2020 Ultralight Levo rumors

[Dpca10]

Ok, another Rumors thread! Here are some facts: we all know this is coming, an ultra light emtb from specialized using the new motor seen in their 2020 creo road bike. I’ve known this was coming for years from people with relationships to specialized but it kept being pushed back, but it seems on the doorstep now. My biggest speculation questions are when will it be released, how big the battery will be, range and power? From people who have caught a glimpse it seems it is based on the levo frame which is a huge relief as I’d hate this to skew too xc just because it’s lighter. Seems 350wh internal battery and potentially removable supplemental battery. Any more info?

 

[Rusty]

Where did you hear that?

 

[TrailwattsUK]

The Creo motor would not last long on the trails. There would have to be some heavy duty gears within the motor or switch to belt setup for use with E-MOUNTAINBIKE frame, tyres and gearing.
If they have their own unit in development then 2021-2022 may yield a different power plant.

 

[Dpca10]

The Creo motor would not last long on the trails. There would have to be some heavy duty gears within the motor or switch to belt setup for use with E-MOUNTAINBIKE frame, tyres and gearing.
If they have their own unit in development then 2021-2022 may yield a different power plant.

Why wouldn’t it last? You mean distance or durability? I don’t see any reason durability wise it couldn’t work in its current configuration right now

 

[Dpca10]

Where did you hear that?

I could tell you but they’d have to kill me. Rob also alluded to it in his Creo text review. I live about 30 miles from specialized headquarters, it’s a secret not a secret at my local shop and it’s been seen in person by people I trust. I hear it’s not a replacement for the Levo as that’s really a different class of power. It will hopefully be what the ezesty hoped to be but needs to be in the 17-18kg range to really get me excited.

 

[TrailwattsUK]

Why wouldn’t it last? You mean distance or durability? I don’t see any reason durability wise it couldn’t work in its current configuration right now

Nylon gear ratios are wrong. As a cyclocross ebike it would be interesting to see how it copes.

 

[Mondfuchs]

It's so obvious that Specialized would asses this opportunity to leverage the Mahle engine of Creo with Levo frame or optimised Levo frame to create something like Levo light... they've already got everything in their shop ... the question only is, by when this will be displayed to us

 

[R120]

Surely it will be a variant of the Epic its based on

 

[Wheelie_King]

I've got a 2019 Levo, and have had a brief test ride on a Creo. Whilst I can see how the Creo would ride and perform well on the road, I'm not sure I'd want the Creo motor in the Levo on the basis I can't see it being strong enough.

 

[Mondfuchs]

I've got a 2019 Levo, and have had a brief test ride on a Creo. Whilst I can see how the Creo would ride and perform well on the road, I'm not sure I'd want the Creo motor in the Levo on the basis I can't see it being strong enough.

that might be indeed a challenging for those who are used to ride Brose/Bosch/Yamaha/Bosch - and some will not decline to have less power...unexperienced eMTB riders would better accept the reduced power.
If I'm analysing my riding style I need to admit that I using mainly between 25-45% power level - full turbo at 100% I'm using very rarely. So in principal it could be sufficient power to me and if the engine is even a bit improved/tuned it would be probably good enough and with 3-4kg less it could also compensate a bit... but never the same
As I'm receiving soon a Levo 2020 this potential next innovative bike is out of scope however, I'm still interested to see and ride it - and really hoping that I'm not get in ...

 

[paquo]

doesn't the creo motor's powerband come in at a higher rpm ? Not really what you want for a mountain bike.

 

[CjP]

It’ll be the perfect bike for all the Emtb “haters”

 

[ccrdave]

gearing in the Mahle motor would be easy to change if needed, personally I think it would just be a software/firmware retune.
I have long believed we will see an epic style bike with a lightweight motor from spesh. why wouldnt they!!

 

[Rusty]

I don't see the Mahle motor as an option currently. The internals are nowhere near sturdy enough for an eMTB as they are and to be fit for purpose would need a major re-engineer.
Possibly see the Mahle motor in a few different brand road-touring-CX bikes though.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

gearing in the Mahle motor would be easy to change if needed, personally I think it would just be a software/firmware retune.
I have long believed we will see an epic style bike with a lightweight motor from spesh. why wouldnt they!!

Agree with you there Dave, I was out for a walk and saw a Creo with CX tyres happily riding the off-road XC trails near me the other day. From what I saw he was not mucking about and looked quite comfortable on the trails considering Creos have a tiny bit of suspension up front. I saw him later on flying down a fairly lumpy fireroad. Now wrap an Epic frame around that motor and you should have a real fun machine to play with me thinks.

 

[Enon]

Ok, another Rumors thread! Here are some facts: we all know this is coming, an ultra light emtb from specialized using the new motor seen in their 2020 creo road bike. I’ve known this was coming for years from people with relationships to specialized but it kept being pushed back, but it seems on the doorstep now. My biggest speculation questions are when will it be released, how big the battery will be, range and power? From people who have caught a glimpse it seems it is based on the levo frame which is a huge relief as I’d hate this to skew too xc just because it’s lighter. Seems 350wh internal battery and potentially removable supplemental battery. Any more info?

It's going be called the Levo SL and will be released around March 2020. I believe it will have a booster battery like the Creo SL

 

[MattyB]

I don't see the Mahle motor as an option currently. The internals are nowhere near sturdy enough for an eMTB as they are and to be fit for purpose would need a major re-engineer.
Possibly see the Mahle motor in a few different brand road-touring-CX bikes though.

The decision to use Mahle for the Creo would strongly suggest that Specialized will dump Brose in the medium term, probably because of the well publicised reliability issues (they must have cost Spec a fortune, though riders still love the way it delivers the power). If that is the case the question is will a "Levo Lite" appear before the next generation "Full-fat" Levo, or even in the same year (model year 2021)? That would require Mahle to develop a new motor for the Levo as well as re-gearing/engineering the Creo motor for MTB.

I understand they are a pretty big company with lots of R&D money, but that is still a pretty big ask. I suspect we will see this come out in MY 2021, with a new Levo matched to an all new Mahle motor in MY 2022. Feel free to call me out as completely wrong in autumn 2021...

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

The decision to use Mahle for the Creo would strongly suggest that Specialized will dump Brose in the medium term, probably because of the well publicised reliability issues (they must have cost Spec a fortune, though riders still love the way it delivers the power). If that is the case the question is will a "Levo Lite" appear before the next generation "Full-fat" Levo, or even in the same year (model year 2021)? That would require Mahle to develop a new motor for the Levo as well as re-gearing/engineering the Creo motor for MTB.

I understand they are a pretty big company with lots of R&D money, but that is still a pretty big ask. I suspect we will see this come out in MY 2021, with a new Levo matched to an all new Mahle motor in 2022. Feel free to call me out as completely wrong in summer 2021...

I am sure they have been beavering away on this for sometime already. I will be more than happy to have an IP67 rated motor, battery and TCU underneath me in the very near future.

 

[MattyB]

I am sure they have been beavering away on this for sometime already. I will be more than happy to have an IP67 rated motor, battery and TCU underneath me in the very near future.

Yes, probably true. I still doubt that you will see two new Mahle motored MTBs from Spec next year, though.

 

[Slowroller]

It's becoming obvious that motor choice is completely changing the level of risk among bike manufacturers. Using Specialized as an example, in past years and decades they could use their knowledge base to make incremental improvements to geometry and suspension kinematics without betting the farm on them. Each generation was generally better than before, and if they took a risk it was of a small enough magnitude that it wouldn't affect the companies over all reputation if it failed, or cost them a bundle in recalls. Now however, the motors and software make the bike. The patent is expired on the suspension kinematics, and there isn't much special about the Levo outside of the motor and it's proprietary software, which is brilliant when it's working. When it's not though, its very costly to their image and bank account. With how new emtb systems are, and what the failure rate is, switching to a new motor manufacturer has got to be scary.

 

[Rusty]

With how new emtb systems are, and what the failure rate is, switching to a new motor manufacturer has got to be scary.

THAT is the thing. No matter what I am seeing here, talking to literally dozens of Levo owners I have only heard of one or two issues locally and those were apparently build mistakes with crimped wiring or some loose screws.
Worldwide I expect the numbers are not too bad and my dealers understanding is that Brose replaces the motors when required. His opinion, based on his visit to the factory recently is that Speshy are happy with Brose and would have used Brose for the Creo if they had a suitable motor. Speshy was determined to get the Creo out before a bunch of others hit the market so looked around for something suitable.
With big changes to the Knevo this year I would not expect something too different until 2021 or possibly 2022.

 

[westcoastmtbr]

Awe, we're in the technology change game, and like the iphone and Apple Watch, it's going to change so quickly, ane this is where manufacturers see the opportunity for sustained growth and market advantage. Simply, it takes lots of $$ to perfect and support this cutting edge technology. The small players will have to hang onto old technology compared to a Specialized, YT. Let's do some thinking on some things. Let's say you have a current 2020 Levo at 51lbs. Let's say you're an average rider using average trails. at 6k USD for this bike, are you willing to part ways with your investment for say a 42lb. bike at 10k USD or more? BTW, this current 6k bike will sell new for 4k or less in the future becuase it's going to be old technology, and probably very reliable proven stuff too. So to be fair it's a 4k purchase vs. say a 9k cutting edge tech purchase. This top end bike would have a full carbon frame, wheels and a new lightweight motor and all the goodies. What is the real effect on the avearage and may a dare to say 80-90% of the riders in the marketplace? Will it really make a huge difference? I think this tech is still a few years away, and funny enough, my answer is that the person with enough cash will ALWAYS chase the newer tech. Ugh.

 

[R120]

THAT is the thing. No matter what I am seeing here, talking to literally dozens of Levo owners I have only heard of one or two issues locally and those were apparently build mistakes with crimped wiring or some loose screws.
Worldwide I expect the numbers are not too bad and my dealers understanding is that Brose replaces the motors when required. His opinion, based on his visit to the factory recently is that Speshy are happy with Brose and would have used Brose for the Creo if they had a suitable motor. Speshy was determined to get the Creo out before a bunch of others hit the market so looked around for something suitable.
With big changes to the Knevo this year I would not expect something too different until 2021 or possibly 2022.

I would have said the Creo is late to the market - been several super high end e-road bikes using the Fazua system on the market for a while from the likes of Look, Pinarello, etc etc

 

[Rusty]

I would have said the Creo is late to the market - been several super high end e-road bikes using the Fazua system on the market for a while from the likes of Look, Pinarello, etc etc

True enough, but Speshy had to beat Giant, Trek, Merida etc.I would think.

 

[MattyB]

I would have said the Creo is late to the market - been several super high end e-road bikes using the Fazua system on the market for a while from the likes of Look, Pinarello, etc etc

Having ridden several Fazua and ebikemotion powered road bikes with their well proven powertrains there is no way I would pay the premium Spec are asking for the Creo. Their only tenable competitor at that price point is the Pinarello ebike, and I am pretty sure I know which most fashion conscious roadies would go for...

 

[jd_3d]

I really hope these rumors are true as I've been thinking about a Levo Superlight for a while:

eZesty version of the Turbo Levo - EMTB Forums

Now that Specialized has the Creo motor it seems like a no-brainer.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

I really hope these rumors are true as I've been thinking about a Levo Superlight for a while:

eZesty version of the Turbo Levo - EMTB Forums

Now that Specialized has the Creo motor it seems like a no-brainer.

Next year, sometime, maybe?

 

[Mondfuchs]

my latest info this subject received today by a retailer:
- probably 21st January publication about 4 new Specialized bikes
- 26th retailer event by Specialized
- Ultralight version will come - very convinced
- new Tarmac
- the other 2 bikes are not known...

 

[Dpca10]

So, news is starting to leak. Sounds like an apple style launch is forthcoming with the bikes available to purchase the day of the launch and very soon.

 

[westcoastmtbr]

It shall be interesting indeed. How light do you think as Levo SL would be. With the Creo coming in at 27lbs, add Fork, Rear Shock, etc, etc. My guess is that they get the bike at 40lbs. and no less. It just won't be worth it. Guesses?