Bafang m510

[El Topo]

In regards to the actual topic of this thread, the M510:

I don't see it as a good sign, that there is still no review of the M510 from @Rob Rides EMTB. I would really love to see this motor being a real alternative to the established brands in terms of software, torque sensing, and maybe even App compatibility. The future of EMTB IMHO are lightweight systems and no 7kg boat anchors bolted to the bottom of the frame.

 

[TeoElFeo]

Well there's already so many people that shared their opinion here. If you want to know mine, I can tell you this - m510 is a huge improvement over m500. Nonetheless it is definitely less powerful than Bosch or Brose. The torque sensing is definitely less refined, the motor is somewhat jerky. The tunability is somewhat ok with the new besst pro. Overall it's a working motor that is definitely usable for MTB style of riding. Keep in mind that motor is not the only consideration when buying a bike. Dengfu E10 frame is pretty good and I like it way more than my previous bike Focus Jam². Also the 820wh battery is definitely an advantage(at least for me)

 

[Kyokushin]

... where it is perfectly legal to ride as fast as one can, and then forgets to turn off the unlocked setting to ride on a public road -without having to use the magnet again.

So this works exactly this way mate I have been waited long time for such solution.

 

[Dado]

I think there might be a language barrier at place, on my end, @Dado 's end, or both?!

I was proposing to have a feature that always resets the motor to 25km/h when turned off - or being turned on again (the latter should be silent - as in not showing on the display if possible).
The reason for it is obviously to avoid getting in trouble in the unfortunate case that one leaves private property, where it is perfectly legal to ride as fast as one can, and then forgets to turn off the unlocked setting to ride on a public road -without having to use the magnet again.

How that is solved technically, I will leave to the experts.

Maybe my barrier, sorry. Yes, it always set to low speed as you turn on motor. Mentioned on endless link page.
And when turning off - also possible, but would need some reverse engineering again. And what is the main concern, I am getting voltage from motor, once you press power button, it will cut off voltage in few milisecond and coyld be that motor wont be accepting any can messages during turn off procedure. Not sure, was not digging more into this turn off procedure. When setting low speed after each turn on is much simple. And my slogan is: Lets make gadgets simple again. ))

 

[TeoElFeo]

Could somebody recommend an online shop where to buy m510?

 

[LAnton]

Could somebody recommend an online shop where to buy m510?

https://aliexpress.ru/item/1005004550658492.html?_ga=2.253548929.965792674.1661939788-833248895.1642800815&sku_id=12000029827497969

https://aliexpress.ru/item/1005003076140691.html?spm=a2g2w.orderdetails.0.0.3ac54aa63Cnqnt&sku_id=12000027488378693&_ga=2.175299114.965792674.1661939788-833248895.1642800815

https://aliexpress.ru/item/1005004056586265.html?_ga=2.175299114.965792674.1661939788-833248895.1642800815&sku_id=12000027940294384

https://aliexpress.ru/item/1005004055153347.html?_ga=2.175299114.965792674.1661939788-833248895.1642800815&sku_id=12000028747136270

https://aliexpress.ru/item/1005003251657166.html?_ga=2.253548929.965792674.1661939788-833248895.1642800815&sku_id=12000024861436627

 

[TeoElFeo]

Hm, none of these seem to sell just the motor separately. I am wondering if it's possible to buy just the motor

 

[thaeber]

Hm, none of these seem to sell just the motor separately. I am wondering if it's possible to buy just the motor

Contact Chili Shen / Changzhou Victory Machinery via FB Messenger and discuss options.

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

GBK (Green Bike Kits) is also another option as well for bare bone Bafang motors, accessories & spares and repairs

Bafang M620 G510 kits, Bafang M510 motor, Bafang M600 motor, Dengfu E10 E22 frame, Bafang BBS parts, Bafang M620 repair, Bafang M400 G330 parts, Electric bike kit, ebike batteries, hub motors, controllers, bike parts - GreenBikeKit BBS, ebike batteri

Bafang BBS kit repair, Bafang M620, Bafang M420, Bafang M560, Bafang M600, Bafang M510, Bafang M200, Bafang M400, NCM Dorado battery, bbs01, bbs02, bbshd maintainence, electric bike downtube battery manufacturer, customized battery packs building, KT kunteng controller and KT LCD meter...

www.greenbikekit.com

 

[mgx]

Today i tried for first time flash M510, but bad luck.

Looks like bafang is making our life even more horror then M500, M600.

I read that there are 2 different subversions of controller, E and I and based on screenshot taken before flashing FC.510.FC 1.0
i was in thinking, this is version E

I applied this fw

ROB_FIRMWARE_CRX10NC4814i101003.2-28-2230-boot3.0-20220523131321.bin

All went ok, local upload reset and upload to bike, then error 30 on display and now I cannot see controller via BEEST. When I connect HMI into bike canbus, i cannot start bike. Best was used 1.2.18 version

ANy ideas?

@Kyokushin - also one recomendation regarding GITHUB firmware folder-> put all fw into separated zips, as when you download it directly (save as link), you get rubbish...

I have another controller from M600 here, can I use it? If yes, what fw to use?

Also is there any way to reprogram controller?

 

[Kyokushin]

From the software version on the screenshot you have the version that we're calling "I".

Version names are not baffang official and they comes from the ASCII of letter in 1st byte of firmware file.
Thats strange you were able to flash this firmware. People tried to do it but besst not allowed them.

CRX10NC4814i101003.2-28-2230-boot3.0-20220523131321.bin is for version I

Try to disconnect battery and reset everything, thats only what comes to my mind at now.

Is there anyone here with 510 who flashed succesfully "CRX10NC4814i101003.2-28-2230-boot3.0-20220523131321.bin" ?

 

[mgx]

I disconnected battery no change. How to reset everything?

I am uploading to BEST tool fw (which one should I use? (Now i am trying revI -

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs-28-2230-boot3-0-20220517161110-48v-M510.bin

I go to update-> select controller -> I enter value CR into serial number. Then upload is running at best tool beep. When i disconnect/reconnect bus- i got only ERROR 30, but no upload to controller. Any idea here?

 

[Sheff73]

Today i tried for first time flash M510, but bad luck.

Looks like bafang is making our life even more horror then M500, M600.

I read that there are 2 different subversions of controller, E and I and based on screenshot taken before flashing FC.510.FC 1.0
i was in thinking, this is version E

I applied this fw

ROB_FIRMWARE_CRX10NC4814i101003.2-28-2230-boot3.0-20220523131321.bin

All went ok, local upload reset and upload to bike, then error 30 on display and now I cannot see controller via BEEST. When I connect HMI into bike canbus, i cannot start bike. Best was used 1.2.18 version

ANy ideas?

@Kyokushin - also one recomendation regarding GITHUB firmware folder-> put all fw into separated zips, as when you download it directly (save as link), you get rubbish...

I have another controller from M600 here, can I use it? If yes, what fw to use?

Also is there any way to reprogram controller?

View attachment 97741

View attachment 97742

I remember having a similar issue where error 30 came up whilst trying to upload a different firmware to my M510. Like Kyokushin suggested; try disconnecting the battery on the bike and if this does not work then try using different versions of the BESST software. One will eventually get things working. Total faff I know but this is Bafang!
Good luck.

 

[Sheff73]

I disconnected battery no change. How to reset everything?

I am uploading to BEST tool fw (which one should I use? (Now i am trying revI -

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs-28-2230-boot3-0-20220517161110-48v-M510.bin

I go to update-> select controller -> I enter value CR into serial number. Then upload is running at best tool beep. When i disconnect/reconnect bus- i got only ERROR 30, but no upload to controller. Any idea here?

Try BESST 1.2.23 or 1.2.26 or even the Pro Beta version.
The other 'issue' I had was that one version would update the firmware without any problem, but I had to use a different version to change the wheel size and max. speed!

 

[Sheff73]

I disconnected battery no change. How to reset everything?

I am uploading to BEST tool fw (which one should I use? (Now i am trying revI -

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs-28-2230-boot3-0-20220517161110-48v-M510.bin

I go to update-> select controller -> I enter value CR into serial number. Then upload is running at best tool beep. When i disconnect/reconnect bus- i got only ERROR 30, but no upload to controller. Any idea here?

Also try reducing the size of the firmware file name i.e. change CRX10NC4814i101003.2-28-2230-boot3.0-20220523131321.bin to CRX10NC4814i101003.2.bin

 

[Kyokushin]

And 100% check the wires, especially these ones in speedometer.

 

[mgx]

Hello,

thanks for hints, meanwhile i managed as per below (valid ONLY for 510 revI):

1) source correct firmware

i used

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs.bin

from Github-> Bafang_M500_M600/Firmwares/Official/Motor/m510/Rev_I at main · OpenSourceEBike/Bafang_M500_M600

make sure you save raw version, file size should be 89242 bytes

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs.bin

2) verify the firmware is for your platform

notepad-> open-> Options (hex)

First byte 90 (88 M500,89 M600, 90 M510), second byte 67(revI). RevE use bytes89,45 (means the fw is based on M600 and 3.2 controller? Just theory).

3) install BEEST 1.23 (tried other 1.16,1.18,1.21,1.30,1.31 beta), update Drivers

4) bike-> disconnect battery, reconnect batery, turn key ON. connect with BEST HMI turn on. connect USB to PC

5) in BESST login (use python hack), go to Update. BEST is connected (green), but no serial key.

Be sure, you put into SN value "RC" otherwise you cannot flash. This SN cannot be empty!

Click Get file from local, enter fw name (short preferred, but above #1 works).

6. click Update. FW is transferred to BEST TOOL. then it beep.

7. disconnect BEST from bike, reconnect (or press reset on BEST- does not work for me). Upload from BEST to bike must start. If you get error 30, repeat steps 6-7 multiple times (for me 3-4 times).

when upload to bike is finished, long press RESET on BEST and you are back on track.


I think i am off for today upgrades (Bafang sucks...) , but can somebody recommend good fw for revI?

Currently i have

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs-28-2230-boot3-0-20220517161110-48v-M510.bin

Also another question, can be controller from M600 used in 510?

@Kyokushin i suggest to make some housecleaning in Github folder, so its more undestandable for normal humans. Specially folder M510 is currently mess.

I suggest to:

1) add specific step-by step plan how to find which version user is having
2) more descriptive numbering of fw releases with description
3) summary of current issues per each motor branch and our bigger pains...

Lets start with some small survey, who is using which version of motor/which firmware and what are his/her current plus/minus strong/pains...

then we can summarize and let the ball roll to bafang. At least before we change to opensource controller

 

[Kyokushin]

Happy you're on track mate!

M510 have different torque sensor than M600, so i suppose controllers are not interchangable.

 

[ficorama]

Hello everyone. after the bafang m500 and m510 motors that I sold, I got an e-bike with a bosch gen4 motor. I didn't believe it when @Rob Rides EMTB wrote that bafang was miles behind the big players. unfortunately it's true, bosch is light years ahead of bafang. both by power, sensor sensitivity, pedaling, linear power delivery. the bike sits and rides. the system is worked out to the smallest detail. per max. in terms of power, the m510 is 20% stronger. but bosch is smoother, it is easier to drive on technical climbs. tour+ mode is phenomenal. I wish everyone good luck and success in DIY projects.

 

[mgx]

I think this is not what we want to hear .

On other hand, I dont understand why bafang goes from UART to locked CAN solution, also with such poor support and availability of spare parts. If they want the market share, they motors must be:

1) ease to use
2) easy to upgrade
3) cheaper then competitors
4) parameters (weight, tuning, kg to nm) comparable to competitors
5) easy to build&maintain and service
6) supported by manufacturer with availability of all parts

currently, no point is true with CAN motors. So i am afraid Bafang is slowly going where it will end-minor market share on minor markets.

 

[thaeber]

Hello,

thanks for hints, meanwhile i managed as per below (valid ONLY for 510 revI):

1) source correct firmware

i used

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs.bin

from Github-> Bafang_M500_M600/Firmwares/Official/Motor/m510/Rev_I at main · OpenSourceEBike/Bafang_M500_M600

make sure you save raw version, file size should be 89242 bytes

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs.bin

2) verify the firmware is for your platform

notepad-> open-> Options (hex)

First byte 90 (88 M500,89 M600, 90 M510), second byte 67(revI). RevE use bytes89,45 (means the fw is based on M600 and 3.2 controller? Just theory).

3) install BEEST 1.23 (tried other 1.16,1.18,1.21,1.30,1.31 beta), update Drivers

4) bike-> disconnect battery, reconnect batery, turn key ON. connect with BEST HMI turn on. connect USB to PC

5) in BESST login (use python hack), go to Update. BEST is connected (green), but no serial key.

Be sure, you put into SN value "RC" otherwise you cannot flash. This SN cannot be empty!

Click Get file from local, enter fw name (short preferred, but above #1 works).

6. click Update. FW is transferred to BEST TOOL. then it beep.

7. disconnect BEST from bike, reconnect (or press reset on BEST- does not work for me). Upload from BEST to bike must start. If you get error 30, repeat steps 6-7 multiple times (for me 3-4 times).

when upload to bike is finished, long press RESET on BEST and you are back on track.


I think i am off for today upgrades (Bafang sucks...) , but can somebody recommend good fw for revI?

Currently i have

CRX10NC4814i101003-1-cs-28-2230-boot3-0-20220517161110-48v-M510.bin

Also another question, can be controller from M600 used in 510?

View attachment 97753

View attachment 97754

View attachment 97755

@Kyokushin i suggest to make some housecleaning in Github folder, so its more undestandable for normal humans. Specially folder M510 is currently mess.

I suggest to:

1) add specific step-by step plan how to find which version user is having
2) more descriptive numbering of fw releases with description
3) summary of current issues per each motor branch and our bigger pains...

Lets start with some small survey, who is using which version of motor/which firmware and what are his/her current plus/minus strong/pains...

then we can summarize and let the ball roll to bafang. At least before we change to opensource controller

I‘m running this firmware for appr. 1200 km now. I start the bike and wait for appr. 1 minute before I touch the pedals. I don’t have any issues with cut off, and the range of this firmware is phenomenal because of the improved battery attenuation. Almost full power until 10% SoC, then 200W max available til battery is dead. I have no experience with Bosch, but my bike suits me very well in regards of cadence / support. I‘m still happy!

 

[Neeko DeVinchi]

I agree with @thaeber. Bafang motors are different in design (internally) compared to the mainstream brands of motors. This difference ultimately gives their motors a different characteristic.

And whilst I'll refrain from turning this into a "bafang vs everyone else" post. All I'll say is that I have yet to have physically encountered a bafang motor which couldn't be serviced / repaired / modified & upgraded.

I do understand that the CANBus protocol has thrown a spanner in the works in terms of development (and I'm sure Bafang have their reasons.......which none of us will ever truly understand!!!). But development for the M500/M600/M510 remains strong (both from Bafang and third party developers).

Even I have been toiling away, in an effort to improve a motor, which 'in my opinion' has potential

 

[mgx]

I am not saying bafang is bad, but this are pains which should somehow be mitigated by Bafang.

For example, i yesterday tried to search for new controller CXN10.510. In Europe its impossible to find. Major brand must have such replacement part wide available, as controller can go off anytime. Same for the gaskets, lubrication.

I tried to source lubrication recommended by Bafang, which is Mobile Mobilgrease 28. 150 euro for 2kg? Really???? I ended with bosch lubricant, because i need for season 75g for 10e. I am not cycloservice with 10 bikes per day which need motor lubrication.

And so on.

 

[patdam]

Hello everyone. after the bafang m500 and m510 motors that I sold, I got an e-bike with a bosch gen4 motor. I didn't believe it when @Rob Rides EMTB wrote that bafang was miles behind the big players. unfortunately it's true, bosch is light years ahead of bafang. both by power, sensor sensitivity, pedaling, linear power delivery. the bike sits and rides. the system is worked out to the smallest detail. per max. in terms of power, the m510 is 20% stronger. but bosch is smoother, it is easier to drive on technical climbs. tour+ mode is phenomenal. I wish everyone good luck and success in DIY projects.

Same using but completely different philosopie. may be better fuctioning ? but your are only the tenant of your buying. During warranty in case of any failure you need to return your bike to the dealer and wait for motor standard exchange. After warranty you need to purchase another bike, nothing spare parts available, same the dealer have not the right to open the motor.

Personally i 'm satified since 3 years by the motor functioning for my use on high mountain, the motor is just an help to up the toy to playing downhill (i never use the max power), i'm not a racer to need more, especially no more functions.

And i'm fully enjoy to could doing has i want with my motor and to be the only one who build and maintin my bike. Good pleasure with your comon bike.

 

[patdam]

I agree with @thaeber. Bafang motors are different in design (internally) compared to the mainstream brands of motors. This difference ultimately gives their motors a different characteristic.

And whilst I'll refrain from turning this into a "bafang vs everyone else" post. All I'll say is that I have yet to have physically encountered a bafang motor which couldn't be serviced / repaired / modified & upgraded.

I do understand that the CANBus protocol has thrown a spanner in the works in terms of development (and I'm sure Bafang have their reasons.......which none of us will ever truly understand!!!). But development for the M500/M600/M510 remains strong (both from Bafang and third party developers).
View attachment 97803
Even I have been toiling away, in an effort to improve a motor, which 'in my opinion' has potential

About canbus. My opinion is that bafang is company is designed to saling for bike builder in great quantity, not the DIY owners. They estimate (right or false ?) that the "open" uart, who allow final user to modified their motor functioning as he want (exemple increase limit speed), is the raison why they couldn't enter in major bike brands. And they have radicaled change her policy to close her system and avoid that their motor will be the cause of ruling change who currently allow to e-bike user to do the same thing than classic bike.

 

[LAnton]

I have a spare bafang motor. If the engine stops working, I can have fun driving again. Does the owner of bosch have a spare motor? And we don't have to wait for repairs or spare parts.

 

[LAnton]

I'm already driving the M510. I have a besst, but I don't have time to make a new firmware. I will do it in the winter.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Has it got to the stage where Bafang are unwilling to support the DIYer through the risk of being fined / unable to sell engines due to the risks of eg EU law infringement ( speed and power ) combined with wanting to increase sales by linking up with major manufacturers, who will inevitably want their own say in forcing customers back to the dealerships to ensure branding never becomes an uncontrollable issue due to faults ?

In my view what they are doing is probably the right corporate move. But without the feedback of the DIYer they are so far behind their competitors, that it is unlikely any major brand will buy into their motors. Are they in a good corporate position, of course just maybe we are being blindsided by our views of just our local EU and US markets, which in all truth are just a tiny part of their main sales that of Asia, where all the customers want are reliable cadence based engines for commuting or shifting goods on cargo bikes. It’s rumoured alone that the BB series 1& 2 engines had sold over 2M engines and that was about 5 years ago. No Bosch or Brose motor will ever sell that number.

So why do we persist in buying Bafang when there are alternatives such as Polini and FAZUA, that is purely down to the predominate DIY builder frame manufacturers, building frames compatible to only Bafang.

What I have never understood is why the likes of Polini have not made a modular engine which can be fitted with say Bafang compatible adaptors, why not all major car companies do it ?

 

[patdam]

they are so far behind their competitors

I don't share this point of views. Before M500/600 i wad had shimano E8000. I prefer the M500 (for my use allways), less noise, more efficient to climb (when i can keep the right RPM) and the most positve point for me, the throttle for use in walk mode.

The only desagrement is that i can't adjust 1st level powerfull (to reduce it), but it is only a problem when i ride with unassist bike, because i ride diffictuly less than 7 km/h in uphill

 

[phil85]

Je ne partage pas ce point de vue. Avant le M500/600, j'avais un shimano E8000. Je préfère le M500 (toujours pour mon utilisation), moins bruyant, plus efficace en montée (quand j'arrive à garder le bon RPM) et le point le plus positif pour moi, la manette des gaz pour une utilisation en mode marche.

Le seul désagrément est que je ne peux pas régler le 1er niveau de puissance (pour le réduire), mais ce n'est un problème que lorsque je roule avec un vélo sans assistance, car je roule difficilement à moins de 7 km/h en montée
[/DEVIS]

intéressant ton point de vue ! Je suis intéressé par l'achat d'un Frey Evolve équipe par un m510. Ce 1er niveau d'assistance ne peut être modifié par l'application Bafang Go ?