drive systems.

I would have pointed him to Performance line bearings ( @Bearing Man ) on here, but by the time I'd read the thread, the op had already said he'd contact them.

I'd suggest you hover over my name and click the "ignore" option then you won't have to see anything else I post which might be helpful. (or more likely stupid).

 

[Tmack1960]

I would open motor, could just be a belt failure you can purchase the belt for a $100.00 from Germany.https://youtu.be/DkK7mkNRfdI {} Hope this works out!

Thanks for the advice. I didn’t get any loud noises or bang - one minute I was getting assistance, the next the motor just whirred & no forward momentum. Waiting on Specialized at the moment but the plan is the open up the motor & see if I can see what the problem is before deciding what to do next.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Thanks for the advice. I didn’t get any loud noises or bang - one minute I was getting assistance, the next the motor just whirred & no forward momentum. Waiting on Specialized at the moment but the plan is the open up the motor & see if I can see what the problem is before deciding what to do next.

If you're now in that limbo state, once you open it up if you mail Performance line or put the pictures on here and tag @Bearing Man , I'm sure he'd be happy to help you in the right direction ..

For only TWO THOUSAND FOUR HUNDRED AND NINETY NINE DOLLARS !