Levo Gen 2 Anyone gone from a coil shock back to air shock on the Levo?

[grim007]

So I've had DHX2 on my Levo for about 2-3 months and had some mixed feelings about it.
Unfortunately the eyelet on the DHX2 cracked and I went back to the original shock.
After playing with the settings abit I must say I like the responsiveness of the air shock better than the coil shock.
Sure the coil just rolls over everything, feels like a tank rolling over stuff. However the popply responsive feeling seems to be lost compared to an air shock.
I've also had bottoming out issues with the coil shock even though the spring was supposed to fit my weight.
Anyone else also had this experience?

 

[speedkills]

I haven't gone to coil on this bike (have a Manitou Mara Pro on order) but thought about going coil before ordering the Mara and I "think" you would need a progressive spring to retain that poppy feeling if you wanted to go spring, or progressive damping if you want to have the spring rate you want up top and prevent bottoming but don't mind a dead feeling shock.

I'm interested in others experiences here, even if you didn't go back to air, as this is a pretty linear suspension design for a coil shock. Although, if you aren't sending it then a linear coil on a linear suspension design can be pretty damned plush feeling.

 

[ebikerider]

Yeah I have gone back and forth on a multitude of air/coil variations. The 2020 Levo is very linear (there's a reason why it comes from factory with a small volume air can stuffed with a gnar dog and a token). The coil gives a very different ride characteristic than the air and tends to run quite deep in its travel unless you put a big spring in there which kind of defeats the purpose. On this bike I would definitely try to get a progressive spring on a coil if I went back there. I'm currently running the standard Rockshox air shock but with a megneg and I'm finding that surprisingly good. Not as supple as coil and not quite the levels of traction but close on both counts and much livelier on the trail.

 

[grim007]

These guys are developing a progressive link for the levo.. already have one for Levo LT and Stumpjumper.
I spoke to them they told me one for levo should be coming out soon.

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[bluemtrider]

Yeah, I put a coil shock on for a while because I had one on another bike which fit. Plush ride but it rode too low in the suspension so pedal strikes were increased dramatically. I now run the stock Rockshox with a MegNeg and couldn't be happier.

 

[Hasse Birkmose]

Yeah I have gone back and forth on a multitude of air/coil variations. The 2020 Levo is very linear (there's a reason why it comes from factory with a small volume air can stuffed with a gnar dog and a token). The coil gives a very different ride characteristic than the air and tends to run quite deep in its travel unless you put a big spring in there which kind of defeats the purpose. On this bike I would definitely try to get a progressive spring on a coil if I went back there. I'm currently running the standard Rockshox air shock but with a megneg and I'm finding that surprisingly good. Not as supple as coil and not quite the levels of traction but close on both counts and much livelier on the trail.

Can i ask what the megneg does to the standart shock?

 

[NETTA17]

Hello,
I have a long experience with Coil Vs. Air shock.
By looking into the LEVO Leverage-Ratio (see picture- BLUE LINE). It not design for a coil - you probably Bottom-up
very quickly! + you losing the "pop" of the back - more planted feel from already "planted" feeling bike + Specialized probably tune the shock to the bike. You need a full tunable shock to do it ($$$)
Trust me - do not enter to this adventure

 

[losgatosgtr]

I'd be interested in the cascade engineering link form my 2019 Levo. I'm running the EXT Storia Lok 3 and love the tremendous grip it provides on the rocky trails I ride. It is a pretty progressive coil shock, compared to other coil shocks, and feels probably about 75% of the progressiveness of the stock air shock.

 

[ebikerider]

I'd be interested in the cascade engineering link form my 2019 Levo. I'm running the EXT Storia Lok 3 and love the tremendous grip it provides on the rocky trails I ride. It is a pretty progressive coil shock probably about 75% of the progressives of the stock air shock.

Where are you getting that 75% figure from? Are you using a progressive coil spring?

 

[speedkills]

MegNeg: It megnifies the size of the negative air chamber.

 

[losgatosgtr]

Where are you getting that 75% figure from? Are you using a progressive coil spring?

I went back and edited my post for clarity. The EXT Storia feels about 75% or more of the progressiveness of an air shock.

 

[Criquet17]

Hello,

I have installed the megneg upgrade kit on the RS deluxe and the difference is noticeable.
But with 2 bands on the negative chamber and the blue 3.5 spacer, I need 270 Psi! With the standard air can I was at 190 Psi. So I need more than the extra 20% announced by RS.
I will try with an extra band and hope it will reduce the pressure.

For the megneg users, what are your settings?
Thx

 

[Konanige]

I find mine ride quite nicely with the standard shock with largest volume spacer, I wonder if some of us are expecting a little too much from a TRAIL bike. I think if I was that concerned about plushness I would have bought a Kenevo (I may still buy one as well), its horses for courses really the Levo is a long travel trail bike for big days out, not really a park bike.

 

[jcmonty]

I have this for the SL (actually was the prototype tester). It’s definitely worth it. More sensitive off the top and better bottom out if set correctly

I had to run the shock with about 10% more pressure (stock dps) to get the same sag. This is of note for those running coils because that may mean you need a stiffer coil setup. I have a storia enroute to test.

Another note on the SL - I managed to touch shock yoke to chainstay after installing this link and adding an offset bushing at full shock compression (bottom out). I can’t say this would happen with the standard levo, but it is something of note especially if you are running a longer stroke shock (55mm)

 

[losgatosgtr]

I have this for the SL (actually was the prototype tester). It’s definitely worth it. More sensitive off the top and better bottom out if set correctly

I had to run the shock with about 10% more pressure (stock dps) to get the same sag. This is of note for those running coils because that may mean you need a stiffer coil setup. I have a storia enroute to test.

Another note on the SL - I managed to touch shock yoke to chainstay after installing this link and adding an offset bushing at full shock compression (bottom out). I can’t say this would happen with the standard levo, but it is something of note especially if you are running a longer stroke shock (55mm)

Are you talking about the cascade link hitting the Seat Tube, Seat Stay or Chain Stay? Maybe you could please attach a photo to clarify? I definitely would not want to buy a new link if it will make contact with the frame on a Levo as it would indicate more testing, design revisions and machining of the link are needed.

 

[jcmonty]

Technically it's the shock yoke hitting the cross member of the seat stay. I don't have the link on atm, so I can't take a picture, but if you compress your bike all the way and note where the shock yoke ends are closest to seat stay - that's where it touches.

I wouldn't worry about this for the standard levo for the following reasons:

1) The SL touches after modifying the geometry beyond stock.
2) The SL link was a SJ link originally since the PN for the stock links are the same between the two bikes. Why I worked with CC was to ID any differences. between SJ and SL. They trimmed some material based on my observations. The yoke touching came after I changed the GEO.
3) If they are planning a Levo link - it will have to be brand new and thoroughly tested as the SL and std. Levo links are different from the factory. I can imagine they are working with someone with the bike and/or have a bike to test at their shop.

Folks on the SL link should be fine unless you are running a longer stroke shock and/or modified the GEO like I did. At least from my observations.

 

[lumpy]

All this talk of the Megneg and the Cascade Components link has really piqued my interest! Being fairly ignorant about suspension setup leaves me vulnerable to screwing things up so I'm looking forward to more viewpoints.

FWIW, my RS Pike has the 160mm air spring and the new Charger 2.1 so I think the front end is good to go. Just not sure what to do for the rear of the bike - if anything

 

[Forever Wild]

Yeah, I put a coil shock on for a while because I had one on another bike which fit. Plush ride but it rode too low in the suspension so pedal strikes were increased dramatically. I now run the stock Rockshox with a MegNeg and couldn't be happier.

I had similar problem but spent $30 on a stiffer spring. Still rides plush but frame sits higher.

 

[ReinerSt0ff77]

I have never looked back ?

63mm Hub and SAR Spring.

 

[ebikerider]

I have never looked back ?

63mm Hub and SAR Spring.

Do you mean 63mm stroke?

 

[ReinerSt0ff77]

Yes u right.

 

[jcmonty]

For those interested, Cascade Components posted a IG story of a bunch of levo links being machined. I would expect them in stock in the next few weeks. 158mm travel and 23% progression. Huge improvements!

 

[clearmind]

I have never looked back too. At first I rode a linear VALT. It was fluffy but no pop enough.
Now with the progressive VALT I feel like I'm riding another Levo. It doesn't get any better.

 

[jcmonty]

It’s up Cascade Components

 

[ebikerider]

It’s up Cascade Components

Damn, he's recommending some heavy duty springs for coil!

 

[losgatosgtr]

It’s up Cascade Components

I just pre-ordered a black link for the S-Works Levo 2019. Do you think this new link will work well with the EXT Storia Lok 3 shock? I'm using either the 575 lb or 600 lb spring with my rider weight about 186 lb with all gear on.

Just to clarify the Storia shock feels great now using the 2019 S Works Levo stock linkage. The Storia is 210mm by 55 mm sizing.

Over the past week I just did some really hard rides in North lake Tahoe with lots of Rock gardens and hooks to flat off of small bowlers and jumps on trails like the tyrolian downhill and Tahoe rim trail. The Storia felt great didn't notice any harsh bottoms out with 600 lb spring. This is with the stock levo linkage.

 

[jcmonty]

It should work pretty well (i am betting on it for my SL.. link + EXT incoming). For the levo, they recommend increasing the spring rate 5% from the stock link or keeping as close to 30% sag as possible. I would check your static sag with the 600lb spring when you install the link. Given the HBO, you may be ok with the higher sag unless you feel like the bike is wallowing at all. The bike will be super supple of the top with that setup and not much of a loss in bottom out support. If you need a stiffer spring rate, there shoudl be some rockshox or custom options for the EXT that could work.

Since you are running 55mm stroke, it will be interesting to see how it works out for you since that will be ~ 165mm travel. You may feel the need to get a longer front fork to balance it (if you aren't running 160+ already)

 

[losgatosgtr]

It seems if the new link makes the current shock more progressive that I wouldn't need to up my spring rate correct?

Right now the 600 lb spring works fine on the Levo with the stock link.

I already have a Fox 38 factory 160 mm travel fork on the front. main reason I'm trying out the 575 lb spring is because the 600 lb spring seems slightly oversprung compared to the Fox 38. Trying to balance the bike front rear and attain the spider-like levels of grip I had with the 575 lb spring on the Storia shock when it was installed on the Levo SL with stock link.

Not sure I would want to up the spring rate to anything over 600 lbs using the new Cascade link on the Levo as that might mean I need to use more air in the Fox 38 up front?

I think going anything more than 600lbs spring would make the Levo over sprung but the only reference point I have is using the stock linkage setup.

 

[jcmonty]

It seems if the new link makes the current shock more progressive that I wouldn't need to up my spring rate correct?

Right now the 600 lb spring works fine on the Levo with the stock link.

I already have a Fox 38 factory 160 mm travel fork on the front. main reason I'm trying out the 575 lb spring is because the 600 lb spring seems slightly oversprung compared to the Fox 38. Trying to balance the bike front rear and attain the spider-like levels of grip I had with the 575 lb spring on the Storia shock when it was installed on the Levo SL with stock link.

Not sure I would want to up the spring rate to anything over 600 lbs using the new Cascade link on the Levo as that might mean I need to use more air in the Fox 38 up front?

I think going anything more than 600lbs spring would make the Levo over sprung but the only reference point I have is using the stock linkage setup.

So the CC link is more progressive (23% vs. 16% stock link), but it has a higher overall leverage rate, biased to the beginning of the curve:

At the 30% sag (~ 16.5mm for your 55mm stroke), the leverage rate of the CC link is about 6% higher leverage ratio. Meaning - you will need more force at the shock to hold the same sag position. CC recommends 5% more spring rate on their site.

That being said, if you are thinking that the 600lb spring was a bit firmer than you would like on the Levo, this link could definitely help with that. It will be plusher off the top and not give too much on the bottom out or midstroke, especially if you feel you are oversprung.

 

[lumpy]

I ordered one for my Levo too. I have the stock air shock and am looking forward to the improvement